One day Pirates of the Caribbean closure for refurbishment

JenniferS

JenniferS

When you're the leader, you don't have to follow.
ford91exploder said:
That's your problem, the CM needs to make their numbers and that's the only metric that counts. Unfortunately the parks are now run by the 'Sharp pencil boys' Walt warned about so numbers are the only thing that matter guest satisfaction is last on the list.
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Hubby is 6' 8", 265 lbs. When they tell us four to the row, he just says, "No".
Nobody has ever given him a hard time.
The CM's will absolutely make concessions to the numbers where warranted.
 
ford91exploder

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
Bairstow said:
Depends on the park-goer.

For Disney's preferred target audience of families with young kids, who have to take frequent breaks/naps/meals to let the kids burn off energy or rest or whatever, being able to virtually queue and/or have some set ride reservations really is a time-saver and a benefit.

For commando-style theme park "experts" who try to do 12-14 attractions per day, which I assume makes up a lot of the user base of this site, not only is FP+ not a big advantage, it actually increases their wait times by putting first-timers and families on a more level playing field.
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It also damages those with a more moderate touring style who don't decide on which park to attend months in advance in that it effectively locks out these people from many of the E-ticket attractions. Our touring style at WDW is more like a DL local.

Once again the FP system as currently implemented tends to benefit only the parents with toddler demographic to the detriment of every other visitor. Perhaps rename the MK 'Toddler Kingdom'...
 
Goofyernmost

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
BoarderPhreak said:
Yeah, seriously. For $2B - it would've been better spent on new, crowd-eating attractions than FP+.
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On the surface it seems like that doesn't it? However, if you think a little deeper the old IT system was pretty dated and regardless of what they called it, the newer system was required just to update the parks operating system to this century. The decision to do this wasn't connected in any way to attraction spending. It wasn't even in the same budget and it was needed. The problem is that many people used to the old ways and willing to fight this one tooth and nail, think that by working against it as much as possible will cause them to retract this and put everything back to how it was. Reclaim the money spent on it and build some new stuff with the savings.

I'm not sure what color the skies are in that world, but, it truly is different from the one I live in. My opinion is that people should just give it a rest and instead of being colossal PITA they should at least try and work with the system to help make it better. There is an old saying that is true to this day... "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem."
 
Incomudro

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
RSoxNo1 said:
Have you used the previous version?
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Yes I have.
Matter of fact, I had gotten quite good at it and had a system down!
I was very upset when FP+ failed to offer the Park hopper feature, and I believe it should offer Park hopper.
I was all prepared to find that FP+ would ruin the good thing I had going with the ticket dispensing Fast Pass method when I took last years trip.
I didn't find that to be the case at all, and much like Disney claimed - we had more relaxing time in the park because I no longer had to scramble like I used to.
 
space42

space42

Well-Known Member
Goofyernmost said:
On the surface it seems like that doesn't it? However, if you think a little deeper the old IT system was pretty dated and regardless of what they called it, the newer system was required just to update the parks operating system to this century. The decision to do this wasn't connected in any way to attraction spending. It wasn't even in the same budget and it was needed. The problem is that many people used to the old ways and willing to fight this one tooth and nail, think that by working against it as much as possible will cause them to retract this and put everything back to how it was. Reclaim the money spent on it and build some new stuff with the savings.

I'm not sure what color the skies are in that world, but, it truly is different from the one I live in. My opinion is that people should just give it a rest and instead of being colossal PITA they should at least try and work with the system to help make it better. There is an old saying that is true to this day... "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem."
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naaa - just waiting on WDW to build compelling attractions again. Seeing them dump ridiculous amounts of money on an IT project that no one really wanted just rubs salt in the wound. Then having an attractions like Pirates in the condition it is makes matters even worse. Don't even get me started with all the cutbacks, closed attractions, closed (or seasonal) eateries (while turning guests away), lackluster replacement attractions, stale entertainment, crumbling transportation infrastructure, etc - all while raising prices and reaping record profits.

My solution? Not give them any more of my money until I see a reason worthwhile to return. This is really sad for me as I have been visiting since 1973.
 
Goofyernmost

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
space42 said:
naaa - just waiting on WDW to build compelling attractions again. Seeing them dump ridiculous amounts of money on an IT project that no one really wanted just rubs salt in the wound. Then having an attractions like Pirates in the condition it is makes matters even worse. Don't even get me started with all the cutbacks, closed attractions, closed (or seasonal) eateries (while turning guests away), lackluster replacement attractions, stale entertainment, crumbling transportation infrastructure, etc - all while raising prices and reaping record profits.

My solution? Not give them any more of my money until I see a reason worthwhile to return. This is really sad for me as I have been visiting since 1973.
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That is the point I was making. Who are we to decide what they need or don't need. It has been established over and over that MM+ was mostly not for the guests directly, it was an operating system that Disney decided that was needed to continue to run it's business with updated technology. The little odds and ends, like magic bands, FP+ and whatever else that were included were just added things, not the focus.

It is an entire operating system, not just a FP dispenser. It is much bigger then just its parts. Your solution is indeed a viable one in the sense that you will feel that you are not contributing and it is a form of protest. Overall, it will not mean much unless thousands of people do the same thing. I don't see that happening. In the meantime, whether or not I think that they should be building more (I do btw) I do not want to deprive myself of the thing that I enjoy the most, because a few parts of it are not up to my expectations. I just feel that for my own lifetime enjoyment, I want to just accept the way things are, not live in the past and just take it for what it is now, not what it was once upon a time. When it gets to the point that I no longer enjoy my visits and that I no longer feel it is worth the expense, I will join you in our lonely protest knowing that there is a good chance that Disney will continue to thrive with or without us.
 
