Space Mt. and Juncle Cruise rehabs

wannab@dis

Well-Known Member
I don't know that it's really narrow-minded, that seems a bit infammatory.
Wasn't meant as inflammatory, but meant to show that *we* don't always remember there are millions of guests at WDW that do not dwell on Disney like we do. We are just a small fraction of the daily masses that walk through the gates. :wave:
 

wannab@dis

Well-Known Member
Maybe I combined Pumba and Timon? :lookaroun

For the record, I would welcome improvements to the JC. I saw a video of the changes to DL's and they look great. I just don't want to see any veido screens, and I don't think JC needs any cute characters, whether actually from Disney films or straight from my addled brain...
Personally... I don't think JC *needs* any characters either, but that's coming from my point of view as a fan. However, if the powers that be feel the characters would plus the attraction, create a resurgence for an old attraction that some feel is a waste of time (yep, I've heard it several times leaving the ride), and extend the lifetime and enjoyment of the attraction for future guests, then it's worth a try. How hard would it be to remove a TV if it doesn't work?
 

Slowjack

Well-Known Member
I think most will see a distinct set of posters who seem to complain about every change and that is the group that I was speaking to. You're right, not all posters complain about everything, but there is a significant subset that are very pessimistic about any possible rumors coming out. Read enough of the posts and it's fairly apparent.
That may be true, I just know that anytime I see you responding to someone with a criticism, you talk about how some people aren't happy with any changes at all--true enough, but you often don't bother to find out whether the person you are responding to is in that category. Read enough of the posts and it's fairly apparent.

In fact, you do it again in this same post!
Who's Tumbaa? :lol:
Yeah, okay.:hammer:
So when was the last time an "unthemed hypercoaster in Epcot" was rumored? :rolleyes: Let's not be juvenile here and actually stick to real world matters. Theme that baby and I'll be checking it out. :D

There you go off the deep end again. It appears you can't develop a decent response to justify your stance. Try again.
I think you misunderstood what I was saying. Obviously (or so I thought) I was giving extreme, entirely fictional examples (thanks for the unnecessary insult). My point was to show that for all of us here, there is something Disney could do that would make us sit up and say, "They go too far! No increase in attendence can justify this!" We just draw the lines at different points. I'm well aware that for some people, repainting a wall in a slightly different shade of the original color is akin to setting the park on fire ("Walt wanted that wall to be sage!").

(Just to be clear, that is also an extreme, entirely fictional example).

But I am not one of those people, so indicating that such people exist isn't really a response to anything I have to say, or that other people "in the middle" like me have to say.
If WDI was scared that the end result wouldn't always be perfect, they would never try in the first place. It's no guarantee that an idea will always work and DL history shows that very well. Some of the original and early concepts were failures that had to be replaced. The issue here is the simple problem that some don't want them to try to plus an attraction for fear that it may change their nostalgic views of the attraction. They can't stagnate so change is necessary. Not all changes or additions will be perfect but the attempt is always good for the company.
See, there you go again. I have said over and over that I have no problem with change in and of itself. I've been going to the MK for thirty years now and I've seen a lot of changes. Most of them have been for the better, even if many of them have not. I'm not in favor of the parks stagnating. I don't think Disney should be afraid of trying new things. I have no problem with the JC, in particular, being different than it was when it first opened. I'd love to see some new stuff there.

But I disagree that an attempt is always good. Undoing mistakes can be a lengthy process, and subtle mistakes can be hard to recognize. It's not like I think many people would actively complain if a video screen was put in the queue. But I think that it's possible their experience will be diminished even if they don't realize it. When I first rode Pirates as a six-year-old, I remember my dad taking me through that queue and thinking we really were wandering through a fort--I remember pulling my dad's sleeve and and asking him if he was sure we were going the right way! If there had been, say, a series of video screens with Orlando Bloom along the way, it would have been a very different experience. The "magic" is a tricky thing to keep a hold of.
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
I don't know that it's really narrow-minded, that seems a bit infammatory.
Detail oriented might be a more PC term but narrow minded, while maybe incorrect for the rest of our lives, is pretty accurate to how many of us are regarding Disney.

