I couldn't agree more with your observations. We spent 10 days at the parks in November and I was shocked at the surly cast members. And the fast pass seemed to take some of the magic out of our trip. Too much scheduling. We left with the same thoughts. Fun but enough. We've always left with that "I need to go back again" feeling, but not this time.
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The Spirited Back Nine ...
- Thread starter WDW1974
- Start date
I couldn't agree more with your observations. We spent 10 days at the parks in November and I was shocked at the surly cast members. And the fast pass seemed to take some of the magic out of our trip. Too much scheduling. We left with the same thoughts. Fun but enough. We've always left with that "I need to go back again" feeling, but not this time.
BrianLo
Well-Known Member
I know this is hyperbole, but no, they most definitely could not. It wasn't all that long ago they nearly broke the bank on their second park...
The capital they can eventually raise would be better spent on their own third park down the line anyways.
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
Please don't take this the wrong way, but we're not discussing the price of a burger at your cafeteria.
We're discussing what WDW was like years ago versus what it's like now and how that has resulted in grumpier Guests and Cast Members.
A 7-day base MYW ticket costs 53% more than it did when it was first introduced in 2005. Over that same period, median household income is up only 17%. A WDW vacation is taking a bigger bite out of most people's paychecks.
Over the last decade, WDW annual attendance is up 11 million. That's more than an entire theme park's worth of 'Guests' crammed into the same 4 theme parks.
Comparing WDW to WDW, WDW has never charged so much.
Comparing WDW to WDW, WDW has never been so crowded.
You don't have to look any further to understand why both Guests and Cast Members don't behave as nicely as 10 years ago, and why they are taking it out on each other at the parks.
asianway
Well-Known Member
If you can raise the capital, you can buy anything...
OLC has a proven track record in this area
GoofGoof
Premium Member
Imagine how crowded the parks would be if they didn't raise prices so much
May be getting close to time for that 5th gate too.
Mike S
Well-Known Member
How about using the empty spaces available for expansion in the existing parks first? You know, fill them as much as you can like Disneyland so they can individually meet the demand of the millions of guests who enter the parks each year.Imagine how crowded the parks would be if they didn't raise prices so much
May be getting close to time for that 5th gate too.
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misterID
Well-Known Member
George Jefferson?
That's why MK is my least favorite park at WDW. The vibe is all wrong. Even the nieces and nephews would rather stay at DHS and EPCOT.
EPCOTCenterLover
Well-Known Member
Yes, this is true. I was there two days ago (detailed trip report coming!) and the cast members at both parks were wonderful- happy and helpful. A great experience with the cast. Some surprises I didn't expect though...
misterID
Well-Known Member
Oh no, it's not some new thing, or some manifestation of an online persona... This is real human behavior. There was always a stressful nature to Magic Kingdom, some of it was actually kind of funny seeing the young family having a total melt down... Mom screaming, father slumped on a bench, head in hands, defeated, kids crying.... It has been getting worse, perhaps money has something to do with it. But no, these are not online personas, this is real personalities and they're ugly.
This board is way more civil than a day at Magic Kingdom.
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
You're missing the point.
Today's WDW is bursting at the seams.
New lands in existing parks are needed but they are going to attract additional Guests while adding only limited capacity.
I've looked at historical data and believe that by the middle of next decade, operationally and financially, WDW will need a 5th Gate.
Building a theme park takes time, especially for Disney.
Therefore, even as they move forward with the current expansions, they need to earnestly start planning for WDW's next theme park.
It's not a matter of "fix the current theme parks" or "build a 5th theme park".
By 2025, both will be needed.
If you haven't done so, please read my post on this link explaining the financial justification for a 5th theme park.
flynnibus
Premium Member
But there you get to replace the painful CMs with painful guests around you
And I would have put mostly in the air quotes.
misterID
Well-Known Member
Ah, that makes me feel bad for you, actually. Not to beat a dead horse, but the worst CM experiences I've ever had were at MK. EPCOT has always been a great experience; inviting CMs who will talk, engage and joke with you. The kids working at the Starbucks actually remembered me from a few days before.
I think it's best to really spread the WDW trip out. We take two days to do MK so it's less stressful. And spend a day at UNI just to change things up. Go to the beach. And yeah, staying offsite is great.
flynnibus
Premium Member
I think it's more that other locations learned that people WILL pay.. so just like the theme park ticket prices just chased the guy willing to charge the most... food service is doing the same thing. They know you will pay for a $8 hotdog at the stadium... so why charge $3? Let's push the limit and charge $5.. and then the next guy goes 'they'll pay $5, why not $6?' and it continues.
