Spirited Thoughts, News, Observations etc.

OK, hide the women and the children ... most importantly send the fanbois to bed with their plush and tell them to hide under the covers ... waaaay down under them because it's time for some Spirited thoughts, observations, news and anecdotes from a long weekend at The World Maintenance Forgot, yes WDW.

Where to start? With a conclusion? Or should I just work on down?

Should I start with the good ... things like seeing friends, having great weather, appreciating some things that the fan community tends to ignore and seeing EPCOT in its best colors?

Or ... do I focus on everything else? Because all going to WDW did for me this weekend was exceed my already amazingly low expectations for the state of WDW infrastructure and show quality (hey, they did exceed expectations, right?) and get me more excited for my future visits to DLP, possibly BGW, DL ... and, hopefully in the not too distant future, the Asian resorts again too.

Let's start with the basics. Freshness. If you had visited WDW in 2006 and hadn't returned in six years, you would find no appreciable new product in three of four parks.

You would find show quality that already had issues showing more issues than the typical fanboi in therapy. Well, that's if you can actually get to the MK because the crumbling monorail system has to be shut down all day from 11:30 a.m to 6 p.m. to do track work in the midst of one of the busiest times of the year ... imagine paying $500-700 a night for a room at the GF or Poly with monorail convenience touted (wonder what guest recovery they are doing there!) ... but let's assume you find your way there.

Let's start with the stuff the fan community is all lathered up for, namely the Storybook Circus mini-land expansion of Fantasyland. What did I think of it?

Not very much at all.

As usual, the hype was much greater than the product, which can't be viewed in a vacuum in a park that is crumbling and has no wow factor at all anymore.

In the day, Dumbo's primary colors and the red painted construction fences all around come off as garish ... befitting a circus, no doubt ... but Old Man Disney was no more a fan of circuses than he was of amusement parks and piers and the shady elements that all attracted. So, we have a new spinner that is prettier than the last. And it spins high enough to peek over construction walls and we all know how much that has become en vogue in O-Town of late.

It is a beautiful kinetic piece at night when the lighting is largely coming from the white and red bulbs that rim the queue (likely more of a makeshift deal now until the old Dumbo starts spinning across the way) and the LEDs embedded in the fountains underneath. But it is still Dumbo.

Sort of like the Barnstormer is still the Barnstormer, just missing much in the way of theming. Its prior incarnation had some whimsy, this doesn't. But they weren't getting rid of the only kiddie coaster in the park, so this was a cheap fix. Oh, and thanks to Bob Iger working with a chainsaw, you can now watch Disney buses and CMs driving to/fro work behind the MK as you walk up the queue if you peer left. I will never get what Phil and TDO have against trees, but they certainly do.

Nothing else is open beyond a much nicer train station that is still a train station ... and a set of new restrooms (someone needs to page Talking Head to this thread stat!) What I found amazing is that Disney was too cheap to actually connect these facilities to the park's main water supply, so they are using water from the immediate area that is untreated (or perhaps non-filtered/cleansed is more appropriate) so you have bizarre signs saying the water is 'non potable' (that means you can't drink it for those with limited vocabularies) over toilets. I know Disney's prices are crazy for a Coke, but over the toilet?!? ... Of course, the reason is they have colored the water blue because otherwise it would be a very icky color and folks would constantly be complaining that something isn't right.

Are the details nice? Sure. But they are very basic. I was much more excited by leaf patterns in the walkways around Old Man Island at Dixie Landings 20 years ago than I am by various hoof prints and 'peanuts' embedded in this area.

So much of this area also suffers from having both exposed coaster track (Disney fanbois seem to have issues with this at UNI) and show buildings just sticking out like a Duffy alone on a shelf full of Minnies.

If this is what Disney believes will raise the bar in O-Town ... well, no ... they don't. They understand what they have built and why. This is about capacity ... and NEXT GEN ... and keeping folks from being bored out of their minds by offering something 'new'.

It's in 'soft opening' now, but let's be blunt: they had to get this open and open now. They have so little capacity in this park due to 15 years of taking away and not adding. MK just isn't a very pleasant place right now at all with crowds and walls and lots of attractions that have seen far better days.

