Spirited News & Observations II -- NGE/Baxter

[the.dreamfinder]

Not crazy, really.
Just as smart to open a Marvel attraction(s) near the release date of Avengers 2.

Also, I'd love to see Disney build a clone as fast as UNI did with Transformers.

Speaking of HKDL TL, I wonder if Tim Deleaney would ever go back to work for WDI.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Speaking of HKDL TL, I wonder if Tim Deleaney would ever go back to work for WDI.

I thought Delaney was tapped to work on Shanghai Disneyland as part of Weis' Creative experiment.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

I thought Delaney was tapped to work on Shanghai Disneyland as part of Weis' Creative experiment.

I didn't know that. I'll put out the @Lee signal for more information.

@Lee

 

[luv]

I really didn't mean for you to take offense. By "afford it" I mean Grand Floridan guests don't use words like "splitting the cost four ways," "insane," " not worth the way extra $$," "fraction of the price," or "not worth it."

Edit: They don't look at the price, period. They pick the one they like best, regardless of price, and pay whatever they're told by the booking agent.

Okay, I've stayed at GF as well as other WDW hotels/motels a number of times.

And I knew GF would be expensive. And I knew whatever number got tossed out, I was going to pay it. $3000, $7000, whatever. I decided what I wanted and paid what I was told. True dat.

But it isn't like I never noticed what I was paying. In fact, the entire reason I stopped staying in WDW hotels (generally) was that I was extremely disappointed in what they gave me. The charge a higher price than true luxury hotels and don't even come close to offering the same amenities and service.

So I stopped paying those prices.

If Disney is working on the assumption that all their fans are suckers who will continue to shell out nice chunks of change for less than standard service, they have another think coming.

"Not worth the money" IS a phrase used by GF guests. If Disney has told you otherwise, they're wrong.

After a while you just say, "Duh. I'm done with Disney."

 

[JenniferS]

I think even crummy transportation adds significant value to the Value resorts. It might be $50 to $100 more a night than a comparable off property hotel but you'd spend that on a rental car anyways.

I paid less than $200 for a 10 day rental last November.
We dined at resort locations 5 evenings, park-hopped almost every day, and went to Publix once, Walgreens twice and a quickie trip to Old Town for a specific purchase. Disney buses are not my thing. At the end of the day (hate that saying, but it actually applies here) too many folks are over-tired, under-deodorized, and downright pushy. A rental car is a necessity for us.

 

[marni1971]

IMO the FLE is just a starting point in addressing the issue. Interactive queues, RFID, interactive challenges are all part of long range plans to address capacity.

But they don't address capacity. They just accommodate those already in the park.

At best NextGen will keep off the streets because they're stuck in lines. The opposite of what Fastpass was designed for.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Interesting. The available room nights works out to about 27,000 rooms. The room nights booked is about 22,000. DLR has a little over 2,000 rooms. Lets assume they were all available all year and at 100% occupancy. In that scenario WDW had 25,000 rooms available and 20,000 rooms booked or an occupancy rate of 80%. I guess that's still a big tick down from peak levels, but still a pretty solid number for WDW.

The occupancy rate also includes DVC units, which runs much higher, above 90%. There are the equivalent of 4158 rooms in DVC. (The number depends on whether you count lock-offs as one or two rooms.) Take these out of the equation and the "real" occupancy rate of WDW rooms that Disney is actively trying to rent out drops further.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Attendance is only ever reported on a "Domestic Parks" level, if at all. I doubt you hear a growth percentage for WDW unless it's VERY good.

During the FY2013 Q1 conference call covering the Thanksgiving and Christmas 2012 period, Jay Rasulo said:

Attendance at Disney World was down at hair, I would say, and that -- oh, I'm sorry -- it was up a hair, but it wasn't the driver for the quarter. As Bob just said, everything that's going on at the Disneyland Resort is really what's driving the attendance trends for domestic parks.

Folks are reporting the parks to be more crowded than ever but it's difficult to reconcile this with "up a hair", especially since WDW attendance declined in 2 of the last 3 years.

Possibilities:

• There has been a recent surge in attendance and Q2 numbers will be much better.
• People are staying in the parks for more hours, making them feel more crowded at any one time. IMHO, this is something to consider. As WDW continues to raise ticket prices, perhaps guests feel more of a need to stay in the parks for as long as possible to maximize what they get for their money.
• Perception is being influenced by Standby queue length. Perhaps WDW has allocated a larger percentage of ride capacity to FP, causing longer Standby lines.
• More rambunctious than normal guests make the parks feel more crowded. If I'm standing in a line, then it feels crowded. But if I'm standing in a line and someone nearby is making a raucous, the line feels more crowded because they are interfering with my personal space.
• Something else?

