The Spirited Back Nine ...

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
Meanwhile, that $400M in 1971 represented 230% of the entire company's revenue for that year. Roy Disney was serious about investing in Orlando, and he drove the company to its limits to do so.

Conversely, the $2B being spent at WDW represents less than 5% of the company's revenue in 2014.

Not to detract from the point you are making, and I largely agree with, but that's probably not the fairest comparison either. Disney is a goliath of a company now, with many, many other divisions. Unless Disney was cash strapped amongst multiple different sectors, it would be unfair to think that revenues from ESPN for example should always be siphoned to WDW specifically.

From the most recent quarter - as a whole - The Park and Resorts specific operating income (minus operational loss) is 3.273 billion. Meanwhile, the investments in Parks/Resorts and Other properties was 3.311 billion. Of course the primary problem being, at least from the WDW-centric viewpoint, the money WDW largely brings for this division as a whole is partially being invested elsewhere.

Now on the other hand I do agree: the rest of the of the corporation could push P&R investments beyond that ~100%. Instead they are investing a lot of money in stock buybacks. P&R are the largest tangible asset they have on their balance sheet after all. Long term the corporation is better off focusing on expanding its existing divisions or look to acquisitions, before just buying back stock.

Isn't the sage advice - the best investments long term are "property"... P&R are literally just that. I suppose IP/brand is a type of property too, as long as you are good stewards of it. Stocks on the other hand are a fickle beast.
 
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EPCOTCenterLover

Well-Known Member
I suggest you to be very careful when using inflation calculators. Except for a few consumer goods, they rarely portray an accurate representation of the true cost of inflation.

When Disney opened the Magic Kingdom in 1971, it wasn't only building a theme park. It was constructing an entire infrastructure including draining & clearing swamp land, building a monorail, 2 hotels, roads, and utilities. Do you really think that anyone could do that today for $2.3B?

Meanwhile, that $400M in 1971 represented 230% of the entire company's revenue for that year. Roy Disney was serious about investing in Orlando, and he drove the company to its limits to do so.

Conversely, the $2B being spent at WDW represents less than 5% of the company's revenue in 2014.

Stated differently, the $2B being spent over the next 6 years at WDW represents less than one-third of the $6.5B spent on stock buybacks in 2014 alone.

The company has priorities and Orlando is not one of them. :banghead:

Corporate Disney is investing nothing more than the bare minimum to fix 2 theme parks that have been allowed to languish for over a decade.
If they want to not invest for over a decade, thats ok. I just won't go back until they change their ways. Haven't been to WDW in almost 6.
 

Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
I don't disagree that it really is the bare minimum needed and the percentage isn't large compared to historic numbers, but in terms of whole dollars spent it's pretty significant. Some quick numbers:

  • The original WDW opened in 1971 and cost $400M to build. Adjusted for inflation to 2014 dollars that's about $2.3B
  • The original EPCOT center cost $1.4B to build in 1982. Adjusted for inflation to 2014 dollars that's about $3.4B.
  • Disney MGM Studios cost about $500M to build. Adjusted for inflation that's about $1B
  • AK was built in 1998 and cost about $1B to build. Adjusted for inflation that's about $1.5B.
Added together all 4 parks as they stood on their opening days would cost just north of $8B to build in 2014 dollars. They are planning on spending about a third of that or roughly the coat of both AK and DHS combined. It's still a significant investment.

Looking at it another way the $2.5B represents 1.5% of revenue expected for the decade. If they bumped it up even a little to 5% they could spend roughly the same $8B inflation adjusted cost to build all 4 existing parks. I know this is fuzzy math because construction costs have increased at a much higher rate than inflation, but it gives you an idea of the ballpark and scale of what could be accomplished. If they jumped all the way up to the 20% of revenue number that @ford91exploder was quoting from the Eisner era that would be $32B to spend in a decade. I know they have cruise ships and timeshares and foreign parks too, but I don't know if there are enough projects to get to that level of spending. It would be a crazy level of building unlike anything seen in the history of the company.
pretty sure the parks would cost way more in today's dollars.. because you're thinking only in price difference (money wise) but not in the construction issues and delays.
Disney Builds SLOW AS CRAP now.
Building something like epcot would take.. what? 10 years by using Current Disney's building speed?
 

Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
Not to detract from the point you are making, and I largely agree with, but that's probably not the fairest comparison either. Disney is a goliath of a company now, with many, many other divisions. Unless Disney was cash strapped amongst multiple different sectors, it would be unfair to think that revenues from ESPN for example should always be siphoned to WDW specifically.

From the most recent quarter - as a whole - The Park and Resorts specific operating income (minus operational loss) is 3.273 billion. Meanwhile, the investments in Parks/Resorts and Other properties was 3.311 billion. Of course the primary problem being, at least from the WDW-centric viewpoint, the money WDW largely brings for this division as a whole is partially being invested elsewhere.

Now on the other hand I do agree: the rest of the of the corporation could push P&R investments beyond that ~100%. Instead they are investing a lot of money in stock buybacks. P&R are the largest tangible asset they have on their balance sheet after all. Long term the corporation is better off focusing on expanding its existing divisions or look to acquisitions, before just buying back stock.

Isn't the sage advice - the best investments long term are "property"... P&R are literally just that. I suppose IP/brand is a type of property too, as long as you are good stewards of it. Stocks on the other hand are a fickle beast.
Well, aren't they syphoning almost all the money from all areas to do the stock buyback? :cool:
 

Next Big Thing

Well-Known Member
The obvious choice for another international park would be somewhere in South America (probably Brazil). No clue if there is enough of a base of customers to keep it running. Disney has generally partnered with foreign governments and other corporations on international projects. I'm not sure how stable the political environment is in Brazil, but China had some risks and they went forward with a second park there.
I think the obvious choice for another international park is a second Hong Kong park.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
I admit the inflation calculation is fuzzy math. It was just to show the scale of money we are talking about. Forget about the past for a minute. If WDW did build a 5th gate today what would the budget likely be? $2.5B is likely in the ballpark. Possibly a little more, but not much. Shanghai's original budget was around $4B but that included the park, 2 hotels, recreation areas and all the surrounding infrastructure. I think it's a bit over budget now so the total cost will be more than $4B. Of course Disney is only covering a portion of that cost.

My only point is that $2.5B is that despite not being a large percentage of P&R revenue it's still a substantial amount of money. I agree it's doing what needs to be done for those parks just like DCA 2.0 was for that park. I agree that WDW hasn't been a priority for the company lately and I'm not saying spending $2.5B makes up for the past decade, but it's still a significant investment.
Actually it's not inflation adjusted
 

Ignohippo

Well-Known Member
Wow. Great conversation @GoofGoof and @ParentsOf4 !! Thanks!

I would only add that after a major investment in the parks, how TWDCo could relatively coast on the income from the parks for a decade or two with minimal investment. So, in essence, any major expenditure could be thought of as a 15 year investment (although it wouldn't be that way on the books).

Heck, they've been coasting that way for 20 years on parks that were never truly fully-built out in the first place anyway.
 

ParentsOf4

Well-Known Member
Not to detract from the point you are making, and I largely agree with, but that's probably not the fairest comparison either. Disney is a goliath of a company now, with many, many other divisions. Unless Disney was cash strapped amongst multiple different sectors, it would be unfair to think that revenues from ESPN for example should always be siphoned to WDW specifically.
But Disney siphons off revenue from WDW to spend elsewhere all the time. ;)

Are you suggesting that using WDW revenue to spend elsewhere is ok, but using other revenue to invest in WDW is not?

Now you are thinking like Iger. :D

As far as relative sizes, my point is that today's Disney is much more capable of investing $7.5 billion over 15 years for a significant WDW upgrade than the 1971 Disney was capable of investing $400M over 4 years to create the original WDW.

Some might ask, "$7.5B over 15 years? Where is that number coming from?"

In addition to the $2.5B over 10 years (2011-2020) mentioned by @GoofGoof, WDW really does need a 5th theme park by about 2025 to handle crowds and maintain growth. The extra $5B is a rough estimate of a fully realized 5th theme park in Orlando.

Between 2015 and 2025, total Parks & Resorts (P&R) revenue will be well over $200B, probably over $250B. $5B is a drop in the bucket to invest in Disney's largest single source of revenue.

WDW's attendance is at record levels and, 10 years from now, will be even higher. WDW needs the extra capacity (and revenue ;)) provided by a 5th theme park.

