Resort Parking Charges

[monothingie]

Agreed. It's like McDonald's all of a sudden charging for ketchup.

They do in some locations in Europe...

They charge $.25 for each additional sauce above 2 unless you’ve ordered multiple mcnuggets. $.50 for Szechuan sauce.

 

[flynnibus]

I don't interpret it that way at all. He's been pretty consistent in saying you should spend within your means.

That's a different subject entirely. If you have tens of millions... burning $100 bills is still 'spending within your means' - you can afford to treat money like toilet paper. But just because someone has tens of millions doesn't mean they can't respect that $100.. or that someone does. Being money conscious or not is not directly coupled to your spending ability, or diligence to adhering to it. It's a different topic entirely... and someone here projects that worrying over $20 is beneath you if you have plenty to spend.. and if you don't, well maybe you don't have the money to spend (wrong). That's because his value system is broken and his assumptions and what he values are driven by the idea that money is the end game.

Every "on property non-Disney hotel" does it

This argument is the equivalent of you kid saying "... but everyone was doing it" when getting busted for breaking their parent's rules. "Safety is numbers" is not a moral or ethical vision statement.

I mean, think about it... you are taking examples of behavior NO ONE LIKES... and then saying "you know what... we should do that too" and justify the decision to your customers with "well its not just me...".

 

[monothingie]

This argument is the equivalent of you kid saying "... but everyone was doing it" when getting busted for breaking their parent's rules. "Safety is numbers" is not a moral or ethical vision statement.

I mean, think about it... you are taking examples of behavior NO ONE LIKES... and then saying "you know what... we should do that too" and justify the decision to your customers with "well its not just me...".

Allow me to translate, it’s pronounced “Adopting standard industry practices”.

 

[flynnibus]

Allow me to translate, it’s pronounced “Adopting standard industry practices”.

None of which means "You should be happy to accept it"

See... Reducing Leg Room (airlines), Breaking out traditional costs as stand-alone "fees" and charging more (cable company), shrinking packaging while charging the same price (package goods)... boosting interest rates for 1 late payment (credit cards)...

They all are 'industry practices'... that doesn't mean they are desirable nor that consumers should embrace them as 'just the way it is'. They can still voice their displeasure, and speak with their wallets... when someone decides "standard industry practices" aren't good enough.

You don't build brand champions with corporate vision statements like "we aim to charge anything we can get away with"

 

[eliza61nyc]

That's a different subject entirely. If you have tens of millions... burning $100 bills is still 'spending within your means' - you can afford to treat money like toilet paper. But just because someone has tens of millions doesn't mean they can't respect that $100.. or that someone does. Being money conscious or not is not directly coupled to your spending ability, or diligence to adhering to it. It's a different topic entirely... and someone here projects that worrying over $20 is beneath you if you have plenty to spend.. and if you don't, well maybe you don't have the money to spend. That's because his value system is broken and his assumptions and what he values are driven by the idea that money is the end game.



This argument is the equivalent of you kid saying "... but everyone was doing it" when getting busted for breaking their parent's rules. "Safety is numbers" is not a moral or ethical vision statement.

I mean, think about it... you are taking examples of behavior NO ONE LIKES... and then saying "you know what... we should do that too" and justify the decision to your customers with "well its not just me...".

But in reality that's exactly what businesses do. I think the disconnect is that you guys have some vision of Disney as some benevolent company still under Walt's influence. It is not. One airline started charging seating fees, now 99% of them do so, ATM fees started with one bank and now they are ubiquitous. Whatever Disney's legacy WAS, it is NOW a fortune 100 international company.
I too feel that resort fees will definitely be there especially in the deluxes

 

[monothingie]

None of which means "You should be happy to accept it"

See... Reducing Leg Room (airlines), Breaking out traditional costs as stand-alone "fees" and charging more (cable company), shrinking packaging while charging the same price (package goods)... boosting interest rates for 1 late payment (credit cards)...

They all are 'industry practices'... that doesn't mean they are desirable nor that consumers should embrace them as 'just the way it is'. They can still voice their displeasure, and speak with their wallets... when someone decides "standard industry practices" aren't good enough.

Didn’t say I like it, but it’s the way they can internally justify it. Unfortunatly we haven’t hit the tipping point were people are canceling their vacations because of it. However the blood loss from the thou$and$ of little pin pricks is starting add up.