 

[asianway]

The occupancy rate also includes DVC units, which runs much higher, above 90%. There are the equivalent of 4158 rooms in DVC. (The number depends on whether you count lock-offs as one or two rooms.) Take these out of the equation and the "real" occupancy rate of WDW rooms that Disney is actively trying to rent out drops further.

That really would drag the true number down but I'm pretty sure they don't include owner occupied rooms in the numerator or denominator(only the rooms available for rent from DVD or from BVTC exchanges).
Since there's no revenue associated with these rooms, including them wouldn't paint a true ADR.
I'm sure they track both. But this would explain why the available rooms fluctuates.

 

[Darth Sidious]

During the FY2013 Q1 conference call, covering the Christmas 2012 period, Jay Rasulo said:

Folks are reporting the parks to be more crowded than ever but it's difficult to reconcile this with "up a hair", especially since WDW attendance has declined in 2 of the last 3 years.

Possibilities:

• There has been a recent surge in attendance and the Q2 numbers will be much better.
• People are staying in the parks for more hours, making them feel more crowded at any one time. IMHO, this is something to consider. As WDW continues to raise ticket prices, perhaps guests feel more of a need to stay in the parks for as long as possible to maximize what they get for their money.
• Perception is being influenced by Standby queue length. Perhaps WDW has allocated a larger percentage of ride capacity to FP, causing longer Standby lines.
• More rambunctious than normal guests make the parks feel more crowded. If I'm standing in a line, then it feels crowded. But if I'm standing in a line and someone nearby is making a raucous, the line feels more crowded because they are interfering with my personal space.
• Something else?

Tour groups do a nice job of making a slow park day seem crowded by clogging lines. Ever had the misfortune of getting stuck behind one? I have and it really stinks... It was like the group was purposely going where we wanted to go. Our solution was to literally sprint to ToT first get on, ride then go to another section of the park.

 

[jt04]

But they don't address capacity. They just accommodate those already in the park.

At best NextGen will keep off the streets because they're stuck in lines. The opposite of what Fastpass was designed for.

We will have to agree to disagree. It is clear to me that these are strategies for when they do add more attractions which will bring in more guests they currently have trouble handling. The former 20K space was off limits to guests, now it isn't. People are still in queues, as before, but now they have something to do making for a better experience. Many more m&g's absorb crowds. The new parade will do the same. Interactive games also absorb guests. All these strategies are being utilized as a foundation necessary before any major new attractions are added IMO.

Of course, another strategy is to add content to the other 3 parks to draw guests away from the MK and better balance the crowds. We will be able to have a much more informed conversation after D23.

 

[stlphil]

During the FY2013 Q1 conference call covering the Thanksgiving and Christmas 2012 period, Jay Rasulo said:

Folks are reporting the parks to be more crowded than ever but it's difficult to reconcile this with "up a hair", especially since WDW attendance has declined in 2 of the last 3 years.

Possibilities:

• There has been a recent surge in attendance and the Q2 numbers will be much better.
• People are staying in the parks for more hours, making them feel more crowded at any one time. IMHO, this is something to consider. As WDW continues to raise ticket prices, perhaps guests feel more of a need to stay in the parks for as long as possible to maximize what they get for their money.
• Perception is being influenced by Standby queue length. Perhaps WDW has allocated a larger percentage of ride capacity to FP, causing longer Standby lines.
• More rambunctious than normal guests make the parks feel more crowded. If I'm standing in a line, then it feels crowded. But if I'm standing in a line and someone nearby is making a raucous, the line feels more crowded because they are interfering with my personal space.
• Something else?

Another possibility is that they are saving on operational costs by decreasing ride capacity. Given their laser focus on cutting costs, it wouldn't surprise me if this was the case.

 

[michmousefan]

I paid less than $200 for a 10 day rental last November.
We dined at resort locations 5 evenings, park-hopped almost every day, and went to Publix once, Walgreens twice and a quickie trip to Old Town for a specific purchase. Disney buses are not my thing. At the end of the day (hate that saying, but it actually applies here) too many folks are over-tired, under-deodorized, and downright pushy. A rental car is a necessity for us.

Agree. If you know how to monitor the Orlando rental car market, significant deals can be found. We'll be staying on property (SSR) in October but the inefficiency of the bus system makes a rental car a nice (and affordable) extra luxury.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Really? You have proof of this? Or is this just what you think about wealthy people? Usually wealthy people are the cheapest and the most concerned about $$.

It has to be broken down into category's. I will do my own, if you are middle to lower economically...you cannot afford GF without getting into debt. If you are wealthy to stinking rich you don't care what it cost as long as it supports your lifestyle and image. If you are well off, (upper middle to lower upper) you do look at the cost as well as the location because you are still working toward the wealthy and stinking rich. Then, of course there is that more illusive category that WDW74 falls into and that would be Faux 1%. No one knows what they will do or why, not even themselves.