I've written the following point a couple of times but people seem to miss it, so I'll write it again:

New lands at DHS and DAK are not enough. Adding a few attractions (which will attract even more Guests) is not going to solve WDW's capacity problem. In addition to the work already planned at DHS and DAK, WDW is going to need a 5th theme park next decade to handle the increased demand.
From the most recent quarter - as a whole - The Park and Resorts specific operating income (minus operational loss) is 3.273 billion. Meanwhile, the investments in Parks/Resorts and Other properties was 3.311 billion.
Capital expenditure (capex) generally is measured against revenue, not operating income. Even if a company is losing money, it needs to spend on its facilities and products to stay afloat. In fact, wise capex investment is one way for a company to restore profitability.

Disney's domestic P&R revenue in 2014 was $12.329B while domestic P&R capex was $1.184B.

"Wow," you say, "Disney spent $1.2B domestically. That's great."

There are a couple of misconceptions with this line of thinking.

First, at 9.6% of revenue, domestic P&R capex is less than half Disney's historical average over the decades. In fact, 9.6% is one of Disney's lowest ever.

Second, the capex being spent is for maintenance, not for investment.

In the business world, there tends to be two types of capex: growth and maintenance.

Growth (or investment) capex is aimed at expansion. When a factory adds an assembly line to its plant, it’s expanding capacity. It’s investing in growth. The New Fantasyland, Toy Story Mania, and Pandora are examples of growth capex.

When a factory replaces a machine in an existing assembly line, it’s updating something that’s no longer serviceable. It’s not expanding capacity. It’s simply trying to maintain its old capacity. That’s generally considered maintenance capex. A few years ago, much of Main Street U.S.A. was covered in tarps for repairs to the structures, which were rotting after years of use. This is an example of maintenance capex.

It’s possible for the exact same item to be growth capex in one instance and maintenance capex in another.

Let’s say WDW replaces an old bus. That’s maintenance capex. Conversely, let’s say WDW increases the number of buses in its fleet. That’s growth capex.

A project such as the Magic Kingdom hub redesign can be difficult to classify. Is Disney maintaining something that’s more than 40 years old or expanding capacity? It’s probably a bit of both.

Companies are not required to distinguish between growth and maintenance capex in their public disclosures. Therefore, it’s hard for outsiders to distinguish between the two. The combined costs of depreciation and amortization sometimes are used as a guide.

At Disney, P&R amortization is essentially $0.

However, in 2014, domestic P&R depreciation was $1.117B.

So, domestic P&R capex was less than $1.2B while domestic P&R depreciation was over $1.1B.

Overwhelmingly, the money being spent at WDW today is just to keep an aging facility from falling apart. :(
 
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PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
Or just build higher capacity monorails to match increased park attendance.

Sorry, never mind, don't know what I was thinking. Buses are magical and so much more efficient (how is a non-stop express train supposed to compete with a bunch of buses all stuck in traffic trying to enter or leave the park). :banghead:

Yeah, I know... :rolleyes:

Exactly what is a "higher capacity monorail" and how is it supposed to fit in the existing station?
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
New lands at DHS and DAK are not enough. Adding a few attractions (which will attract even more Guests) is not going to solve WDW's capacity problem. In addition to the work already planned at DHS and DAK, WDW is going to need a 5th theme park next decade to handle the increased demand.
I understand what you are saying, but, it brings up a question in my mind. It seems to me that the only park that is having serious capacity problems would be MK. There are three other parks that are usually not even close to capacity.

There are some things underway to help alleviate the capacity of the most popular attractions in DHS, for example the added track to TSMM. Also the added theater to Soarin will help that specific attraction meet capacity. What about the rest of the park. You don't usually find massive crowds anyplace in any of those parks except the major, so called, e-ticket rides. The rest can sometimes look like a ghost town. Adding quality attractions to those park may increase the number of people in the parks over all, but it would be directing it to areas that had the room to handle it. At the same time it would serve to draw away from MK because, god forbid, they would have something else worth of seeing.

Adding Pandora to DAK will increase the number of people that spend more time in DAK (hopefully) again filling a large space with more people and helping draw away from MK.

I guess that, personally, I have no desire for a 5th Gate. I have my fill with 4 and especially would if the other three had something worth spending time experiencing. How many more people can fit in Epcot then presently attend? Quite a few, I would guess. DHS has a land space problem, but anything that would spread out the crowd at any given time will help with overcrowding. DAK has gigantic amount of space over all of them and almost absolutely nothing for people to see and spend a day seeing. That, in my mind, needs to be addressed immediately to see if that helps the capacity situation before spending 7.5B on a new Gate that actually does bring in more people from the outside instead of attempting to balance out the crowds in what currently exists.