Again, it also seems that Ops and WDI simply can't get on the same page no matter what ... Dumbo opens with small plants where every little kid (and plenty of big ones) are going to stand, so the result is the foliage that was there Monday was trampled and mostly dead or dying by Friday. How they miss these basics is beyond me, although I think communication and common sense are both lacking.

Now, what else was 'new' (to me) at MK? Spin the Fanboi? Pin the Tail on Meg? Dole Whip tees (I mean, REALLY?!?!) ... or how about the latest way to hook OCD fanbois and why it is so important to NEXT GEN.

I'll see you all a little later ... like in the next post!
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I guess add me into the grumpies then. I was at WDW this weekend and my thoughts and observations for the most part equal 74's points. I will say that Dumbo looked great but Goofini theming is just sad. When we were exiting the ride my 6 year old told me that we were in jail and that she missed the chickens.

Overall the parks just looked dirty and tired. Hopefully whoever follows Iger will take some interest in getting WDW back to being the best them park in the world.

Hows that? I didn't insult any fanboi's, opps never mind.

Well, it has come to the point where I can't honestly advise folks to go to the MK anymore. I just don't think the sheer contempt management shows for its guests at that park daily shown by the product they put out is worthy of people spending their money.

The park is a mess and I don't really care that Fantasyland will look better in two years. Everything else (with the LS exceptions) is falling apart. The entertainment is beyond stale.

I will likely skip it entirely on my next visit to O-Town.

I've been to the other four MKs, and that just isn't how things are supposed to be done.
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
Well, it has come to the point where I can't honestly advise folks to go to the MK anymore. I just don't think the sheer contempt management shows for its guests at that park daily shown by the product they put out is worthy of people spending their money.

The park is a mess and I don't really care that Fantasyland will look better in two years. Everything else (with the LS exceptions) is falling apart. The entertainment is beyond stale.

I will likely skip it entirely on my next visit to O-Town.

I've been to the other four MKs, and that just isn't how things are supposed to be done.

It should be noted that I've got my family going to Disneyland for our next family vacation instead of Disney World. It was 4-5 years of pushing from me to make the switch, but I'd really like to see how they view it. No one other than my fiance or myself has visited Disneyland in the last 15 years.
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
That's a winning statement...TDO shows contempt for guests because you do not like ML. Time for me to tell my nephew he is stupid for having the time of his life at ML
 

mgf

Well-Known Member
'74, I appreciate your comments much more than I did a year ago. Disney has always been a wonderful annual escape for me and holds a special place in my heart. That said, I just returned from my longest trip ever (9 days because of business), and my wife and I left having had fun but feeling "off" about the experience. We ultimately decided to skip getting annual passes and turned down an invitation to go with friends this summer.

On the drive home, we started talking about what we noticed that was really bothersome this trip. Here is a short list for just the MK:

  • SotMK is not nearly as well implemented as KP and does much to harm the park, especially at night. The one just past the veranda in Adventureland is particularly bad as is the one at Pirates. (Why not put it on the side of the clock tower?) I also noticed the binders.
  • SW is in pretty bad shape. We rode and the entire main audio track was out. The load areas is gross and beat to pieces. Lots of rot and mold.
  • Peoplemover track needs paint, the EPCOT model looks like trash (background literally rotting away), the vignette with the black leather couch is filthy (including visible hand prints in the dust on the couch - which made me wonder if someone had "christened" that room after hours), Star Traders view is covered in dust, Buzz looks bad even from a distance, and the track lighting is inconsistent with random soft lighting and color.
  • Sloppy instillation of props at the new train station and the old themed elements at the water tower, which you mentioned.
  • The HM had one of the worst damage repair jobs I have ever seen. See the tree with the two owls just after the decent into the graveyard. The branch clearly was snapped then repaired with highly visible metal strapping. You can even see the electrical nuts from the wires breaking.
  • Splash looks and rides terrible. The finale had numerous burned out light strips. The Laughing Place was missing all water effects.
  • The drunk pirate talking to the cats lost his hand. I was laying on the ground mug side up. It was very obvious, rather funny, and quite pathetic as it had been reported by several people but not fixed.
  • The lighting on the Grand Floridian looks terrible.
  • We rode a monorail (not sure which one) with such damaged weatherstripping on the door I could fit my hand outside when it was closed.
  • Park food is getting more expensive, more boring, and less tasty.
  • The shopping mall on Main Street is getting obnoxious.

