News New security measures

ford91exploder

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
-em said:
I noticed today at DAK the metal detectors were being run by wdw security not a 'yellow shirt csc events or whatever they were shirt' visible...
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Good - Looks like Disney finally hit the number of complaints threshold with the CSC rent a goons and decided to run the detectors themselves.
 
ford91exploder

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
s8film40 said:
Well yes, I think the whole point of the criticism of doing this in a random fashion is that it doesn't create that deterrent. If I were looking to do something violent in a park and bring a gun in. I would simply hide it under my clothes. If I got "selected" I would simply decline and come back again. There's absolutely nothing Disney or OCSD can do at that point.

In an unrelated note, I went to Universal today and went through their security check for the first time since this started. At the time I went through the metal detectors were optional, I opted not to go through. I was kind of surprised though at how many people were opting to go through them.
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And yet Jedi robes are banned at Disney, Hogwarts robes are sold and encouraged at the park which must not be named, More evidence of a massive overreaction by some mid level bureaucrat trying to get noticed.
 
S

Stepmc

Member
I've been following this forum for awhile now, and I'm new to the board. I guess I'm in the minority in being really upset that Disney has implemented this policy. Aside from believing that random screening is utterly useless, I also am frightened by the creeping ubiquity of security theater. It doesn't make me feel better; if anything, it makes me profoundly uncomfortable. I personally like being treated as a guest, not a criminal, and I especially don't like my kids learning that this is normal just to go ride roller coasters and flying elephants.
That said, I have a couple of questions. I heard that everyone using the no bags entrance is being sent through a metal detector. Is that true? Also, I'd heard from people who had booked the VIP tours that you use a different entrance altogether. Do they use the same screening measures? I've thought for awhile that it might be a worthy investment at least once, all the more so if I could avoid subjecting my 10-year-old daughter to this feel good (for some) farce.

Finally, I was hoping this was a temporary measure for the holidays, but it seems it's still there and becoming more entrenched. I plan to write to tell Disney that I oppose the new measures and will rethink planning my next vacation there (we go every couple of years, always stay at one of the resorts on the monorail, and usually bring friends/extended family) as long as they are in place. I was wondering if others who share my feelings would do the same. Too often, I think we just quietly change our plans and don't express our concerns--outside of message boards-- while the "I'm so happy! Anything for security! I personally don't mind. It's the world we live in." crowd gets all the press. I hope others will join in and let your opinion be heard as well.

Sorry to be so long. Really interesting forum. I enjoy it.
 
G00fyDad

G00fyDad

Well-Known Member
Stepmc said:
I've been following this forum for awhile now, and I'm new to the board. I guess I'm in the minority in being really upset that Disney has implemented this policy. Aside from believing that random screening is utterly useless, I also am frightened by the creeping ubiquity of security theater. It doesn't make me feel better; if anything, it makes me profoundly uncomfortable. I personally like being treated as a guest, not a criminal, and I especially don't like my kids learning that this is normal just to go ride roller coasters and flying elephants.
That said, I have a couple of questions. I heard that everyone using the no bags entrance is being sent through a metal detector. Is that true? Also, I'd heard from people who had booked the VIP tours that you use a different entrance altogether. Do they use the same screening measures? I've thought for awhile that it might be a worthy investment at least once, all the more so if I could avoid subjecting my 10-year-old daughter to this feel good (for some) farce.

Finally, I was hoping this was a temporary measure for the holidays, but it seems it's still there and becoming more entrenched. I plan to write to tell Disney that I oppose the new measures and will rethink planning my next vacation there (we go every couple of years, always stay at one of the resorts on the monorail, and usually bring friends/extended family) as long as they are in place. I was wondering if others who share my feelings would do the same. Too often, I think we just quietly change our plans and don't express our concerns--outside of message boards-- while the "I'm so happy! Anything for security! I personally don't mind. It's the world we live in." crowd gets all the press. I hope others will join in and let your opinion be heard as well.

Sorry to be so long. Really interesting forum. I enjoy it.
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As I said before you can't have your cake and eat it too. Choose security with less privacy or more privacy and the threat of getting hurt or killed. Putting blinders on and saying that you want to keep your freedoms and your privacy while still staying safe is just plain silly.
 
EOD K9

EOD K9

Well-Known Member
G00fyDad said:
As I said before you can't have your cake and eat it too. Choose security with less privacy or more privacy and the threat of getting hurt or killed. Putting blinders on and saying that you want to keep your freedoms and your privacy while still staying safe is just plain silly.
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It is similar to those who refuse a pat down, don't want the magnetometer, or step through an x ray. So you tell me, how do you find a plastic explosive?
C-4 is an organic high order explosive. The Z-Backscatter x ray can pick it up (it is what you find at the airport. All organic material pops up in a different color shade). If it is secreted in a person's junkal area, and not checked by hand, it wont be found. It will not be found by the mag, but it can be picked up by a stand up walk in x ray. If there was a better way (other than K9) to find it, I'm sure it would be in use by now. Unfortunately, this is what we have to work with.
 
flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
G00fyDad said:
Except that Disney security has no real authority to detain you if you have done nothing wrong. Until you actually try to walk through the entrance with a weapon you have done nothing wrong
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The security screening is already behind the first entrance... the bag check area. You are funneled to bag check, then pass the security screeners, then get to the ticket entrance.