The average guest could care less if Disney put up some giant unthemed coaster, many would love it. However many of the Disney faithful, myself included, would have an aneurysm. We expect things to be done a certain way and dislike deviation from that pre-set standard.

I for one love changes and updates if they keep with the theme of an attraction. IMHO change for branding reasons are not a good thing.
 

Shaman

Well-Known Member
See this is why they should do away with JC at MK...:lookaroun

Let's move on...the change vs. no change debate is old...but I digress...

You can go to AK for the real thing...it would be cool if they used the space now occupied for JC for a couple of original attractions...maybe one based off a movie and another with an original story.
 

MeTa

Member
Before reading my post take into regard that I haven't really read any before this so I might be repeating someones thoughts.:wave:

Being a person who loves the originals I personally think that if they update the Jungle Cruise in a similar way to how they updated the Pirates then its all for the best....They would be keeping a original ride but doing it tastefully and tweaking it to satisfy the modern crowds.

As for Space Mountain, MAKE IT LIKE Disneyland! Its 100 times better, plus for all I knew it was the same track as the original just smoother. Its not like there any AA's or anything that keep to the original Disney themes. And the music they have makes it a much better ride.
 

Slowjack

Well-Known Member
Personally... I don't think JC *needs* any characters either, but that's coming from my point of view as a fan. However, if the powers that be feel the characters would plus the attraction, create a resurgence for an old attraction that some feel is a waste of time (yep, I've heard it several times leaving the ride), and extend the lifetime and enjoyment of the attraction for future guests, then it's worth a try. How hard would it be to remove a TV if it doesn't work?
To be honest...little kids love the characters, and you could always, in the short term, boost attendence that way on any attraction. If you found some hobo, put him in a Mickey suit, and sat him at the top of the TTA platform it would probably double in popularity overnight, at least until Mickey started asking the kids to buy him fortified wine. :)
 

CrashNet

Well-Known Member
I am not an expert on financing required for rollercoasters, but wouldn't $30 million be a little low to completely gut Space Mountain, build a new coaster(s), and improve and/or revamp the rest of the theming? Especially with Disney's theming and attention to detail.
 

HandyAndy

Member
If this rumour of updating our SM, I really really hope they keep the single seating configuration, thats what makes ours so unique and one of the reasons why i love the ride!
 

NeedABreak

New Member
As long as they keep the single file seating and two tracks I don't really think they can miss with SM.

JC needs some love. I would love to see the AAs cleaned up and working right.

I do think that there is room for plusing in the queue. TVs would be kinda tacky if you ask me. Since the attraction is theamed to be in the 1930's a refrence to the Advanturer's Club would be a nice inside joke. :lol:
 

justducky78

New Member
I agree! I love Space Mountain as it is, although a smoother track and effects would be nice. I have an equilibrium problem and it progressively getting worse. Space Mountain and BTM are about my limit for thrill rides. I hope Disney doesn't take that away from those of us who (at only 28) want desperately to ride the newest thrill ride, and can't. But if I didn't have this problem, I'd say bigger, better, faster! So really it's only a personal request.:wave:

I agree - it would alienate a lot of people if they added loops, etc. There are plenty of thrill rides throughout the parks, and they can always add more, but keep classics like SM the same. A smoother track would definitely be better, though!
 

jaredliu

Active Member
SM does need a refub so badly. It is the wrost out of the five Space Mountain. DLP is the best for a lot of people and recently got an upgrade. DL got a upgrade and turn into a 21th century ride. HKDL got a brand new one just like the DL's newly refurb verison. TDL has already announced that their SM is going to have a 7-month rehab later this year and will be completely brand new after it repoen the coming spring. As for Magic Kingdom's Space Mountain, I just feel sorry for the millions and millions of the guests coming to MK who have no idea how much better SM could be in other Disney parks.
 

marni1971

Park History nut
Premium Member
I am not an expert on financing required for rollercoasters, but wouldn't $30 million be a little low to completely gut Space Mountain, build a new coaster(s), and improve and/or revamp the rest of the theming? Especially with Disney's theming and attention to detail.
Indeed it does - so imagine what $30m could do if used for enhanced A/V effects and track tweaking....

drool...
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
I am not an expert on financing required for rollercoasters, but wouldn't $30 million be a little low to completely gut Space Mountain, build a new coaster(s), and improve and/or revamp the rest of the theming? Especially with Disney's theming and attention to detail.
If we judge by the DL refurb suspected price tag of $15 million and look how well that turned out I like the $30 million budget.
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
Even the interior queue could use some work on space mountain. The images look dated, and although there isn't much you can do to avoid the rows of blue bars once you get past the control tower, there could be more added in that area as well.