They also need to spend some time figuring out how to maintain what they have and not add additional need to an already slacking ability to keep up. They need more time and people management to make that happen. Everyone talks about how downhill they have all gone since the early years, yet, refuse to acknowledge that those early years consisted of mostly just one park, then two. It wasn't until after the third was in place that it started to noticeably lack in proper control of maintenance. Coincidence?... I really don't think so. They are just plain overwhelmed at WDW. The blessing of size as Walt so lovingly referred to it, is really a nightmare of size when the real world of problems and challenges is introduced. One more Gate is just going to make that situation that much worse. We can sit here and say all day that... "well, all they have to do is hire more people to do it". If that were the solution it would have been done a long time ago. The need for maintenance is a variable from day to day. Disney has always tried to limit the bigger maintenance procedures to after park hours. Has anyone ever tried to staff a graveyard shift? Has anyone ever tried to staff a graveyard shift with highly skilled craftsmen? It may sound easy, but, it truly isn't. What highly skilled worker wants to spend his nights working and spend his days sleeping while his family is out and about. It got the name graveyard shift for a reason... it's a killer.

I don't see a need to ever have a 5th Gate. There is a limit to how much growth is possible and to assume that the Central Florida growth rate will continue at it's current pace over the next 10 years is a highly optimistic viewpoint. What happens to a place like Disney when (not if) the economy takes another downturn or unexpected world events (like 911) happen and knock the pins out from the tourist industry again. Don't tell me it cannot happen because it most certainly can. When you also, take into account the number of worldwide Disney parks that there are both now and in construction competing with what used to be a guest draw from other countries there will be no need to travel to Florida to experience a Disney park.

I just do not see any current or future need for yet another park to be left to fall into disrepair, which we already know, from past experience, will happen.
 
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BrianLo

Well-Known Member
But Disney siphons off revenue from WDW to spend elsewhere all the time. ;)

Are you suggesting that using WDW revenue to spend elsewhere is ok, but using other revenue to invest in WDW is not?

Now you are thinking like Iger. :D

Ha ha! I appreciate the dialogue. I fully admit I do not have an educational background remotely related to Economics, so this is very educational. Iger hasn't been the best steward of WDW, although as a whole I largely like the way Disney is headed across many of its other divisions. Who that's attributed to is a very different topic for another time! :D

The company as a whole SHOULD siphon money towards WDW, especially when it needs it, but obviously not in an unsustainable manner. WDW is rolling off a poor decade as it is, but if the circumstances were slightly different, it wouldn't have been unreasonable for WDW to be supporting Shanghai and bailing out Paris right now. In the case of our reality though, the stock buy-backs should be taking care of Shanghai and Paris, leaving WDW to actually invest in itself. I'm sure we can all come up with a massive list of things they could be using that money for instead, trying to become more than just a niche market in the cruise ship industry for starters.

The way Disney as a whole operates, that's the one scary part of a 5th gate. It shifts the resources further away from investing as if each park were its own entity. Instead it's very easy for execs to step back and say the "resort" is getting New Fantasyland, Animal Kingdom investment and a DHS redo in ten years. Seems ok for the resort as a whole, but not so good for Epcot as an isolated park.

I agree, Disney is back to doing the bare minimum: Large scale projects every 3 years in the resort with entertainment, infrastructure and the occasional E- or D- ticket or large refurb in the off years. In one sense that's a heck of a lot better than what was happening in the 2000's, in the other it's barely enough, and would definitely not be enough with a 5th gate in the mix.

I'd argue a 2 year cycles for the top tier projects is really a benchmark they should be aiming for. There is no reason a gate should be left to mostly languish for more than a decade. If and when a 5th gate comes into the mix, unless investments pick up by ~25% accordingly (and that's not the way Disney tends to think), the problem only worsens!
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
pretty sure the parks would cost way more in today's dollars.. because you're thinking only in price difference (money wise) but not in the construction issues and delays.
Disney Builds SLOW AS **** now.
Building something like epcot would take.. what? 10 years by using Current Disney's building speed?
Yep. I agree. That's why I called it fuzzy math (anyone else here old enough to remember the Bush/Gore debate?).
Actually it's not inflation adjusted
It's adjusted for simple inflation using an inflation calculator. I already acknowledged that construction costs have risen faster than inflation. I know they couldn't build a whole park today for $1B. The point wasn't to say what past projects could be built today, but to show the scale of the numbers. $2.5B may be a small percentage of TWDC's total revenue but it's a large sum when talking about theme park projects.

