Apparently so.
-
Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.
News Park attendance showing significant softness heading into the Fall 2018
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
A hard question to answer...
1. The dynamics change as they tinker with all the moving pieces...tough to get a “baseline”...
2. That data is heavily mined and manipulated...nobody really know what they collect and what they fence for angles
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
I’ll try to say this without judging (it’s tough)
But the strategy seems to be twofold:
1. Maximum price/assault on the one and dones. That justifies raising the prices to the point where you actively drive them away.
2. This “luxury” nonsense with the lifers...a class system essentially. Where in the last they specifically avoided that...now it’s the protocol.
4 club 33s? If that’s not telling - it should be.
But it’s the same old stuff -decades old amusement parks paid for that require tens of millions of annual visitors for the gates to stay open.
Again...I’m guessing about strategy now. I’m not guessing in the past. The two don’t correlate very well.
MickeyMinnieMom
Well-Known Member
Guess our family is lucky... no diminished satisfaction here! I'd kill to see aggregated Disney survey data... well, not literally... probably...
Kman101
Well-Known Member
Agreed...
A lot of that is the locals...can you stop mobbing the food and wine festival please? Or the Halloween parties?
But the vloggers have to go once a week don't you know?
Kman101
Well-Known Member
There's no way long time returning visitors can't see a decline. Eventually the first timers will too. What happens when the vloggers and lifestylers who promote Disney decide it's too expensive? I'm already seeing some talking more and more about pricing for things. It's slowly starting to happen. I just wish it were happening faster and more people were pushing back on them instead of promoting cupcakes and the upcharge events.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Dak is the largest WDW park constructed...studios is by far the smallest...I think it’s around 1/3rd the size of the other three.
It’s been an uncomfortable mess many days since the attendance went over the 9 mil annual number with hardly anything there...
Now it will be under IP crunch with not much more net.
That’s why I’m thinking low ceiling...lack of physical space.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Guess our family is lucky... no diminished satisfaction here! I'd kill to see aggregated Disney survey data... well, not literally... probably...
I’ve only seen that kind of progressive take once before:
pax_65
Well-Known Member
We used to just pay the bill for the trip and then put that out of our mind and just enjoy the experience. If you can still do that, you might be able to enjoy your vacation as much as you ever did... depending on how long the lines are and how short the hours are, unless your bill included some upcharge events to give you shorter lines and longer hours...
My problem is that after literally dozens of trips over the past 3 decades, I started saying "Holy crap, prices have gone up a lot" and then I started taking a hard look at what I was getting for that money and what I could get for that money at other vacation destinations. Disney is still a unique experience so it's difficult to compare it but still...
All that said we still enjoy our Disney vacations (that we take less frequently) but I don't believe I'm getting the quality and value for my vacation dollar that Disney used to offer.
geekza
Well-Known Member
I think you make very good points. The Disney Company under Iger has been on a spending spree when it comes to IP. Since the parks (at least domestically) have been a reliable source of income throughout their history, the goal now seems to be to find any way possible to increase their monetization. They are consistently adding in upcharge events, raising ticket prices, and hawking overpriced status items (Dooney and Bourke, anyone?) in an effort to extract as much money from guests as they can. All the while, they've been steadily eroding guest service and show quality. They have done it in such a slow, methodical way, though, that the younger visitors who have no firsthand knowledge about WDW's past not only accept the current situation as the status quo, but often dismiss long-time visitors to the parks as simply living in the past and hating change. This is exactly what the current Disney wants.
With that said, it's an untenable situation in the long run. There is a limit where even those who are okay with the way things are now will refuse to cross if they finally feel like they aren't getting a return on their investment. By that time, the older fans will have stopped going as well and, let's face it, current Disney parks still rely a lot on nostalgic persons who are repeat visitors. The middle class has shrunk considerably and those without a lot of money far outnumber those with heaps of disposable income. Disney Parks succeeded initially in part because they were accessible to the general populace. An average, middle class family could go to DL or WDW and not break the bank. Of course, nobody went several times a year like they do now unless they lived close to the park. Now, though, the average family can't afford to even go once every 2-3 years. I have nothing against those who can afford to hop down to WDW several times a year. They have to realize, though, that they are not representative of the majority of people in this country and are very lucky to have that kind of money. I truly have the feeling that my trip in November will be my last because, firstly, I'm not rich and never will be and, secondly, the quality just isn't there any longer. I hope I'm wrong, but I suspect I won't be.
dizneeboy
Active Member
That's a weird system glitch when there is no availability it will show the annual avg price for each resort. If you click on any of them, it says no availability and to check other dates. Not attempting to be argumentative for no reason. I actually called in and booked the boardwalk and the cast member confirmed my findings.
