Spirited News and Observations and Opinions ...

[ParentsOf4]

Unless they find the political will not to. If they restrict the supply of FP+ even for the hotel visitors, that makes the hotel room all the MORE valuable.

I understand what you are suggesting but it does not make the rooms more valuable if onsite guests cannot get the "good" (as I like to call them) FP+.

People booking $400+/night rooms are going to want FP+ for Peter Pan. If Disney does not increase the supply of FP+ for onsite guests, they are going to have a lot of upset onsite guests who will decide that the price is not worth it. 10,000 Deluxe Resort onsite rooms means potentially 30,000 to 40,000 Deluxe Resort guests per day. Even if only one-in-four go to the MK, Deluxe Resort guests alone have the potential to use up the lion's share of Peter Pan's capacity.

Now add the 20,000 Moderate and Value resort rooms. Potential demand from onsite guests alone is tremendous.

P.S. The numbers are worse at the other three theme parks, where there are significantly fewer E ticket attractions.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

4 FP+ per day, plus Lunch and Dinner ADRs sounds like a pretty regimented day to me. Particularly if you did something stupid like weren't referancing a map when doing your planing.

How does this sound to you guys:

9AM Space Mtn
11AM Haunted Mansion
noon Lunch Tony's
3PM Pirates
5PM Dumbo
6PM Liberty Tree
8:30PM Castle Projection Show
10PM Wishes!

 

[Lee]

The one and only way I could get behind FP+ is if it leads to SHORTER standby lines in 2014 than we had in 2012. I also have not seen Disney say out loud that lines will get longer. But if they do, what little "wait and see" attitude I had will evaporate.

True, they haven't come out and said it.
It requires a little reading between the lines.

It adds up. Why would they drop millions of dollars on interactive queues if they don't expect people to be spending a considerable amount of time standing there?
FP+ folks will not be in the queue long enough to play with the new features, and if the Standby lines were getting shorter...wouldn't need games to play.

It makes sense...and I don't really like it.

 

[WDW1974]

Ten million extra 'clicks' in Disney lingo doesn't mean 10 million more people on property.

Yes, and also the fact is if someone is spending the day at DAK that doesn't affect MK or EPCOT or dining anywhere else. All of those people aren't trying to eat at Le Cellier at 6:45 p.m.

And the fact there may be more people around.. doesn't magically increase the amount of money people have to spend on meals. Increased crowds doesn't suddenly make people flock to $30/plate meals. Or suddenly cause them to desire table service vs counter service as their preference. Your pretense is basically these places are crowded because there is no where else to go.

That may work for the B/C dining locations... but not for the top dollar ones. And for the B/C locations.. it's another example of how DDP serves Disney - it encourages people to goto restaurants even if they didn't want to... and try more locations. In effect.. it lets restaurants be subpar and still attract people because their choices are finite. A percentage of people will end up there because 'there was no where else..' or 'why not..'

Exactly. This is why the higher end places now deal with lower end clientele that wants to dumb down the menus into things they're comfortable eating at at say The Golden Coral or maybe Perkins. They are also pushing the menu prices up. A filet that used to be $25 at the California Grill may now cost $44, not because of any increase in costs (although certainly everything costs more since the 2007-08 economic collapse ... btw, did we go off the cliff, I was sorta hoping for it!), but because the DDP has to appear to be a value. If food was priced about 30% lower (as it should be), I doubt so many people would fall for the DDP mirage.

 

[WDW1974]

Starting next year, they'll be pushing the deluxe DDP on everyone who books a reservation. "Staying at an All-Star? Great, did you hear about our Deluxe Disney Dining Plan?"

Btw, this isn't sarcasm. That really is the plan.

Btw, this isn't sarcasm. But I hate the plan ... oh, and this isn't sarcasm either, but nice to see the mysterious @tirian dropping in for a visit.

Hope your holidays were MAGICal!

 

[WDW1974]

I'll say it forever, DDP had nothing to do with the food quality going down and food prices going up. That was happening anyway. And yeah, crowds were getting heavy even before DDP, especially in MK. That ship had already left the port.

