The Spirited Back Nine ...

matt9112

Well-Known Member
Are you saying that's why it does much better from a money standpoint? If so, yep definitely. If you are saying you think they should actually take away the beer and food that's blasphemy;)

Put aside alcohol sales, food and wine festival or people drinking around the world for a minute. Just dinners alone are a huge money maker. At AK there are only a handful of places you can even eat dinner and the park is regularly closed too early to really capitalize. The plans to add a nighttime show, night safaris and more rides in Pandora that can stay open late should help to keep people at AK longer and help the park to capitalize on the dinner crowd. It will never be as lucrative as World Showcase, but there's a lot of room for improvement financially.


referring to money wise yes....that epcot is a shell of a park without world showcase food and such (in current state) so many public areas of disuse now.....
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
referring to money wise yes....that epcot is a shell of a park without world showcase food and such (in current state) so many public areas of disuse now.....

EPCOT needs some major pavilion refurbs but I wouldn't call it a shell. The main problems are Imagination and Energy and the closed WOL pavilion. Even if they left WOL closed but did major refurbs of Inagination and Energy and beefed up innoventions a little the park would be in pretty decent shape.

AK is in decent shape already (minus the Yeti and DinoCarnival) but needs more meat.
 

matt9112

Well-Known Member
EPCOT needs some major pavilion refurbs but I wouldn't call it a shell. The main problems are Imagination and Energy and the closed WOL pavilion. Even if they left WOL closed but did major refurbs of Inagination and Energy and beefed up innoventions a little the park would be in pretty decent shape.

AK is in decent shape already (minus the Yeti and DinoCarnival) but needs more meat.

epcot is a yawn....some great scenery and ambiance but i don't like to pay to walk in a fancy "park" am in not even a horizons fiend....i like the new rides but TT and soaring and MS.....not going to hold it together...sorry energy adventure is horrible...this is 2014 you know that right? and disney is a multi billion dollar company right? and imagination....i have not walked into that building since my first visit in 98...i mean really that is a giant waste of space. and how many kids wait in line to go on a boat through a greenhouse? how many? that's right zero. and hell i will even defend the nemofication of seas because it attracts children and such....and innovations wow....where to begin i mean facepalm.... the WLP is really not a big dseal in the grand scheme at least people forgot about it...

WITHOUT FESTIVALS AND BEER epcot is nothing....it is not a world class theme park and it sure as hell isn't anywhere near what TEA numbers say.
 

ProfSavage

Well-Known Member
I've been pushing for a Beatles Yellow Submarine/Pepperland ride in UK for like, forever. (Or, hey, maybe my Mary Poppins/Cherry Tree Lane idea would work there...)And I don't see any issues with a Nintendo ride in Japan either. A Mario ride would be sweet.

Right?! Disney and Nintendo already collaborated together with Wreck-It Ralph. I think a dark ride about the history and cultural influence of Mario/Video games via dark ride in Japan would be great!

Yellow Submarine would be sweeeeeet!
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
epcot is a yawn....some great scenery and ambiance but i don't like to pay to walk in a fancy "park" am in not even a horizons fiend....i like the new rides but TT and soaring and MS.....not going to hold it together...sorry energy adventure is horrible...this is 2014 you know that right? and disney is a multi billion dollar company right? and imagination....i have not walked into that building since my first visit in 98...i mean really that is a giant waste of space. and how many kids wait in line to go on a boat through a greenhouse? how many? that's right zero. and hell i will even defend the nemofication of seas because it attracts children and such....and innovations wow....where to begin i mean facepalm.... the WLP is really not a big dseal in the grand scheme at least people forgot about it...

WITHOUT FESTIVALS AND BEER epcot is nothing....it is not a world class theme park and it sure as hell isn't anywhere near what TEA numbers say.

OK. We can agree to disagree then.

EPCOT in its prime was my favorite all time theme park. It STILL IS absolutely a world class theme park.
 
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PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
epcot is a yawn....some great scenery and ambiance but i don't like to pay to walk in a fancy "park" am in not even a horizons fiend....i like the new rides but TT and soaring and MS.....not going to hold it together...sorry energy adventure is horrible...this is 2014 you know that right? and disney is a multi billion dollar company right? and imagination....i have not walked into that building since my first visit in 98...i mean really that is a giant waste of space. and how many kids wait in line to go on a boat through a greenhouse? how many? that's right zero. and hell i will even defend the nemofication of seas because it attracts children and such....and innovations wow....where to begin i mean facepalm.... the WLP is really not a big dseal in the grand scheme at least people forgot about it...

WITHOUT FESTIVALS AND BEER epcot is nothing....it is not a world class theme park and it sure as hell isn't anywhere near what TEA numbers say.

