Spirited News and Observations and Opinions ...

flynnibus

Premium Member
Yeah, you have completely lost me. You'd rather have a confusing, privacy concern riddled guest planning tool that an actual E-Ticket attraction that is the best Disney has produced stateside this century? OK ... You go and enjoy your virtual ride on your smartphone (I've got an APP for that!) because you're arguing that better planning is better than fresh attractions that you might have to wait for.

I'll translate.. I'd rather have a whole platform that I will benefit from in multiple ways.. for many years to come.. than a single attraction that I would enjoy. Why? I can only take so much of one attraction before you bore of it. It's not like I'm going to goto WDW and hang out in RSR for 5 days straight.

I don't get your point. Those attractions that date back to the 50s and 60s and, one, 70s, are all beloved today all over the world. They're holding up just fine and that is even with people addicted to their iPhones.

I'll translate.. if the 'alternative was a full slate of block-busters that are gaurunteed hits for decades' then no I wouldn't want NextGen vs that. But if Disney were able to build that, and all that was holding them back were the up front $$$ - they would have done it long ago and been way more successful than they are now. So I don't think it's all that worthwhile a comparison.

Right, ultimately, the issue to you is that people will always have something to complain about. Not that maybe this isn't the best way for a company to spend a few billion dollars.

No, I just can't wait for hindsight to get here so we can really measure up all these concerns vs the real thing.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I already said that there are HUGE aspects of this program I am not comfortable with and I don't like.

And aside from the "creepy" factor, I just don't think a day at an amusement park needs to be this complicated.

No, it doesn't. ... It shouldn't be. ... And, ultimately in WDW's case, the product simply isn't currently worth the effort this program will make you go through to experience it.
 

Longhairbear

Well-Known Member
@WDW1974, another site that conjectures in the blue sky realm has posted today that the DHS expansion is waffling between Cars Land clone and an Incredibles E-ticket/couple C-tickets expansion. Have you heard anything about that? I'd vastly prefer a new Incredibles E-ticket over Cars Land (which I like very much...in DCA).
I just read it too. I hope they go cloneless.
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
As for the Iger v. Eisner debate, I'd take Eisner and all of his faults over Iger any day. Eisner made a great number of mistakes, no doubt, but he also had an undeniable passion and was a charismatic leader. Some bad things happened as a result of his ego, impulsive nature, and fixations, but some great things happened as a result of his very same traits.

Now, I say this without having ever met either of them, but I think I've seen enough to come to this conclusion.

First 10 years Eisner, up to Frank Well's passing, hands down. He was Golden.
 

Genie of the Lamp

Well-Known Member
Hey Mr. Spirit, sir, any updates/sightings of where the rag tag crew of Iger/Staggs/Meg/George went today in WDW? I would imagine that since you stated they went tho EPCOT and MK yesterday, they probably swung by DHS and AK today.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
As it turns out, opposition to the use of Radio Frequency Identification (RFID) devices on humans is both long and widespread. Groups as diverse as the ACLU and the Christian Coalition oppose their use. Concerns center on invasions of privacy and dehumanization. The debate continues with some Supreme Court justices recently suggesting laws have not kept pace with tracking technology.

At WDW, the issue with RFID is not merely its use, but the pervasiveness of its use. An argument could be made that short-range RFID readers are appropriate at some locations such as theme park entrances, as resort room keys, and at points of purchase. These are, after all, points at which individuals need to exchange information with Disney.

However, a significant portion of NextGen’s considerable budget was used to install RFID readers throughout the theme parks and beyond. There is a reason why NextGen costs so much. With widespread deployment of RFID readers along with a significantly upgraded data network, Disney now has the ability to closely track individual movements in real-time and to amass considerable datasets on these movements. For those who wear MagicBands, Disney has the ability to track those using long-range readers. MagicBands afford Disney greater tracking capabilities but, because of the vast infrastructure upgrade, Disney has newly enhanced capabilities to track movements in real-time throughout many WDW locations even with RFID cards.