It did have a lot to do with homogenizing most of the menus.

Yes, it did.

The dumbing down of food and beverage began at EPCOT in the 1990s when Georgie K was VP. It wasn't to dumb things down so much as streamline purchasing and save by not having waste (all noble goals) ... but the DDP (also on Georgie's watch when he was VP of the WDTC) absolutely was the death knell for fine dining.

Homogenization (locales having 6-8 entrees), prices going up, portions going down, quality going down, all of that came with the DDP. And it's here to stay.

I actually remember when Disney restaurants had real menus like in the real world, not paper or cardboard ones.

 

[WDW1974]

Here's the interesting part: sit-down dining has become more homogenized and quick service has improved considerably.

Um ... you obviously haven't had a burger at the Electric Umbrella or a turkey sandwich as Cosmic Ray's of late.

 

[WDW1974]

Take Everest down and fix it. Also, as much as Disney charges for tickets, they should provide as much time in the parks as possible. As mentioned earlier, park hours had nothing to do with lack of maintenance. Lack of spending and caring about show quality seems to have caused the most impact.

You obviously hate Disney ... so you should just go to UNI and then the lines for Everest Extreme Crappy Edition will be shorter for the rest of us.

 

[WDW1974]

What kind of comment is that? I never said I couldn't read a EMH weekly schedule and figure out the hours, It's just cumbersome for me personally to plan around, and I have a right to that opinion, I'm not looking to blame. Nice to feel a warm welcome for a newbie on the boards.

Would you like a hug for a welcome? Women and fanbois (and some men too) love to be hugged by me.

You complained about an issue that I feel is quite minor. Looking at a schedule and figuring out park hours is pretty basic. Like me looking at the hours of a restaurant last night because it was NYE and realizing many places were closing early.

Sorry if I hurt your feelings (I like to save the nasty for those who have it coming), but it seemed like you had a big problem with something very miniscule. But welcome to MAGIC and hope you stay a spell.

 

[WDW1974]

A foundation in Florida is very deep. If the foundation is the issue don't expect it to ever move again. These were poured in the open. There is now a large mountain with a roller coaster inside of it.

The foundation isn't the issue at all. The cost is ... plus the downtime ... plus the fact that Legal is literally afraid to put anything over guests out of fear it will fall on them ... you know what that means? All of those 'dark rides' are going to come out in the light as every roof will be disappearing. Just think of shopping a roofless Emporium in August!

 

[WDW1974]

As you hang around longer you will discover that 74 doesn't spend a lot of time filtering his thoughts. An ego, that boy has!

An ego??! Moi?!?!? ... My ego is considerably smaller than my (expletive deleted).

However, he is an equal opportunity offender. If he isn't being offensive at some point in any post it is time to check for an imposter or a pulse. I kinda like his straight forward approach based on the absolute fact that he IS the most intelligent man on the planet. It makes me giggle a little. I can only hope for his sake that Karma is just a fictional thing, cause, otherwise, at some point in time he is going to get some big time problems.

That is so funny. I can only say I'm not even the most intelligent man in my house, but thanks for thinking so highly of me. I am pretty damn smart. ... Oh and karma exists ... just like Santa Claus and the tooth fairy and ...

In the meantime, he has some pretty informative information and can create some of the most interesting and, sometimes aggravating, posts and or threads you will find anywhere. Relax and enjoy!

 

[beachlover4444]

... from a quickee holiday visit to WDW and UNI this week.

Let's start with the stuff you likely don't know.

EMH. You like it? You don't? You are ambivalent? Well, doesn't matter because plans are to eliminate it. First step was cutting night hours down from three to two. Look for that to drop more and nights to slowly get eliminated. They'll cut back mornings lastly as they are more popular, but look for DAK to lose a morning soon as well.

The reason? Resort guests will be getting a perq (using Queen's English here) in the form of extra FP+ so that will allow them to ride as much as the extra time allegedly does. It's all about eliminating labor hours for ops, while telling guests it's the amount of rides they get, not when they get them that matters.