To me, the ride has the old horizons feel up until the launch. I would be in favor of gutting, perhaps even making it a little faster (the top speed of space mountain is 27 mph, iirc). But I think a better soundsystem, and removal of that "dated" feel would do wonders to revitalize the older attraction.

As for Jungle Cruise - I haven't seen the Pirahna scene, but I wouldn't mind any additions that would enhance the attraction. The biggest problem with that ride is when you get bad skippers. I've also thought I would make a great Jungle Cruise skipper, but it doesn't seem like something you can make a career out of. To me, the skipper on Jungle cruise is as important as a performer in a stage show, and I'm guessing they aren't compensated the same way. Better training (or simply funnier people) would make the attraction significantly better.
 

Expo_Seeker40

Well-Known Member
I'm all in favor of the much needed TLC given to the track. whatever they do with say new vehicles or new seating arrangments (four people to a seat again?) I hope they keep it single file.It ads to the thrill, uniqueness, and materhorness (lol new word), of our original space mountain.

I welcome new and enhanced effects to the actual rollercoaster...AND A NEW POSTSHOW!!!!!!

Good God the home of future living must have been cool through the world of RCA, but with RCA and fed ex gone, and a jumble of sets left from their sponsorship in the postshow, something needs to be done.

I'm sorry but I really hope that the 70s music can be kept in certain parts, it ads to the retro and smooth idealic feel to the interior. I welcome new diagrams and even some new set designs, but I really hope not all of the original diagrams are lost.

I vow that the next time I go to WDW I will try my best to get a better look at the display boxes in the queue, if anyone ever gets video or good photos of what those display boxes look like please PM me with pics or video. :wave:
 

MagliteL13

Active Member
As long as they keep the single file seating and two tracks I don't really think they can miss with SM.

JC needs some love. I would love to see the AAs cleaned up and working right.

I do think that there is room for plusing in the queue. TVs would be kinda tacky if you ask me. Since the attraction is theamed to be in the 1930's a refrence to the Advanturer's Club would be a nice inside joke. :lol:

I forget who told me it, but it was in regards to seating arangements. It actually pertained to Splash Mountain when it first opened at TDL, then WDW and DL, but I suppose it could apply to Space--and I'm not sure how reliable it is. Anyways, it was something along the lines of the single file seating being a cultural taboo in Japan, hence the side by side seating. That just kinda carried on to WDW. In designing DL, they changed it to be a little more efficient.

As for Jungle, it definetly needs some TLC. The Adventurer's Club references are already in the ride/queue, btw, in a couple of places. It used to be three places. And one place is kinda debatable.

RSoxNo1 said:
As for Jungle Cruise - I haven't seen the Pirahna scene, but I wouldn't mind any additions that would enhance the attraction. The biggest problem with that ride is when you get bad skippers. I've also thought I would make a great Jungle Cruise skipper, but it doesn't seem like something you can make a career out of. To me, the skipper on Jungle cruise is as important as a performer in a stage show, and I'm guessing they aren't compensated the same way. Better training (or simply funnier people) would make the attraction significantly better.

I honestly can't see any good point to put the pirahna scene. There's a point after the gorilla camp that requires some fill spiel, but most people become enthralled with the elephants up ahead. There's also the area right after trapped safari before the crocs that requires some fill. Placing them between squeezeplay and the Chief I think is out because we back up there so often. Being a skipper is a hard role to pull off, but an incredibly rewarding one. The skipper is incredibly important, but doesn't have to be hysterical. The humor is kinda intermingled in the SOG. To make a good cruise though, the skipper has to give the crew what they want and that makes it hard--trying to figure out what they'll respond to (Puns, facts, randomness, physical comedy, etc...). It takes a looooonngg time to become a Skipper--a whopping 4 days. To be a good Skipper, it takes a really long time, though. Like Ron, or Babs, or Rhonda, or Jeff.
 

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