 

[Lee]

I thought Delaney was tapped to work on Shanghai Disneyland as part of Weis' Creative experiment.

I didn't know that. I'll put out the @Lee signal for more information.

@Lee

I'm not aware of Delaney working on Shangai, but I'm also not that well-informed about that whole project. (Is anyone?)
Tim has his own design firm now, so it's not out of the question for him to have been brought in for some work as an outside contractor. Lots of outside work being done on that park.

 

[asianway]

Thanks for correcting me, I think I'm wrong. The following is from the annual report:

So they include only "rentals of Disney Vacation Club units". A DVC memeber staying on points is not renting. But that makes me wonder: do they include all DVC rooms available for rental or only rooms actually rented?

They should include anything they are trying to monetize, which I believe would also include "breakage"-expiring inventory not booked by owners by x number of days prior. These proceed would actually be a share with DVRMC & the condo.

 

[Lee]

Right at the top of each article, they're both sourced to TheDailyMeal.com. And the same article is on their main page as well.
http://www.thedailymeal.com/best-disney-restaurants-every-occasion

I'm gonna stand up for my friend AJ here. AJ runs DisneyFoodBlog.com and rather sucessfully. AJ is very fair and plays it down the middle here. Disney dining is their fortè. AJ is not a "plant."

EDIT: Actually... AJ wrote it for someone else (TheDailyMeal) and both USAT & Fox picked it up. Its a fluff piece and props for The Daily Meal for selling their content twice!

If anything, its a larger look at how consolidated reporting and writing is becoming, with more and more outlets relying on a very select set of people to fill their content. If USAT or Fox wanted something original rather than a wire piece, they'd have sent someone to cover it.

Either way, its like a wire service story running in both NYT & WaPo. No big deal.

They have huge websites and they have to fill content somehow. God forbid they do anything on their own....

In my opinion, all it does is show how little those two news outlets actually care about their travel and tourism sections.

Going back to this, because its the sort of thing '74 would want being discussed here in his absence, and its more interesting than an accounting argument....

It's not as simple as all that. This isn't a wire story, it's a blog post. Posting stories from blogs is not how USAToday does business.
A source as been in touch with me today about this, and the fact that the nation's largest (by circulation) paper has run a fluff blog piece that reads like Disney PR is not sitting too well with some of the executive staff over there.

I'm not trying to bash AJ Wolfe, she's made quite a place for herself with her very extensive Disney work.
But, when a piece like this lands on two major news sites, when its not exactly in accordance with their editorial policy....

There is more afoot.

 

[marni1971]

We will have to agree to disagree. It is clear to me that these are strategies for when they do add more attractions which will bring in more guests they currently have trouble handling..

Bizarre.... I always assumed more physical space and more rides holding people was an increase in capacity. If a park can't cope due to overcrowding, give it more space to hold people. Not have them crowd areas that are already crowded.

The MK is reaching a finite point in capacity, and exceeds it quite often. It's getting to the point when its physically too small. All the walkways and queues in the world can't help a park that has not enough to see or do.

Epcot on the other hand...

 

[jt04]

Going back to this, because its the sort of thing '74 would want being discussed here in his absence, and its more interesting than an accounting argument....

It's not as simple as all that. This isn't a wire story, it's a blog post. Posting stories from blogs is not how USAToday does business.
A source as been in touch with me today about this, and the fact that the nation's largest (by circulation) paper has run a fluff blog piece that reads like Disney PR is not sitting too well with some of the executive staff over there.

I'm not trying to bash AJ Wolfe, she's made quite a place for herself with her very extensive Disney work.
But, when a piece like this lands on two major news sites, when its not exactly in accordance with their editorial policy....

There is more afoot.

Some call it the 'future'.

Let the consumer of information be discerning and educated because there is no going back except by way of censorship. I would rather take my chances with a free internet than censorship.

~Freedom~

 

[jt04]

Bizarre.... I always assumed more physical space and more rides holding people was an increase in capacity. If a park can't cope due to overcrowding, give it more space to hold people. Not have them crowd areas that are already crowded.

The MK is reaching a finite point in capacity, and exceeds it quite often. It's getting to the point when its physically too small. All the walkways and queues in the world can't help a park that has not enough to see or do.

Epcot on the other hand...

On this we agree.

This is why I advocate for slightly skewing the parks to different age demographics. Some parks geared to be more family friendly, some with more thrills, some with more edutainment, some more interactive. This would do a lot to level out the crowds. Epcot has so much untapped potential it is mind-boggling.