Service Dogs

[mlee10]

The issue is that people think that because they have depression, anxiety or loneliness that their dogs are "service dogs" or "working dogs" and that's not the case. Comfort dogs are not working dogs or service dogs. People that abuse this system should be put in jail honestly.

I can understand dogs that give warnings to someone having a seizure, but that really is the ONLY case. The rest of the cases are for service dogs that are professionally trained.

Our dog is a "seizure alert dog" and she was professionally trained. We then went for 10 days of specialized training with her. So there are A LOT of service dogs that are professionally trained for a lot of different things.

The dogs you mention are emotional support animals vs. service animals.....that is where the problem began. A service dog most definatly has a "specific job", in other words they perform some sort of job for their owner. In our case, Nala alerts during seizures and helps to calm anxiety which is a trigger for seizures, she has also started to show signs of knowing when a seizure might be coming. She spent a long time in training. We did not "pick" her, she was chosen for us for the specific tasks we needed her for. We also work very hard to make sure her training is followed and even have follow up visits with her trainers when we see issues starting to arise. Again just like with anything, there are responsible and irresponsible service dog owners.

 

[Polydweller]

The issue is that people think that because they have depression, anxiety or loneliness that their dogs are "service dogs" or "working dogs" and that's not the case. Comfort dogs are not working dogs or service dogs. People that abuse this system should be put in jail honestly.

I can understand dogs that give warnings to someone having a seizure, but that really is the ONLY case. The rest of the cases are for service dogs that are professionally trained.

Not really ONLY. Some service dogs are trained to do things calm a person with PTSD, remind a person to take medications, alert a deaf persons n of hazards, assist persons with autism, and other tasks that human partner has difficulty doing or can’t. All would fit the legal definition of service dog and many of the disabilities and/or needs are hard for others to see.

Notice also tha some of these include anxiety as a component of the need. The only restriction is that their sole role cannot be emotional support or comfort dogs.

 

[wagner1225]

When they opened up a couple of Hotels to pets last year they said in the announcement they have to be Licensed and certified what ever that means, also No Peacocks, airlines turn them down also...PS as you can see by Picture, Bugs Allowed

 

[joejccva71]

Some service dogs are trained to do things calm a person with PTSD, remind a person to take medications, alert a deaf persons n of hazards, assist persons with autism, and other tasks that human partner has difficulty doing or can’t. All would fit the legal definition of service dog and many of the disabilities and/or needs are hard for others to see.

Notice also tha some of these include anxiety as a component of the need. The only restriction is that their sole role cannot be emotional support or comfort dogs.

The BOLD parts I have problems with. Those do not demand a service dog. Autism, deaf or blind persons, yes of course. Seizures most definitely. I served 10 years as an EOD tech team lead in the Air Force and did 1 stretch in Kuwait and 2 in Iraq and I have seen my fair share of war and PTSD is not something to be taken lightly but it does NOT need a service dog. That is a bit ridiculous. That goes in line with the "comfort dog" and it's not a service dog necessity. I know people have their opinions and that's fine, but seriously.

People take this way too far. Next thing you know it will be "my boyfriend just broke up with me, I need a service dog stat!"

 

[Polydweller]

The BOLD parts I have problems with. Those do not demand a service dog. Autism, deaf or blind persons, yes of course. Seizures most definitely. I served 10 years as an EOD tech team lead in the Air Force and did 1 stretch in Kuwait and 2 in Iraq and I have seen my fair share of war and PTSD is not something to be taken lightly but it does NOT need a service dog. That is a bit ridiculous. That goes in line with the "comfort dog" and it's not a service dog necessity. I know people have their opinions and that's fine, but seriously.

People take this way too far. Next thing you know it will be "my boyfriend just broke up with me, I need a service dog stat!"

But specifically cited as such by the US Dept of Justice so yes they are. PTSD does not “require” it but controlling the anxiety that can be part of it is legally something a service dog can do, as we’re the other things I mentioned. It isn’t me saying it or my opinion, it’s the DOJ saying it.

 

[jloucks]

Some methods to spot fakes: (i also have no problem walking up to an owner and questioning whether it's a true service dog or not)

1. Reach out your hand to see if the dog comes over. MOST service dogs will not as they're very well trained and will not leave their owners side.

