Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts Tres

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pheneix

Well-Known Member
Sue_Vongello said:
NEW TOPIC: Who will be the scapegoat or what kind of kneejerk (but really late actually) reaction will there be in a few years if a Uni park overtakes DHS in attendance numbers, surely with nothing on the horizon for DHS before 2015/2016 ... this is a distinct possibility ... I think this is the catalyst we need.
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That happened in 2011 when IOA jumped into the stratosphere of theme parks that are capable of pulling down 25k day all year long.
Scapegoating has been going on inside WDPR since May 2012. Not only have they not found someone to blame, they haven't come up with a game plan to compete with Universal either.
 
Sue_Vongello

Sue_Vongello

Well-Known Member
pheneix said:
That happened in 2011 when IOA jumped into the stratosphere of theme parks that are capable of pulling down 25k day all year long.
Scapegoating has been going on inside WDPR since May 2012. Not only have they not found someone to blame, they haven't come up with a game plan to compete with Universal either.
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Oh, really? So maybe they don't read these message boards then ... there are literally dozens of posters with some suggestions for them (that would actually work too!)
 
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pheneix

Well-Known Member
MerlinTheGoat said:
I wasn't referring to their government or laws with my praise. I'm referring to the country's physical beauty and architecture (same with DLP). Having backwards drug laws doesn't have any relevance to who has the best theme park. The US (where I live) has very backwards drug laws (and the government and economy is a complete and ongoing train wreck overall), but the country has undeniable beauty and wonderful things to see and do in it.

Europa and Efteling are both lovely parks, though i'd probably be much more of a fan of Efteling. But Disneyland Paris at least in its heyday was also an absolute stunner and has awesome and detailed rides to match its outward beauty. Europa clearly has great beauty on the surface but I can tell that I wouldn't be a big fan of many of its rides. It appears to rely on roller coasters (unfortunately with largely exposed tracks). For a coaster to attract my attention, it has to be something like Big Thunder where there's actual scenery and sets surrounding the entire thing to hide the track's framework. I'm not at all a fan of coasters that have a lot of exposed elements. It's a flaw that I also have with both Busch Gardens parks and Sea World (even though I like those parks), and it's also a flaw I have with Universal (though they've been much more focused on creating immersive and richly themed ride experiences lately that appeal to people who appreciate Disney rides). I value rides with elaborate show scenes very highly (physical sets and physical character figures, particularly animatronics), the more the better.

I think I would really love Efteling though, it looks stunning and has several attractions that i'm sure would cater towards my taste of richly detailed show scenes. Particularly the lovely looking Fairy Tale Forest walk (that they apparently continue to expand upon), Dreamflight and Fata Morgana. And I hear they've got plans for future dark rides as well and continue to add on to the place. I discovered the park during the past couple of years and took a bit of time to watch a bunch of videos of the park and its attractions. It looks absolutely charming and wonderful and I would love to visit in person someday.

But again, from my experience with DLP, it's a tough one to beat. I have no idea what it's like today, but I can say that it was absolutely fantastic in the early-mid 90's. It had the looks AND the attractions.

EDIT- I should say that I think I would enjoy Europa as well. There are some pretty cool looking dark rides there as well (the Pirates one for instance, while very much a blatant POTC ripoff, at least looks like a pretty neat ripoff). But better than heyday DLP? Wouldn't say i'd agree.
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Efteling is probably the only park in the world that out-DIsney'd the Walt Disney Company's product.

Europa is a different beast. More comparable to Busch Gardens but much larger and MUCH better run. Europa Park has the best operations in the world. Better than OLC, better than Universal, better than anyone. They also churn out awesome new rides almost every year like clockwork.
 
asianway

asianway

Well-Known Member
pheneix said:
That happened in 2011 when IOA jumped into the stratosphere of theme parks that are capable of pulling down 25k day all year long.
Scapegoating has been going on inside WDPR since May 2012. Not only have they not found someone to blame, they haven't come up with a game plan to compete with Universal either.
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Wouldnt Meg be the place to start? I mean, why is she bullet proof?
 
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pheneix

Well-Known Member
Bolna said:
Ok, I am used to this thread coming up with the strangest topics - but I was truly very surprised to wake up to a beautiful summer morning here in Germany and see that suddenly there is a discussion about the German's inability to build large projects and their rampant corruption.