BernardandBianca
Well-Known Member
They used to give us a little bag of some kind of chocolate bark type stuff. It was very good.
I guess if they're "only" doing little cards now, I can make a "Disney has lost the magic" thread next time.
Sorry to bust your bubble, but they gave us both the chocolate bark and the card yesterday. Unfortunately, it was so hot that the chocolate melted before we were hungry enough to eat it, but it's in the fridge becoming reconstituted.
eddie104
Well-Known Member
I will say people hoping Disney prices come down need to face the facts. They have continually raised prices since way back in the 80s year after year. The demand for the experience has risen dramatically since than.
Unfortunately for some families WDW and the other parks have definitely shifted their focus on capitalizing on every single thing they can to make the most money. Will their be a ceiling for them to hit before people say enough is enough ? I really don’t know considering people are still coming.
Unfortunately for some families WDW and the other parks have definitely shifted their focus on capitalizing on every single thing they can to make the most money. Will their be a ceiling for them to hit before people say enough is enough ? I really don’t know considering people are still coming.
MickeyMinnieMom
Well-Known Member
That’s it. Lodging a complaint right now!
winstongator
Well-Known Member
7 of the 19 park days I did my last year as an AP (Feb 2017-Feb 2018) were at HS. At no point did I feel it an uncomfortable mess. That's pre-TSL, and around 10.8M annual attendance. Daily attendance at HS is around 30k. Consider each rider on the new SWGE attractions to take an hour. At 1500/hr capacity (estimate), that's 3000 people at SWGE. Say half that at TSL (SDD + A.S.S combined capacities are around 2000/hr.). Say runaway railway is 1500/hr. And the rising tide of SWGE raising all DHS attractions, and another 1500 guests (20 min queue increase across the board for the attractions that were open our last visit gets 650, so maybe a little high estimate). You'll have the Cars show as well. When those crowds hit, it will then be uncomfortably full. However, I think the park pretty easily absorbs a 10% increase to around 12M. I'd put a reasonable estimate for DHS attendance in 2020 at 12.5M, and most people will say it was packed. I'd bet a beer on both of those projections.
Now AK our last visit? Feb 11. Touringplans predicted a 7, was a 10, and that was a hot mess (unseasonably hot for mid Feb, even in FL).
WondersOfLife
Blink, blink. Breathe, breathe. Day in, day out.
Disney's site has a terrible habit of making you immedately search specifically for a "deal." You gotta click on any hotel, change the offer to "room only," and then do a full search again.
Here's another data point:
It's freaking hot right now in Orlando. Has been for a while. Instead of average 80 degrees, every day is over 90. And it will continue that way next week.
So, yes, there may be long term and deep signs that attendance is flagging, such as with reduced hotel reservation, but there's also been:
1. It used to be this time of year was always 'dead.'
2. Florence cut off the Eastern Seaboard from driving to Orlando for two weeks.
3. The flipping heat is surely suppressing locals with APs waiting for nicer weather to pop in.
It's freaking hot right now in Orlando. Has been for a while. Instead of average 80 degrees, every day is over 90. And it will continue that way next week.
So, yes, there may be long term and deep signs that attendance is flagging, such as with reduced hotel reservation, but there's also been:
1. It used to be this time of year was always 'dead.'
2. Florence cut off the Eastern Seaboard from driving to Orlando for two weeks.
3. The flipping heat is surely suppressing locals with APs waiting for nicer weather to pop in.
I think folks from Louisiana made up the difference... I can't remember exactly how many times I gave a "Geaux Tigers" to people in purple and gold.
JoeCamel
Well-Known Member
I think it is the advance bookings that are causing the concern not if joe local finds it too hot to go outside.