Spirited Thoughts, News, Observations etc.

OK, hide the women and the children ... most importantly send the fanbois to bed with their plush and tell them to hide under the covers ... waaaay down under them because it's time for some Spirited thoughts, observations, news and anecdotes from a long weekend at The World Maintenance Forgot, yes WDW.

Where to start? With a conclusion? Or should I just work on down?

Should I start with the good ... things like seeing friends, having great weather, appreciating some things that the fan community tends to ignore and seeing EPCOT in its best colors?

Or ... do I focus on everything else? Because all going to WDW did for me this weekend was exceed my already amazingly low expectations for the state of WDW infrastructure and show quality (hey, they did exceed expectations, right?) and get me more excited for my future visits to DLP, possibly BGW, DL ... and, hopefully in the not too distant future, the Asian resorts again too.

Let's start with the basics. Freshness. If you had visited WDW in 2006 and hadn't returned in six years, you would find no appreciable new product in three of four parks.

You would find show quality that already had issues showing more issues than the typical fanboi in therapy. Well, that's if you can actually get to the MK because the crumbling monorail system has to be shut down all day from 11:30 a.m to 6 p.m. to do track work in the midst of one of the busiest times of the year ... imagine paying $500-700 a night for a room at the GF or Poly with monorail convenience touted (wonder what guest recovery they are doing there!) ... but let's assume you find your way there.

Let's start with the stuff the fan community is all lathered up for, namely the Storybook Circus mini-land expansion of Fantasyland. What did I think of it?

Not very much at all.

As usual, the hype was much greater than the product, which can't be viewed in a vacuum in a park that is crumbling and has no wow factor at all anymore.

In the day, Dumbo's primary colors and the red painted construction fences all around come off as garish ... befitting a circus, no doubt ... but Old Man Disney was no more a fan of circuses than he was of amusement parks and piers and the shady elements that all attracted. So, we have a new spinner that is prettier than the last. And it spins high enough to peek over construction walls and we all know how much that has become en vogue in O-Town of late.

It is a beautiful kinetic piece at night when the lighting is largely coming from the white and red bulbs that rim the queue (likely more of a makeshift deal now until the old Dumbo starts spinning across the way) and the LEDs embedded in the fountains underneath. But it is still Dumbo.

Sort of like the Barnstormer is still the Barnstormer, just missing much in the way of theming. Its prior incarnation had some whimsy, this doesn't. But they weren't getting rid of the only kiddie coaster in the park, so this was a cheap fix. Oh, and thanks to Bob Iger working with a chainsaw, you can now watch Disney buses and CMs driving to/fro work behind the MK as you walk up the queue if you peer left. I will never get what Phil and TDO have against trees, but they certainly do.

Nothing else is open beyond a much nicer train station that is still a train station ... and a set of new restrooms (someone needs to page Talking Head to this thread stat!) What I found amazing is that Disney was too cheap to actually connect these facilities to the park's main water supply, so they are using water from the immediate area that is untreated (or perhaps non-filtered/cleansed is more appropriate) so you have bizarre signs saying the water is 'non potable' (that means you can't drink it for those with limited vocabularies) over toilets. I know Disney's prices are crazy for a Coke, but over the toilet?!? ... Of course, the reason is they have colored the water blue because otherwise it would be a very icky color and folks would constantly be complaining that something isn't right.

Are the details nice? Sure. But they are very basic. I was much more excited by leaf patterns in the walkways around Old Man Island at Dixie Landings 20 years ago than I am by various hoof prints and 'peanuts' embedded in this area.

So much of this area also suffers from having both exposed coaster track (Disney fanbois seem to have issues with this at UNI) and show buildings just sticking out like a Duffy alone on a shelf full of Minnies.

If this is what Disney believes will raise the bar in O-Town ... well, no ... they don't. They understand what they have built and why. This is about capacity ... and NEXT GEN ... and keeping folks from being bored out of their minds by offering something 'new'.

It's in 'soft opening' now, but let's be blunt: they had to get this open and open now. They have so little capacity in this park due to 15 years of taking away and not adding. MK just isn't a very pleasant place right now at all with crowds and walls and lots of attractions that have seen far better days.

