The Muppets Present… Great Moments in American History'

[Mike S]

To give them a little credit, I've never heard kids complaining in the Hall of Presidents.

 

[Wikkler]

To give them a little credit, I've never heard kids complaining in the Hall of Presidents.

They're asleep.

 

[AEfx]

Well when they're making a Muppet land in DHS why split off Sam the Eagle and put him in Magic Kingdom? Keep characters where they would make the most sense. It's not something I'm mad about at all. It just seems bizarre.

I'm not sure what is bizarre about it. Do you know who Sam the Eagle is? He's a patriotic bald eagle. That's not something just invented for the Muppets 3D film. It's the core of his character. They would have no problem dressing him up and him being in perfect theme with Frontierland - it's not like they would dress him up in a pinstripe suit and dark shades singing 1990's hits...

This is one of those things that makes perfect sense to everyone but folks on a board like this, LOL. Honestly, if you step back and drop a few of these fan-generated "rules" of what belongs where, it's a perfect fit and not a single "normal" guest is going to ever say "Why is this not at the Studios? I don't understand why SAM THE BALD EAGLE is in LIBERTY SQUARE!", hahahaha.

 

[AEfx]

They're imagining a full scenario in their heads, and they're not liking what they're seeing.

You pretty much summed up the problem around here. There are a lot of folks who haven't liked anything for a very, very long time and likely, if they keep going the way they are - are never going to like anything again.

And oh DEAR, the little toddlers might be bored or whine or something during the Hall of Presidents, so they MUST be succored because EVERY SQUARE INCH of a Disney park is, after all, a hideously expensive day care. Come ON. Surely you know better than that.

Oh please, spare the dramatics - what this sounds like is a little side attraction alternative/optional add-on that you can simply walk right past without really noticing if you are so offended.

I certainly have no problem with everything not being designed for little children - in fact, I encourage it - which is another reason I think it's great to give them a little alternative. Liberty Square doesn't have much for the under-5 crowd. I see no problem whatsoever in giving an additional small thing for them to do - helps keep those little buggers out of everyone else's way.

 

[Magenta Panther]

I'm not sure what is bizarre about it. Do you know who Sam the Eagle is? He's a patriotic bald eagle. That's not something just invented for the Muppets 3D film. It's the core of his character. They would have no problem dressing him up and him being in perfect theme with Frontierland - it's not like they would dress him up in a pinstripe suit and dark shades singing 1990's hits...

This is one of those things that makes perfect sense to everyone but folks on a board like this, LOL. Honestly, if you step back and drop a few of these fan-generated "rules" of what belongs where, it's a perfect fit and not a single "normal" guest is going to ever say "Why is this not at the Studios? I don't understand why SAM THE BALD EAGLE is in LIBERTY SQUARE!", hahahaha.

As I mentioned in another post in this thread, Sam the Eagle is not so much a patriotic bald eagle as he is a caricature of jingoism (definition: the feelings and beliefs of people who think that their country is always right and who are in favor of aggressive acts against other countries.) Sam is a character that was created to RIDICULE patriotism, putting him in direct contrast with the theme of the Hall of Presidents. THAT'S why the idea of combining the two is so jarring, even to some here who like the Muppets. And that very fact lends credence to their reaction. And I doubt very much that reaction would be singular to the people on this board. A terrible idea is a terrible idea, whether you recognize it or not. Why does the Hall of Presidents need this? It was never meant to be a kiddie attraction. Why dumb it down now?

 

[Magenta Panther]

You pretty much summed up the problem around here. There are a lot of folks who haven't liked anything for a very, very long time and likely, if they keep going the way they are - are never going to like anything again.

You really think people are objecting to this just out of habit? Seriously?

Oh please, spare the dramatics - what this sounds like is a little side attraction alternative/optional add-on that you can simply walk right past without really noticing if you are so offended.

I certainly have no problem with everything not being designed for little children - in fact, I encourage it - which is another reason I think it's great to give them a little alternative. Liberty Square doesn't have much for the under-5 crowd. I see no problem whatsoever in giving an additional small thing for them to do - helps keep those little buggers out of everyone else's way.

Why should Liberty Square have anything for the under-5 crowd?

