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Opinion: Toy Story Land's grand opening will be a disaster

Angel Ariel

Well-Known Member
Or until they are old enough to remember the trip, like 6 or 7.
WHy does the child have to remember it for the trip to be worthwhile? I can understand if it's a once in a lifetime trip, but if it isn't a one and done trip, then why does it matter?

(and FTR, DD does currently remember the trip she took to Disneyland at 3 y/o. She may not retain those memories as she gets older, but that doesn't negate that she does remember them now).
 

TwilightZone

Well-Known Member
If Snow White’s Scary Adventures came out tomorrow, folks would bash it.

If it came back tomorrow, there would be so much oohing and ahhing.
I think that ride is unintentionally hilarious, both versions end very abruptly.
Maybe if it came out tomorrow, maybe that would have been the new crowd for the ride.
DSC_4434.jpg
 

DreamalittleDisney

Well-Known Member
I’ve got pics of my kids standing (or being held) in front of the wilderness lodge Mickey totem pole every year from the ages of 8 weeks through now. They’re 12 and 10 respectively. I wouldn’t trade those memories and photos for anything.
It’s hard to tell but this is a mosaic of my family made up of about 10000 of those memories from 5 years ago. It’s hanging on our wall and if you get close enough you can see what each of those photos are.
View attachment 283494
This is amazing !
 

Damon7777

Well-Known Member
Star Wars in Animal Kingdom? I can't figure out what that means. Are you just referring to Pandora sarcastically as Star Wars or do you mean that there is some actual Star Wars stuff in Animal Kingdom? Sorry if I'm missing the hyperbole or the sarcasm on that one.

Neither sarcasm nor hyperbole but straight up undeniable fact.

There are Yoda's and Wookies in Dinoland USA........for sale of course. That is just a tiny example of modern day Disney being abysmal compared to the older days......thematic incongruence.
 

Damon7777

Well-Known Member
And also if I can challenge you on one thing. What's wrong with a Jamaican or Flint Michigan person (or two) working in the world showcase Pavilion?

There's that pesky thing about the modern day Disney overt thematic incongruence showing up again
 

eliza61nyc

Well-Known Member
Neither sarcasm nor hyperbole but straight up undeniable fact.

There are Yoda's and Wookies in Dinoland USA........for sale of course. That is just a tiny example of modern day Disney being abysmal compared to the older days......thematic incongruence.
There's that pesky thing about the modern day Disney overt thematic incongruence showing up again


lol, which absolutely no one and I mean no one except the few hundred uber fans here would even notice.

So not sure if I would call it abysmal or would I call you more obsessive compulsive. Most normal theme park visitors do not notice that a Yoda is being sold in dinoland therefore it has absolutely no bearing on their "happiness" or "good" time perception.

I couldn't tell you if my server in Chef de France was American, French or Klingon, I know the food was good and the service was excellent. So if I saw a West Indian working in England pavilion, I would simply assume she/he lives in England and I once had a Caucasian server at the China Pavilion. If you go to the American Pavilion gift shop, almost every thing sold is made in China. Does that incongruency make the trinket "bad" or make the pavilion abysmal? don't know, 40 years ago would this never happen?

Now once again we run into the issue of is this a slip in greatness that evidently once was Disney or simply providing a product to todays consumer.
 
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Damon7777

Well-Known Member
I'm sure if I go to the real Morocco I am bound to see a few non Moroccans. So having a similar experience at Epcot is not embarrassing disgusting or discouraging to m

Serious and real question:
If you went for a more authentic Chinese food(correct, I'm not talking Panad Express here) and the staff were native Colombian or from Sudan would you find that restaurant credible? I would not at face value, even though there is a chance that it could pump out some damn tasty offerings.
Goes to credibility/believability
 

MrConbon

Well-Known Member
Serious and real question:
If you went for a more authentic Chinese food(correct, I'm not talking Panad Express here) and the staff were native Colombian or from Sudan would you find that restaurant credible? I would not at face value, even though there is a chance that it could pump out some damn tasty offerings.
Goes to credibility/believability

What type of awful bigoted response is this? Yes, as long as they make good Chinese food you should care less.

You do realize that you aren’t actually in Morocco? You’re in a theme park in Florida. Why does Tomorrowland not have aliens working along with Pandora? Where are the native peoples of the Caribbean at Pirates?
 

