Space Mountain

[wvdisneyfamily]

I think Disney is fairly confident in the economy because they continue to increase prices (even if it is somewhat minimal). SM's refurb will probably have more to do with how long they want it to be closed rather than how long it should be closed to 100% complete the job.

 

[the-reason14]

^ not in this case. The rehab was cleared, scheduled and planned. Management are scared to close for more than 6 months for fear of complaints.

They`ll have a lot more complaints should they have a DLC situation on their hands.

Well, if the rumors are true about SM being closed all of or most of next year, I know I wont be going to WDW until its open again.......

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

Why can't Disney learn their lesson once and for all?!

-Walt Disney Studios vs. Tokyo DisneySea
-Primeval Whirl vs. Expedition Everest
-Dated Haunted Mansion vs. Fabulously Restored Haunted Mansion
-MK's Space Mountain vs. Disneyland's or Disneyland Paris's SM

Disney certainly feels confident about MK maintaining huge crowds, and it probably will for several years. But Disney isn't immune to criticism and bad word of mouth - these two things (deservedly) shot both DCA and WDS in the foot. People already complain about MK's attractions being dated, and deservedly so. But why can't Disney take in this lesson and move on?

 

[RSoxNo1]

This idea is also called "build it and they will come." History has shown that for theme parks, it doesn't work.

Exhibit 2: Hard Rock Park in Myrtle Beach. This is a park much closer to IOA or a Disney park than is your typical Six Flags. In other words, they did it right. A very immersive experience, not just a collection of rides. But, they built a big-a**'d park out of nothing, and their business plan expected 3M guests in the first year. I think they might have gotten half that. They just filed Chapter 11. They still hope to operate in 2009.

Hard Rock Park filed for Chapter 11 today.

Taken from poster that_l_do_Pig on ITM:

http://www.scnow.com/scp/news/local/grand_strand/article/hard_rock_park_files_for_chapter_11/15310

 

[maxime29]

I don't care when the refurb is or how long it's expected to be. Just as long as they don't turn the ride into a one track coaster and keep the "out of control" feeling then I'll be happy.

 

[tirian]

And in exchange we got:

• Animal Kingdom Lodge
• Old Key West Resort
• Wilderness Lodge Villas
• Beach Club Villas
• Boardwalk Villas
• Saratoga Springs Resort & Spa
• Beach Club Resort
• Boardwalk Inn
• Grand Floridian Resort
• Wilderness Lodge
• Yacht Club Resort
• Caribbean Beach
• Coronado Springs
• Port Orleans Riverside
• Port Orleans French Quarter
• All-Star Movies
• All-Star Music
• All-Star Sports
• Pop Century Resort
  
  And
• Big Thunder Mountain Railroad

Many of those hotels would have been built regardless of whether the others were or weren't.

At one point, BTMRR and WRR were to be built, with BTMRR wrapping around the dark ride. That would have been amazing.

As for Space Mt.— MK's management needs to decide they want the best kingdom again. After the success of the HM refurb, they were excited about future problems. Now they're dragging their feet.

If they're concerned about the effect closing an E-ticket is going to have on the rest of the park, that's their fault for waiting almost 20 years to add another one. The MK should have had another E-ticket 10 years ago.

This is the kind of lethargy that kills corporate divisions, and somebody at the Corporate management level needs to nip this in the bud. It's a textbook example of bad management practices.

*** I can hear naysayers: "The MK is the most visited park on earth! They couldn't do that with bad management!" Nonsense. It's Disney. They're going to get guests no matter what. But a company is supposed to plan for its future, and recent practices at the MK have been too shortsighted.

 

[Enigma]

This idea is also called "build it and they will come." History has shown that for theme parks, it doesn't work.

Exhibit 1: Six Flags in the Kieran Burke era---they ran several parks into the ground (they were the beginning of the end of Worlds of Adventure, and almost killed Magic Mountain) by overbuilding attractions in the hope it would drive attendance. Now that Shapiro is CEO, Six Flags has grown much more carefully and prudently, focusing instead on improving service and the in-park experience, and it is working. Attendance is up, and this is expected to be their first cash-flow-positive year. Ever. In the entire history of the company.

Exhibit 2: Hard Rock Park in Myrtle Beach. This is a park much closer to IOA or a Disney park than is your typical Six Flags. In other words, they did it right. A very immersive experience, not just a collection of rides. But, they built a big-a**'d park out of nothing, and their business plan expected 3M guests in the first year. I think they might have gotten half that. They just filed Chapter 11.

Dude whos ever heard of Hard rock park? and six flags? these companies aren't even in the same league as Disney and UNiversal. The fact of the matter is Universal is investing heavily in their parks right now, Disney has only agreed to build new rides at DCA because attendance is low there and the attitude in florida is "People will mindlessly come here by the boatloads and spend there money so we shouldn't invest too heavily in the parks...better to cut costs to make the bottom line look better" I have confirmed this with several people who work on site at WDW. It's a very strange complacent attitude and thats why they cancel ambitios plans for Space Mountain and new e-tickets. It is because people keep on visiting and blowing money on merchandise that disney feels that they can get away with just a new marketing campaign every 2 years rather than a new major attraction every 2 years (It used to be the other way around up until around the mid 1990s).