No matter how you cut it though, the premium charged by WDW is absurd. Others have just stepped in the vacuum behind it. Very few things WDW keeps competitive (like drink prices)... everything else... off to the races.
$1.75 for an apple?? That's what you can pay at a kiosk at WDW.
$2.50 for a bottle of water..
$16 for a freaking SALAD at Brown Derby
$38 a PLATE for lamb..
These prices are nuts. Those prices are not 10-20% over priced, they are over 3x over priced. You've just become numb to them because other locations are following and doing the same.
I'm glad you had fun, but your post eloquently points out a truism: having fun is not the proper standard for evaluating a Disney park or Disney vacation. There are lots of places to have fun. For example, my wife and I went to DCA 1.0 shortly after it opened and decided it was a fun park. We also both hated it greatly. Little or no "magic" and a wasted opportunity. The "wow" is what makes a Disney vacation special, and it was almost completely missing then from that park. It was then that I realized that fun alone is just like sugar- empty calories.
BTW, I suspect it isn't you that has changed. Santa in his own way is real and timeless. WDW not necessarily so.
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
Yes they do indeed - always something new
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
I assume you do not travel much, Disney's cost premium is about 100-150% above comparable properties.
Cesar R M
Well-Known Member
except WDW's Magic Kingdom's burgers were worse than Mcdonalds quality wise. and they cost like twice.
There are some things that are beyond ridiculous price wise vs value.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
You're both wrong... it was Franklin.
Considering it is the common consensus that Disney is destroying the parks, why would you want Disney to buy out OLC. They are the ones doing it right.
Can someone explain that phenomenon to me? How are those two thoughts compatible? If Disney is terribly over priced and it takes such a larger part of ones paycheck to actually go there, how is it possible that there are more people there then ever before. It just doesn't make sense, economics wise. Perhaps the vast majority of that high end charging is in the resorts and dining sector. Since the overall resort census is down they must be staying elsewhere and eating elsewhere. The cost of admittance is high but only in percentage. It is affordable because even though the percentage is higher WDW to WDW it is not that way when total income is considered. It doesn't matter what the rate of inflation is, if you have enough money to pay the admittance you will go and that part will not cause you to melt down. It is already spent before you ever set foot in the park.
Now what will cause a meltdown and angry people is that when someone has never been to WDW before shows up unprepared and have done no research they are quickly overwhelmed by the complexity and the need to plan. The problem is it is already to late to plan cause they are there now. Then they try to get something to eat at a sit down restaurant and find that without a ADR they cannot get served. So they have a hungry family standing in place behind a long line at a quick service restaurant. They cannot even sit down until the food is purchased. The QS restaurants are so crowded because Disney, in all their wisdom, will not open another quick service location to ease that problem. Then they have to spend hours in the heat trying to get on a dam* ride because they were not aware of the need to get FP's ahead of time. They see people sitting on the curbs on Main Street a full 2 hours before a parade, but they don't know that's why they are there. So the parade starts and there is a group of people that seem seven feet tall that have a kid on their shoulders standing in front of them so they cannot really see the parade. And the list goes on.
It is frustration, not expense that induces anger. And really, who would think that simply going to a theme park would require a half year of planning? If I had never been there before it would never even occur to me that any planning was required at all. We know that now because of our exposure to it, but, they have no way of knowing without being told directly. They will not research it because they just don't know that they need to do so. So frustrated people are angry people because, yes they are paying a lot for the experience and they are getting very little satisfaction out of it, but, if the experience was good, no matter what it costs, they would not be angry and frustrated.
Cesar R M
Well-Known Member
considering the hard limit of the parks seems to be fixed by some security department (the firefighters right?)Imagine how crowded the parks would be if they didn't raise prices so much
May be getting close to time for that 5th gate too.
I dont see how "more" they would be. during peak time, they would still be at peak.
MinnieM123
Premium Member
Not that any of us can comprehend why some people behave poorly, but I wonder if you think that the upcoming holidays might add an additional layer of stress upon some park-goers? Just a thought, but I wonder if some families try to "do it all" with already busy work and school schedules, a December vacation to WDW, and then making sure they have enough money left over to please everyone on their holiday, or Christmas, shopping list.
Hence, if something doesn't go perfectly, while they're vacationing at WDW, they begin to unravel at the seams. Perhaps this subliminal, beneath-the-surface, stressor might be contributing to some of the normally sane people, who are now acting irrationally.