The “wealthy” is not going to work

[Lilofan]

Lol and I never understand how people here can possibly know who is going into debt to go to Disney.

Some love to boast about their personal lives to peers, family and friends especially in workplaces I've been

 

[Lilofan]

Disney isn’t targeting the wealthy so much as they are trying to maximize profits, which isn’t unusual for a corporation. What they have been really successful with is convincing the American public that a trip to a Disney park is a vital part of childhood. You don’t have to be wealthy to go to WDW, but you can’t be poor. If you have some disposable income and discipline, you can do it. We chatted up a family on line for Peter Pan that had driven from New Hampshire and carried all their lunches in backpacks rather than pay for meals in the park. I knew a single mom in her 20s who scrimped to get her son a Disney vacation at the All Stars. People can go for the day or go and stay off site. The deluxe resorts are outrageously priced for what many of them are in comparison with a Ritz Carlton or Waldorf, but there are guests who are willing to pay for the theming, myself included. The lighting lane thing is pricey, but maybe some people, not of unlimited means, would sacrifice a treat or a souvenir to pay for LL passes. It depends on a family’s priorities. I think Disney is targeting all classes of people. As long as they remain a dominant force in international entertainment, the target guest is anyone who relates to the movies and TV shows and wants more of that through the parks.

Disney is building " affordable housing " for cast. Usually that's an aka low income apts in plain english. They must love those company perks like free admission !

 

[adamparanoia]

I don't think there's a master plan other than simply increasing profits to shareholders however possible. They've decided some time ago that making investments is not in the cards. We're all falling victim to corporate-level ideas of "packages" and "pluses" and intangible ways to draw more business. Universal and Comcast are going to own Orlando by the end of the decade.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

We're not wealthy or going into debt visiting WDW. Having fun can get expensive but we have a strategy. We don't spend heavily on material goods or eating out, and try to get the best bang for our buck at WDW and other destinations that recharge our spirit. I shop the sales at ShopRite and try to avoid unnecessary goods purchases. Participating in the economy is good for everyone, stretching our discretionary income even better lol. I'm already getting old. Somewhere is a balance between living life and security.

I often have people ask how we can afford to take trips every month, my answer is simple… we don’t gamble, we don’t go to clubs, we don’t go out drinking, etc.

Many of the people asking spend just as much as we do, they just spend a little every day, we do it monthly in one big chunk.

 

[Lilofan]

I often have people ask how we can afford to take trips every month, my answer is simple… we don’t gamble, we don’t go to clubs, we don’t go out drinking, etc.

Many of the people asking spend just as much as we do, they just spend a little every day, we do it monthly in one big chunk.

That takes tremendous willpower to live and work in Vegas and not gamble. One can still lose or win at the airport where slot machines are ready to take your money. Even the casinos off the Strip where the locals gamble would be too tempting.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Lol and I never understand how people here can possibly know who is going into debt to go to Disney.

We don't know specifically, but the old story of if you have to ask, you can't afford it, comes into play. A very large percentage of non-wealthy people are utilizing very expensive credit card expenditures to go to Disney. Just because we don't know who they are doesn't mean that we cannot know the many are spending beyond their means to go to Disney, based on studies and statistics.

We're not wealthy or going into debt visiting WDW. Having fun can get expensive but we have a strategy. We don't spend heavily on material goods or eating out, and try to get the best bang for our buck at WDW and other destinations that recharge our spirit. I shop the sales at ShopRite and try to avoid unnecessary goods purchases. Participating in the economy is good for everyone, stretching our discretionary income even better lol. I'm already getting old. Somewhere is a balance between living life and security.

Our point was that even though we can afford the admission price does not mean that everyone can afford to spend the money needed to pay life's bills without limiting the experience. That is what you do, you currently are shaving experiences off your trip to match what you can afford. A very commendable way to at least get some of the experience. I have done that for many year. However, back not to long ago so many of those experiences were included in the cost of admission now after you pay to get in, primarily to walk around in the park you are financially forced to sacrifice experiences due to financial limitations.