Try arguing to the judge that because you didn't go down the jetway at the airport, your gun at security screening was not against the rules.
 
G00fyDad

G00fyDad

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
The security screening is already behind the first entrance... the bag check area. You are funneled to bag check, then pass the security screeners, then get to the ticket entrance.

Try arguing to the judge that because you didn't go down the jetway at the airport, your gun at security screening was not against the rules.
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I understand your point. I haven't been to Disney since they started this silliness so I wasn't aware that you already had to pass an initial point to get to that area.
 
PhotoDave219

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
or.. Disney actually finished their procedures and training for their own staff. You really like to make conclusive statements that are based on such flimsy 'could be any number of things' facts.
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Last I heard, CSC would be here to stay *IF* the metal detectors are here for good.

We shall see.
 
S

Stepmc

Member
G00fyDad said:
As I said before you can't have your cake and eat it too. Choose security with less privacy or more privacy and the threat of getting hurt or killed. Putting blinders on and saying that you want to keep your freedoms and your privacy while still staying safe is just plain silly.
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I don't have blinders on. I just rationally recognize that the statistical threat of being the victim of a violent attack at a theme park is infinitesimally small and doesn't warrant turning a pleasant day at an amusement park into an experience akin to visiting someone in prison. I don't think it's Disney's job to "keep me safe." It's their job to entertain us. The world has risk. I accept it and live. Since the most dangerous thing you will probably ever do is get into a car and drive anywhere, what on earth were you so scared of at Disney World prior to December 18?
 
T

Thelazer

Well-Known Member
The problem here, is everyone is going "Oh it's the guns... " and these metal detector's are there to prevent that.

As others have said and if they haven't directly said it, I'll say it...

Anyone wishing to do harm, knows now what procedure is in place and what they are looking for, those looking
to do harm WILL easily switch to other tactics.... Therefore, whatever "might" happen, will most likely involve things that a metal detector would not pick up on, or will happen in an area that these detectors do not exist at (IE, a hotel, the TTC, etc)
 
s8film40

s8film40

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
The security screening is already behind the first entrance... the bag check area. You are funneled to bag check, then pass the security screeners, then get to the ticket entrance.

Try arguing to the judge that because you didn't go down the jetway at the airport, your gun at security screening was not against the rules.
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That's really not the best comparison attempting to take a gun on an airplane is a crime but taking a gun into a park is not. The simple fact is a judge isn't going to even hear this story. If someone refuses Disney really only has the option of denying them entrance.
 
T

Thelazer

Well-Known Member
Mad Stitch said:
But therein lies the problem. They have no right to detain you when you choose to just leave. A cop can not detain you unless there is reasonable suspension that a crime has been committed. Refusing to walk through a medal detector is not a crime. And these people are not even cops, they are citizens wearing a shirt that says security.
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Now if anything causes a lawsuit, it's some one in Disney security or a yellow shirt saying "Sir, you have to wait here with me, we need to detain you.." hell, I'd WOULD be the first to jump on that lawsuit actually, never-mind what i said before. In that case, if they did that to me, you can bet I'll file one (actually I'd walk away and hope they tackle me.. go for the pain and suffering angle)
 
flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
s8film40 said:
That's really not the best comparison attempting to take a gun on an airplane is a crime but taking a gun into a park is not. The simple fact is a judge isn't going to even hear this story. If someone refuses Disney really only has the option of denying them entrance.
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The consequences are different... and not really relevant to the analogy. The point of interest is -- its not the ticket turnstile that defines the boundary of the park or property... just like the airplane door is not what defines the boundary in the airport scenario.

Think harder people... it's the concept that counts not the skin deep stuff.
 
s8film40

s8film40

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
The consequences are different... and not really relevant to the analogy. The point of interest is -- its not the ticket turnstile that defines the boundary of the park or property... just like the airplane door is not what defines the boundary in the airport scenario.

Think harder people... it's the concept that counts not the skin deep stuff.
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Ok so here's the hypothetical scenario:

Guest carrying gun walks up to park goes through the bag check is then asked to go through the metal detector.
Guest: I would prefer not to.
Security employee: It is required to go through the metal detector or you will not be able to enter the park.
Guest: Okay I understand, I decline and I have decided to go home then.

Guest then walks away.

Am I missing something? This seems pretty straightforward to me.
 

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