As cost and technology improves, it makes sense for Disney, if unchallenged, to enhance their tracking capabilities further in order to “provide guests with enhanced experiences”. (Isn’t this the reason we’ve been told they are needed now?) In WDW’s case, the issue is not merely the use of RFID technology but the pervasiveness and continued expansion of its deployment.

Discussions of “RFID triangulation” are a red herring. Disney does not need to use triangulation algorithms to determine location. With a sufficient number of short-range RFID readers, Disney has the capability to determine location to within a few feet. It’s simply a matter of where and how many RFID readers Disney chooses to deploy.

Disney does not need RFID devices to track overall crowds. Disney’s current considerable video surveillance coverage, along with extensive data collected over decades using traditional methods, are more than adequate to monitor and respond to overall crowd patterns. From a business perspective, the only justification for person-specific RFID tracking technology is exactly that, to collect specific information on each “guest”.

Since Disney intends young children to wear MagicBands, there is concern that data collected on them could be a violation of current law. Proponents indicate that Disney provides an “opt out” option but, seriously, how many WDW “guests” truly know or understand their options? Up till now, Disney has not been forthcoming with information and it’s only because of widespread concerns that Disney has slowly released more detailed information. It seems Disney had hoped its “guests” would not notice; that the mind-numbing “Terms & Conditions” along with the less-then-informative FAQ would suffice. Disney clearly expected its “guests” to not pay attention.

RFID’s main supporters are those with vested interests in the technology and the data it produces. Essentially, RFID proponents are either RFID & associated technology manufacturers or involved in the data collection business. These organizations heavily lobby Congress, making it difficult to pass laws to protect our civil liberties. When it comes to using RFID technology on humans, it’s important to consider the motivations of organizations that defend it. Ultimately, these organizations have significant financial interests in assuring its success, with other considerations, including liberty and privacy, being secondary.

Disney’s failure to correctly gauge the public’s reaction to concerns with privacy and anxieties over children’s safety might explain Iger’s hostile cover letter to Rep. Markey. Having been assured by his internal team on its legality and anticipated public reaction, Iger almost certainly is aggravated by its reception so far. A lot of financial eggs have been placed in the NextGen basket and Disney cannot afford to drop that basket. Let’s not forget that the New Fantasyland has not turned out to be the “pretty spectacular” success Iger predicted it would be. Iger must be frustrated both with WDW’s financial performance and track record. Under Iger’s tenure, WDW has not had a single major success, a black eye on Iger’s otherwise impressive career. At this point, Iger has to exacerbated that NextGen is off to an inauspicious start. Iger took a risk when he approved NextGen and NextGen potentially represents Iger greatest failure.

Disney sells NextGen as an “enhanced guest experience” but, first and foremost, executives view it as an enormous financial windfall. That’s the biggest problem at WDW today; senior leadership thinks of profits first, customers second. WDW management used to place show before all else and customers financially rewarded them for it. As symbolized by Iger’s recent WDW visit where he seemingly traveled via backstage access and dined at the finest restaurants, Disney leadership has little appreciation for what most WDW “guests” experience every day.

NOTHING TO ADD!
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
I think what Disney is doing with my personal information, my actions, my choices, is just as unsettling as when other companies do it.

But I think the pushback they're getting (unexpectedly judging from Mr. Iger's reaction) is due in part to the use of a bracelet to carry the technology. Perhaps they thought guests would love the convenience factor but there's been a groundswell of negatvity because of the symbolic nature of the bracelet. It's hard to ignore what they're doing because it's literally as clear as the bracelet on your wrist.

When some in the company internally call this program "tag and release" there's a reason for it, and Disney has to realize some of its customers have conjured up the same symbolism.

I think DisCo rolled this out too quickly and too haphazardly without considering the negatives. In their brazenness they've clearly crossed a line with many. Perhaps it's all for the best because as a society we're finally starting to wake up and think about these issues. Disney's actions may have done this nation a service by kick-starting the discussion.

Excellent point. The bracelet creates a strange dynamic. It just feels creepy, icky, odd.

Tag and release. Perfect.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Maybe the crowds are big because the parks are still a lot more fun overall than universal. I like universal and what they are doing today is genius, it is also almost 15 years past due.

That's opinion.