Upset that Fantasmic looks like a disaster? Well, it seems that maintenance has basically been told not to fix anything that breaks or doesn't work because the show isn't long for the park. Let the WoC rumours commence.

EPCOT truly looks sad at the holidays with such little decoration. And c'mon guys, can't you at least keep all the lights on the tree working? Or maybe add some more pyro back to RoE (tag nonwithstanding)?

New Fantasyland? ... Where do I even start. Maybe tomorrow or Monday. ... But while what's there looks detailed and nice (and it does), can I also state that The Port of Entry at IOA is just as detailed or more and that ET is a better ride in 2012 than Little Mermaid is? Oh, I just did.

Gotta remember to also plug the best new thing at the MK that no one seems to want to talk about (no, it isn't pork shanks at Gaston's ... or the new interactive game Help Gary Buchanan Find His Missing Dragon!)

More to come you can be sure ...

you know they could have done even more to belle's village. how about a book store (Disney has thousands of books to sell done they?) and a bakery (marie, the baguettes, hurry up) especially since their quick service in the castle is not quick, 2 hour wait to order a fast meal??? it just could have gone hog wild like hogsmeade over at Universal. and little mermaid, for a new ride has very little new technology. come on I expect more from the imagineers than they are putting out. i'm from oh and I want to go to Disneyland to see the new cars land which BETTER come to FLA.

 

[WDW1974]

@GoofGoof, why else would Disney expand the queue for The Haunted Mansion and make it more distracting if its relatively short, and quick moving lines were going to remain? No need for that unless you expect a change.

There are TWO reasons and only two as to why ineractive queues are going in:
1.) Disney feels its guests are stupid rubes who need to be constantly stimulated and just being in the parks isn't enough; and
2.) Disney knows lines will increase dramatically across the board with FP+ ... this has happend with FP in the past when added to attractions that never needed it (like Mansion here or PoC in Anaheim).

 

[WDW1974]

I somehow get the impression that many people only view the possible changes FP+ will bring from their own touring perspective without realising what the bigger picture is and what consequences this will bring.

Yes, I think it would be wonderful if I could ensure to have a Soarin FP for the afternoon when I want to be at Epcot. That would be great for me personally. But the reality is that not every single visitor to Epcot on that day will be able to get their preferred time for Soarin, how can I be sure to get one? I also never really took part in EMHs, so theoretically I wouldn't mind if they disappear. But then, people who previously used them will most likely now spend less time outside of the parks during the normal hours, so in the end this will lead to more crowded parks during the normal hours.

FP+ is not about guest satisfaction, it is about treating guests as inventory that ought to be distributed as evenly as possible to the available resources. It is all about streamlining the operation.

So true, especially the last paragraph.

The biggest problem with WDW fans is they largely only care about themselves and don't think about the big picture. If they don't like CoP, then let Disney close it and replace it with another exec parking lot. If they don't like EPCOT, then let it stagnate. If they don't like the Studios, who cares what shape Fantasmic is in? They never look at the big picture, and they just and moan and argue with those of us who do.

I wouldn't set foot in Chef Mickey's if you paid me, but I still want it to be as good as it possibly can.

Most guests don't view thing like that.

Of course, I wonder how many notice how filthy the film in Soarin always looks.

 

[ScoutN]

I wouldn't set foot in Chef Mickey's if you paid me, but I still want it to be as good as it possibly can.

Most guests don't view thing like that.

Of course, I wonder how many notice how filthy the film in Soarin always looks.

I will disagree with that the CM deal. Chef Mickey is a place I was hesitant to visit last month. When I did I was actually glad that I did. TiWL making me feel glad I did to an extent. The food was MUCH MUCH better than the last time I went there.

I do not like princess meet, greets, and what was that last thing.... (although that would be a good one!). i am not taking up twits... tweets.. or w/e they call those things stating that they should be closed.

