SPOILER: The Acolyte -- Disney+ Star Wars -- begins June 5, 2024

[MagicMouseFan]

The line “If you draw a weapon on a Jedi, you lose” could indicate that revealing oneself as a Sith and engaging in a lightsaber fight would reveal the existence of the Sith to the Jedi. Even if the Sith should come out the victor in any given encounter, the big picture of staying in the shadows and working in the shadows would be thrown away. This could be a threat to the Jedi and their plans, and could threaten the long-term plans of the Sith.

This interpretation helps to keep the connection with the line said by Jedi Master Ki-Adi-Mundi in TPM, ‘The Sith have been extinct for a millennium.’
This paper explains the Sith’s plan as not to fight the Jedi directly because they did not want to be discovered. Hence, why the Jedi did not know of their existence for a thousand years.
This enables Acolyte to continue with the Sith’s covert operations and avoid contradicting the previous canon where the Sith are unknown up until the prequel trilogy.
This paves the way for potential sequels that could see the build up to TPM with the secrecy of the Sith.

 

[MisterPenguin]

We've already seen a member of the council wanting to make it a secret that a former paduan killed a Jedi Knight because "their enemies would use this against them."

Imagine if the Jedi on the Kill-Bill-list had acted shamefully. They're already hiding that information. If this series ends with the Jedi *seemingly* killing the resurgent Sith, it's not hard to imagine they'd keep it secret. Their lack of transparency and desire for power and desire to seem invincible and incorruptible would doom them to cover this all up.

 

[Disney Irish]

The line “If you draw a weapon on a Jedi, you lose” could suggest that by revealing oneself as a Sith and engaging in direct combat with a light saber, risks exposing the Sith’s presence to the Jedi. Even if the Sith were to win the immediate battle, the larger strategy of remaining hidden and operating in the shadows would be compromised. This exposure could lead to the Jedi discovering their plans, thereby jeopardizing the Sith’s long-term goals.

This interpretation helps maintain the relevance of the line from TPM where Jedi Master Ki-Adi-Mundi states, “The Sith have been extinct for a millennium.”
The Sith’s strategy involves avoiding direct confrontation with the Jedi to remain hidden, it explains why the Jedi were unaware of their existence for so long.
This approach allows Acolyte to explore the Sith’s covert operations and maintain the continuity of the established canon, where the Sith’s presence remains a secret until the events of the prequel trilogy.
This also paves the way for sequels that could follow the secrecy of the Sith leading up to TPM.

You're again making a lot of assumptions with very little information based on a few lines from that movie that happens 100 years after the events of this show.

 

[Disney Irish]

We've already seen a member of the council wanting to make it a secret that a former paduan killed a Jedi Knight because "their enemies would use this against them."

Imagine if the Jedi on the Kill-Bill-list had acted shamefully. They're already hiding that information. If this series ends with the Jedi *seemingly* killing the resurgent Sith, it's not hard to imagine they'd keep it secret. Their lack of transparency and desire for power and desire to seem invincible and incorruptible would doom them to cover this all up.

Exactly the show has already established that during this time period the Council is way more political than during the PT. Its not a hard stretch of the imagination that they'd want to keep any Sith resurgence hidden from the rest of the Order, and even the Council as needed.

 

[MagicMouseFan]

You're making a lot of assumptions based on a single line. A line mind you that as the saying goes, is true based on a certain point of view.

There could be lots of reasons why the Council was surprised by that reveal while still having some within the Order know of the Sith's existence prior to that moment.

Also you're making a lot of assumptions about the Council's vigilance during this High Republic time period. This is the first we're seeing of it in canon. So you can't assume how responsive the Council was during this time period just because of their actions a century later. In fact we get clues that they are more political during this period given the Council trying to keep Mae's actions hidden. So yes its conceivable that if the Sith were known by some in the Order that some would want to keep that hidden as they are the direct enemy of the Jedi. They wouldn't want it know that their natural enemy has returned and can upset the balance of power.