 

[monothingie]

You don't build brand champions with corporate vision statements like "we aim to charge anything we can get away with"

Don’t tell Apple that.

 

["El Gran Magnifico"]

I mean, think about it... you are taking examples of behavior NO ONE LIKES... and then saying "you know what... we should do that too" and justify the decision to your customers with "well its not just me...".

That's exactly what Disney is doing. So is the Four Seasons, Hilton and Waldorf Bonnet Creek, Wyndham, the hotels on Hotel Plaza Blvd, The Gaylord, The Hyatt Regency, Hilton Orlando, all the Uni resorts, hotels in Miami, Dallas, LA, Vegas, NYC, Atlanta on and on an on.

NO ONE LIKES paying a parking fee staying in Buckhead either...but guess what? The point is...that the parking fee is here. Would it make you feel any better if Disney came out and said: "We implemented the fee - just because we wanted to"?

Generally, no one likes paying parking fees - fees for parking meters, airport parking, cruise ship parking, parking for concerts, parking for sporting events, parking for the opera, parking for the theater, parking in a parking garage, parking downtown, parking uptown, - when you think of the amount of fees that are charged for parking...its mind-blowing. Yet, you want to single out Disney?

There are many behaviors a company is complicit in that alienate the general public (or the ones that buy the product). Once upon a time (2008) American Airlines initiated the first charge for checked baggage....then.....United said "you know what...we should do that too". Now it's accepted behavior. This entire industry is a copycat industry. Disney just wants their piece of the pie.

Think about this. If the hotel industry began adopting extra charges for 3rd and 4th guests in a room (as a whole...some hotels do do this today and it is common practice on cruise ships) - once it became an accepted practice at the hotel level - how long before you think Disney would want in on that?

 

[eliza61nyc]

None of which means "You should be happy to accept it"

See... Reducing Leg Room (airlines), Breaking out traditional costs as stand-alone "fees" and charging more (cable company), shrinking packaging while charging the same price (package goods)... boosting interest rates for 1 late payment (credit cards)...

They all are 'industry practices'... that doesn't mean they are desirable nor that consumers should embrace them as 'just the way it is'. They can still voice their displeasure, and speak with their wallets... when someone decides "standard industry practices" aren't good enough.

You don't build brand champions with corporate vision statements like "we aim to charge anything we can get away with"

None of which means "You should be happy to accept it"

See... Reducing Leg Room (airlines), Breaking out traditional costs as stand-alone "fees" and charging more (cable company), shrinking packaging while charging the same price (package goods)... boosting interest rates for 1 late payment (credit cards)...

They all are 'industry practices'... that doesn't mean they are desirable nor that consumers should embrace them as 'just the way it is'. They can still voice their displeasure, and speak with their wallets... when someone decides "standard industry practices" aren't good enough.

You don't build brand champions with corporate vision statements like "we aim to charge anything we can get away with"

but that's the rub, outside of a few exceptions all the criticizers here still give the mouse world lots of money and when we ask why, it's well we still have a good time. oh, ok. lol. Now some folks believe that writing wdw customer service helps. I'm not one of them. I think the cable company is waking up to that now. more and more folks are leaving comcast (especially in my next of the woods). it's just way to many options now to get entertainment to put up with their high cost and low service.. I've got the basic package just to keep wired.
Same with credit cards. raise my rates if you want, I'll simply close the account and open one elsewhere..
cell phone company's same story. now with so many low cost alternatives, and competition. it's easy for a dissatisfied customer to bounce.

so again when I say "don't go", it's not to be snarky or snide. IMO and my opinion only, you want Disney to change. effect the bottom line.

 

[Chef Mickey]

No, it's that he thinks watching your money means you are cheap... where all the kool kids flaunt their money and brag about how much they spend. He's reading this with Siri on his iphoneX in his BMW right now...

In no way do I think watching your money means you’re cheap. I’ll put my financial acumen up against anyone. I actually watch my money like a hawk. A huge part of my life is money. It’s what I do. I’m highly interested in getting the best deal possible in all of the boring things. Food, Electricity, insurance, appliances, financial products, etc. People waste ungodly amounts of money, particularly in my field (finance). But when I play, I play really hard whether it’s vacation or discretionary things I buy. I still negotiate hard on cars and where I can.