Well good, without you in the parks, thats one less person to keep me from Soarin
 

Disneyhead'71

Well-Known Member
Instead of a Beatles/Yellow Submarine ride, how about a recreation of The Cavern Club and have a good Beatles tribute band do sets every 45 mins.

807_large_1.jpg


Hey, more food and liquor sales.
 

culturenthrills

Well-Known Member
It wasn't always that way. But while UNI now seems to attract a higher caliber guest than Disney in general during the day and at its resorts, well, HHNs is a different story. It's often a trashfest due to the Frequent Fear Pass (had one last year for the first time, won't be repeating) where so many locals who drink and use drugs and are young and dumb are prevalent.

I've only once felt unsafe. That was last year when there was a group of wannabe gangstas who kept pushing my group, playing the touching game (not funny in middle school, much less funny when it's a 29-year-old stranger) ... I finally was about to leave and go find a cop when all of a sudden I heard a scream and turned to see that four of the guys in this group of 12 were beating the **** out of each other.

It took almost four minutes for police, followed by UNI security, to get there, which is insane.

Bill Davis and his OPs team is well aware they have a problem, a major one. But they just look at the bottom line and this event prints money.

But I'm done with it. I'd rather head to SoCal and do the events there (usually in much better weather too!)

FWIW, we arrived at 6:45 for a Thursday night 2a.m. close and did six of eight houses (only missed Dracula and From Dusk Til Dawn), saw Bill and Ted's and had dinner at Finnegan's. That's less than I have ever done considering we left the park at 2:40 a.m. And we wouldn't have gotten to see The Walking Dead (MUCH better than last year's) if not for the kindness of Dusty and Fishbulb of Micechat who gave @Lee and I two of their Express Passes that hadn't been scanned for that house for some reason. At that point, the wait was something like 140 minutes and I wouldn't wait that long for anything in a theme park anywhere.

OPs are a nightmare because they refuse to put caps on attendance and/or Express Pass sales. I don't think we waited longer than 45-50 minutes for anything (@Lee might recall better), but I am a Spirit who flat out doesn't believe in waiting more than 15-20 minutes for anything, so some lines felt like an eternity. And again, UNI does nothing to dress up the fact you are backstage in parking lots and dark areas etc ... nothing ... well, except for selling alcohol.

Once in the houses, they try their damndest to rush you in and out, so scares are few as is the opportunity to see some of the amazing design work that is put into the event.

It's all about $$$, much like Food and Wine Fest ...and what were once great events that I looked forward to annually going back to the 90s are now events that I largely want no part of.

There seems to be less and less slow nights. Sundays except for the last one used to be not too bad but it seemed like every Sunday was packed and most Thursdays. You really have to plan to do HHN on most nights now. Even on the last Sunday when it was packed we managed to do 6 houses, B&T and all the scare zones(including The Purge show) by 11 and we could have gotten the other 2 if we stayed until the end of the night. You have to get to the gates by 530 or do stay and scream or be an AP and get into the park before it closes at 5. I would never go on most Friday or Saturday, even though wish I went last night because it was dead.
The lines for The Walking Dead house were simply insane most nights. I don't know if this was because of putting it at the front of the park this year or just the huge popularity of the show but it was nuts. I don't know if by having a maze that long it ended up slowing people down.
If there is a cap on Express Pass sales it is pretty high or non existent. They need to find a fine line between the amount they sale and how they merge the lines. TWD and Halloween sometimes had 30-45 min in there express lines.
The really need to look at the OPs of the event. They need to look at either adding another house or two or an additional show to deal with the crowds. Because with it being the 25th next year I think the crowds will be even worse.

All that said I thought this year was the best HHN in years. There where so many great mazes. Halloween was awesome. Great design, cant believe they got all of that in a tent, a lot of well designed scares. The Walking Dead was epic. Can't believe how huge it was and had so many details esp for hardcore fans. AvP really blew me away. One of the most 3 dimensional mazes they have done. Had a claustrophobic feel to it like the first Alien movie and the Alien puppets and Predator costumes really took it to the next level. Dollhouse was just creepy as hell. LIke a childhood nightmare come to life. Roanoke while a typical cannibal house just had amazing set design. The sets where huge and detailed. Giggles and Gore was a different twist on a clown maze but I am guessing we will have a better clown maze next year since "you know who" will be back. From Dusk Til Dawn and Dracula just didn't have enough scares. Nice design but seemed lacking. So I thought the houses were better than last year.
And thank god we finally have the return of full blown scare zones. All were well designed and the scare actors were really good this year(A friend of mine, a long time HHN vet, was the performance captain for the scare zones this year and she did a great job) but The Purge:Anarchy is one of the best scare zones in years. It was epic, the design of having the scare actors in regular clothes with the creepy masks and the victims running around too, caused them to blend in with the crowd and scare the crap out of people. Then the mini show(the capture, auction and escape) was a nice bonus and added to the theming of the area.
Bill and Ted was one of the best shows they have had in awhile. The skewering of Disney was spot on(the Frozen stuff brought the house down every show) and the cast was great. Saw it 4 times throughout the run and the cast brought it every time. Glad they brought back Rocky Horror too. I thought it was one of the best cast they have had for the show.
Overall I thought it was the best HHN in awhile. However, like I and many have said they need to take a hard look at OPs and upping the budget(more houses or shows) before they have a real mess or tragedy on their hands.
 