I often have people ask how we can afford to take trips every month, my answer is simple… we don’t gamble, we don’t go to clubs, we don’t go out drinking, etc.

Not all the people that cannot afford to go are gambling, club hopping drunks. That is how you are able to operate but, many just cannot. Those are the same people that once upon a time could, but Disney's desire to have their yearly profits be registered in the Guinness Book of Records not because they need that much money instead it is because they can charge it and just continue to raise prices for no other reason then they can.

 

[SteveAZee]

If a lower middle class family who can’t afford a trip to WDW saves for 10 years for a week long stay at the Polynesian (or more likely instead of saving and waiting goes now and charges it on a credit card ) they add as much to the bottom line as a “wealthy“ customer staying in the same room.

To a degree, that's true. Disney makes the same money on that hotel room regardless of the guest's financial status (as long as the bill gets paid). I think, though, there will be a healthy subset of those 10 year planners that planned for the room and the park tickets, but eat homemade PB&J's in their room and buy merch online, if at all. Taken to a (correctly absurd) degree, if you filled most of the rooms on property with PB&J'ers, you'd be a sad little Disney. Their ideal guest is someone who'll happily pay for the room, tickets, food, after hours events, cabanas, and merch while spending all their vacation time and money on property. They want to maximize their profit for each warm body that crosses the threshold, and minimize the PB&J'ers.

 

[GoofGoof]

To a degree, that's true. Disney makes the same money on that hotel room regardless of the guest's financial status (as long as the bill gets paid). I think, though, there will be a healthy subset of those 10 year planners that planned for the room and the park tickets, but eat homemade PB&J's in their room and buy merch online, if at all. Taken to a (correctly absurd) degree, if you filled most of the rooms on property with PB&J'ers, you'd be a sad little Disney. Their ideal guest is someone who'll happily pay for the room, tickets, food, after hours events, cabanas, and merch while spending all their vacation time and money on property. They want to maximize their profit for each warm body that crosses the threshold, and minimize the PB&J'ers.

I would think the PB&Jers you describe are more likely to be frequent visitors and/or locals. They had to put chips in the drink cups to prevent these people from stealing soda. I know a number of people who planned once in a lifetime family trips and they wanted to have the full experience so Chef Mickeys and character meals, princesses for those with girls and they want souvenirs to remember the once in a lifetime trip. Also, since many are likely completely unfamiliar with anything around WDW and a large number will not have a car with them they are not as likely to be interested in venturing out to a local super market to buy food. People on a budget may be more likely to eat quick service more frequently vs eating every meal at a table service restaurant but I don’t think too many people are staying at the Polynesian and then eating PB&J in their room to save money.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I would think the PB&Jers you describe are more likely to be frequent visitors and/or locals. They had to put chips in the drink cups to prevent these people from stealing soda. I know a number of people who planned once in a lifetime family trips and they wanted to have the full experience so Chef Mickeys and character meals, princesses for those with girls and they want souvenirs to remember the once in a lifetime trip. Also, since many are likely completely unfamiliar with anything around WDW and a large number will not have a car with them they are not as likely to be interested in venturing out to a local super market to buy food. People on a budget may be more likely to eat quick service more frequently vs eating every meal at a table service restaurant but I don’t think too many people are staying at the Polynesian and then eating PB&J in their room to save money.

Or those PB&Jers might be realistic and honest enough to stay offsite where hotels are reasonable enough and affordable food is everywhere to the point that renting a car or paying Uber is way cheaper.

P.S. They are not the ones that were stealing soda, it was the wealthy, entitled crowd that feels that everything should be "given" to them, mostly because they were being fleeced for room rates and felt that they had paid for unlimited soda, for life.

 

[erasure fan1]

I don't think there's a master plan other than simply increasing profits to shareholders however possible. They've decided some time ago that making investments is not in the cards

That's it all the way. The people in charge obviously don't care in the least about the future. Raise the stock value by any means necessary. And why worry about the future when the mindset is you're invincible. And who knows, maybe they are.