 

[SirLink]

It's also kind of ironic as folks are always saying "characters belong in the MK!". and now, we are parsing out the MK. LOL. I mean we actually have folks saying "characters should only be in Fantasyland!" and it's like - uh, guess we need to dismantle Splash Mountain? LOL. We clearly are way past that point, and it's futile to get all riled up about it because - for better or worse - it's never going to happen - and never really was that way, as you say - the characters have been all over the MK since the beginning.

I do think folks are over-reacting to this - or more accurately, knee-jerk reacting to it - without thinking about it practically and contextually. They aren't thinking past the headline.

What it sounds like to me (particularly with the "upstairs" mention) is that they may put some type of small-scale show/presentation (perhaps something like Turtle Talk-lite), aimed at the kids who really are too young to get much out of Hall of Presidents, in the space above. Which we should actually be happy about because that equals less whiny kids in the main presentation.

If they are appealing to small children, they could invent some character/theme, but I see perfectly why they wouldn't - Sam the Eagle is more than perfect for this sort of thing. It's in his DNA. The fact he is a Muppet is rather irrelevant, really - he's just the most appropriate character under Disney control to do such a thing.

If they were talking a Muppet's overlay, with Sam the Eagle sparring with the Presidents, Statler and Waldorf heckling Ben Franklin, etc. - I'd think folks were being a bit less irrational. But this really isn't that crazy of an idea, and if done discretely/well it could be a neat little thing for both small kids and Muppet-fans alike. And who knows - even though some see it as a low-brow move, hey, if some little kid wants to find out more about history - even just asking "Why is Sam an Eagle?" is better than them not paying attention and asking to play with someone's phone because they are bored.

BTW our views don't mesh, the Toons are the only things that should be kept in Fantasyland - for instance Monsters don't belong in Tomorrowland, same with Buzz or even Woody in Frontierland. Splash mountain characters are based on books which have are tales from the frontier. Which I have no problem with the idea of a Splash mountain near to or in Frontierland - Disneyland idea was better in a critter country.

Muppets can be put in any situation really and they just about fit, we have seen them as 1700 pirates and 1800 Charles Dickens characters so it is less of a mental stretch.

 

[Mike S]

Why should Liberty Square have anything for the under-5 crowd?

Technically everything in LS already is. Not a single height limiting attraction. Kids already have the Haunted Mansion if Hall of Presidents is "too boring" (unamerican little brats...)

 

[Yankee Mouse]

I'm not sure what is bizarre about it. Do you know who Sam the Eagle is? He's a patriotic bald eagle. That's not something just invented for the Muppets 3D film. It's the core of his character. They would have no problem dressing him up and him being in perfect theme with Frontierland - it's not like they would dress him up in a pinstripe suit and dark shades singing 1990's hits...

This is one of those things that makes perfect sense to everyone but folks on a board like this, LOL. Honestly, if you step back and drop a few of these fan-generated "rules" of what belongs where, it's a perfect fit and not a single "normal" guest is going to ever say "Why is this not at the Studios? I don't understand why SAM THE BALD EAGLE is in LIBERTY SQUARE!", hahahaha.

They aren't fan-generated rules. They are Walt Disney ideas that have fallen by the wayside over the years because of the bottom line. When you cross the plane into the Magic Kingdom he wanted people to leave the world of today and enter a world of fantasy, which meant total immersion and is one of the reasons for the utilidors, (the cowboy in tomorrowland story). That idea has been corrupted over the years, and is most evident in Tomorrowland (and now Norway). There is nothing in the movies to suggest that Monsters or Stitch or Toy Story takes place in the future. To quote one of my favorite lines in the movies "You are a Toy!!!!"

When I went last year with my 10 year old niece who is just now learning about US history all she talked about was going to the HoP. In fact while her little sister went on the mine train I took her to HoP and she loved it. I guess she is the exception to the rule.

Keep the Muppets where they are, expand it, make it better, give people more than star wars and toy story at DHS.

 

[Bacon]

They're asleep.

Yep sadly same with cop

 

[ford91exploder]

As I mentioned in another post in this thread, Sam the Eagle is not so much a patriotic bald eagle as he is a caricature of jingoism (definition: the feelings and beliefs of people who think that their country is always right and who are in favor of aggressive acts against other countries.) Sam is a character that was created to RIDICULE patriotism, putting him in direct contrast with the theme of the Hall of Presidents. THAT'S why the idea of combining the two is so jarring, even to some here who like the Muppets. And that very fact lends credence to their reaction. And I doubt very much that reaction would be singular to the people on this board. A terrible idea is a terrible idea, whether you recognize it or not. Why does the Hall of Presidents need this? It was never meant to be a kiddie attraction. Why dumb it down now?