First of all - I think it is obvious that at the time Euro Disney was thought of Germany was never on anyone's mind. And quite rightly so. A park outside of Berlin would have been in the communist block until late 1989. And the infrastructure in East Germany would not have been able to support any large project like this until at the very earliest maybe 2000/2001.
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That is very true. I only wish that Michael Eisner wasn't so enamored with Paris that he could have picked up a newspaper in 1989 and realized, "Germany just reunified?!? Eff this French Disney park, delay it five years and build it over there!"

But in 2013? Man alive, whoever finally builds a world class theme park to support the Berlin metro area is going to bank HARD. Especially if they are savvy enough to keep the key features indoors.

Btw there is another German park I've visited, Phantasialand, that I also have a tremendous amount of respect for. They don't have the budgets or the attendance that Disney and Europa enjoy but the park was still exceptionally clean and in great working order. And some of their rides are serious over-achievers for a park of that size. Maus au Chocolate simply destroys Toy Story Mania. It fact, Maus is so thorough in its one-upmanship that it brings TSM back to life just so it can kill it again.

http://www.parkworld-online.com/news/fullstory.php/aid/2037/Maus_au_Chocolat.html
 
Soarin' Over Pgh

Soarin' Over Pgh

Well-Known Member
pheneix said:
That is very true. I only wish that Michael Eisner wasn't so enamored with Paris that he could have picked up a newspaper in 1989 and realized, "Germany just reunified?!? Eff this French Disney park, delay it five years and build it over there!"

But in 2013? Man alive, whoever finally builds a world class theme park to support the Berlin metro area is going to bank HARD. Especially if they are savvy enough to keep the key features indoors.

Btw there is another German park I've visited, Phantasialand, that I also have a tremendous amount of respect for. They don't have the budgets or the attendance that Disney and Europa enjoy but the park was still exceptionally clean and in great working order. And some of their rides are serious over-achievers for a park of that size. Maus au Chocolate simply destroys Toy Story Mania. It fact, Maus is so thorough in its one-upmanship that it brings TSM back to life just so it can kill it again.

http://www.parkworld-online.com/news/fullstory.php/aid/2037/Maus_au_Chocolat.html
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You sure do travel a lot. Can I go with you next time? :D

Also, your last sentence made my day. Thanks.
 
PeterAlt

PeterAlt

Well-Known Member
By the way, a while ago I suggested that Disney could wait until the planned exentension of the Las Vegas monorail system to the LV airport before doing any expansion of the WDW system. Building both at the same time would enable a single monorail production run through Bombardiar in a shared order and cut costs for both.

I recently did some research about the LV strip area in general. Las Vegas is still in recession. Big projects that were announced years ago have stalled, been cancelled, or hav been cut back. This includes the monorail expansion. According to the privately owned company running the system, which just emerged from bankruptcy, there will be no expansion without federal assistance. I don't know if they even applied for it.

In any case, there will be a long wait until they ever start this project. That's okay, if WDW goes in with them on the Bombardiar contract because Disney still has to upgrade their system first with automation technogy (which is planned). Disney (through the RCID) can apply for federal funds, just as the LV Monorail Corporation plans to do. To increase the odds of receiving those funds, the WDW extension should go to just outside the property to the southern terminus of American Maglev Technology's planned maglev monorail which would run from just outside the gates of WDW, stop at the Orlando Convention Center at International Drive, stop at the Florida Mall, and end at a new Intermodal station being built at OIA. Also stopping at the Intermodal station will be All Aboard Florida, a high speed diesel-powered passenger train that will run along new tracks parallel to the Bee Line Express Way to Cocoa Beach and then on the existing FEC tracks to Miami, stopping at West Palm Beach (my home town), Ft. Lauderdale, and Miami.

See, everything will come together nicely. It just takes a little patience and the foresight to plan very far ahead, anticipating all the dominos and where they are going to be when they fall - and a plan of action of what to do.
 
Cody5242

Cody5242

Well-Known Member
Computer Magic said:
Has this been discussed?