Again, it also seems that Ops and WDI simply can't get on the same page no matter what ... Dumbo opens with small plants where every little kid (and plenty of big ones) are going to stand, so the result is the foliage that was there Monday was trampled and mostly dead or dying by Friday. How they miss these basics is beyond me, although I think communication and common sense are both lacking.

Now, what else was 'new' (to me) at MK? Spin the Fanboi? Pin the Tail on Meg? Dole Whip tees (I mean, REALLY?!?!) ... or how about the latest way to hook OCD fanbois and why it is so important to NEXT GEN.

I'll see you all a little later ... like in the next post!
 

Lee

Adventurer
Why is it okay for '74 to bash Disney about EVERYTHING, but wrong for people to say that they enjoy WDW?

I don't know why I'm doing this :shrug:....

Here's the thing...'74 doesn't bash everything. Not even close. You should hear his praises for the Disneyland resort, HK, Tokyo and Paris. Dude is a fan of the highest order.

What he bashes is what every true fan should bash, the horrible way WDW in general, and MK in particular, are being managed. In doing so he uses statements of fact (lots of show quality issues) and statements of opinion )didn't like SotMK). He also calls out those who refuse to acknowledge the problems that undeniably exist. It's great to enjoy your trip, we all do, but some objectivity is required in order to be taken seriously.

You can attempt to argue facts if you have evidence that he has stated something incorrect. You can also disagree with his opinion if yours is different.

However, getting riled up, calling him "wrong", etc, is far from helpful to your cause. State your case as best you can, then move on. Hanging around just to argue is the very definition of a "troll".
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
I don't know why I'm doing this :shrug:....

Here's the thing...'74 doesn't bash everything. Not even close. You should hear his praises for the Disneyland resort, HK, Tokyo and Paris. Dude is a fan of the highest order.

What he bashes is what every true fan should bash, the horrible way WDW in general, and MK in particular, are being managed. In doing so he uses statements of fact (lots of show quality issues) and statements of opinion )didn't like SotMK). He also calls out those who refuse to acknowledge the problems that undeniably exist. It's great to enjoy your trip, we all do, but some objectivity is required in order to be taken seriously.

You can attempt to argue facts if you have evidence that he has stated something incorrect. You can also disagree with his opinion if yours is different.

However, getting riled up, calling him "wrong", etc, is far from helpful to your cause. State your case as best you can, then move on. Hanging around just to argue is the very definition of a "troll".

Right here is proof. You posted a rational post without attacking anyone. Objectivity goes both ways, if all you do is post negatives about MK you should not be taken seriously

Do you support his attacks on the "fanbois" who have a great time at WDW?
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
I am starting to feel pity for you.

Let me give you a bit of unsolicited advice.

Starting with this, You are not fooling anyone. We know you are on at least your 3rd incarnation on these boards. You have been banned before, and at this rate will be banned again. It is also fairly obvious that you are fibbing about your age, though I am not sure why, as there are a multitude of younger members here who are afforded a great deal of respect regardless of age, for an example look to our newest member Ravenclawdia.

You strike me as someone who is having trouble controlling their emotions, rather then someone deliberately looking to stir up trouble. If you want to be an active, contributing member of these forums, and engage in fun and enlightening discussions, you need to reel in this anger.

Stop making it your job to defend Bobby Iger. He does not need you here defending his honor, all it does is make you look cuckoo.

Stop attacking anyone who has a negative point of view about things at WDW. It is really none of your business how they feel about the parks. If you disagree with a point someone is making, state your case without calling them a hater, or rude, or whatever other negative term you have rolling around in your head.

It's not to late for you to turn it around. For some reason the mods have seen fit to allow you to come back a 4th time. And let you stay for 100+ posts. Don't blow it.




In closing...I see no way on earth he takes any of that advice.
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
Lee, here is my point. He made a valid complaint about how the flowers in the Dumbo line are set up wrong so that they will get destroyed. That is a valid critique. But surrounded by that was attacks on the people playing and enjoying SotMK and people having fun in the parks. Can you see why i would attack him?
 