Bear with me on another sports analogy. The Dodgers have a payroll north of $230M and climbing. It's a staggering sum of money that would have even made George Steinbrenner blush. The reason...they scored a TV contract that's worth something like $9B over 20 years. Even though they have the largest payroll in MLB by a lot, their payroll as a percentage of revenue is probably not in the top 10 in the league. They could probably afford to spend $300M+ and still make a profit. Because they aren't spending $300M doesn't change the fact that their payroll is still substantial and they have some very good players on their roster. In Disney terms, even though the $2.5B isn't a large portion of TWDC's total revenue it still represents a substantial investment in WDW. And yes...a much needed and probably long overdue one.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
But Disney siphons off revenue from WDW to spend elsewhere all the time. ;)

Are you suggesting that using WDW revenue to spend elsewhere is ok, but using other revenue to invest in WDW is not?

Now you are thinking like Iger. :D

As far as relative sizes, my point is that today's Disney is much more capable of investing $7.5 billion over 15 years for a significant WDW upgrade than the 1971 Disney was capable of investing $400M over 4 years to create the original WDW.

Some might ask, "$7.5B over 15 years? Where is that number coming from?"

In addition to the $2.5B over 10 years (2011-2020) mentioned by @GoofGoof, WDW really does need a 5th theme park by about 2025 to handle crowds and maintain growth. The extra $5B is a rough estimate of a fully realized 5th theme park in Orlando.

Between 2015 and 2025, total Parks & Resorts (P&R) revenue will be well over $200B, probably over $250B. $5B is a drop in the bucket to invest in Disney's largest single source of revenue.

WDW's attendance is at record levels and, 10 years from now, will be even higher. WDW needs the extra capacity (and revenue ;)) provided by a 5th theme park.

I've written the following point a couple of times but people seem to miss it, so I'll write it again:

New lands at DHS and DAK are not enough. Adding a few attractions (which will attract even more Guests) is not going to solve WDW's capacity problem. In addition to the work already planned at DHS and DAK, WDW is going to need a 5th theme park next decade to handle the increased demand.

Capital expenditure (capex) generally is measured against revenue, not operating income. Even if a company is losing money, it needs to spend on its facilities and products to stay afloat. In fact, wise capex investment is one way for a company to restore profitability.

Disney's domestic P&R revenue in 2014 was $12.329B while domestic P&R capex was $1.184B.

"Wow," you say, "Disney spent $1.2B domestically. That's great."

There are a couple of misconceptions with this line of thinking.

First, at 9.6% of revenue, domestic P&R capex is less than half Disney's historical average over the decades. In fact, 9.6% is one of Disney's lowest ever.

Second, the capex being spent is for maintenance, not for investment.

In the business world, there tends to be two types of capex: growth and maintenance.

Growth (or investment) capex is aimed at expansion. When a factory adds an assembly line to its plant, it’s expanding capacity. It’s investing in growth. The New Fantasyland, Toy Story Mania, and Pandora are examples of growth capex.

When a factory replaces a machine in an existing assembly line, it’s updating something that’s no longer serviceable. It’s not expanding capacity. It’s simply trying to maintain its old capacity. That’s generally considered maintenance capex. A few years ago, much of Main Street U.S.A. was covered in tarps for repairs to the structures, which were rotting after years of use. This is an example of maintenance capex.

It’s possible for the exact same item to be growth capex in one instance and maintenance capex in another.

Let’s say WDW replaces an old bus. That’s maintenance capex. Conversely, let’s say WDW increases the number of buses in its fleet. That’s growth capex.

A project such as the Magic Kingdom hub redesign can be difficult to classify. Is Disney maintaining something that’s more than 40 years old or expanding capacity? It’s probably a bit of both.

Companies are not required to distinguish between growth and maintenance capex in their public disclosures. Therefore, it’s hard for outsiders to distinguish between the two. The combined costs of depreciation and amortization sometimes are used as a guide.

At Disney, P&R amortization is essentially $0.

However, in 2014, domestic P&R depreciation was $1.117B.

So, domestic P&R capex was less than $1.2B while domestic P&R depreciation was over $1.1B.