DisneyDoctor

Well-Known Member
Serious and real question:
If you went for a more authentic Chinese food(correct, I'm not talking Panad Express here) and the staff were native Colombian or from Sudan would you find that restaurant credible? I would not at face value, even though there is a chance that it could pump out some damn tasty offerings.
Goes to credibility/believability

 

geekza

Well-Known Member
I think that those of you who are of the opinion that folks who defend Disney of the past are just old fogies and need to get with the times misunderstand why the majority of us feel the way we do. It has very little to do with individual attractions and more to do with the effort and creativity that went into attractions in the past that, in many cases, is absent from a lot (not all) of modern attractions.

Of course not all of the attractions from the "glory days" of DL or WDW were instant classics that should have never been improved or removed. Disneyland was in an almost constant state of flux while Walt was alive. You don't hear too many people pining for the return of the Conestoga Wagons or mule rides. The Flying Saucers in DL were terrible, by all accounts.

All I want is for modern Disney to create attractions with the idea of saying, "There may be a similar ride mechanism elsewhere, but we're Disney and we're going to do something with it to make the experience unlike anything else." Make experiences that are worth spending thousands of dollars and travelling from other parts of the world to enjoy.

Am I upset that the original mission of Epcot is being abandoned in the name of adding more thrill rides and incongruous IP? Absolutely. I'm well aware that time travel hasn't been invented yet and so it isn't possible for those of you who weren't able to visit EPCOT Center in it's heyday to have a frame of reference, but it's not fair to dismiss the opinions of those of us who were able to experience it simply because you enjoy today's WDW. I'm glad you enjoy it. I've never had a bad time at Disney. All I can do is offer my informed opinion comparing today's parks with yesterday's. After my upcoming trip, I will have visited WDW once in each decade of its operation (twice in the 80's). There were several years between each visit, so the changes stood out to me. Many were for the better, some detracted from what had come before.

I can't speak for everyone, but all I want is for Disney to always strive to be the best that it can be, because I've seen what is possible when they're firing on all cylinders and it's marvelous. Right now, I don't think they are. It doesn't mean that they won't ever again.
 

DisneyDoctor

Well-Known Member
Neither sarcasm nor hyperbole but straight up undeniable fact.

There are Yoda's and Wookies in Dinoland USA........for sale of course. That is just a tiny example of modern day Disney being abysmal compared to the older days......thematic incongruence.
So thematic incongruence and colored people in the "wrong" WS pavilion are the things keeping you up at night?
 

Tony the Tigger

Well-Known Member
lol, which absolutely no one and I mean no one except the few hundred uber fans here would even notice.

So not sure if I would call it abysmal or would I call you more obsessive compulsive. Most normal theme park visitors do not notice that a Yoda is being sold in dinoland therefore it has absolutely no bearing on their "happiness" or "good" time perception.

I couldn't tell you if my server in Chef de France was American, French or Klingon, I know the food was good and the service was excellent. So if I saw a West Indian working in England pavilion, I would simply assume she/he lives in England and I once had a Caucasian server at the China Pavilion. If you go to the American Pavilion gift shop, almost every thing sold is made in China. Does that incongruency make the trinket "bad" or make the pavilion abysmal? don't know, 40 years ago would this never happen?

Now once again we run into the issue of is this a slip in greatness that evidently once was Disney or simply providing a product to todays consumer.

Thank you for posting that before I did!
 

DisneyDoctor

Well-Known Member
I think that those of you who are of the opinion that folks who defend Disney of the past are just old fogies and need to get with the times misunderstand why the majority of us feel the way we do. It has very little to do with individual attractions and more to do with the effort and creativity that went into attractions in the past that, in many cases, is absent from a lot (not all) of modern attractions.

Of course not all of the attractions from the "glory days" of DL or WDW were instant classics that should have never been improved or removed. Disneyland was in an almost constant state of flux while Walt was alive. You don't hear too many people pining for the return of the Conestoga Wagons or mule rides. The Flying Saucers in DL were terrible, by all accounts.

All I want is for modern Disney to create attractions with the idea of saying, "There may be a similar ride mechanism elsewhere, but we're Disney and we're going to do something with it to make the experience unlike anything else." Make experiences that are worth spending thousands of dollars and travelling from other parts of the world to enjoy.