TP2000

Well-Known Member
We're now rolling into a Tuesday night during Spring Break. According to Arizona State University lore, that should mean it'll be time for a break from posting so that all the undergrads can go out and begin the mandatory partying. :D
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
Let me give you a bit of unsolicited advice.

Starting with this, You are not fooling anyone. We know you are on at least your 3rd incarnation on these boards. You have been banned before, and at this rate will be banned again. It is also fairly obvious that you are fibbing about your age, though I am not sure why, as there are a multitude of younger members here who are afforded a great deal of respect regardless of age, for an example look to our newest member Ravenclawdia.

You strike me as someone who is having trouble controlling their emotions, rather then someone deliberately looking to stir up trouble. If you want to be an active, contributing member of these forums, and engage in fun and enlightening discussions, you need to reel in this anger.

Stop making it your job to defend Bobby Iger. He does not need you here defending his honor, all it does is make you look cuckoo.

Stop attacking anyone who has a negative point of view about things at WDW. It is really none of your business how they feel about the parks. If you disagree with a point someone is making, state your case without calling them a hater, or rude, or whatever other negative term you have rolling around in your head.

It's not to late for you to turn it around. For some reason the mods have seen fit to allow you to come back a 4th time. And let you stay for 100+ posts. Don't blow it.




In closing...I see no way on earth he takes any of that advice.

You can believe what you want to believe. I am not lying about anything. I am posting like an adult and since i dont side with you for some reason you think i am a child. That is your problem not mine. I have fun engaging with adults who use common sense and logic. It is others like you who attack, attack, attack, and attack some more then try to play the victim. I am defending mr. iger because internet bullies who attack a man for no reason make me sick. People blame the man for everything and never give him credit.

I dont attack everyone, i attacked three people, you included who attacked others. I never attacked Lee because he is an adult when he posts his critiques.

I have some advice for you but you wont listen to it. Dont attack everyone who likes WDW and accuse them of being plants from TDO. Remember just because you dont like something that is not a universal fact. Take it if you want
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
You can believe what you want to believe. I am not lying about anything. I am posting like an adult and since i dont side with you for some reason you think i am a child. That is your problem not mine. I have fun engaging with adults who use common sense and logic. It is others like you who attack, attack, attack, and attack some more then try to play the victim. I am defending mr. iger because internet bullies who attack a man for no reason make me sick. People blame the man for everything and never give him credit.

I dont attack everyone, i attacked three people, you included who attacked others. I never attacked Lee because he is an adult when he posts his critiques.

I have some advice for you but you wont listen to it. Dont attack everyone who likes WDW and accuse them of being plants from TDO. Remember just because you dont like something that is not a universal fact. Take it if you want

Well, I tried. :shrug:
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
We're now rolling into a Tuesday night during Spring Break. According to Arizona State University lore, that should mean it'll be time for a break from posting so that all the undergrads can go out and begin the mandatory partying. :D

Funny, i am a graduate though.
 

Lee

Adventurer
Right here is proof. You posted a rational post without attacking anyone. Objectivity goes both ways, if all you do is post negatives about MK you should not be taken seriously

Do you support his attacks on the "fanbois" who have a great time at WDW?

I can post just as many negatives about MK as '74 does. I sometimes do. However my posting style doesn't attract as much attention, resulting in my points being missed. Perhaps I should switch to a more eye-catching style.

As for your question, yes and no.
No, in that I don't feel he attacks anyone for enjoying anything. He attacks the thing they are enjoying, based on his opinion of the thing in question.
Yes, in that if someone says "Boy, I'm glad they cut down do many trees! TDO and Disney are awesome!" I'm gonna question that persons sanity. I will attack anyone who supports the dumbing down and neglect of a park by blindly accepting anything that Disney does, no matter how foul. Sadly their numbers are legion.
 

unkadug

Follower of "Saget"The Cult
Sheesh guys...this is a trip report...not news and rumors...not general discussion... a freaking trip report.

I haven't seen you guys taking others to task in their trip reports, in fact most of you have probably never bothered to read a lot of the trip reports that are posted here.

If you don't like his views of things then why on earth are you participating in his trip report.


