Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

[coolbeans14]

People who actually pay to visit Central Florida theme parks in the summer are insane or British (is that the same? ;-) )

Pretty much! In all seriousness, the British school holiday was 21st July to 4th September this year, and is similar every year, hence why us Brits are nutters and go to Florida in summer.

The Wii U will be interesting to watch. So far it's doing quite poorly in sales. The complaints being a lacking game library and poor third party support. This is often a problem with game systems, they launch with a poor lineup of games and few people want them at first. We'll see what happens when the holidays arrive though, there's a new Mario game coming out and that always drives sales by a huge amount. It also has a head start against the PS4 and Xbox One. Should be an interesting generation regardless of what happens. Nintendo have at least shown they still know how to make fantastic games.

Speaking of the wii U, there was a story recently about it no longer available in Asda (the UK Walmart: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23506080

FINAL EDIT, I PROMISE:

I think @WDW1974 views as well as a lot of the comments I've read on this board are short sighted, misguided, and emotional responses to a changing landscape. And, I think it really needs to be reflected on more before final judgments are thrown out.

Quite frankly, I've done nothing but disagree with Disney's moves over the past 4-5 years about WDW. Their focus on DLR is nothing more than allowing Lassetter to fund his first love, and ignoring the needs of the "secondary" resort in the US.

However, the idea that, all of a sudden, all the things you loved about the parks are now taken away because of its new "direction" is hard to swallow. The updates have been slow and plodding, but, Disney's plans are fairly clear. They look beyond 3 years from now and consider what 20 years will look like. And, quite frankly, it makes sense. As large as the budget is growing for NextGen, Disney fully expects this system (and it's ability to evolve), to last for decades. They are building, what they think, will replace interactions and will build personalization into attractions. This is now an attention economy. A million things can now hold our attentions at any one time. There is now no limit to how we can be entertained and spend our leisure time. So, along with themed experiences, Disney wants to grab your attention by making things easier for logistical stuff, but, far more personal for their experiential items. And, everything built from this day forward will have that in mind.

They're betting (And I don't disagree), that the next big stage in keeping theme parks relevant is competing with the immense personalization that exists on phones and gaming systems today (and in the future). Whether it's characters that know children's names, or the ability for kiosks to be able to recommend certain new restaurants or tailer another experience.

Frankly, we are in this time right now where we are all frightened over the next stage of technology/personalization. The Xbox One, Next Gen, other political items that I won't mention due to this not being the right forum. But, it's happening and it all starts with our acceptance of it in our smartphones that we carry with us constantly. Companies know this next level stuff is okay because we do it on Facebook, twitter, and with our phones. We share our locations and deepest thoughts without any sense of what we're putting online. And, the bet that people are willing to share a name or preference with the company to make a trip more magical is probably a good one. Allowing rides like It's a small world to take the next level and include you as the star is bold and allows its timelessness to continue.

Suggesting that Universal's bubble makes it a better experience is strange to me. Disney World has always been sprawling, and something that was promised (one of its most exciting possibilities) when it was announced was the idea that it could continue to expand into a city. A place that you could drive through without much worry. No doubt, part of that meant that you couldn't just walk everywhere. Disneyland accomplishes that. No, Disney World has always meant to be an adventure.

In terms of Universal's growth, they are in their booming years. They have a lot of room to grow, and they're embracing it. Disney was once in that place. This will eventually stop (history always suggests this type of growth eventually stops). What do you think will happen when all these projects are completed? You think their growth plan will just continue forever? In 6-8 years, there will be people on Universal boards typing the same things as you guys.

I think Disney is at a different place of development than Universal and we should enjoy Universal during this exciting time. But, it doesn't change the fact that Disney is still lovely and the idea that my trip could include Mickey calling me by name or tailoring a new interactive ride to my preferences is something I would love to see happen.

Speaking of Universal, it reminds me of E.T.s personalization at the end (saying goodbye to you by name). That kind of interaction makes experiences more magical and engrossing. Exactly what this type of entertainment is supposed to do.

Be Our Guest is inspired and New Fantasyland's immersion is a trend that should continue into every land. I'm not sure it was every meant to be a land full of 4-5 attractions. It was meant to be a land that children could look through and get lost in world's they know and love. And, I don't think we can see past the lack of new things to hold our own more mature attention. I can't wait for Avatar, and the eventual DHS makeover and the Imagination replacement. And I'm hoping they come sooner rather than later.

I just am not as positive that Disney World has become a place without magic. For me anyway. And I'm hoping 10 years down the road, I'll be able to look back and say "I told you so."