It’s interesting to consider how reimagining a line or a plot point can lead to intriguing new ideas and storylines. No line is a throwaway when you use your imagination. For example, part of John Knoll’s inspiration for Rogue One: A Star Wars Story was to provide a plausible explanation for why the Death Star had such a critical vulnerability that allowed it to be destroyed so easily. Another example is the line from A New Hope when Darth Vader tells Obi-Wan, “When I left you, I was but the learner. Now I am the master.” This was reinterpreted in the Obi-Wan Kenobi series to add depth to their relationship and past encounters.

You’re right, I’m making assumptions… I don’t know what going to happen. That’s the fun of it all.

The idea that the Jedi Council might have been more politically motivated during the High Republic era is an interesting angle. It opens up possibilities for complex narratives

 

[MagicMouseFan]

You're again making a lot of assumptions with very little information based on a few lines from that movie that happens 100 years after the events of this show.

Speculation is fun. It’s what being a fan is all about. Where is a story going to lead? Throwing ideas out on a message board and imagining the possibilities are part of the excitement.
Speculation is what keeps discussions lively and engaging. It’s all about exploring different angles and seeing how they might fit into the larger narrative.

 

[MagicMouseFan]

We've already seen a member of the council wanting to make it a secret that a former paduan killed a Jedi Knight because "their enemies would use this against them."

Imagine if the Jedi on the Kill-Bill-list had acted shamefully. They're already hiding that information. If this series ends with the Jedi *seemingly* killing the resurgent Sith, it's not hard to imagine they'd keep it secret. Their lack of transparency and desire for power and desire to seem invincible and incorruptible would doom them to cover this all up.

So in that case, the show will paint the Jedi as hypocritical and flawed, driven by a desire to maintain an image of invincibility and incorruptibility at the expense of truth and transparency.
Their secrecy and lack of transparency paint them as an organization that prioritizes self-preservation over justice and accountability, contributing to their eventual downfall.

 

[MisterPenguin]

So in that case, the show will paint the Jedi as hypocritical and flawed, driven by a desire to maintain an image of invincibility and incorruptibility at the expense of truth and transparency.

At least some of them. Maybe.

 

[Disney Irish]

It’s interesting to consider how reimagining a line or a plot point can lead to intriguing new ideas and storylines. No line is a throwaway when you use your imagination. For example, part of John Knoll’s inspiration for Rogue One: A Star Wars Story was to provide a plausible explanation for why the Death Star had such a critical vulnerability that allowed it to be destroyed so easily. Another example is the line from A New Hope when Darth Vader tells Obi-Wan, “When I left you, I was but the learner. Now I am the master.” This was reinterpreted in the Obi-Wan Kenobi series to add depth to their relationship and past encounters.

You’re right, I’m making assumptions… I don’t know what going to happen. That’s the fun of it all.

The idea that the Jedi Council might have been more politically motivated during the High Republic era is an interesting angle. It opens up possibilities for complex narratives

Speculation is fun. It’s what being a fan is all about. Where is a story going to lead? Throwing ideas out on a message board and imagining the possibilities are part of the excitement.
Speculation is what keeps discussions lively and engaging. It’s all about exploring different angles and seeing how they might fit into the larger narrative.

Except you're taking lines and making up your own head canon. And that is your right to do, but the show is establishing what the canon is for this time period.

Also its not like franchises don't retcon all time, including Star Wars. Which is why the whole dialog of a "certain point of view" exists.

 

[Disney Irish]

So in that case, the show will paint the Jedi as hypocritical and flawed, driven by a desire to maintain an image of invincibility and incorruptibility at the expense of truth and transparency.
Their secrecy and lack of transparency paint them as an organization that prioritizes self-preservation over justice and accountability, contributing to their eventual downfall.

This idea you have that the Order is virtuous and transparent goes against what we've seen established in canon.

 

[MagicMouseFan]

Except you're taking lines and making up your own head canon. And that is your right to do, but the show is establishing what the canon is for this time period.