Overwhelmingly, the money being spent at WDW today is just to keep an aging facility from falling apart. :(

I think adding a 5th gate for $5B may be easier to justify from an ROI perspective than spending $2.5B on existing parks. Adding a 5th gate would provide justification to raise multi-day ticket prices. You would also get a huge short term boost from people coming to see the 5th park. If FLE resulted in attendance growth imagine a whole new park.

Another issue is the more you build the more maintenance capex you have in the future. One of the reasons they tend to close less popular or more "expensive" rides while building new ones is to balance that out.
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
But Disney siphons off revenue from WDW to spend elsewhere all the time. ;)

Are you suggesting that using WDW revenue to spend elsewhere is ok, but using other revenue to invest in WDW is not?

Now you are thinking like Iger. :D

As far as relative sizes, my point is that today's Disney is much more capable of investing $7.5 billion over 15 years for a significant WDW upgrade than the 1971 Disney was capable of investing $400M over 4 years to create the original WDW.

Some might ask, "$7.5B over 15 years? Where is that number coming from?"

In addition to the $2.5B over 10 years (2011-2020) mentioned by @GoofGoof, WDW really does need a 5th theme park by about 2025 to handle crowds and maintain growth. The extra $5B is a rough estimate of a fully realized 5th theme park in Orlando.

Between 2015 and 2025, total Parks & Resorts (P&R) revenue will be well over $200B, probably over $250B. $5B is a drop in the bucket to invest in Disney's largest single source of revenue.

WDW's attendance is at record levels and, 10 years from now, will be even higher. WDW needs the extra capacity (and revenue ;)) provided by a 5th theme park.

I've written the following point a couple of times but people seem to miss it, so I'll write it again:

New lands at DHS and DAK are not enough. Adding a few attractions (which will attract even more Guests) is not going to solve WDW's capacity problem. In addition to the work already planned at DHS and DAK, WDW is going to need a 5th theme park next decade to handle the increased demand.

Capital expenditure (capex) generally is measured against revenue, not operating income. Even if a company is losing money, it needs to spend on its facilities and products to stay afloat. In fact, wise capex investment is one way for a company to restore profitability.

Disney's domestic P&R revenue in 2014 was $12.329B while domestic P&R capex was $1.184B.

"Wow," you say, "Disney spent $1.2B domestically. That's great."

There are a couple of misconceptions with this line of thinking.

First, at 9.6% of revenue, domestic P&R capex is less than half Disney's historical average over the decades. In fact, 9.6% is one of Disney's lowest ever.

Second, the capex being spent is for maintenance, not for investment.

In the business world, there tends to be two types of capex: growth and maintenance.

Growth (or investment) capex is aimed at expansion. When a factory adds an assembly line to its plant, it’s expanding capacity. It’s investing in growth. The New Fantasyland, Toy Story Mania, and Pandora are examples of growth capex.

When a factory replaces a machine in an existing assembly line, it’s updating something that’s no longer serviceable. It’s not expanding capacity. It’s simply trying to maintain its old capacity. That’s generally considered maintenance capex. A few years ago, much of Main Street U.S.A. was covered in tarps for repairs to the structures, which were rotting after years of use. This is an example of maintenance capex.

It’s possible for the exact same item to be growth capex in one instance and maintenance capex in another.

Let’s say WDW replaces an old bus. That’s maintenance capex. Conversely, let’s say WDW increases the number of buses in its fleet. That’s growth capex.

A project such as the Magic Kingdom hub redesign can be difficult to classify. Is Disney maintaining something that’s more than 40 years old or expanding capacity? It’s probably a bit of both.

Companies are not required to distinguish between growth and maintenance capex in their public disclosures. Therefore, it’s hard for outsiders to distinguish between the two. The combined costs of depreciation and amortization sometimes are used as a guide.

At Disney, P&R amortization is essentially $0.

However, in 2014, domestic P&R depreciation was $1.117B.

So, domestic P&R capex was less than $1.2B while domestic P&R depreciation was over $1.1B.

Overwhelmingly, the money being spent at WDW today is just to keep an aging facility from falling apart. :(
Love the way you use all these numbers to support your argument. Like what has been said before, if a fifth gate does come, it needs to be full of things to do. No nonsense like when AK opened.
Nothing ever comes back.

Nothing.
So this guy is nothing then?
image.jpg

Not saying WoL is coming back or anything, just that it's possible if Disney wanted to (especially if Inside Out is successful).
 

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