This and the references to gaming are interesting, and IMO accurate.

I think Disney aren't being as short sighted as we think. Big brother is the future (spend a day in London- here it's the present). Disney collecting this information will provide a more positive experience, just not anytime soon. It's been poorly handled but I do think still has potential for the visitors 20 years from now. Change will always cause issues, there will be bumps in the road, and in this case mountains, but considering how revolutionary this is, it's hardly surprising.

Regarding it being unnecessary, I don't know. It might never work as envisioned, as hoped, but as people become more tech savvy, using a system like this will become natural.

And speaking of tech, I think/hope WDW and Uni are more like Sony and Microsoft, and that we are at the PS3 vs Xbox 360 period. WDW is complacent and very much priced at a premium level, where as Uni is exciting and fresh. The Ps3 struggles, people move over to Xbox. They realise its actually decent, and offers plenty that's new, and exclusive (see: CoD exclusives and HP).

Microsoft are raking in the cash. They've beat the PS3, and continue to. Further more, they're making the Xbox cheap, and with more product available, they decide to try upping the prices. How can they do this? What about adding hardware. How about the kinect?(HP) Let's charge more because we have this unique product.

In the WDW/Uni example, time passes. Prices go up and up at Uni as they value themselves more.

But what happens at e3 2013(for theme parks aka the turning point)?

Sony go back to what they do best, they realise they need to build. They do. They release the PS4.

Microsoft are complacent. They have such a following, they reckon they could do anything. They create the Xbox one.

My point is, Uni is already expensive, particularly for foreign tourists- a major player now. One thing that is concerning is, what happens when things go wrong? What happens if Comcast begin struggling? Will they really not cut budgets? No, they'll do what Disney does now, demanding higher prices for a product not worth the cost. At the same time, Disney will have a chance to pull something incredible, and to prove themselves again.

I honestly see this happening, as well as something else. Several of the new additions at Uni are past their prime. Harry potter is over- how long till that fades from pop culture? Simpsons has only a few years left, and no one will care once that's finished.

Meanwhile, Disney has a catalogue stretching nearly a century, with many characters still popular. There's a reason the mine train is getting built, Snow White still has legs.


Overall, I think what I'm saying is people are jumping to conclusions. I can't see Disney becoming the next Nintendo. They aren't going to lose.

 

[marni1971]

You do know that eventually Uni will adopt the same Next Gen systems WDW is installing

Source?

 

[marni1971]

Whats the deal with Epcot running attractions with all the work lights on?? Have they totally lost it or what of what little they had left.

We had this on Gran Fiesta. I told the CMs at unload and they just starred at me with puzzled looks.

 

[ParentsOf4]

You do know that eventually Uni will adopt the same Next Gen systems WDW is installing.

No, Uni won't adopt the same technology. Nor will DLR.

Indications are FP+ is crashing and burning during testing. @t3techcom18 reports "of those who are active in the test, 30% thus far have opted to do anything with FP+ prior to arrival." That's a devastatingly bad number. If anything close to that number holds up, then MyMagic+ will have failed at one of its main objectives, which is to get guests to preplan their vacations so they don't drive up I-4 and visit a theme park that's building new, exciting attractions. If that participation rate continues, MyMagic+ will become the biggest boondoggle in the history of WDW.

FP+ requires a lot of preplanning. Many really enjoy that preplanning but, based on FP+ results so far, most don't. It's common sense. Most don't want to treat their vacations like homework assignments.

@t3techcom18 is writing some absolutely fascinating posts on the current round of testing. I strongly suggest you read his latest posts.

 

[GLaDOS]

Forgot to add one more thing: On the subject of Universal's latest attractions, I'm surprised no one has noticed a disturbing trend in storytelling.

Essentially, every story is the same. Spiderman, Simpsons, Harry Potter, Transformers (pretty sure there are others). "Hey guys, whatsup?! Oh no, somethings wrong! hold on guys! Follow me, I'll help you! Alright cool, it's fixed. Thanks for the help!" All the characters say this to the audience, the narrative system is the exact same. I'm hoping the formula will start to change. Immersive rides can be told from different perspectives. And, I wish Universal would spend as much time on their scenery as on their attraction script writers. Disney started to figure this out after a while, and most of their e-ticket attractions have very unique systems of delivering stories to their guests.

So, while I'm very (very) pleased with Universal's expansions and the immense quality behind it, I'm still not as sold on their ability to diversify their experiences and expand how themed attractions can interact with their guests.