You know that people think a 1% fee to manage their life savings is “reasonable” or even “nothing?” And they pay that person to underperform what they could have done themselves for nearly nothing?

You know how many people have 401ks and IRAs with mutual funds with 1% and more expense ratios that again underperform the market?

I watch my money, work hard, and invest/save my butt off to make sure I don’t have to get up and arms about a nominal fee at a place I truly love. The love is different than people I love but I love Disney. I’m not going to get upset about capitalism. Disney has built something amazing and if they want to charge for parking at their hotels, I see zero problem with it. That’s where I am on this. I have no problem with any good company making customers pay up for their proprietary stuff. That goes for Disney, Apple, a Microsoft, and other services that are flat out great.

My issue comes when companies charge customers for a product that is a commodity or trick ignorant people into paying too much for a crappy product.

Disney is worth it and they aren’t screwing people with the fees. They have built a product unlike any other. This isn’t AT&T doubling your customer charge or your local,electricity provider adding a penny to your kWh charge because they can. You can’t always live in the past and say this or that used to be free. Disney is making improvements all the time and sometimes you gotta pay for the best.

 

[Chef Mickey]

I don’t disagree with either of you...or even condemn it. But begging to be charged more is a textbook “economic napoleon” complex. Like driving an H3 circa 2004.

The thing about WDW Travelers - more than most places - is it brings out the “new money” tendencies In the customers. Many like to bring up that they’re paying...as if everyone else isn’t.

We know, big guy/gal...it doesn’t mean you have “arrived”

I wish I had a nickel for everytime somebody talked too loudly at a bar or acted like clowns in the grand Floridian - for example.

Act like you’ve been there before...if you have real wealth, you’d have learned not to act like a clown that sticks out.

That is a frequent occurrence with Disney customers and those that gravitate to these boards - sadly.

Here’s what my favorite coach says about it (first two lines):

The crowds are simply too large and the only way to change it will be to charge more. I don’t “want” to be charged more, but I know it’s about the only short term way to meaningfully reduce crowds that are getting out of control and impacted the Disney experience.

The parking fees I view as nominal, standard, and something I’m surprised was ever free in the first place. I think people are severely overreacting to fees for parking.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The crowds are simply too large and the only way to change it will be to charge more. I don’t “want” to be charged more, but I know it’s about the only short term way to meaningfully reduce crowds that are getting out of control and impacted the Disney experience.

The parking fees I view as nominal, standard, and something I’m surprised was ever free in the first place. I think people are severely overreacting to fees for parking.

Charging more has not deterred crowds...and if it does, they will make efforts to increase them even at reduced margins.

Smaller crowds doesn’t mesh with the strategic realities playing out. It is what it is. Disney parks require masses to produce profit...and they need to produce more profits

 

[flynnibus]

But in reality that's exactly what businesses do. I think the disconnect is that you guys have some vision of Disney as some benevolent company still under Walt's influence. It is not. One airline started charging seating fees, now 99% of them do so, ATM fees started with one bank and now they are ubiquitous. Whatever Disney's legacy WAS, it is NOW a fortune 100 international company.
I too feel that resort fees will definitely be there especially in the deluxes

I mean.. if you want Disney to just become a has been... sure... keep acting like this is Ok and we'll just roll with it.

The people who think you build brands or your future on spreadsheets are happy to keep obliging you.

 

[flynnibus]

Don’t tell Apple that.

No, apple is very different. Apple sets a vision... and sets a price they feel they can get for it... A 'price of admission' so to speak.

They don't set their product strategy based on slipping behind someone else's price point.

 

[eliza61nyc]

I mean.. if you want Disney to just become a has been... sure... keep acting like this is Ok and we'll just roll with it.

View attachment 295551

The people who think you build brands or your future on spreadsheets are happy to keep obliging you.

Not at all, I've been pretty consistent. I have no emotional loyalty to wdw at all, the nanosecond I feel the value is not there anymore is the nanosecond I stop going.
I have absolutely no intention of paying the parking fees. I know you don't build brands on spreadsheets but I also know the quickest way to get results is to withhold the moola.
I've gotten better service and quality with every single company I've threaten to take my business away. From my cable company, to my satellite radio provider, lawn care service, home security provider, and the bank that has my mortgage (PNC) every last one of them when I called and threaten to take my business elsewhere.