2. Have some food / munchies in your hand and sit down somewhere, whistle for the dog to come over while you're eating. If it's a true service dog they will not move.

3. If you see any "service dog" hop up on furniture, they are a fake.

4. This one is tougher to spot but most service dogs will only go to the bathroom upon command. If you see one just randomly lifting it's leg to pee or whatever, then further investigating should take place.

Mostly true, but like any tool, they can get 'altered' by their *final owners. They can learn some non-typical behaviors, and these behaviors don't automatically downgrade them from Service to Therapy dog.

Sidetrack...... So last night, we were at a school science fair with my daughter and her dog. Many people asked to pet her (the dog, not my daughter) and the answer was always "sorry, not now, she is working". 95% were cool about it. One full grown adult male decided it would be a good idea to then grab the dog on her spine, I suspect pretty hard based on the dogs reaction. My daughter wheeled around responding to the dog lurching and the guy just kinda smirked. At least until he realized I too was watching with dagger eyes from across the room. He skedaddled pretty quick which is a good thing because I almost created a Disney World bus line cutter level scene right there in the classroom.


*Real service dogs retire after a surprisingly short career. I want to say it is only like 5 years, but I would need to verify before anybody quotes me. They are then swapped out. This may vary based on the stress level of the different careers. Dogs basically burn out.

Retired pooches are in high demand, they are not put down or anything like that. You can pick one up for $3,000. I may be getting that confused with wash-out pups during training.

Another random fact (that may only be applicable to the school our dogs go thru)..... so what happens if a trainer falls in such hard love with their dog that giving them back is a soul crushing reality they cannot face? A 'perk' of being a first level trainer is you can buy a dog you fall in too much love with for $12,000. I have actually seen this happen! I was super clear with my kid that this eventuality would NEVER happen. Not to be confused with pups that wash-out or fail the program as I mentioned above.

 

[jloucks]

The BOLD parts I have problems with. Those do not demand a service dog. Autism, deaf or blind persons, yes of course. Seizures most definitely. I served 10 years as an EOD tech team lead in the Air Force and did 1 stretch in Kuwait and 2 in Iraq and I have seen my fair share of war and PTSD is not something to be taken lightly but it does NOT need a service dog. That is a bit ridiculous. That goes in line with the "comfort dog" and it's not a service dog necessity. I know people have their opinions and that's fine, but seriously.

People take this way too far. Next thing you know it will be "my boyfriend just broke up with me, I need a service dog stat!"

If the medication reminder process is based on the dog identifying via smell a chemical imbalance in the owners body, that is absolutely a service animal. There is some pretty significant breeding and training going on there.

I reluctantly agree, PTSD dogs are therapy dogs, not service dogs.

Sheesh,, I know way more than I realized, but come to think of it, lots of service dogs that wash out go on to be therapy dogs. So, you can have a therapy dog that is of a pretty high caliber in pedigree and still retaining some pretty fancy skills (potty on command for example).

...but still not legally a service dog.

Poor pooches... missed it by ---><--- this much.

 

[NormC]

When they opened up a couple of Hotels to pets last year they said in the announcement they have to be Licensed and certified what ever that means...

No. They opened four hotels to all dogs, pets or service in certain rooms. Service dogs were already allowed by Disney in every hotel..

 

[JIMINYCR]

Some methods to spot fakes: (i also have no problem walking up to an owner and questioning whether it's a true service dog or not)
1. Reach out your hand to see if the dog comes over. MOST service dogs will not as they're very well trained and will not leave their owners side.
2. Have some food / munchies in your hand and sit down somewhere, whistle for the dog to come over while you're eating. If it's a true service dog they will not move.
3. If you see any "service dog" hop up on furniture, they are a fake.
4. This one is tougher to spot but most service dogs will only go to the bathroom upon command. If you see one just randomly lifting it's leg to pee or whatever, then further investigating should take place.