Other random observations:
  • In generally, DAK, EPCOT, and DHS were pretty enjoyable with few obvious issues - Dinosaur and Yeti aside although steam and both waterfalls were working. We really enjoyed seeing the garden festival. (I noticed the train town in Germany was celebrating the festival in miniature, which gave me hope that some people still care about the details.)
  • The back 9 on the Fantasia mini-golf was almost completely non-functional.
  • We sat one night on the Boardwalk and the ESPN Club side's lighting package was totally dark....for the entire night.
  • On a total rain-out, we realized how little there is to do outside the parks besides shop for stuff they sell inside the parks.

On the positive side, I had much more pleasant experiences with CM's this trip than years previously. While it has issues, I think the new Dumbo is an improvement to the old experience. For better or worse, DTD was jammed every night I was there. Seeing them for the first time, I liked Pooh's next-gen and thought HM's were passable.

This trip seemed much more mixed than I would have wanted. We are contemplating a WDW break to try Disneyland and see more of the real world. (We loved Europe last summer and thought our day at DLP was great fun.) We just aren't sure that WDW is a slam-dunk vacation experience right now, which is tough to admit....
 

TP2000

Well-Known Member
So where were we?

Oh yeah, admiring the fact Disney left some remnants of Tentland in the water tower and other RR facility building opposite the new station.

I'd wondered about that too when the pictures came flooding in a week ago. They didn't touch the old Toontown-themed railroad support structures on the other side of the tracks, and they now clash with the more realistic and differently themed train station and facilities in the rebuilt part of the station.

FantasylandStation.jpg

http://blog.closesttodisney.com/2012/03/12/storybookcircussoftopening.aspx

The shed behind the locomotive still has the cartoony oversized bricks and wacky paint colors, and the water tower behind the train has the circus tent cover over it. You could argue the circus tent water tower references the new Dumbo facility and two big tents that will re-appear across the way and so it could stay but just feel a bit out of place in the elegantly themed train depot. But the cartoony Toontown bricks on the shed no longer reference back to anything in New Fantasyland. Maybe they could repaint it (it doesn't look like it got new paint anyway in this remodel) to a darker color scheme and it wouldn't stick out as badly?

Interesting that the project dollars didn't extend across the tracks for a full remodel. As in fiscally tight project management jobs, those structures were likely once included in the original scope but were pushed out of the project when it was time to trim the budget. :eek:
 

Captain Chaos

Well-Known Member
I'm surprised to see such a negative response to this thread. Is it so hard to hear criticism of your beloved parks?

I LOVE WDW, but I can see a lot of negative changes in recent years. My first trip was 1991... it was a whole different vibe then. It just felt like the standards of quality were a lot higher across the board, and everyone cared about guest satisfaction. This included the parks, the resorts, the restaurants, you name it.

I'm a DVC owner, and I still say buying DVC was some of the best money I've ever spent. But for the first time I'm actually becoming concerned about having ownership in a resort that seems to be in decline. Right now demand is still high, but if the slide continues will I still want my membership? Will I have trouble selling it?

I wouldn't have even imagined having thoughts like these only a few short years ago.

For some people, yes, it is hard to hear the criticism... Another forum I belong to, but don't post on, had a thread about the pixie dusters and the doomers and gloomers... they pretty much rather hear about how everything in WDW is perfect and there are no issues... They want the "doomers and gloomers" to go away.... They say the negative opinions mean nothing... They don't care how bad the show is in WDW... They don't care if Disney gives you less entertainment while taking more money out of your pockets... they really don't care that the merchandise is blah, cheap, and really tacky... Try to say anything negative, and you are attacked... Express your opinions about how stale things have gotten, and they call for your banning... They want to classify you as a troll... You know, sometimes, you need to hear the bad... And we all know, truth hurts... And sadly, truth is, WDW has slipped...