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JediMasterMatt

JediMasterMatt

Well-Known Member
Goofyernmost said:
My opinion is that people should just give it a rest and instead of being colossal PITA they should at least try and work with the system to help make it better. There is an old saying that is true to this day... "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem."
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Interesting point you make there re: being part of the solution and not the problem and one I would like to know how you plan on proceeding with.

I know that I've tried to assist WDW on several occasions now with improvement possibilities with MM+ and as of yet, I haven't received any response or indication that my feedback was being used for process improvement. Instead of regurgitating the details here, I'll simply link to them.

http://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/fp-meltdown-part-x.891964/page-15#post-6391583
&
http://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/fp-meltdown-part-x.891964/page-4#post-6384357

In addition, I've spent many minutes on property with Cast Members and team leads onsite trying to assist them with tangible feedback regarding the implementation of MM+ (examples include the very awkward placement of the RFID sensor in the box that was designed to insert room keys to control the gates when parking at the resorts to ways to improve flow for the DAC at rides and attractions now that FP+ is online).

The sorry truth is that nobody that we the guests interact with wants to hear this information because there is nothing they can do with it. They already know the systems short comings and the 800 pound gorilla in the room that is MM+ has become is simply too unwieldy and complex that even those that are directly responsible for the programming of it have no way of making changes efficiently or effectively. MM+ is proof of chaos theory running amok in a complex system. Far too much control of things that by their nature are not controllable is being attempted.

I still suggest keep trying to help WDW make improvements by providing feedback; but, the other unfortunate truth is that MM+ has become Too Big To Fail and valuable time, effort, money and other resources are going to be funneled towards it instead of the alternative that was rejected as the course of action when the concept was originally proposed - growth. Increasing the supply is the only tangible solution to the resorts issues of keeping up with demand. Attempting to increase profits/drive up capacity at "under utilized" rides/attractions/restaurants/gift shops/etc. will never work in the long term. Guests vote with their feet/wallets. If they don't want to experience "X" at the resort before MM+, trying to bait and switch them over to it because the ride/attraction/restaurant/resort they want is too busy or unavailable does nothing but frustrate them.

MM+ by its very nature is an effort to control guests behavior on an unprecedented level.
 
wdisney9000

wdisney9000

Truindenashendubapreser
Premium Member
Goofyernmost said:
On the surface it seems like that doesn't it? However, if you think a little deeper the old IT system was pretty dated and regardless of what they called it, the newer system was required just to update the parks operating system to this century.
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What about the old IT system was really upgraded though in terms of helping attractions, shows, or operations run more smoothly? I see more things that were added, not upgraded. Lets take a look.


1. They changed the turn styles at park entrance to the mickey heads. The turn styles were not "failing" and were actually quicker considering how long the lines can get due to magic band error, whether its human or computer error, it happens often. I don't see any upgrade there.

2. They added the mickey heads to FP+ entrance. Again, legacy FP was not failing and technically could not break down because it was a piece of paper and also made it more difficult to try and scam your way past a CM or act like you cant speak English and don't understand. Yes, making FP+ selection on phone is slightly more convenient but also adds room for error and you can see it when a FP+ line backs up, which again, happens often now. No real upgrade there in terms of the "old system" and it hasn't improved wait times.

3. Behind the scenes: I haven't seen any photos or read anything in regards to systems that operate attractions or shows being updated. If they did, they did a horrible job because attractions are still malfunctioning, POTC being one of them. Even the new rides like 7DMT have issues almost daily, so I ask, whats the benefit of the new IT in this aspect? They most likely just added the proper equipment for magic band tracking. Which is understandable, but that has nothing to do with the old system or proves that it was failing in any way. I would bet dollars to doughnuts that any and all attractions have the exact same operating systems and computers that they've had for years with the exception of anything added for FP+.

4. MDE. The only true upgrade to come out of the 2 $billion + investment. Lets say MDE cost appx $100 million (which seems on the high side) that leaves a lot of money left over. Where did it go? What IT has been improved?

WDW is parks and resorts so I would think a majority of the IT systems revolve around them. Resort reservation systems don't seem like they would cost millions to upgrade and Disney is constantly upgrading them anyway so that rules that out. That leaves the parks. So I ask again, what exactly was upgraded? Rides are not operating more efficiently, there are no vast improvements in operations or wait times and I haven't heard CM's raving about anything on their end becoming better. Heck, I still CM's using an old style clicker to count riders. Where did the money go?
 
ford91exploder

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
wdisney9000 said:
What about the old IT system was really upgraded though in terms of helping attractions, shows, or operations run more smoothly? I see more things that were added, not upgraded.

Heck, I still CM's using an old style clicker to count riders. Where did the money go?
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That's a really GOOD question, My guess this was like a Federal IT project lots of 3rd party consultants and little accountability or coordination I would bet much of it got wasted on 'retreats' and high level meetings meanwhile the code monkeys needed to fill out 12 pages of documentation for a replacement mouse or keyboard.
 
C

celluloid

Well-Known Member
ford91exploder said:
But then it would be UNI... (Ducks and runs)
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Yeah, but they would not spend that kind of money. They would just had sporadic strobe lighting to non moving figures. That would keep their TDO status.



Funny. Best the ride has looked in a lot of the recent rides I have ridden. Then again, the video only shows so much. Also, a lot of it just has to do with the movie tie ins being non active.
 
Goofyernmost

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
It's like the two best examples of the new animatronics were completely missed. The one right after the mayor scene and the one where Capt. Jack peeks up out of the barrel. Those two were working but panned away from almost immediately. Was that intentional or accidental?
 

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