Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Park hop expansion is thoroughly unnecessary
Boy…they know how to kill a dime for labor, don’t they?
Boy…they know how to kill a dime for labor, don’t they?
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Reservation expansion
- Thread starter ChuckFromCanada
- Start date
SteveAZee
Premium Member
LOL, most of my career I've been an engineer or technology adjacent, so I like to know how things work and I like to plan ahead, including vacations.Sorry I misread your intent then. I do actually think the early 2000s were pretty good as well. And I know Disney has my data. I'm in IT, so I know everyone does LOL. I wasn't a fan of FP+ at all but we are not planners too much. I started disliking when the whole pre-plan vacations and dining plan made it hard to get good lunches.
I understand what you are saying though. I just think Disney is using some things as excuses and crutches even though I don't like it. Sometimes I think I should've said how much I dislike park reservations when I met Josh D'Amaro last month. Probably would've fallen on deaf ears. But we were having a great day in MK so probably affected my mood
That said, in the moment I'm perfectly happy doing a 180 if something pops up that's better. Some of my favorite moments, both inside and outside of the bubble, have been spontaneous. I just like knowing I have options.Yeah, 2000's were pretty decent too.
I've been trying to come up with a model or example from history that's similar to what Disney is doing with the parks to get some idea of how this will pan out. Essentially, companies that milk their niche market dry. A few come to mind, but there are as many winners as losers. I've been in a company with multiple divisions where the 'cash cow' is milked dry to fund the growth opportunities... kind of like milking the parks to (indirectly) fund Disney+.
My own personal goal is to find ways to get the most out of visiting WDW while spending as little as possible. Not sure if I'm the problem or the solution.
SteveAZee
Premium Member
We're similar... resale DVC and plans for meals at 'home' and approaching the vacation time as 'staying at a really nice resort that happens to be adjacent to some fun parks to spend some time in'.Lol we actually bought resale DVC to hedge our bet of the WDW experience. Bought enough points to comfortably use every other year.
If parks are going well we can transfer in points to make yearly trips. If cash offers like free food seem better, we can still take advantage on off years, or bank our points, or rent out, etc. If costs outpace value, we can adjust our usage to under $200/night BWV rooms to help keep our budget commensurate with experience. If UO starts looking more attractive for a few years, we rent out our points and apply to OU budget.
We know we love WDW. But some of our confidence is gone. It’s become more common for us to regret spending at WDW. That never used to happen whether it was merch, hard tickets, a meal, or whatever. One reasons I was happy seeing FP go was they gave them out like candy to appease disgruntled guests. I don’t like that direction they went. Felt like they’d see what they could get away with cost/value wise and those who it negatively affected need to complain when unsatisfied? I’d rather be more thoughtful where my WDW money goes and not show up on the GS line. So we bought DVC
yensidtlaw1969
Well-Known Member
What I really want to know is why attendance has gone up so much in that time. Disney's been underbuilding, prices have been rising, guest satisfaction has been falling . . . and yet somehow more people than ever seem to want to visit the resort.
Aside from all the problems that can and will come with that (as well as the ones that are already presenting themselves), I really can't help but wonder what it is that's causing this. How are 10,000 more people a day visiting the Magic Kingdom now when 10 years ago it was absolutely a better (and generally more viable) deal? What's happening nowadays that wasn't happening then?
Vacationeer
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
Same here in that it almost feels like defensive spending. If they’re going to keep inflating what it costs to have that really fun trip, then Ill double up efforts to choose the most worthwhile spending.
Paid Park Pass Park Hopper? Could it get any more confusing?
What the heck is WDW doing???????????????????????????????????????? There are now (credible) rumors that WDW is going to sell Park Pass Park Hopper reservations......................Rumor is that you will be required to have a second park pass for the park you want to hop to and that WDW might...
UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
This is also why EPCOT was such a phenomenal park in the 1990s, and why even with the new additions it's still behind in overall capacity from what it was at its height.
That park was not only full of attractions that lasted 10-15 minutes (or longer) -- which are better for capacity than a 2 minute ride -- but also had pavilions full of other activities and shows. They've mainly been replaced with shorter attractions and fewer additional activities.
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UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
I think it's mostly what I said above -- simple population increases. There really aren't significantly more people going, once you factor in how many more people live in the US (and world) now. If attendance wasn't increasing, then it would essentially be decreasing as population grows.
Also, 10 years ago was a recession, so travel was depressed.
Jrb1979
Well-Known Member
That and I would add that for many it's all they know. They know their local park and Disney.
Vacationeer
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
Part of it is consumers putting greater value on experiences over goods.
Tha Realest
Well-Known Member
From WDW's perspective I think they need to keep adding to the inventory, for the same reason that Ponzi scheme orchestrators need to keep adding more "investors"
yensidtlaw1969
Well-Known Member
But to the tune of 10,000 more people a day at MK? The culture hasn't changed that severely.
The problem. If you're not there, and enough people like you are not there, then Disney has a customer acquisition problem. This is a hard problem, and short-term fixes only take them so far. If you are there, just not spending, then Disney has a revenue extraction problem. This is a comparatively simple problem. They just need to remove more opportunities for you *not* to spend money.
They'd far rather have the adversarial relationship, because then you're already at the table. They just need to figure out what levers move you.
Unfortunately Disney seem blind to the corrosiveness of this relationship, and as we bumble our way into a recession, they're likely going to misread the warning signs that their brand is badly tarnished as just softer attendance/spend due to prevailing economic headwinds.
Jeff4272
Well-Known Member
tyPaid Park Pass Park Hopper? Could it get any more confusing?
What the heck is WDW doing???????????????????????????????????????? There are now (credible) rumors that WDW is going to sell Park Pass Park Hopper reservations......................Rumor is that you will be required to have a second park pass for the park you want to hop to and that WDW might...forums.wdwmagic.com
I think it has. Millennials as a generation, due to a number of factors don't seem to collect things, especially not expensive things, as much as gen-x and prior. The jury I believe is still very much out on whether that is a long-term shift or a just a quirk of a restless generation. You can see signs of it all over though: from the decline of traditional middle-class luxury companies such as china/crystal manufacturers, to an ever shifting shape and variety of even banal things like the snickers bars in the checkout line.
ETA: that's not to say it's a wholesale change, but it's certainly a change and companies are reacting, or being forced to react. Disney is not impervious.
Jeff4272
Well-Known Member
I think youre wrong on this one........I think they are going to sell pre 2pm park hopper park passes
Jeff4272
Well-Known Member
Please expand on this
crazy4disney
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
I think the recession which brought in many deals got people hooked again and then you have people like myself in that age group having kids and doing what they did now as a parent instead of a child... dont discount social media either and the FOMO effect.. little bit of everything adds up... also after 9/11 i think #s probably dipped low as well as people were afraid to travel
SteveAZee
Premium Member
There's some irony in this... having bought DVC resale (so nearly nothing gained by Disney in that transaction), parking fees baked into the contract (so no money there), but doing things like canceling DME so more people renting cars, making it much easier to go shopping and stock up on food and liquor, or buy souvenirs outside the bubble, or drive (and park free) to each park. Making the prices higher on food and beverage means we'll more likely bring snacks and beverages with us, or plan our meals back at the room. Perhaps only buy a four day ticket and spend the rest of the week at Universal.
Perhaps I'm part of the solution to lowering food and beverage prices, at the least, if you're right about them working the levers. If they want me to buy from them, they'll need to make it worthwhile.
Jeff4272
Well-Known Member
Genie+ is worse, but park pass a close 2nd