Funny, people don't seem to mind. Everyone's always clapping at the end of those rides.

Face it, 99.9% of gusts don't care about story. They're there to have a good time on a ride. Give them that and you've won over the vast majority of your audience.

 

[PeterAlt]

Speaking of preventative maintainence, like when I was like six, on one of our trips to WDW in 1976, they were painting the fascades of the buildings on Main Street, USA. They were always painting those buildings. In fact, every time we were there on every trip when I was that age, regardless of what month or season, crews were always kept out - decked in turn-of-the-century costumes - painting Main Street, USA facades - even if the same building had a fresh coat of paint on it from just a few months back! They said (and I remember this clearly) that they do this so that everything will always like "new".

Talk about preventative maintainence! Imagine if they did this today!

 

[Goofyernmost]

PeterAlt said: ↑
You do know that eventually Uni will adopt the same Next Gen systems WDW is installing

Source?

It wouldn't surprise me, but only if they can get it to work properly. I have always had my doubts that it would ever be possible to nickel and dime current guests anywhere near enough to recoup even the original budget. I said at the beginning that they intended to copy-write (or whatever it is you do to show ownership of an electronic creation. I'm old...cant' remember) and then sell the system to other parks. Not the information that Disney has accumulated but just the system. If you buy Quicken, for example, you don't get the information that other people have on it. You just get the program or system, if you like.

That would be the reason why they are so desperate to release it all at one time and not piecemeal. This, of course is my opinion and it might be wrong, but to me it's the only thing that makes even spending 1 billion on it have any degree of sense attached to it. Hey, what the heck lets get really speculative here and say that even the start-up problems might be intentional to insure that others do not make an attempt to create their own system. Could happen!

 

[aladdin2007]

We had this on Gran Fiesta. I told the CMs at unload and they just starred at me with puzzled looks.

I think they ruined the lighting in there anyway, there are now these bright spotlights in the float through by San Angel, all the time, they took away the darkness and what made it really nice. Word is they have done the same to Maelstrom and took away the night atmosphere, not sure if its been toned down or not. Its like they dont want any darkness anymore or are afraid to because of security or something?

 

[Goofyernmost]

I saw Peoplemover cars hitting multiple times during the last week of June. I never really saw that before and couldn't get an answer from any of the CM's as to why it was happening. Sorry to hear you were almost injured. I wonder what's going on...

I also noticed the lack of LE pins in June. I usually try to bring a couple back for my old man but only saw a 4th of July LE pin. Any idea what's going on?

Isn't being almost injured about the same as being almost pregnant? You either are injured or your not. There is no middle because one doesn't know what the worst case scenario might be until it actually happens. If they bump and no one is being injured, why is that a problem? Could I say that the bumper cars at the carnival left me almost injured at least 100 times?

 

[PeterAlt]

It wouldn't surprise me, but only if they can get it to work properly. I have always had my doubts that it would ever be possible to nickel and dime current guests anywhere near enough to recoup even the original budget. I said at the beginning that they intended to copy-write (or whatever it is you do to show ownership of an electronic creation. I'm old...cant' remember) and then sell the system to other parks. Not the information that Disney has accumulated but just the system. If you buy Quicken, for example, you don't get the information that other people have on it. You just get the program or system, if you like.

That would be the reason why they are so desperate to release it all at one time and not piecemeal. This, of course is my opinion and it might be wrong, but to me it's the only thing that makes even spending 1 billion on it have any degree of sense attached to it. Hey, what the heck lets get really speculative here and say that even the start-up problems might be intentional to insure that others do not make an attempt to create their own system. Could happen!

Reminds me of WDI Community Transportation Systems. As you know, after developing the WEDway PeopleMover and the monorail system and then deploying the prototypes at WDW, they organized the patents into a subdivision of the company with the intent to sell licensed systems outside the company. This move set the stage to outright sell the division and recoup their loses on the R&D for those systems.

Once they all the bugs and kinks out of NextGen, after building the prototype at WDW, they pretty much could do the same thing here. They could wrap it into a subsidiary to sell licenses. They could also sell off that subsidiary and recoup the R&D loss.

 

[marni1971]

but to me it's the only thing that makes even spending 1 billion on it have any degree of sense attached to it.

2.8 billion. And the realisation of those involved that it may never deliver what was promised 6 years ago.

 

[PeterAlt]

Funny, people don't seem to mind. Everyone's always clapping at the end of those rides.

Face it, 99.9% of gusts don't care about story. They're there to have a good time on a ride. Give them that and you've won over the vast majority of your audience.