Pitchforkguy...you need to take a break...you've been on this thread ALL DAY LONG... :lol:
 

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
OK, hide the women and the children ... most importantly send the fanbois to bed with their plush and tell them to hide under the covers ... waaaay down under them because it's time for some Spirited thoughts, observations, news and anecdotes from a long weekend at The World Maintenance Forgot, yes WDW.

Good! Finally a thread that gives me a reason to check this site again.

Let's start with the basics. Freshness. If you had visited WDW in 2006 and hadn't returned in six years, you would find no appreciable new product in three of four parks.

That underscores something about the audience Disney is targeting: they're after first-timers, DVC-owners, and (I'll avoid the f-word) obsessives. Speaking of, what's the status on that legendary mental health book?

So, we have a new spinner that is prettier than the last.

Which isn't saying much since the last one circling the magical asphalt of Fantasyland was a step above the small town carnival.

It is a beautiful kinetic piece at night when the lighting is largely coming from the white and red bulbs that rim the queue (likely more of a makeshift deal now until the old Dumbo starts spinning across the way) and the LEDs embedded in the fountains underneath. But it is still Dumbo.

That's cool, although I don't find myself compelled to visit MK just to see new beautiful kinetic sculptures. Maybe it's just me, but a new nighttime parade or fireworks show or ground-breaking E-ticket would be more interesting.

Sort of like the Barnstormer is still the Barnstormer, just missing much in the way of theming. Its prior incarnation had some whimsy, this doesn't.

That's being generous about the old one. I always thought Gadget's Go-Coaster looked interesting and fun, even if both rides are laughably short. Kid coaster or not, 30 seconds isn't long enough for the magical fun to begin.

But they weren't getting rid of the only kiddie coaster in the park, so this was a cheap fix. Oh, and thanks to Bob Iger working with a chainsaw, you can now watch Disney buses and CMs driving to/fro work behind the MK as you walk up the queue if you peer left.

Sorta makes you wonder what Walter Elias meant when he said WDW would have the blessing of size. :rolleyes: What's the use of size if the parks can't hide outside world?

Nothing else is open beyond a much nicer train station that is still a train station ... and a set of new restrooms (someone needs to page Talking Head to this thread stat!)

Sounds like an update is needed for the Mickey's Magical Restrooms Blog. I should've gotten into documenting the construction walls, because I would've been a lot busier these days.

What I found amazing is that Disney was too cheap to actually connect these facilities to the park's main water supply, so they are using water from the immediate area that is untreated (or perhaps non-filtered/cleansed is more appropriate) so you have bizarre signs saying the water is 'non potable' (that means you can't drink it for those with limited vocabularies) over toilets. I know Disney's prices are crazy for a Coke, but over the toilet?!?

Reminds me of the Brawny-sponsored instructions on how to wash your hands that you'll find in all the restrooms.

So much of this area also suffers from having both exposed coaster track (Disney fanbois seem to have issues with this at UNI) and show buildings just sticking out like a Duffy alone on a shelf full of Minnies.

Funny how the double standard works. It's all in how you wear your pixie dust glasses--glued to your face or sliding down your nose so you can peek over the top.

Again, it also seems that Ops and WDI simply can't get on the same page no matter what ... Dumbo opens with small plants where every little kid (and plenty of big ones) are going to stand, so the result is the foliage that was there Monday was trampled and mostly dead or dying by Friday. How they miss these basics is beyond me, although I think communication and common sense are both lacking.

The Tigger bounce pads, anyone?

Not sure why this thread was moved from News and Rumors, because anytime Spirit gives a rundown of his resort observations, I consider it first-rate news (and entertainment).
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
I can post just as many negatives about MK as '74 does. I sometimes do. However my posting style doesn't attract as much attention, resulting in my points being missed. Perhaps I should switch to a more eye-catching style.

As for your question, yes and no.
No, in that I don't feel he attacks anyone for enjoying anything. He attacks the thing they are enjoying, based on his opinion of the thing in question.
Yes, in that if someone says "Boy, I'm glad they cut down do many trees! TDO and Disney are awesome!" I'm gonna question that persons sanity. I will attack anyone who supports the dumbing down and neglect of a park by blindly accepting anything that Disney does, no matter how foul. Sadly their numbers are legion.
Please don't. Just because we do not comment does not mean we are not reading and learning.
 

asianway

Well-Known Member
I can post just as many negatives about MK as '74 does. I sometimes do. However my posting style doesn't attract as much attention, resulting in my points being missed. Perhaps I should switch to a more eye-catching style.