I love EPCOT and DAK and appreciate parts of the others, although often the MK bores me to tears. I don't have that problem at UNI or IOA.

And I think UNI has been putting out cutting edge product since IOA opened in 1999. Funny, that's sorta when Disney stopped (in O-Town at least).
 

djlaosc

Well-Known Member
@WDW1974, another site that conjectures in the blue sky realm has posted today that the DHS expansion is waffling between Cars Land clone and an Incredibles E-ticket/couple C-tickets expansion. Have you heard anything about that? I'd vastly prefer a new Incredibles E-ticket over Cars Land (which I like very much...in DCA).

The Incredibles would seem to be a weird choice for a major Pixar attraction, as it is not one of the 4 "franchises" that Pixar have (Toy Story, Monsters Inc., Finding Nemo and Cars), but, according to Wikipedia, out of the 13 Pixar films that have been released, The Incredibles ranked 2nd in Opening, 5th in Domestic Performance, and 4th in Worldwide Performance, so it did well (and with the 3rd lowest Budget out of the 13), so you would wonder why they haven't done more with it (just 2 videogames, as well as Disney Infinity, and a few comic books), especially as the film is perfectly set up for a sequel (the whole film, to me, seemed like the first hour of a two hour film - although that would actually be the first two hours of a three/four or five hour film, I guess. It just seemed like it was setting the scene for something more, which happened right at the end, and then it stopped.)
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Is this thread always going to be about Next Gen? It looks like this discussion has killed all other discussion in all of the other threads.

Right now, that's the hot topic.

If no one is posting in the other threads, then I'd assume they aren't interested in what's being discussed there. ... but if there's something else you'd like to discuss, bring it up!
 

SirNim

Well-Known Member
Leave the bracelet in a locker. (Or the RFID card if that's what you've got instead.)

Won't be able to use Fastpass. But you also won't be tracked!

I'm predicting the lockers are going to be updated to work on the RFID platform. Meaning. You won't be able to lock your bracelet away since you'll need your bracelet to open the locker back up.
 

djlaosc

Well-Known Member
Leave the bracelet in a locker. (Or the RFID card if that's what you've got instead.)

Won't be able to use Fastpass. But you also won't be tracked!

I'm predicting the lockers are going to be updated to work on the RFID platform. Meaning. You won't be able to lock your bracelet away since you'll need your bracelet to open the locker back up.

At least with the card you could put it in a RFID Blocking Wallet, although I guess you could get a RFID Blocking Bag for the Band (although that would be more bulky to carry around)
 

unkadug

Follower of "Saget"The Cult
Leave the bracelet in a locker. (Or the RFID card if that's what you've got instead.)

Won't be able to use Fastpass. But you also won't be tracked!

I'm predicting the lockers are going to be updated to work on the RFID platform. Meaning. You won't be able to lock your bracelet away since you'll need your bracelet to open the locker back up.
The perfect Catch 23.

(get it?)
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Wait a second... @WDW1974, are you actually suggesting to me that THIS...

03.jpg


...is not the proper way to honor Walt Disney's legacy?!?!?!?!??!?!?!!??!?!?!!?!?!?!?!!?

I'd love to get Diane Disney's or any of the grandkids or other Disney's opinions on that @WDWFigment.
Hell, I'm sure they have a nicer version at The Walt Disney Family Museum in San Francisco!:D

You really have some nerve.

If I had a $ for every time I've heard that one, Tom ...

As for the Iger v. Eisner debate, I'd take Eisner and all of his faults over Iger any day. Eisner made a great number of mistakes, no doubt, but he also had an undeniable passion and was a charismatic leader. Some bad things happened as a result of his ego, impulsive nature, and fixations, but some great things happened as a result of his very same traits.

Now, I say this without having ever met either of them, but I think I've seen enough to come to this conclusion.

You are right. And while I have had the pleasure of knowing Michael (no, we aren't best buddies or such), I've never met Bob directly. Been at events with him, but never got near him. ... I was told by a close friend today that if I spotted him at WDW and tried to approach that I might 'get tackled and dragged off' or tasered.

Yeah, Bob and Michael are definitely two different type of individuals.
 

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