Also it’s not like franchises don't retcon all time, including Star Wars. Which is why the whole dialog of a "certain point of view" exists.

So… based on what you just said above, this is how I interpret your words.

You think viewers shouldn’t engage their imaginations or think critically about the story. Yes, the show is establishing the canon for this time period, but dismissing any personal interpretation as mere “head canon” seems like a way to stifle creative engagement.

By discouraging this kind of speculation, aren’t you just saying, “Don’t think, just accept what you’re told”? Engaging with the story on a deeper level is what being a fan is all about. You’re just like Crash Davis in Bull Durham with his “Don’t think, just throw” mentality. Which did work for Nuke LaLoosh.

 

[MagicMouseFan]

This idea you have that the Order is virtuous and transparent goes against what we've seen established in canon.

I thought my focus has been on encouraging creative engagement and critical thinking about the story. By speculating and interpreting the narrative, we delve deeper into the complexities and nuances of the Star Wars universe. My intention is to explore these layers, not to assert any specific stance on the nature of the Jedi Order.

Also, I do find it cute how you and MisterPenguin keep liking each other’s comments. It’s adorable and fun to see.

 

[Disney Irish]

So… based on what you just said above, this is how I interpret your words.

You think viewers shouldn’t engage their imaginations or think critically about the story. Yes, the show is establishing the canon for this time period, but dismissing any personal interpretation as mere “head canon” seems like a way to stifle creative engagement.

By discouraging this kind of speculation, aren’t you just saying, “Don’t think, just accept what you’re told”? Engaging with the story on a deeper level is what being a fan is all about. You’re just like Crash Davis in Bull Durham with his “Don’t think, just throw” mentality. Which did work for Nuke LaLoosh.

I thought my focus has been on encouraging creative engagement and critical thinking about the story. By speculating and interpreting the narrative, we delve deeper into the complexities and nuances of the Star Wars universe. My intention is to explore these layers, not to assert any specific stance on the nature of the Jedi Order.

Also, I do find it cute how you and MisterPenguin keep liking each other’s comments. It’s adorable and fun to see.

Except we're discussing a show and a universe that has established canon, canon mind you that we have no control over only the creators do. But you're wanting to discuss and create a speculative narrative which is contradicting the established canon and calling it "delving deeper". If you want to write your own fan fiction please be my guest, in fact you should create your own thread for that. But for the discussion of this show we should keep it to the established canon that the shows creators are using and expanding upon.

 

[MagicMouseFan]

Except we're discussing a show and a universe that has established canon, canon mind you that we have no control over only the creators do. But you're wanting to discuss and create a speculative narrative which is contradicting the established canon and calling it "delving deeper". If you want to write your own fan fiction please be my guest, in fact you should create your own thread for that. But for the discussion of this show we should keep it to the established canon that the shows creators are using and expanding upon.

Crash, I got it. You’re a “don’t think, just throw” kind of guy.
I respect that. I do…
But for some of us, part of the fun is speculating on the story.
It’s about engaging creatively with the story and imagining the possibilities.
As you know, If I don’t like something or I love something, I’m going to comment on it.

Speculating with my friends on what was going to happen to Han Solo after Empire while we ate PBJ sandwiches at school was amazing. You can’t take that magic away from the inner child.

 

[Disney Irish]

Crash, I got it. You’re a “don’t think, just throw” kind of guy.
I respect that. I do…
But for some of us, part of the fun is speculating on the story.
It’s about engaging creatively with the story and imagining the possibilities.
As you know, If I don’t like something or I love something, I’m going to comment on it.

Speculating with my friends on what was going to happen to Han Solo after Empire while we ate PBJ sandwiches at school was amazing. You can’t take that magic away from the inner child.

Incorrect, I'm not saying "don't think", I'm saying "think within the game being played based on the already established rules of the game". To continue the analogy of Bull Durham, that would be like Nuke trying to play tennis when Crash just wants him to play baseball. Also you missed the whole point of what Crash was trying to teach Nuke which is apt here, don't overthink as it not only hurts the team but the game.