In order for the parks to grow the arrogance of management needs to dissolve and the only way to do that is to cut spending and attendance at the parks which will then cause disney to finally take notice and improve and reinvest in the parks. Otherwise, you can buy all the AP's and YOAMD merchandise you want your only encouraging them to do the bare minimum. Its sad but that doesn't make it any less true.

 

[JWG]

I, for one, hope that when I show up at the MK on Feb. 18, 2009 that SM is closed. Last time I rode it (July, 2007) it was awful. Visible track from light bleed, jerky, bumpy, the thrill is will I get whip lash as I'm riding, etc.

Shut 'er down!
open 'er back up in 2010.

 

[Brian Noble]

EDIT: Now I'm trying to remember if anything was added in 2004

I don't think so. I think they marketed Dragster for two years running starting in 2003, but 2004 saw an addition to the water park. And, 2001 didn't have anything either, that was Millennium's "second marketing year". 2002 was Wicked Twister. 2005 and 2006 were both relatively modest additions: a Huss giant frisbee and an S&S swing. 2007 was the next major addition with Maverick, and 2008 saw a "new" kids area (the kiddie ride package from Geauga Lake, repainted.)

You'd really only call three, maybe four of these "major additions" in the 9 seasons from 2000-2008. And, Cedar Fair executives have been pretty public in admitting that Dragster has taken a lot longer to pay off than they expected. Which is why subsequent additions---even Maverick---have been a lot less about the Tallest And Fastest anything, and a lot more about fun rides.

 

[Brian Noble]

The fact of the matter is Universal is investing heavily in their parks right now,

Sure, right now. But, Harry Potterland is the first major addition to IOA since it opened---almost 10 years ago. In the same period USO has added a few things here and there, but Mummy and MIB are probably the only ones you'd call major.

But, I completley agree with your premise: nothing will change unless and until attendance/market share in the Orlando resort generally takes a hit. And, I'm really really hoping that Harry Potter And The Amazing Robot Arm will do that.

 

[Glasgow]

I was at US and IOA in June and hadn't been since 2000. FWIW, I only saw a few appreciable differences and basically only a couple of new rides (most were just rehabs). I wasn't at all impressed.

Harry Potter is a necessary project for US/IOA to remain competitive at all, even with Disney in non-expansion mode. As previous posters said, it's a good thing for WDW and hopefully will initiate a fully comprehensive response from Disney.

 

[dandaman]

I don't think so. I think they marketed Dragster for two years running starting in 2003, but 2004 saw an addition to the water park. And, 2001 didn't have anything either, that was Millennium's "second marketing year".

I keep thinking that 2001 saw Woodstock Express, but obviously it's not a major addition anyway. (Save for maybe the old habit of "MOST COASTERS!!1!" :lol: )

Back to your regularly scheduled Florida park-based comparisons...

 

[sknydave]

The influx of foreign tourists is what will keep these parks going (in my opinion, of course.)

 

[scarpiapiano]

Not a very difficult question. Just look to Disneyland's Space Mountain!


2. An in-ride musical score (it would be cool if Michael Giacchino composed it, he also did DL's and DLP's SM soundtracks)

I don't know who Mr. Giacchino is but he didn't make an original score for Space Mountain. He put the Aquarium movement from the Carnival of the Animals by Camille Saint-Seans to a heavy rock beat. If you're going to steal a tune, make sure it's a good one.

 

[EpcotServo]

I don't know who Mr. Giacchino is but he didn't make an original score for Space Mountain. He put the Aquarium movement from the Carnival of the Animals by Camille Saint-Seans to a heavy rock beat. If you're going to steal a tune, make sure it's a good one.

Wrong.

You are thinking of DickDale's soundtrack for DL's old Space Mountain.

The new song in piano rendition:

[YOUTUBE]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/AM1NzirGpcY&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/AM1NzirGpcY&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Lee]

I don't know who Mr. Giacchino is but he didn't make an original score for Space Mountain. He put the Aquarium movement from the Carnival of the Animals by Camille Saint-Seans to a heavy rock beat. If you're going to steal a tune, make sure it's a good one.

Nope. Wrong.
Giacchino did the music for the Incredibles and the Space Mountains in Paris, Hong Kong, and Anaheim.
The OLD soundtrack, replaced by Giacchino's, at Disneyland was the one with D.Dale's guitar and the Carnival of the Animals music. That is long gone.

 

[Mr.EPCOT]

Giacchino did the music for the Incredibles and the Space Mountains in Paris, Hong Kong, and Anaheim.

Don't forget Ratatouille (for which he was nominated for a Best Original Score Oscar), Lost (for which he won an Emmy), and most importantly, the upcoming new Star Trek movie.

 

[EpcotServo]

Don't forget Ratatouille (for which he was nominated for a Best Original Score Oscar), Lost (for which he won an Emmy), and most importantly, the upcoming new Star Trek movie.

And don't forget the super-awesome Speed Racer score too!

 

[Mr.EPCOT]

And don't forget the super-awesome Speed Racer score too!

That was a good one.

 

[Nosmo King]

And Giacchino is doing the music for the new show Fringe (which come to think of it, is just like Lost, anyway)

By the way, whoever made that piano arrangement of the DL SM score needs to tune their piano and do some serious reshaping on the hammers!