News Splash Mountain retheme to Princess and the Frog - Tiana's Bayou Adventure

[LittleBuford]

You stated, without evidence, PATF was marketable. I countered by demonstrating it’s been a financial failure by an easily observable metric. You’re still refusing to offer evidence of your conclusion.

She’s a Disney princess. That automatically makes her (and her film) marketable.

 

[brettf22]

A $150M budget for this give me hope. To folks that compare this to a new build, I don’t think people appreciate what percentage of a budget goes into basic infrastructure … steel, concrete, conduit, wiring, and (especially for Splash) plumbing. This is why attraction re-skins are so attractive to management.

As others have said, based on the most recent dark ride endeavor, I’d expect the Navi treatment, i.e. lots of projections, lots of projection mapping, and a handful of really advanced AAs (especially ones with a projection B mode). While this will actually cost more up front than simply re-purposing existing AAs, it will save a ton in ongoing maintenance.

 

[Tha Realest]

She’s a Disney princess. That automatically makes her (and her film) marketable.

Ehhh...

This is the world's most popular Disney princess

Ever wondered which Disney princess is the most loved across the globe? It turns out that this royal leading lady is the most popular

www.marieclaire.co.uk

The Most Popular Disney Princess Movies, According to Rotten Tomatoes

Magic mirror on the wall, who is the—most popular—one of all?

www.newsweek.com

Some think Disney princesses are harmful to young girls. Hereâs what a new BYU study says

A new BYU study shows that preadolescent girls (ages 8-12) are taking away lessons of empowerment, and recognizing the positive attributes of Disney princesses.

www.deseret.com

This is the most popular Disney princess

We've got a few others we prefer, tbh

www.cosmopolitan.com

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

You stated, without evidence, PATF was marketable. I countered by demonstrating it’s been a financial failure by an easily observable metric. You’re still refusing to offer evidence of your conclusion.

Do you not realize that, in this day and age, the box office numbers of a film's original release can be basically irrelevant to its level of success?

Hocus Pocus absolutely bombed in theaters in 1993. A few days ago, the teaser for its sequel got 43 million views in the first 24 hours on Disney+ alone, never mind additional millions across Youtube and social media. It beat out viewership for the teasers for both seasons of The Mandalorian and The Book of Boba Fett, by a lot. But by your chosen metrics, that property should be considered dead.

The Princess and the Frog, and Tiana in particular, have proven to have legs beyond the initial box office release for the movie. She's highly sought after in the parks, moves merchandise, and offers representation to part of Disney's viewership that is historically excluded throughout the rest of their canon. The movie's performance in at-home releases and streaming numbers tell a story that the box office, for a number of reasons, does not.

 

[Kirby86]

I do realize that…the parks aren’t open 365 and the attendance is no where the same. I was just genuinely curious as to why everyone says the track needs to be replaced…makes sense I feel educated!

Yup I love rollar Coasters and you are right a full retracking is more of a Wooden coaster thing howeverit isnt unheard of for steel coasters. However the one advantage that seasonal parks have is they can do more in depth maintenance while the park is closed for the season. Disney being open 365 days a year they can't do that naturally. Now that Splash is going to be closed for a while I don't see Disney doing anything with Space Mountain besides daily routine maintenance because they need capacity for the park.

 

[Disney Glimpses]

Exactly... thats why i dont buy for 1 minute that Disney was planning to remove Splash and replace it w Tiana a movie that was far from successful....

If you could see the ideas and brainstorms floating around at WDI, you'd completely lose your mind. They are brainstorming new ideas constantly. This was one of those things. You're correct that this was nothing more than an idea (one of hundreds of unproven ideas) before 2020 though.

 

[Midwest Elitist]

Yup I love rollar Coasters and you are right a full retracking is more of a Wooden coaster thing howeverit isnt unheard of for steel coasters. However the one advantage that seasonal parks have is they can do more in depth maintenance while the park is closed for the season. Disney being open 365 days a year they can't do that naturally. Now that Splash is going to be closed for a while I don't see Disney doing anything with Space Mountain besides daily routine maintenance because they need capacity for the park.

You have to also remember that this is an Arrow Coaster from the 70s, where they still might have been forming the tracks without a computer. Space feels like it's between a wooden coaster of and a steel coaster in terms of roughness.

I actually don't have a problem riding Space with bad back problems, but it's probably because I've memorized the track and can brace for the harsh turns.

Also, the track is banked, just very poorly.

 

[tanc]

Will they honor Tiana's Bayou Adventure with Madea?

 

[Kirby86]

Do you not realize that, in this day and age, the box office numbers of a film's original release can be basically irrelevant to its level of success?