Actually patriotism is not a bad thing as it's NOT the same thing as Jingoism which is a truly bad thing especially if it's coming from someone with a 'true believer' mindset.

 

[Wikkler]

Actually patriotism is not a bad thing as it's NOT the same thing as Jingoism which is a truly bad thing especially if it's coming from someone with a 'true believer' mindset.

Sam the Eagle is both patriotic and jingoist.
His wearing of the American flag? Patriotic.
"A Tribute to All Nations, but Mostly America?" Jingoist.

 

[PizzaPlanet]

As I mentioned in another post in this thread, Sam the Eagle is not so much a patriotic bald eagle as he is a caricature of jingoism (definition: the feelings and beliefs of people who think that their country is always right and who are in favor of aggressive acts against other countries.) Sam is a character that was created to RIDICULE patriotism, putting him in direct contrast with the theme of the Hall of Presidents. THAT'S why the idea of combining the two is so jarring, even to some here who like the Muppets. And that very fact lends credence to their reaction. And I doubt very much that reaction would be singular to the people on this board. A terrible idea is a terrible idea, whether you recognize it or not. Why does the Hall of Presidents need this? It was never meant to be a kiddie attraction. Why dumb it down now?

When has Sam been in favor of aggressive acts against other countries?

 

[AEfx]

When I went last year with my 10 year old niece who is just now learning about US history all she talked about was going to the HoP. In fact while her little sister went on the mine train I took her to HoP and she loved it. I guess she is the exception to the rule.

Keep the Muppets where they are, expand it, make it better, give people more than star wars and toy story at DHS.

Yeah, a ten year old can get Hall of Presidents. That's why I said this sounds like something for the 5 and under crowd.

I'm all for more Muppets at the studios - but this isn't about The Muppets. It's about a Muppet - a very appropriate character being used apart from the "greater" Muppets. People are so hung up on his origin that they aren't seeing the reality of how easily it could fit in.

I'm guessing some folks here were confused as kids as to why Kermit appeared on both The Muppet Show and Sesame Street?

 

[The Empress Lilly]

I'm guessing some folks here were confused as kids as to why Kermit appeared on both The Muppet Show and Sesame Street?

Speaking of, I'm rooting for Kermit as a new Jedi master in Star Wars VIII.

After all, that makes the movie more fun for the under-fives, and as a Frank Oz creation teh frog shows a remarkable likeness to Yoda anyway. Never mind fan rules about who belongs in their closed SW universe and who doesn't.

 

[jt04]

You really think people are objecting to this just out of habit? Seriously?



Why should Liberty Square have anything for the under-5 crowd?

Because it is part of the Magic Kingdom.

 

[Magenta Panther]

Actually patriotism is not a bad thing as it's NOT the same thing as Jingoism which is a truly bad thing especially if it's coming from someone with a 'true believer' mindset.

Which is exactly what Sam the Eagle is. I'm not attacking the character. He's supposed to be funny and he's meant to poke fun at jingoism. But he IS a jingoist, which is why he would be an inappropriate addition to HoP.

 

[Magenta Panther]

Because it is part of the Magic Kingdom.

Bad answer. VERY bad answer. Go to your room!

 

[Magenta Panther]

Yeah, a ten year old can get Hall of Presidents. That's why I said this sounds like something for the 5 and under crowd.

I'm all for more Muppets at the studios - but this isn't about The Muppets. It's about a Muppet - a very appropriate character being used apart from the "greater" Muppets. People are so hung up on his origin that they aren't seeing the reality of how easily it could fit in.

No, he is not an "appropriate" character in that context. No, he would not fit in. By your definition, Captain America would be a great addition to HoP because the Stars and Stripes are part of his costume.

But it's clear that you'll never get it, so whatever, dude.

 

[jt04]

Going full jt04....

Disney should donate The Hall of Presidents to the American History Museum in Washington D.C.. Thereby making it accessible to many more people at an affordable price. Great educational tool for children and foreign visitors.

Then make the space in the MK more appropriate to the park.