I am a DVC member too... I have been to the parks pretty much every year since 2002 (before my DVC days)... I have seen how things have gotten in WDW... They haven't gotten better... The blind defense to how TDO handles things in WDW is the reason things will never change down there...

Sorry but you are completely wrong. But hey believe what you want, i know the truth.

It is funny how you can honestly try to tell a person who ACTUALLY participated in the experience they are wrong. Sorry while i laugh.

Nothing you said is correct.

Scuttle already answered you... But, again, he cannot be wrong... It is his opinion based on what he has seen, his encounters with SotMK...

Here is the thing I find hypocritical... If Universal put something like this in their theme parks, the defends of all things Disney would bash Universal for putting such a poor addition in their parks... But Disney does it, and it is the best thing ever... I'll stick to playing video games at home on Xbox, PS3, Wii...

I used to be a huge WDW pixie dust sniffer... I would always defend WDW (and Disney in general) blindly, like majority here do... Heck, I always took the opportunity to put Universal down when ever I had a chance... And honestly, 74's posts ALWAYS irritated me when he first started here... I used to hate his posts... UNTIL, I saw things for myself... Until I noticed the decline in WDW... Now, Im right there with 74 in his observations... I can now appreciate his posts since I opened my mind and actually saw things for what they were... I will now take the opportunity to praise Universal when they deserve the praise (and they deserve TONS of it now, moreso that WDW does)... it is amazing what you will see if you just open your minds and lay off the pixie dust... Overdosing is bad for the health...
 

Captain Chaos

Well-Known Member
Absolutely. I got distracted by something on the homefront and when I returned I saw all the typical drivel (yes, that is my opinion of much of what was posted and yes it is disparaging to anyone who might have written it) about my 'tude being more important than anything I might have to say that shocks people's World or world views.

Headed offline shortly, but if you have any specific questions ask away ...

Nothing specific.. Just wanna hear more about yuor time at Epcot (likes AND dislikes, what was in good shape vs what was in bad show) and same for DHS... OHHH and I especially want to hear about your experiences with Disney restaurants this time around... Remember, I credit you for me now loving Sanaa since your review of the place was glowing...
 
I have to agree. Just a few examples bust first ..

I must praise the WIFI being present at all the disney resorts. Welcome to the Present Disney.

Now the Bad...

We ate at Shutters at CBR. We used to LOVE this resteraunt. The food is now the same food you get from the food court. We paid extra for the pleasure of sitting down and being served. Just a year ago, it was different and really good. Now the Ribs were the same ones from counter service. I felt very ripped off.

Ill touch on just one ride at MK. Winnie the Pooh. The Acid Trip Scene to me is in horrible shape. The paint is fading or coming off. You can see through it. It is very dirty and badly needs painting. As you exit, on the right side you can see the dry wall has been smashed apart and crudely and unsuccessfully patched together.

All the ques were dirty and filthy especially at Buzz Lightyear. The floors seemed like they hadnt been cleaned in years.

Anywhere there was carpet it was dirty and disgusting. Epcot and MK. Nothing had been vacuumed. Dirty crumbs and spills all throughout. Noticed on Monsters Laugh Floor and Circle of Life video in the land.

We are good for atleast 4 weekends a year and one week at MINIMUM. We hadnt been there in 6 months due to the birth of my youngest and my wife having surgery. I will still go because it is still magical to my son.

Also I agree 100% about the Walmart feel for the merchandise. I can goto Downtown Disney and goto World Of Disney and get everything from the parks right there. I miss the feel of HAVING TO GO to the shops and see what was different at each one. THAT would make it special to me.
 

Megavolt

Member
I have to say that I agree greatly with everything that Spirit says. At this point, Disney has not really produced anything that makes me interested in returning. As a result, my wife and myself will not be renewing our APs this year. After having one for about 5 years, I have finally stopped being hopeful that things would begin to return to the old style. We are opting to swap resorts to Universal and see what a year there is like. We normally make weekend trips, so Universal really fits that bill. As Lee said, we are looking to visiting a park that swinging for the fences instead of bunting memories and magic at us.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
*sigh*
Attacking the messeger instead of the message.