It is difficult to list "How to spot Fake service dogs" only because not all handlers work their dogs properly. I agree your list is a start.
But guide dogs or any service dog can be owner trained. Many people will self train their dogs because of the extensively long waiting lists service dog schools have. Not all self trained dogs are trained properly either.
I trained my DW's first dog, but I have an extensive background in training dogs and knew what to do. My DW wanted her 2nd dog to come from a service dog school, her decision, so she waited 3 years for her second dog. Her first dog worked efficiently for her for almost 11 years.
It also takes effort on the handlers part to maintain the training of a service dog and over time even dogs that come from well respected training organizations can fall short of the initial level of training theyve received. It is up to the handler to continually train with their dog to maintain a high level of standard, so their dog can keep the level of work/behavior appropriate. That is expected from a service dog and owner but not all service dog users are doing that.
There are many individuals and orginizations that are unqualified to train service dogs that are providing dogs to people. They know the need is excessive and service dog schools have long waiting lists for dogs so they exist. Many people have been scammed by these people and organizations providing dogs to them that are improperly trained. Unfortunately the govt. hasnt done anything to regulate or qualify who trains and provides these dogs.

Definitely. The way they are raised seems to an outsider as pretty harsh. No playing ball, very little non-kennel free time (or none, really). These dogs are trained to be work dogs. Tools for people. They take their jobs super seriously as that is how they were raised as pups.

No..... Service dogs in training are played with, have plenty of time being handled like any other dog. Play time releases stress and lets the dogs relax. Properly adapted, some play time can also be valuable as a training lesson.
Yes, they are trained to work and follow commands, but they are not tools. They are companions that assist their owners. They do take their jobs seriously but like you and me, they have time off from work and when not working can act as any other dog might. Many dogs will break down and have stress related issued that make them unusable or unsafe because their owners dont allow then to release the pressures of the job.

 

[mergatroid]

On a lighter note the blind gentleman 'Steve' I used to work with had a funny story. He did a lot of charity work himself and went to a blind person's convention evening out. At the convention center they had some pen areas for the dogs whilst their owners were involved in some activity or other. Anyhow my friend Steve had a couple of drinks that evening and got a taxi home, collecting his guide dog first.

Once home he wondered why 'Henna' wasn't behaving as normal as she seemed to be roaming around the house. He thought that maybe she was in desperate need of the toilet and so let her out. His wife came down from the bedroom as she too had heard 'Henna' roaming around and Steve explained she was in the garden.

When she came back in his wife said "Who the bloody hell is that dog?". It turned out that Steve had got the wrong dog when collecting it from the 'pen' due to some mix up . A phone call soon resolved the issue as another bewildered gentleman had got home and his daughter had spotted their dog had also changed so it was soon sorted. He still laughs about it now

 

[EOD K9]

I don’t have problems with people having an emotional support dog, but they cannot and should not be treated as a working/service dog.

 

[EOD K9]

Apparently, on a flight from AZ there was a young girl bitten by an emotional support dog. The girl however was warned not to touch the dog after repeated attempts. Not saying it’s right, but it was another emotional support and not a true service K9.

 

[Professor_Jason]

Our dog is a service dog who really does help my husband who is combat veteran with PTSD, and while we could take him we just don't think it's fair to him to make him travel 1,000 miles and then make him stay in a strange room while we go out and have fun and then check on him throughout the day. It's a great service from Disney and I'm not knocking anybody who takes their dog but I don't think it's for us, it adds unneeded stress to our vacation

 

[Mickey shaped world]

I feel really sorry for some of the dogs brought to Disney World, owners can be so cruel. Last trip we were waiting in the bus line at Pop Century and a women in a wheel chair rolls up. The women was incredibly over weight, the problem was she had her little dog stored in a pouch under the wheelchair. Unfortunately her but was making the seat of the chair sag down and was squashing the dog, it was panting vigorously in the heat, the poor thing looked so uncomfortable. Some people don't deserve pets

 

[jloucks]

No..... Service dogs in training are played with, have plenty of time being handled like any other dog. Play time releases stress and lets the dogs relax. Properly adapted, some play time can also be valuable as a training lesson.
Yes, they are trained to work and follow commands, but they are not tools. They are companions that assist their owners. They do take their jobs seriously but like you and me, they have time off from work and when not working can act as any other dog might. Many dogs will break down and have stress related issued that make them unusable or unsafe because their owners dont allow then to release the pressures of the job.

Your statement is too generalized. They are played with, but not in most of the ways people play with their dogs. The reason behind this is you are intentionally avoiding any play that triggers undesirable instinctual behavior.

No catch or Frisbee because that triggers pursuit behavior.
No tug of war because that triggers aggression. etc. etc.