It seems like you want to write your own version, ie fan fiction, of what is going to happen based on a canon you're creating. As I said be my guest, go create a thread just for that. I'm sure you'll have a bunch of other posters joining you in that.

 

[MagicMouseFan]

Incorrect, I'm not saying "don't think", I'm saying "think within the game being played based on the already established rules of the game". To continue the analogy of Bull Durham, that would be like Nuke trying to play tennis when Crash just wants him to play baseball. Also you missed the whole point of what Crash was trying to teach Nuke which is apt here, don't overthink as it not only hurts the team but the game.

It seems like you want to write your own version, ie fan fiction, of what is going to happen based on a canon you're creating. As I said be my guest, go create a thread just for that. I'm sure you'll have a bunch of other posters joining you in that.

Irish, take a breath, relax….

When I take the line from The Acolyte, “If you draw a weapon on a Jedi, you lose,” and suggest it could mean something, I’m just having fun with the lines of the TV show.
That way it’s fun when you tune in next week to see if, how, and what happens next!
Just like the serials of yesteryear. What Star Wars was built on.

Didn’t you sit with your friends at school during lunch in 1982, speculating on the whereabouts of Han Solo, reading SW comics hoping for hints, all in anticipation of the next chapter in the continuing Star Wars saga? It was magic. Remember?

Why does this upset you so much? Speculating about the story is part of the fun and doesn’t mean we’re rewriting the canon. It’s about exploring possibilities within the established universe.

Oh.. your analogy is confusing because discussing and speculating about plot points within an established universe (like Star Wars) is different from switching sports entirely. Speculation and fan theories are more akin to exploring different strategies within the same game rather than playing a completely different game.
You are implying that speculation is as out of place as switching from baseball to tennis, which is not a fair comparison since fan speculation is still within the realm of the Star Wars universe.

 

[MagicMouseFan]

I feel like it’s just me and Disney Irish stranded on a deserted island, with MisterPenguin occasionally flying over in a chopper to check if we’ve got enough rations to survive.

I mean, we’re literally arguing about whether we should be able to speculate on a Star Wars show. If that doesn’t say “stranded on a deserted island,” I don’t know what does.

 

[Serpico Jones]

 

[DKampy]

I feel like it’s just me and Disney Irish stranded on a deserted island, with MisterPenguin occasionally flying over in a chopper to check if we’ve got enough rations to survive.

I mean, we’re literally arguing about whether we should be able to speculate on a Star Wars show. If that doesn’t say “stranded on a deserted island,” I don’t know what does.

I am here, but I figured this was between the 2 of you… personally I am not 1 to create my own personal Star Wars stories… I just watch for the entertainment value… speculation is what leads to disappointment in franchises when it does not pan out to what the fans imagined

 

[MagicMouseFan]

I am here, but I figured this was between the 2 of you… personally I am not 1 to create my own personal Star Wars stories… I just watch for the entertainment value… speculation is what leads to disappointment in franchises when it does not pan out to what the fans imagined

Speculation is a fundamental part of being a fan, it fuels excitement and engagement. It’s how we stay connected to the stories we love.

Think about it: after The Empire Strikes Back ended, fans spent years speculating on what would happen to Han Solo. These discussions and theories are what kept the magic alive between the films. Speculating on what could happen next is what makes following a series or franchise so thrilling. It’s not about creating personal Star Wars stories, but rather about enjoying the journey and the possibilities it presents. The fun lies in discussing these theories with fellow fans, even if they don’t always pan out.

Just watching for entertainment value is fine, but dismissing speculation undermines a significant aspect of fandom. Fans should be able to imagine, discuss, and even dream about different story directions without being told it’s the wrong way to enjoy the franchise.

So, pull up a coconut and have a seat. plenty of room on this Island… MisterPenguin should be flying over soon.