 

[GoofGoof]

Or those PB&Jers might be realistic and honest enough to stay offsite where hotels are reasonable enough and affordable food is everywhere to the point that renting a car or paying Uber is way cheaper.

I agree that’s a lot more likely. My original point is Disney doesn’t care whether the person paying for a room at a deluxe resort is “wealthy” or not as long as they are spending their money at WDW.

P.S. They are not the ones that were stealing soda, it was the wealthy, entitled crowd that feels that everything should be "given" to them, mostly because they were being fleeced for room rates and felt that they had paid for unlimited soda, for life.

The soda theft was largely from regular visitors, people who knew how to game the system. I don’t think it had anything to do with wealth or feeling elite. I’m sure some were wealthy repeat visitors and others were locals making their AP stretch as far as possible by avoiding buying a drink in the park and instead “helping themselves” at a monorail resort. Either way, those people weren’t typically the once in a lifetime visitors who wouldn’t have necessarily know to try it.

 

[GimpYancIent]

That's it all the way. The people in charge obviously don't care in the least about the future. Raise the stock value by any means necessary. And why worry about the future when the mindset is you're invincible. And who knows, maybe they are.

Invincible mindset? There's some truth to that. Though there has been some damage to the brand the mystique of at least once in your life going to a Disney property for vacation is quite strong with a chunk of the population. So long as people come up with the money Disney is not going to turn them away. It really is not a matter if someone is wealthy or not but a matter of who wants to come up with and give Disney the money regardless of if they can afford it or not. Every guest is simply a monetary resource as far as Disney is concerned.

 

[Lilofan]

Invincible mindset? There's some truth to that. Though there has been some damage to the brand the mystique of at least once in your life going to a Disney property for vacation is quite strong with a chunk of the population. So long as people come up with the money Disney is not going to turn them away. It really is not a matter if someone is wealthy or not but a matter of who wants to come up with and give Disney the money regardless of if they can afford it or not. Every guest is simply a monetary resource as far as Disney is concerned.

Invincible mindset? The wealthy NYC Moms would fit the bill. Some provided a service, the NYC Moms wanted all in. Local handicapped residents in FL were charging up to $1K per day for front of line disability access to the attractions. No wait for them and their party. NYC Moms and their party were with these folks throughout the day. These changed the Disability Access System moving forward when this scam was uncovered about 9 years ago. This scam how wrong it was , was ingenious.

 

[Tom P.]

"Borrowing is no way to start a vacation in America, no."
"Well, why not? That's the way Americans always start their vacations."
- I Love Lucy, Season 6, Episode 5, "Visitor from Italy" (1956)

Americans borrowing money to be able to afford their vacations is not exactly a new concept. People didn't start putting Disney trips on a credit card because Iger and Chapek took away free dining. I would venture to guess that most American vacations, whether to the beach, to Las Vegas, on a cruise, or to Walt Disney World, are financed on credit cards. You can argue that it's not a wise move, but it's what people have done to afford vacations for a very, very long time.

The fact that people are going into debt to afford a Disney trip doesn't mean that Disney is only catering to the wealthy or is pricing out the middle class. If that were the case, you might as well argue that Ford is only catering to the wealthy and has priced out the middle class, since the vast majority of people could not ever buy a car without taking out a loan.

 

[Lilofan]

As long as Disney successfully markets a family friendly escape from the real world destination , Orlando and WDW will continue to be one of the most visited tourist destinations in the world . It would not surprise me if the wealthy take out loans to finance their vacations. The big misconception is some think the wealthy have at their disposable huge amount of money in the bank. That could be farther from the truth. Some peoples “ wealth” is actually the value of their investments ( ie stock market ) , value of their real estate etc. One doesn’t just exactly liquidate some of these assets to drop several thousands dollars at WDW, hence even the “ wealthy “ take out loans to finance their vacations as an example.