Hocus Pocus absolutely bombed in theaters in 1993. A few days ago, the teaser for its sequel got 43 million views in the first 24 hours on Disney+ alone, never mind additional millions across Youtube and social media. It beat out viewership for The Mandalorian and The Book of Boba Fett. But by your chosen metrics, that property should be considered dead.

The Princess and the Frog, and Tiana in particular, have proven to have legs beyond the initial box office release for the movie. She's highly sought after in the parks, moves merchandise, and offers representation to part of Disney's viewership that is historically excluded throughout the rest of their canon. The movie's performance in at-home releases and streaming numbers tell a story that the box office, for a number of reasons, does not.

Agreed that the Princess and the Frog ip or at least Tiana got a second wind over the years. Whatever the reason be it she's part of the princess line, people like 2d animation again, or a whole multitude of other things.
Also comparing the views of the Hocus Pocus teaser to full series like Mandalorian is comparing apples to oranges. One is 2 minutes long and just an ad that wants to remind you this movie you may remember or heard of has a sequel. The other is an 8 hour series that is trying to have viewership retention. They're going for different goals.

 

[crazy4disney]

If you could see the ideas and brainstorms floating around at WDI, you'd completely lose your mind. They are brainstorming new ideas constantly. This was one of those things. You're correct that this was nothing more than an idea (one of hundreds of unproven ideas) before 2020 though.

again yes im not denying that im not naive and my guess is i dk maybe 75% if not more ideas never actually happen.... all i was saying was this was far from on the table for an attraction that was as popular as Splash was/is... you really want to convince me a company who has skimped on so many things this last decade or 2 was really going to spend money on retheming a ride that was still drawing these crowds... and then even if it was tiana was the actually IP they were looking to put there? i just dont buy it nor see it.... and to me thats the biggest joke/insult/mocking of this whole redo....

 

[Kirby86]

You have to also remember that this is an Arrow Coaster from the 70s, where they still might have been forming the tracks without a computer. Space feels like it's between a wooden coaster of and a steel coaster in terms of roughness.

I actually don't have a problem riding Space with bad back problems, but it's probably because I've memorized the track and can brace for the harsh turns.

Also, the track is banked, just very poorly.

Personally I don't mind Space as it is. It's rougher now them when I first went on it but I've certainly been on rougher coasters wooden and steel.

 

[crazy4disney]

So you're making three claims:

"Highly sought after in the parks" - How exactly are you coming to this conclusion? Does she have an established meet and greet with long lines? I have seen her in the parks many times with a handful of people no different than Mr. Smee. Are you making the claim she has longer lines than the other princesses? From what data do you make this claim?

"Moves merchandise" I assume you have some data to back this curious claim up? When I look at top children consumer retail brands, I don't see her. If you look at the Disney product space dedicated to her at their stores, parks, and mass merchants, I don't see it. She has been recently lumped into the Princess brand, but I don't see any evidence of her particular sales being notable.

"Because representation" - yup.

If the park wants to have a black character be the focus of an attraction that is obviously their choice, but let's just admit that and not make up other reasons and pretend she's a hugely popular, marketable, and financially successful IP.

Hit the nail right on the head with this post... well said

 

[gerarar]

I have a question, when people say 'Screens' these days. What do they mean or think will be installed?

I fully suspect the attraction will use projection mapping to expand vistas, add to the scenes, create interesting lighting / scenic dynamics. It's a modern redo, I hope it utilizes projections, it's what I expect these days. Projection technology when used correctly is STUNNING.

But I am not expecting Tiana on a screen talking to me instead of an AA.

So again, when people say "Screens" - are you saying you don't want any projection tech?

What does it mean...

Looking at something like ROTR, there's only really one true screen, and that's the preshow interrogation with General Hux and Kylo. The Rey and ITS preshows also have smaller screens, but that's given.

Everything else throughout the actual ride is projections on a dome-like surface with multiple dimensions, allowing a 3D-like appearance and visual. That is good as it feels and looks "real". Similar technology also on Space 220.
However I don't see them doing that on Splash due to it requiring a huge backdrop/space, since the flume track is pretty close to the walls. Doubt they would rip out walls and whatnot just to accommodate that.

Like others mentioned, they might go the Na'vi River Journey implementation where it's pure screens, but well hidden and integrated with the physical surroundings. And hopefully it's not like FEA, as that's the complete opposite of NRJ.

MMRR also uses pure projections, but many times it's just flat and has multiple layers. Unlike ROTR, it doesn't have that multiple dimensions feel like with the other ships and explosions.

 

[Tha Realest]

Do you not realize that, in this day and age, the box office numbers of a film's original release can be basically irrelevant to its level of success?

Hocus Pocus absolutely bombed in theaters in 1993. A few days ago, the teaser for its sequel got 43 million views in the first 24 hours on Disney+ alone, never mind additional millions across Youtube and social media. It beat out viewership for The Mandalorian and The Book of Boba Fett. But by your chosen metrics, that property should be considered dead.