Am I upset that the original mission of Epcot is being abandoned in the name of adding more thrill rides and incongruous IP? Absolutely. I'm well aware that time travel hasn't been invented yet and so it isn't possible for those of you who weren't able to visit EPCOT Center in it's heyday to have a frame of reference, but it's not fair to dismiss the opinions of those of us who were able to experience it simply because you enjoy today's WDW. I'm glad you enjoy it. I've never had a bad time at Disney. All I can do is offer my informed opinion comparing today's parks with yesterday's. After my upcoming trip, I will have visited WDW once in each decade of its operation (twice in the 80's). There were several years between each visit, so the changes stood out to me. Many were for the better, some detracted from what had come before.

I can't speak for everyone, but all I want is for Disney to always strive to be the best that it can be, because I've seen what is possible when they're firing on all cylinders and it's marvelous. Right now, I don't think they are. It doesn't mean that they won't ever again.
The effort and creativity that has gone into newer attractions is undoubtedly higher than ever before. See FoP and 7DMT, two of the most recent rides added to WDW. The queues for these rides are attractions in themselves. Why would wait times always push 2 hours and beyond if these attractions weren't developed with the ultimate creativity and effort? They are amazing. Not to mention Star Wars is likely to have some major jaw-dropping theming (hopefully congruent so @Damon7777 can quit whining) and attractions.

I think people like you do need to get with the times, though. Children aren't as excited about the types of things that made kids excited in the 80s. While I would love to see Epcot return with it's original vision, it never will because that won't sell as much as a heavy IP presence will. Disney's ultimate goal is to get you in the parks and hopefully get you to come back each year. A water ride about plants and crops won't get the family of 5 who's children didn't grow up in the 80s excited and begging for a return trip.
 

geekza

Well-Known Member
The effort and creativity that has gone into newer attractions is undoubtedly higher than ever before. See FoP and 7DMT, two of the most recent rides added to WDW.
That's a pretty bold statement and one that doesn't hold up under scrutiny. While I agree that FoP seems to be a really well-made attraction for the most part, 7DMT is a disappointing sliver of what it could have been had it been given the budget it needed and followed the originally-designed layout. It only has long lines because it's still the newest attraction in the park.

As for what children are excited by, I think that you're making a broad assumption there. The only reason why Epcot isn't as interesting to kids these days is because the attractions were not updated with new information and technology. I can assure you that Future World would absolutely be entertaining to today's kids if it had kept up with its mission to show us both where we've come from and where the latest research and technologies are taking us in the future. The problem is that technology moves so fast that it would have cost Disney a lot of money to keep up with it. Corporate sponsorship was difficult to maintain and often came with a demand that attractions be completely revamped, sometimes damaging them in the process. Science, Technology, and History is anything but dull if presented in an entertaining way.
 

jimbojones

Well-Known Member
Yeah I love mr. toad (the California one, I wasn't around for the WDW version), but that ride is basically cardboard cutout-bots: the ride.
Along with 20k leagues it was my favorite ride as a kid, I rode the Disneyland version a couple years back as an adult and I while I liked it and am glad it is still around, it really made me aware of the power of nostalgia to make us view things in the past as better than they were. Admittedly I think Disneyland is the better park and partly because they do such a great job integrating the new with the old classics.
 

DisneyDoctor

Well-Known Member
That's a pretty bold statement and one that doesn't hold up under scrutiny. While I agree that FoP seems to be a really well-made attraction for the most part, 7DMT is a disappointing sliver of what it could have been had it been given the budget it needed and followed the originally-designed layout. It only has long lines because it's still the newest attraction in the park.

As for what children are excited by, I think that you're making a broad assumption there. The only reason why Epcot isn't as interesting to kids these days is because the attractions were not updated with new information and technology. I can assure you that Future World would absolutely be entertaining to today's kids if it had kept up with its mission to show us both where we've come from and where the latest research and technologies are taking us in the future. The problem is that technology moves so fast that it would have cost Disney a lot of money to keep up with it. Corporate sponsorship was difficult to maintain and often came with a demand that attractions be completely revamped, sometimes damaging them in the process. Science, Technology, and History is anything but dull if presented in an entertaining way.
7DMT will continue to have long wait times for years on end.

No broad assumptions about children and what excites them, either. When given the choice between going to an amusement park or a museum, the majority of children will choose the amusement park. Education and curiosity aren't as valued today as they once were. Do you see kids in the Norway pavilion reading about the rich Scandinavian culture, or screaming over Elsa and Anna?
 

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