 

[ohioguy]

As long as Disney successfully markets a family friendly escape from the real world destination , Orlando and WDW will continue to be one of the most visited tourist destinations in the world . It would not surprise me if the wealthy take out loans to finance their vacations. The big misconception is some think the wealthy have at their disposable huge amount of money in the bank. That could be farther from the truth. Some peoples “ wealth” is actually the value of their investments ( ie stock market ) , value of their real estate etc. One doesn’t just exactly liquidate some of these assets to drop several thousands dollars at WDW, hence even the “ wealthy “ take out loans to finance their vacations as an example.

Exactly. And the wealthy, because of their assets, typically have good credit -- meaning they can finance a trip to Disney or wherever at a low interest rate, via loan or credit card. Again, they benefit from the asset wealth, but it doesn't mean it's liquid and readily available. I know a few upper-middle class and wealthy (on paper) people that still have to pay the bills each month.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I agree that’s a lot more likely. My original point is Disney doesn’t care whether the person paying for a room at a deluxe resort is “wealthy” or not as long as they are spending their money at WDW.

The soda theft was largely from regular visitors, people who knew how to game the system. I don’t think it had anything to do with wealth or feeling elite. I’m sure some were wealthy repeat visitors and others were locals making their AP stretch as far as possible by avoiding buying a drink in the park and instead “helping themselves” at a monorail resort. Either way, those people weren’t typically the once in a lifetime visitors who wouldn’t have necessarily know to try it.

I agree but that isn't what you said. Those on a strict enough budget to resort to PB&J were not staying in the resorts and didn't have much access to the free soda.

 

[GoofGoof]

I agree but that isn't what you said. Those on a strict enough budget to resort to PB&J were not staying in the resorts and didn't have much access to the free soda.

You are quoting the wrong guy. I said exactly the same thing as you. The other poster said Disney does care if someone staying at the Polynesian is really wealthy or not because a healthy subset of people who saved for 10 years for a trip would be eating PB&J in their room and not spending on food and souvenirs. I said that I didn’t think there were a lot of people in that category. My point on the soda steeling and bringing in their own food was that the people more likely to do that are regular visitors and/or AP holders who know how to game the system and not once in a lifetime visitors.

 

[SteveAZee]

You are quoting the wrong guy. I said exactly the same thing as you. The other poster said Disney does care if someone staying at the Polynesian is really wealthy or not because a healthy subset of people who saved for 10 years for a trip would be eating PB&J in their room and not spending on food and souvenirs. I said that I didn’t think there were a lot of people in that category. My point on the soda steeling and bringing in their own food was that the people more likely to do that are regular visitors and/or AP holders who know how to game the system and not once in a lifetime visitors.

I don't know how many PB&J's there are (or if they even exist), but it's more a model of what sort of guest Disney wouldn't want. I'm going off the premise that there are people who save up for a long time to get what they know about as far as expenses go (park tickets and a room at a 'cool' Disney resort) but then when they arrive they find they're priced out of food, merch, and other high markup items that Disney wants to sell.

Given the number of people who stay on property and/or visit a park is finite, they would prefer those who are taking up that finite resource to spend money on the other stuff (food/merch/after hours/etc) as much as possible. That's what I was trying to illustrate.

 

[Lilofan]

I don't know how many PB&J's there are (or if they even exist), but it's more a model of what sort of guest Disney wouldn't want. I'm going off the premise that there are people who save up for a long time to get what they know about as far as expenses go (park tickets and a room at a 'cool' Disney resort) but then when they arrive they find they're priced out of food, merch, and other high markup items that Disney wants to sell.

Given the number of people who stay on property and/or visit a park is finite, they would prefer those who are taking up that finite resource to spend money on the other stuff (food/merch/after hours/etc) as much as possible. That's what I was trying to illustrate.

Savvy shoppers drive or take Uber to the Orlando discount outlets on International Drive to get Disney items at a better price. Trying to find your size may be an issue. Some who stay off property load up on their hotel buffett breakfast before heading to the parks.