And this was predicted at our last dinner, was it not?:lol:

Where to begin...

Firstly, as Martin said "Fanboy" or "Fanboi" is not a derogatory term. I (somewhat grudgingly) will admit to being one, as will Spirit.
The "fanboi" or to use the current term from inside the company "foamer" is the negative term. It is somewhat synonymous what is known hereabouts as a "pixie-duster" who can see no wrong. The overzealous sort.
And yes, there are many indise the Walt Disney Co. who look upon it's fans in a very negative light, and do not hesitate to use derogatory terms to describe them. Never forget, to them you are not really a guest, you are a walking $. Last thing they want to deal with are $s with opinions or attitudes. It gets in the way of the spending.

Again, you have it nailed. But you such a gentler kinder version of me ... it's almost like you wear a white robe (with requisite pin lanyard) and a thousand points of light beam from your amazing eyes!:D

Complete and total hogwash. WDW can/and will return to it's former glory just as soon as it is being run by a team that cares about such things as show, quality and value. Nothing at all to do with "business trajectories", that's just silly.
Look at Disneyland and the turnaround it saw between 2003-2005 when a competant leadership team took over. WDW needs itself some Ouimet, stat!

Absolutely and what I tell any/every one who asks if there's hope. Sure, but first management needs to change. Meg won't finish the year due to serious health issues. But the problem is Disney always promotes from inside. You have a cancerous culture and you simply replace one troubled exec with another.

Get ready for Tom Staggs running the entire company!

The illustrious Spirit get's special treatment everywhere he goes, not just Disney parks. Besides, he does actually pay for that AP he has had continuously for the last few decades.

Yes, he does. And sometimes that special treatment is even quite nice.

According to the telephonic trip report I got from him, yes. Just not at MK, particularly. He seemed to quite enjoy DHS and Epcot.

That would be accurate largely. But the MK is the supposed No. 1 theme park in the world ... and it just is a very lousy park right now.

Sad really. I think the thread is more news than trip report.

That was the point, but much better to be 'hidden' here ...

Now then, can we discuss the important points of the thread?
Really bad sightlines in Storybook Circus. Horrible show quality in many attractions. Tigger covered by a black blanket with the tag showing. SotMK being distracting and intrusive.
(He didn't even mention the missing dolls and mold in Small World.)

Why? Much better to discuss me ... guess what? They can take shots all they like, but me being blunt, cynical and a bit snarky doesn't negate the fact the MK is one mess of a park ... or that WDW's business plan is destroying the place.
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
For some people, yes, it is hard to hear the criticism... Another forum I belong to, but don't post on, had a thread about the pixie dusters and the doomers and gloomers... they pretty much rather hear about how everything in WDW is perfect and there are no issues... They want the "doomers and gloomers" to go away.... They say the negative opinions mean nothing... They don't care how bad the show is in WDW... They don't care if Disney gives you less entertainment while taking more money out of your pockets... they really don't care that the merchandise is blah, cheap, and really tacky... Try to say anything negative, and you are attacked... Express your opinions about how stale things have gotten, and they call for your banning... They want to classify you as a troll... You know, sometimes, you need to hear the bad... And we all know, truth hurts... And sadly, truth is, WDW has slipped...

I am a DVC member too... I have been to the parks pretty much every year since 2002 (before my DVC days)... I have seen how things have gotten in WDW... They haven't gotten better... The blind defense to how TDO handles things in WDW is the reason things will never change down there...



Scuttle already answered you... But, again, he cannot be wrong... It is his opinion based on what he has seen, his encounters with SotMK...

Here is the thing I find hypocritical... If Universal put something like this in their theme parks, the defends of all things Disney would bash Universal for putting such a poor addition in their parks... But Disney does it, and it is the best thing ever... I'll stick to playing video games at home on Xbox, PS3, Wii...