The Princess and the Frog, and Tiana in particular, have proven to have legs beyond the initial box office release for the movie. She's highly sought after in the parks, moves merchandise, and offers representation to part of Disney's viewership that is historically excluded throughout the rest of their canon. The movie's performance in at-home releases and streaming numbers tell a story that the box office, for a number of reasons, does not.

My "chosen" metrics? You've offered no metrics or specifics in response. Let's look to some others:

Home box office? PATF only made $117M. Tangled doubled that a year later. https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Princess-and-the-Frog-The#tab=video-sales

You say "Princess and the Frog, and Tiana in particular, have proven to have legs beyond the initial box office release for the movie. She's highly sought after in the parks, moves merchandise."

Again, where's your proof? By 2014, Tiana was selling far less merchandise than other princesses: https://www.seventeen.com/celebrity/movies-tv/reviews/a23199/frozen-most-popular-disney-princess/

It had gotten so bad that by 2017 Jet Magazine noticed the complete absence of Tiana merchandise in stores. If she was as popular as you suggest, why would Disney, Hasbro, and Mattel leave all that Tiana money on the table? https://www.jetmag.com/entertainment/something-shady-happening-princess-tiana-disney/

PATF is a perfectly fine film on its own. I own it, and enjoy it. But you and others are doing it a disservice by artificially boosting its perceived popularity to justify this move. By no measurable standard has this been a popular film.

 

[tanc]

Just curious, is there even an official source saying the budget is $150 million?

 

[solidyne]

If you could see the ideas and brainstorms floating around at WDI, you'd completely lose your mind. They are brainstorming new ideas constantly. [...]

Given what they come up with (F:EA, GotG:CR, MF:SR, T:LR), I'd say those are braindrizzles you're talking about. Yeah, I'd lose my mind, alright, if I had to see the "bad" ideas!

 

[Disney Analyst]

Successful, not succesful film... who the heck cares?

PatF has gorgeous art, a gorgeous world, with likeable characters, and adds the inclusion the parks seek. It can work perfectly for an attraction.

Not like the IP matters when it comes to Splash, seeing as it was based off an IP that was NOT popular, until the ride made it more popular.

If anything this attraction will help PatF build a larger legacy, and or reach newer audiences.

Add in the new show for Disney+, dreams really do come true in New Orleans!

 

[dreday3]

Successful, not succesful film... who the heck cares?

PatF has gorgeous art, a gorgeous world, with likeable characters, and adds the inclusion the parks seek. It can work perfectly for an attraction.

Not like the IP matters when it comes to Splash, seeing as it was based off an IP that was NOT popular, until the ride made it more popular.

If anything this attraction will help PatF build a larger legacy, and or reach newer audiences.

Add in the new show for Disney+, dreams really do come true in New Orleans!

This really is what it all boils down to.
If done right, the ride imagery will be beautiful, have great music, reintroduce some great characters (or introduce to people who haven't seen it) and everyone can enjoy it.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

Agreed that the Princess and the Frog ip or at least Tiana got a second wind over the years. Whatever the reason be it she's part of the princess line, people like 2d animation again, or a whole multitude of other things.
Also comparing the views of the Hocus Pocus teaser to full series like Mandalorian is comparing apples to oranges. One is 2 minutes long and just an ad that wants to remind you this movie you may remember or heard of has a sequel. The other is an 8 hour series that is trying to have viewership retention. They're going for different goals.

The viewership I was referring to was for the Teasers for those shows, I should clarify that statement. Thank you for catching that. The comparison was on equal ground.

The Hocus Pocus 2 teaser outperformed both significantly - 43.6 million views on Disney+ in is first day, compared to The Mandalorian Teasers (Both seasons scored 35 million views) and The Book of Boba Fett at 23 million.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Thanks for your response. If I may ask a follow-on question, what do you think stands to be gained by lessening the stigma, and for whom? My sense from your other posts is that you’re no huge fan of the film, so I don’t think you’re hoping for a recuperation of Song of the South itself.

You’re welcome, my friend.

By lessening the stigma, we gain knowledge/education, understanding, and less censorship. Everyone would benefit from this, as knowledge is universal and not just for specific groups of people. There’s so much to learn from SotS, but Disney is restricting access, and I find that frustrating and annoying.

You’re right, I’m not a fan of the movie, mainly because I find it incredibly boring. Even if I didn’t find it racist, I wouldn’t watch it lol. However, I don’t believe movies and books should be censored. Disney is wrong for refusing to officially release SotS. They think they’re doing something good, but they’re not. And they’ve let the problem grow bigger and bigger over time. It’s unfortunate.