These items are service dog training 101. Every trainer knows this. Hopefully this is not the play to which you were referring.

So what do you have left? Pretty boring play that is really training in disguise. You have the 'wait for it' game with their food. You have the tonail clipping game, to get them used to handling. You have the rub down game, to prep them for examination by blind people. You have the run around like a lunatic game that most puppies do (that is immediately stopped once unauthorized play starts). Then the 'game' pretty much turns into training. Even what toys you give them are very restrictive. No little animal toys, no tug ropes, etc. Just heavy plastic chew logs. Much of anything else genetically triggers.

I'm super skeptical of you raising service animals solo, from pup to final placement. This process usually takes numerous highly trained individuals with genetically managed superior dogs to accomplish. Not saying it is impossible, but just extremely difficult to do. If you do, are a a dog god and I have never witnessed anything like it. ...and I know a lot of amazing trainers.

 

[JIMINYCR]

Your statement is too generalized. They are played with, but not in most of the ways people play with their dogs. The reason behind this is you are intentionally avoiding any play that triggers undesirable instinctual behavior.

No catch or Frisbee because that triggers pursuit behavior.
No tug of war because that triggers aggression. etc. etc.

These items are service dog training 101. Every trainer knows this. Hopefully this is not the play to which you were referring.

So what do you have left? Pretty boring play that is really training in disguise. You have the 'wait for it' game with their food. You have the tonail clipping game, to get them used to handling. You have the rub down game, to prep them for examination by blind people. You have the run around like a lunatic game that most puppies do (that is immediately stopped once unauthorized play starts). Then the 'game' pretty much turns into training. Even what toys you give them are very restrictive. No little animal toys, no tug ropes, etc. Just heavy plastic chew logs. Much of anything else genetically triggers.

I'm super skeptical of you raising service animals solo, from pup to final placement. This process usually takes numerous highly trained individuals with genetically managed superior dogs to accomplish. Not saying it is impossible, but just extremely difficult to do. If you do, are a a dog god and I have never witnessed anything like it. ...and I know a lot of amazing trainers.

With over 40 years of training behind me, many of them years of training guide dogs and service dogs, I certainly do know how to raise and train service dogs as well as dogs in many other fields of training. You are throwing out many statements that are incorrect and show how uninformed you are about service dogs and their training.

Service dogs ARE trained to "tug". They are taught to grab onto specially made handles that can be placed onto doorknobs and/or tug ropes that are placed onto door knobs and drawer handles. They are taught to tug to open drawers, doors, gates and other things on command that a person may not have the strength or ability to grasp.
Playing catch/fetch allows the dog to learn the picking up of items dropped on the floor, return to the persons front, hold the item until told to release, returning it to the handlers hand or lap.
Trainers know how to get dogs to react and respond in favorable ways during training and discourage responses that are innapropriate. Service dogs are not robots , they are dogs that are trained to serve a purpose. They are played with by the trainers and the people who they end up having been placed with. We want happy dogs, dogs that enoy life, and play time is integral to their training phases and success after being placed. They are allowed toys, bones and other things to stimulate them in the home as long as they are safe items just like any pet would enjoy.

 

[jaklgreen]

https://www.apnews.com/f29933c0a6f2...d-by-dog-during-boarding-for-Southwest-flight

Shouldn't that dog have been in a crate?

 

[joejccva71]

https://www.apnews.com/f29933c0a6f2...d-by-dog-during-boarding-for-Southwest-flight

Shouldn't that dog have been in a crate?

Yes, in fact the dog should have been left at home, with a friend or in a dog hotel. I just can't wrap my head around this "emotional support" dog thing. I have an idea. Instead of lugging your dog on an airplane where it may bite someone's ear off, how about just stopping at the little store in the airport and buying a chocolate bar. There. There is your "emotional support". Go indulge.

I just.....I can't.

 

[Captain Barbossa]

I'm contemplating on bringing my "emotional support therapy" lynx on our next WDW trip.

His name is Patches. Isn't he cute?

 

[Whippet Mom]

You're kidding me right? Somebody has that dog insured, it may not be you, but it is insured. It is a high dollar asset. Only people with very bad judgment (or that are self insured, i.e. rich) acquire high dollar assets and then don't insure.

You are wrong..