I used to be a huge WDW pixie dust sniffer... I would always defend WDW (and Disney in general) blindly, like majority here do... Heck, I always took the opportunity to put Universal down when ever I had a chance... And honestly, 74's posts ALWAYS irritated me when he first started here... I used to hate his posts... UNTIL, I saw things for myself... Until I noticed the decline in WDW... Now, Im right there with 74 in his observations... I can now appreciate his posts since I opened my mind and actually saw things for what they were... I will now take the opportunity to praise Universal when they deserve the praise (and they deserve TONS of it now, moreso that WDW does)... it is amazing what you will see if you just open your minds and lay off the pixie dust... Overdosing is bad for the health...

If Universal installed something like SotMK i would be happy it would give me another reason to visit
 

Bolna

Well-Known Member
The supposed MAGIC number at MK is nine in one day. As bad as capacity is there (and it is awful compared to 1992), I can arrive at the MK at 9 p.m. and do that many attractions in three hours. So, I don't understand the folks who get there at 9 a.m. (no matter the closing time) not being able to see and do everything they want ... but that's another discussion and we already have about 65 on this thread ... because I am an attention and all!:lol::drevil::king:

Well, I belong to that 9 am crowd (and don't worry I won't take it personal that you are making fun of us!! :lookaroun) and I manage those magical nine attractions before lunch.


That is exactly what I am saying, although you are the first to put it that way.

My take on this has been said over and over again ... and many here don't/won't like it ... but the 'tude is generally one of TDO saying 'we know our parks are stale and we aren't adding REAL reasons for you to return, so here is something to keep you busy instead of playing with your iPhone''

So, do you have any idea how much money they invested in SotMK? I would think it wasn't cheap - but still cheaper than let's say a new D-ticket for Tomorrowland?

I am really wondering why they are putting the money into this while otherwise they appear to be so adverse to spending anything. Like cancelling a Wishes replacement that would have been like DLP's Dreams (which I get to see in May!! :sohappy: ). It is in a certain way even "innovative" in the sense that something like that hasn't been done. And it seems like Disney prefers to do safe things at the moment. So why this?


But I didn't see it (was at MK for parts of three days -- NOT my choice) as something very popular beyond the teen to 30-something fanboi demos. They were playing and had books of cards and wanted to trade. I saw some kids playing too, but they honestly seemed to lose interest quickly.

I don't blame them. Unlike Kim Possible where you can make things happen, this is strictly a screen game ... and I just don't see this as what the No. 1 theme park in the world should be spending money on as the place literally is crumbling and they have now gone two decades without adding a major attraction.

Didn't Disney have problems with aggressive pin-traders when the whole pin-trading thing started? I seem to remember reports about that in the past. If even after a few weeks (months?) of operation of SotMK people are already standing around with binders - and you get asked about wanting to trade cards (I guess you just look like the typical guy who is into trading cards games?) - couldn't this be a potential problem. Kids who get talked out of cards they have, etc.?

Well, it certainly gets frustrating and boring when you have to stand behind eight people and watch the same video playing. That seemed to be the case, Some 'portals' had between 5-10 people waiting to play while a few others had no one there.

So, in the end the whole game does not really have a lot of capacity. Actually it will only be a good distraction for a few who are waiting for their X-Pass times...
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
I have to agree. Just a few examples bust first ..

I must praise the WIFI being present at all the disney resorts. Welcome to the Present Disney.

Now the Bad...

We ate at Shutters at CBR. We used to LOVE this resteraunt. The food is now the same food you get from the food court. We paid extra for the pleasure of sitting down and being served. Just a year ago, it was different and really good. Now the Ribs were the same ones from counter service. I felt very ripped off.

Ill touch on just one ride at MK. Winnie the Pooh. The Acid Trip Scene to me is in horrible shape. The paint is fading or coming off. You can see through it. It is very dirty and badly needs painting. As you exit, on the right side you can see the dry wall has been smashed apart and crudely and unsuccessfully patched together.

All the ques were dirty and filthy especially at Buzz Lightyear. The floors seemed like they hadnt been cleaned in years.

Anywhere there was carpet it was dirty and disgusting. Epcot and MK. Nothing had been vacuumed. Dirty crumbs and spills all throughout. Noticed on Monsters Laugh Floor and Circle of Life video in the land.