Little Green Men

Well-Known Member
epcot is a yawn....some great scenery and ambiance but i don't like to pay to walk in a fancy "park" am in not even a horizons fiend....i like the new rides but TT and soaring and MS.....not going to hold it together...sorry energy adventure is horrible...this is 2014 you know that right? and disney is a multi billion dollar company right? and imagination....i have not walked into that building since my first visit in 98...i mean really that is a giant waste of space. and how many kids wait in line to go on a boat through a greenhouse? how many? that's right zero. and hell i will even defend the nemofication of seas because it attracts children and such....and innovations wow....where to begin i mean facepalm.... the WLP is really not a big dseal in the grand scheme at least people forgot about it...

WITHOUT FESTIVALS AND BEER epcot is nothing....it is not a world class theme park and it sure as hell isn't anywhere near what TEA numbers say.

Energy I won't defend because apparently some of the animatronics are being taken away, but last time I went on I enjoyed it and I still get a laugh from the jokes after seeing it many times. If you haven't walked in Imagination since 98 then you have no idea what the ride is in there. I've seen kids on Living with the Land many times, alot seem impressed with the growing techniques. Nemo may be a kid ride, but Seabase still has a lot of experiences. The dolphin show, manatee exhibit, the diving exhibit, etc. InnovENtions sees a decent amount of people. East isn't empty, it has exhibits everywhere. The house of the future was redone, the Sum of All Thrills is very popular. West certainly can use more and has empty space. The IBM exhibit is very good though and definitely fits in EPCOT.
 

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
Right?! Disney and Nintendo already collaborated together with Wreck-It Ralph. I think a dark ride about the history and cultural influence of Mario/Video games via dark ride in Japan would be great!
That's a massive understatement. Disney and Nintendo's dealings go all the way back to the sixties when Walt Disney was still alive and Nintendo (which has been around since the 1880s) acquired a license to produce playing cards and board games with Disney characters, which ended up becoming some of the best selling items of the period.
There were only two licensed out properties used in the Game and Watch series of the 80s and one of those properties was Mickey. Through Rare, Nintendo made that Mickey racing game for the N64, as opposed to all the various third parties that have produced Disney games over the years and it was Nintendo themselves that published Epic Mickey in Japan. On the other side of things, WDW hosted some Nintendo tourneys in the early 90s and unfortunately, it was a Disney subsidiary that produced that horrible Super Mario Bros movie.
 

TP2000

Well-Known Member
I think thats more of a leadership issue. I see LOTS of custodial CMs just socializing with one another on stage rather than cleaning.

BINGO! I see the exact same thing in both WDW and Disneyland. Two Custodial CM's walking together talking, maybe one will sweep up a napkin every so often. Or two or three of them just standing around in a corner leaning on their dustpans, talking about maybe sweeping up a napkin later in their shift.

And you have to think, they would be so much more effective if they shut up, split up, and looked at the ground and swept.

There appears to be a serious management problem with Custodial crews in all the parks. Obviously their general duties require them to be out in the park fairly unsupervised. So why not tag their brooms or ID cards with RFID chips and then monitor where they go and what other CM's they interact with during their shift? You could create a computer program that tracks their whereabouts and how much time they spent "Onstage" without hanging out with other Custodial CM's gossiping. I imagine it's also fairly easy for them to disappear "Backstage" or in little hidden spots and just chill out on their phone when they are supposed to be sweeping Adventureland.

RFID tracking of their whereabouts would solve that very quickly. And keep the parks much cleaner.

This Custodial CM problem doesn't apply to the Tokyo parks. In my multiple visits to Tokyo Disneyland and DisneySea, I have never once seen a Custodial CM not sweeping alone. And PERFECTLY uniformed in starched white, slim fitting uniforms. But always with a smile and ready to focus on a visitor if needed, then they go right back to scanning the ground and sweeping anything they can find. Alone. Somehow, management of lone CM's isn't a problem in Tokyo.
 
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