As for your question, yes and no.
No, in that I don't feel he attacks anyone for enjoying anything. He attacks the thing they are enjoying, based on his opinion of the thing in question.
Yes, in that if someone says "Boy, I'm glad they cut down do many trees! TDO and Disney are awesome!" I'm gonna question that persons sanity. I will attack anyone who supports the dumbing down and neglect of a park by blindly accepting anything that Disney does, no matter how foul. Sadly their numbers are legion.

And that is what Uncle Duncan is counting on.

With a little help from his friends of course
 

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
For all the talk about this being something for kids, I noticed far more OCD 16-36 year-old fanboi types playing and holding binders with dozens of cards.

I know there are a lot of DLR APs who go to the parks weekly. I imagine there are far fewer WDW APs who do the same thing (though that's only a guess). Are there actually WDW APs who will go to the parks weekly to play these games and collect these trading cards?

(Side note: have people not learned from the Beanie Baby, Disney pin-trading, and Vinylmation fads that these "collectable" things turn out to be worth pennies when it's all said and done? These trading cards will be the same way.)

There is a purpose to the 'madness' though ... with KP you have to play the game until your adventure ends or you simply return your Kimmunicator. SotMK is designed for the future. For the NEXT GEN MK. For when guests will be standing in Fantasyland having just met Donald and Daisy (booked six months out) and are 40 minutes away from their FP window for Peter Pan opening. Instead of adding more attractions to combat the empty times, Disney feels that this is the perfect solution because once you've paused the game, you can pick it up anytime after ... even days, weeks, months ... at the same point. So, suddenly your downtime can be used to shop, dine or play.

Hasn't this been the rationale for Fastpass, too? That instead of standing in queues, guests can be spending money on food and merch?

It's especially disturbing that TDO/WDPR/WDI/management think these kinds of additions can replace building major attractions like in the past. I like the idea of the park having smaller, unheralded attractions -- Tiki, Tom Sawyer Island, the Disney Gallery and the Primeval Diorama at DL would all be examples. Not everything has to be an E-ticket, obviously. But this Sorcerers game doesn't seem designed to be a smaller, quiet diversion, with the game spread across the park and these queues sprouting up where people are clustered around the video screens. But at the same time the attraction doesn't sound spectacular enough to warrant its intrusion in the park.

I'm also wondering how people are going to enjoy playing this game in summer when it's 1:00 PM, you're on the verge of sunstroke, and you're waiting in line to watch the TV screen talk to you. I guess people will just play the game casually as they experience other attractions in the area? Because going from stop to stop, playing the game all at once, and crisscrossing the park wouldn't be my idea of fun in the summer heat.
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
I can post just as many negatives about MK as '74 does. I sometimes do. However my posting style doesn't attract as much attention, resulting in my points being missed. Perhaps I should switch to a more eye-catching style.

As for your question, yes and no.
No, in that I don't feel he attacks anyone for enjoying anything. He attacks the thing they are enjoying, based on his opinion of the thing in question.
Yes, in that if someone says "Boy, I'm glad they cut down do many trees! TDO and Disney are awesome!" I'm gonna question that persons sanity. I will attack anyone who supports the dumbing down and neglect of a park by blindly accepting anything that Disney does, no matter how foul. Sadly their numbers are legion.

Thank you for your response. On a side note i agree with you about hating the fact that TDO cut down so many trees. It was sad to see it so bare last time i went.
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
Sheesh guys...this is a trip report...not news and rumors...not general discussion... a freaking trip report.

I haven't seen you guys taking others to task in their trip reports, in fact most of you have probably never bothered to read a lot of the trip reports that are posted here.

If you don't like his views of things then why on earth are you participating in his trip report.


Pitchforkguy...you need to take a break...you've been on this thread ALL DAY LONG... :lol:

Very slow day at work...i mean really slow :ROFLOL:
 

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