We are good for atleast 4 weekends a year and one week at MINIMUM. We hadnt been there in 6 months due to the birth of my youngest and my wife having surgery. I will still go because it is still magical to my son.

Also I agree 100% about the Walmart feel for the merchandise. I can goto Downtown Disney and goto World Of Disney and get everything from the parks right there. I miss the feel of HAVING TO GO to the shops and see what was different at each one. THAT would make it special to me.

The WIFI complaint has to be one of the worst complaints i have ever heard of. I work in the industry and i just laugh when people complain about it.
 

The Empress Lilly

Well-Known Member
Why is this thread buried here? Because of people carrying on and on and on how much they dislike somebody's posting style? Are perfectly fine threads allowed to be shouted down nowadays?

I can get bland opinion about how magical Disney is by visiting any Justin Bieber or My Little Pony fora. I visit this website for entertaining opinions, for stimulating debate, for insightful posters with an understanding of the workings of Disney. Now I have to wade through all sorts of obscure subfora to find it.


~ Let everybody do his thing, no need to be judgemental. Everybody has his own posting style, his own tone. All for the better for those seeking spirited debate. ~
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
For some people, yes, it is hard to hear the criticism... Another forum I belong to, but don't post on, had a thread about the pixie dusters and the doomers and gloomers... they pretty much rather hear about how everything in WDW is perfect and there are no issues... They want the "doomers and gloomers" to go away.... They say the negative opinions mean nothing... They don't care how bad the show is in WDW... They don't care if Disney gives you less entertainment while taking more money out of your pockets... they really don't care that the merchandise is blah, cheap, and really tacky... Try to say anything negative, and you are attacked... Express your opinions about how stale things have gotten, and they call for your banning... They want to classify you as a troll... You know, sometimes, you need to hear the bad... And we all know, truth hurts... And sadly, truth is, WDW has slipped...

I am a DVC member too... I have been to the parks pretty much every year since 2002 (before my DVC days)... I have seen how things have gotten in WDW... They haven't gotten better... The blind defense to how TDO handles things in WDW is the reason things will never change down there...



Scuttle already answered you... But, again, he cannot be wrong... It is his opinion based on what he has seen, his encounters with SotMK...

Here is the thing I find hypocritical... If Universal put something like this in their theme parks, the defends of all things Disney would bash Universal for putting such a poor addition in their parks... But Disney does it, and it is the best thing ever... I'll stick to playing video games at home on Xbox, PS3, Wii...

I used to be a huge WDW pixie dust sniffer... I would always defend WDW (and Disney in general) blindly, like majority here do... Heck, I always took the opportunity to put Universal down when ever I had a chance... And honestly, 74's posts ALWAYS irritated me when he first started here... I used to hate his posts... UNTIL, I saw things for myself... Until I noticed the decline in WDW... Now, Im right there with 74 in his observations... I can now appreciate his posts since I opened my mind and actually saw things for what they were... I will now take the opportunity to praise Universal when they deserve the praise (and they deserve TONS of it now, moreso that WDW does)... it is amazing what you will see if you just open your minds and lay off the pixie dust... Overdosing is bad for the health...

There is a difference between opening your mind and just bashing for the sake of bashing. You attack the pixie dust sniffers but praise the people like 74 who offer nothing reasonable but just negativity. They are just as bad if not worse since no one like debbie downers.
 

Pitchforkman

New Member
Why is this thread buried here? Because of people carrying on and on and on how much they dislike somebody's posting style? Are perfectly fine threads allowed to be shouted down nowadays?

I can get bland opinion about how magical Disney is by visiting any Justin Bieber or My Little Pony fora. I visit this website for entertaining opinions, for stimulating debate, for insightful posters with an understanding of the workings of Disney. Now I have to wade through all sorts of obscure subfora to find it.


~ Let everybody do his thing, no need to be judgemental. Everybody has his own posting style, his own tone. All for the better for those seeking spirited debate. ~

Because technically this thread has nothing to do with rumors or updates. It was posted in the wrong catagory.
 

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