Oz Land and Attraction Planned for Disneyland

., Disneyland, Imagineering

“We have plans, ‘great and powerful’ plans” (Tony Baxter @ Fantasy Faire).
DbM has it from reliable sources that our friends at Imagineering are finishing up concept and show design for an Oz land (or area) and Oz attraction based on the movie Oz the Great and Powerful. It will be located where “Big Thunder Ranch” now stands. An alternate location was at the old Motor Boat Cruise next to it’s a small world, but fire-safety issues with the monorail precluded it. It is anticipated that the area will have one E-ticket ride and two C-ticket attractions. A restaurant similar to the Magic Kingdom’s “Be Our Guest” but placed in the Emerald City, and a Munchkinland themed retail store will also be included. Show elements will include a hot air balloon, tornado effects, giant bubbles, and Dark Queen Evanora’s army of Winkies and flying baboons. Word is that China Doll will be featured in the ride. The final attraction mix will be decided shortly, and DbM expects that the announcement about Oz land will be made at D23.
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If this is true, they could easily use whatever the hot air ballon ride system is to build a UP dark ride
 
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Bolna

Well-Known Member
pheneix said:
That is very true. I only wish that Michael Eisner wasn't so enamored with Paris that he could have picked up a newspaper in 1989 and realized, "Germany just reunified?!? Eff this French Disney park, delay it five years and build it over there!"

But in 2013? Man alive, whoever finally builds a world class theme park to support the Berlin metro area is going to bank HARD. Especially if they are savvy enough to keep the key features indoors.
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Part of me agrees with you - but then Berlin still has its own set of problems. It is still not doing well at all economically in general. There are more and more pockets of wealth, but the city itself is insanely short on money. It still has no functioning international airport (actually the Berlin airport story is another building project that totally failed, which still does not make Germans incompetent in general). The old airport was too small over 25 years ago already. Berlin also very much is an island within a very empty countryside. Most of Central Europe is rather densely populated, but around Berlin it is very empty for Europe. All of this really does not really speak for a big theme park project there.

On the other hand, Berlin is incredibly popular with tourists, and for some strange reason seen as a place to go for shopping. I think around 70% of the retail revenue in Berlin comes from tourists. And there are all these smallish "themed entertainments" starting to come up in Berlin. It has a Lego Discovery Center, a House of Barbie is about to open there. So I think for these kind of tourist a theme park would be an additional appeal.

But I truly think you can't blame Eisner. Having experienced the fall of the Berlin Wall and reunification in person and from very close, I can tell you that first of all in 1989 no one would have expected for things to move that quickly! Just remember that in 1989 World War II was still officially ongoing as there had never been a peace treaty. Until the 4+1 treaty in 1990 the US, French and the British were still occupying forces in West Germany even. And those first ten years were an extremely rough time - more for the East than the West. It was truly not the time for big theme park projects to succeed.

And finally - you still have the climate issue. Berlin has really long and cold winters - when I lived there it was two months of temperatures around 15°F. You don't want to be in a theme park in this kind of weather.

pheneix said:
Btw there is another German park I've visited, Phantasialand, that I also have a tremendous amount of respect for. They don't have the budgets or the attendance that Disney and Europa enjoy but the park was still exceptionally clean and in great working order. And some of their rides are serious over-achievers for a park of that size. Maus au Chocolate simply destroys Toy Story Mania. It fact, Maus is so thorough in its one-upmanship that it brings TSM back to life just so it can kill it again.

http://www.parkworld-online.com/news/fullstory.php/aid/2037/Maus_au_Chocolat.html
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I visited Phantasialand in 2006 or 2007. So before Maus. I remember being partly impressed. I liked the indoor coaster (Wuzze or somthing like that) which was similar to Crush in Paris. And I thought Black Mamba was the best coaster I have ever been on. But I did not like it very much at all. I did not find it cleaner than any Disney park and I thought it was far too overbuilt. No space anywhere. And some of it did look very unkept. I know they did invest in quite a lot of new attractions recently, so things might have changed. The Black Mamba area was certainly the prettiest part of the park.

I remember talking about Maus on a discussion board when it opened. And I thought exactly the same as what you say from seeing a video.
 
GiveMeTheMusic

GiveMeTheMusic

Well-Known Member
Bolna said:
And there are all these smallish "themed entertainments" starting to come up in Berlin. It has a Lego Discovery Center, a House of Barbie is about to open there. So I think for these kind of tourist a theme park would be an additional appeal.
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House of Barbie? Is that like the Barbie Museum?

 
NoChesterHester

NoChesterHester

Well-Known Member
Cody5242 said:
Since this is partially a movie thread, here's a great article about how big 2015 will be (Avatar 2 still hasn't been confirmed for 2015 yet, but I think it will come out around Christmas time)
http://www.boxoffice.com/articles/2013-07-2015-looking-to-become-one-for-the-ages
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I hold the belief that they are going to push Star Wars to an early May 2016 release.

I agree with the article that we may have reached saturation on superhero movies. If I were Disney, I'd build up demand by doing a Star Wars blackout on any new media for two years or so before the new movie.
 
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