I am by no means saying just accept everything but imo if all you do is complain while still supporting a business, you are ing in the wind. When I complain, I act AND THAT gets results.

I think if the mouseworld still had some of the old guys who were interested in the parks still around, the letters and comments to customer service may have a fighting chance. Now in the environment companies are operating under. it's about money.

 

[flynnibus]

when you think of the amount of fees that are charged for parking...its mind-blowing. Yet, you want to single out Disney?

Yes, because Disney isn't (wasn't) like the rest of the pack.. and that's why Disney was on its own. I'm singling out the attitude that says "its ok, because its average" or "its ok, because its just how business is". Those are not the mindsets that keep Disney where it was.

Think about this. If the hotel industry began adopting extra charges for 3rd and 4th guests in a room (as a whole...some hotels do do this today and it is common practice on cruise ships) - once it became an accepted practice at the hotel level - how long before you think Disney would want in on that?

Hate to break it to you.. but they already do that (for adults over double occupancy).

 

[flynnibus]

Same with credit cards. raise my rates if you want, I'll simply close the account and open one elsewhere..
cell phone company's same story. now with so many low cost alternatives, and competition. it's easy for a dissatisfied customer to bounce.

so again when I say "don't go", it's not to be snarky or snide. IMO and my opinion only, you want Disney to change. effect the bottom line.

That is the correct approach - let them know your dissatisfaction. Yet others advocate you should just accept it as "the norm" because... well they weren't the only ones looking to screw you.

When after 25 years Discover of loyalty, Discover Card wanted to act like I had no history... I immediately kicked them to the curb. I would not accept their behavior even tho it was 'typical' of the industry - so I spoke with my wallet... not just rolled over and said "darn... I guess its what everyone does now". I went to another provider that had better customer service.

"Typical" does not mean you must accept it as the right choice you will support. That's the point I am countering.

 

[eliza61nyc]

That is the correct approach - let them know your dissatisfaction. Yet others advocate you should just accept it as "the norm" because... well they weren't the only ones looking to screw you.

When after 25 years Discover of loyalty, Discover Card wanted to act like I had no history... I immediately kicked them to the curb. I would not accept their behavior even tho it was 'typical' of the industry - so I spoke with my wallet... not just rolled over and said "darn... I guess its what everyone does now". I went to another provider that had better customer service.

"Typical" does not mean you must accept it as the right choice you will support. That's the point I am countering.

Absolutely!! ok, I'm with ya.

 

[Chef Mickey]

That is the correct approach - let them know your dissatisfaction. Yet others advocate you should just accept it as "the norm" because... well they weren't the only ones looking to screw you.

When after 25 years Discover of loyalty, Discover Card wanted to act like I had no history... I immediately kicked them to the curb. I would not accept their behavior even tho it was 'typical' of the industry - so I spoke with my wallet... not just rolled over and said "darn... I guess its what everyone does now". I went to another provider that had better customer service.

"Typical" does not mean you must accept it as the right choice you will support. That's the point I am countering.

I don’t think anyone is NOT advocating voting with your wallet. You should. I just don’t think this even approaches onerous enough to kick Disney to the curb, and most will agree. That’s why the fee isn’t going away.

Even without considering the industry, free parking isn’t something I’d expect at a top destinstion and if you asked me, I’d tell you they always charged for it. Doesn’t change the Disney brand at all.

We are nearing the end here though. I hope you can still enjoy Disney and not give up over something this minor.

 

[Chef Mickey]

Charging more has not deterred crowds...and if it does, they will make efforts to increase them even at reduced margins.

Smaller crowds doesn’t mess with the strategic realities playing out. It is what it is. Disney parks require masses to produce profit...and they need to produce more profits

That’s true, and it’s only because they haven’t increased prices enough to make it effective and/or price increases have had some effect because demand would probably be even higher with older pricing models.

I predicted demand based pricing and perhaps more of that would deter some of the insane crowds. I would support increasing ticket prices by 50% or even more. I hate it, but the failure to expand meaningfully created the problem. I just hope they see it as a problem.

Frankly, I’m surprised people complain about parking fees at all. They should be complaining about the crowds. That is a WAY bigger and far more unavoidable problem. At least with fees, you decide to pay or not and move on. The crowds are just in your face all the time and the only thing I believe can ruin a Disney experience.