Um it is not filthy! It is simulated bug splats and bird dung on the hang glider's goggles. Ultimate realism! Good job to Disney. Now let's replicate the dung smell!

 

[WDW1974]

I totally get that. I am really trying to understand why standby lines will be longer now under FP+. That seems to be the general consensus.

Why? Because you're going to have more attractions with the service and more FP's being given out per day.
There are days at DLR where they shut FP off of 3-4 attractions because there is no need for it, but to create artificially long lines.

That is what will happen here. Let's say GMR or PoC are pretty much 10-minutes to walk-ons on a weekday in two weeks. One year from now, those attractions will likely have 20-40 minute waits because FP+ has been added.

It is not all that complicated. Get used to planning for everything months in advance or standing in ridiculous lines ... like the 30 minutes I waited recently for Mermaid at MK.

 

[M.rudolf]

So true, especially the last paragraph.

The biggest problem with WDW fans is they largely only care about themselves and don't think about the big picture. If they don't like CoP, then let Disney close it and replace it with another exec parking lot. If they don't like EPCOT, then let it stagnate. If they don't like the Studios, who cares what shape Fantasmic is in? They never look at the big picture, and they just and moan and argue with those of us who do.

I wouldn't set foot in Chef Mickey's if you paid me, but I still want it to be as good as it possibly can.

Most guests don't view thing like that.

Of course, I wonder how many notice how filthy the film in Soarin always looks.

I agree Disney needs to focus on all the parks and resorts as a whole. They need to forecast the cause and effect of all their plans, they also need to undue the alienation that a lot of guests feel in the parks. Look at attractions,queues and all areas of the park to be engaging for children and adults, whether they be male or female

 

[WDW1974]

I know. It's like they don't even pretend to care about the guest experience anymore. What's worse is that they are trying to put it in a pretty package and sell it like a perk. To quote Judge Judy, "Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining."

Do you know that woman gets paid $45 million a year in base salary? Really?!?

As someone who has visited WDW often, I can choose to navigate through this if I want to and still have a nice vacation. I can't imagine how frustrating this will be to first-time visitors who don't understand the need to book dining reservations and experiences 6 months out. It seems like they would want to make the guest experience as easy and "magical" as possible because they want repeat customers.

I think this will turn off both the first timers and the long-timers like myself. The only ones who will enjoy it are the OCD/TouringPlans/Never visited WDW before Y2K/have spread sheets to plan a trip group. ... And those people are not as plentiful as Disney believes.

 

[WDW1974]

This is just my opinion, but I think the "tourist" crowd will eat this up. They are going on a once in a lifetime or once in a while trip to WDW and are less worried about being spontaneous and more concerned with making sure they see everything. Those types of guests usually have no issues with booking ADRs and planning their trip 6 months or more in advance. To the more regular visitors who have been there a bunch and want to be more flexible the system will be a hassle.

No, they won't. They don't understand FP as it is now and it has been a regular feature at WDW since 1999.

And many of them won't be staying at WDW resorts, so they'll get less of an opportunity to obtain FP+ or it will cost more (even if not directly, prices are going way up, so one might assume the entire pricing structure is going to change in 2013 to include the new service ... this way Disney can pretend it isn't charging for something that it is!)

I hate the whole idea of this ... I hate the idea of spending what will surely be over $2 billion when all is said and done and having very little to show for it.

 

[Scuttle]

Why? Because you're going to have more attractions with the service and more FP's being given out per day.
There are days at DLR where they shut FP off of 3-4 attractions because there is no need for it, but to create artificially long lines.

That is what will happen here. Let's say GMR or PoC are pretty much 10-minutes to walk-ons on a weekday in two weeks. One year from now, those attractions will likely have 20-40 minute waits because FP+ has been added.

It is not all that complicated. Get used to planning for everything months in advance or standing in ridiculous lines ... like the 30 minutes I waited recently for Mermaid at MK.

I bet you had those 30 back. That attraction needs a lot of work. I can't believe some of the show scenes and how bad they look.