Eisner believed story was the quintessential element.

 

[thehowiet]

Isn't being almost injured about the same as being almost pregnant? You either are injured or your not. There is no middle because one doesn't know what the worst case scenario might be until it actually happens. If they bump and no one is being injured, why is that a problem? Could I say that the bumper cars at the carnival left me almost injured at least 100 times?

I'm still trying to figure out why you're asking me and not 74 since he posted the original story...

 

[GLaDOS]

Eisner believed story was the quintessential element.

Good for him. Theme parks existed for 30 years before him pretty well without that notion.

 

[wdwmagic]

No, Uni won't adopt the same technology. Nor will DLR.

Indications are FP+ is crashing and burning during testing. @t3techcom18 reports "of those who are active in the test, 30% thus far have opted to do anything with FP+ prior to arrival." That's a devastatingly bad number. If anything close to that number holds up, then MyMagic+ will have failed at one of its main objectives, which is to get guests to preplan their vacations so they don't drive up I-4 and visit a theme park that's building new, exciting attractions. If that participation rate continues, MyMagic+ will become the biggest boondoggle in the history of WDW.

FP+ requires a lot of preplanning. Many really enjoy that preplanning but, based on FP+ results so far, most don't. It's common sense. Most don't want to treat their vacations like homework assignments.

@t3techcom18 is writing some absolutely fascinating posts on the current round of testing. I strongly suggest you read his latest posts.

If there are low numbers now it is because people don't yet get it. The adoption of regular FP was slow. Overtime people will get it, and it will be just as popular as FP is now.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I'm still trying to figure out why you're asking me and not 74 since he posted the original story...

I was only commenting on the statement not the person that said it. No intention on my part to even imply that it was you that originated the phrase. Sorry, it wasn't intended as a reflection on you. I should have been clearer. Also even though it my comment was phrased like a question it was just a sarcastic statement on my part.

 

[PeterAlt]

Good for him. Theme parks existed for 30 years before him pretty well without that notion.

So did Walt Disney and amusement parks existed way before as well.

EDIT - I intentially used the word "amusement" instead of "theme" since Walt Disney invented the concept. What makes theme parks different than amusement parks is the principle of story. Walt Disney created this concept and Eisner (coming from the film and television industries) quickly caught on to this concept almost immediately after starting his administration at Disney.

 

[WDWFigment]

And I think that preventive maintenance is being done well. If it wasn't nothing would be operating. Let's not forget how old a lot of that stuff is. As it gets older it is only logical that things will tend to break down more often. The solution is to rip down the parks and rebuild them completely with all new stuff. There are some mechanical, physical problems that cannot be fixed before they happen. They don't exist in an obvious way until they fail. Imagine, for example, how many miles are on any given part of the omnimover in SSE. It has been making that continuous circle with very few stops during operating hours for 30 years. You can do preventive maintenance daily, as I'd be willing to bet they do, and something that was fine in the morning breaks in the afternoon. If anyone thinks that Prev. Maint. means that they just replace all parts before they break...they would be mistaken. It not only would be physically impossible, it would also be fiscal folly. IMHO!

Again, I'll direct your attention to Tokyo Disneyland, a park that is also 30 years old. I don't recall any instances of broken effects or poor maintenance during our visit there. That 30 year old park is pristine.

There is a clear example of how preventative maintenance can keep theme parks in significantly better condition than the ones at Walt Disney World are in, and that example is not one of "fiscal folly." I'd say this isn't really a matter of opinion any more than gravity is a matter of opinion. You can deny it and append "IMHO" to it, but that doesn't make it so.

 

[GLaDOS]

So did Walt Disney and amusement parks existed way before as well.

Not exactly sure what you're trying to say here.

Are you saying Walt's attractions were dependent on story? Because the evidence points to the contrary.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Again, I'll direct your attention to Tokyo Disneyland, a park that is also 30 years old. I don't recall any instances of broken effects or poor maintenance during our visit there. That 30 year old park is pristine.

There is a clear example of how preventative maintenance can keep theme parks in significantly better condition than the ones at Walt Disney World are in, and that example is not one of "fiscal folly." I'd say this isn't really a matter of opinion any more than gravity is a matter of opinion. You can deny it and append "IMHO" to it, but that doesn't make it so.

Nor does your stating your opinion make it so. This is a two way banter and there is no way to prove one way or the other. I'm telling you how I feel about it, you are telling yours. That will be the extent of it, at least on my part. I have never been to TDL so I will take your word for it.