GoofGoof
Premium Member
Well said. I think there would be a lot less heat on MM+ if there was something else coming in the next 3 years. Doesn't help when the competition is expanding at a 1990s WDW pace.
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MM+ Why we can't have nice things.
- Thread starter asianway
- Start date
WDWDad13
Well-Known Member
Everyone is always so quick to blame MM+ on stagnation at WDW but couldn't blame also be placed on other massive spends like purchasing marvel , Lucas, or especially building Shanghai Disney.
lentesta
Premium Member
They're YTD, including pre- and post-FP+.
lentesta
Premium Member
We can run this for any set of dates. Since the phase-in was gradual for FP+, we'd have to determine a date from which we agree FP+ was widespread enough to have affected waits. There are also seasonal issues to take into account, but we can compare 2012 to 2013 for that.
GoofGoof
Premium Member
Could you run from the beginning of November to now (11/1 to 12/20) for 2012 and 2013? That would give us the same period year over year, but one with FP+ and one without.
GoofGoof
Premium Member
Forget about the blame or the opportunity cost I'm just saying if they did MM+ and also announced multiple projects to be complete in the next few years people wouldn't be as upset with MM+. When it's all you have to talk about that just makes it worse.
Captain Chaos
Well-Known Member
Actually, the same or worse can be said of WDW fans..Because many have not used it, many do not have an open mind and couldn't acknowledge anything good Disney actually does, many are too busy slobbering over a geek wizard boy on a broomstick, and if WDW isn't doing exactly what they think they should be doing then they are just ridiculously awful and will be closing down for good when Uni takes over the world soon. I think that covers much of it
Many WDW fans loves FP+/MyTragic+ despite many not having used it, many do not have an open mind, and couldn't acknowledge anything bad or stupid Disney actually does... Many are too busy shooting pixie dust into their veins, or shorting it up their nose, or bowing downing and worshiping a dead guy and a talking mouse, defending a company who could give a Mickey Mouse's about you, looks at you as their personal ATM machine, resting on their laurels cause they know the dusters would defend them (and all they need to do it toss the whores a freebie and their brain dead minions will follow their fantastical preachings)... They will blindly defend Disney and think anything Disney does is perfect and always tops in the industry despite what insiders (and industry experts) say... They spew nonsense and ignore the facts... And when they have nothing, the only thing they can try to do is ruffle feathers by trying to knock Universal (And they fail all the time in doing so)...
There, that about covers it...
I truly believe, Disney can feed certain WDW fans dog food and they'd come on here bragging how it was the best "stew" they ever had in their life... And as Disney admits to serving them dog food, they would continue to claim it wasn't dog food cause Disney would never do such a thing... It was stew dammit!!!
Marvel and Lucas will more than pay for themselves, and have had little impact on the domestic parks. And Disney isn't the only one footing the bill for Shanghai....
WDWDad13
Well-Known Member
and what about crowd level changes from 2012 and 2013 do we know that?
We can probably make a stat to "prove" whatever we claim
Nubs70
Well-Known Member
Haven't done much statistics, have you?
GoofGoof
Premium Member
You will never have an absolute number that quantifies the exact impact of FP+ on standby. Using the same time period year over year would at least give you an apples to apples comparison as opposed to using full year 2012 compared to the last 6 weeks. If the numbers show standby waits up 1 or 2 minutes on average that could be chalked up to potential increases in overall crowds. If a ride like POTC or HM's standby wait doubles then I think you can certainly draw a conclusion that it's directly impacted by FP+ being added. Before we dismiss the numbers lets see what they are.
Scenario 2 can make the person with knowledge criminally negligent if something happens.
WDWDad13
Well-Known Member
You're also not taking into consideration that both FP and FP+ are/were enabled for some rides and therefore people were abusing the system and sometimes doing both as well
Exactly. Who is going to plan a WDW vacation because a wristband will unlock their hotel room door? I would think the FP pre-planning is what attracts guests the mosts, but I would argue that most of them were planning a WDW vacation regardless.
The rides at DLR break down constantly. But I believe most of the rides have a smaller capacity than at WDW, so the lines are generally much longer. However, DLR has more single rider lines, making it much easier to experience a significant portion of the parks in a shorter period of time.
I have always said that while DLR is still pretty "corporate", it feels very "mom-and-pop" whereas WDW feels extremely "corporate".
WDWDad13
Well-Known Member
No I'm too busy snorting pixie dust, enjoying the new tangled bathrooms, and being a Disney wh*** remember?
No. Marvel and Lucas will have significant return from film and licensing contracts (as well as merchandising). NGE is solely P&R, with no real ROI.
Hyperspace Hoopla
Well-Known Member
My two cents...
I was of the belief that MM+ was neat, but generally a big waste of money. That said, we just got back from WDW a few days ago, and I can tell you that I had never seen the parks like they were last week.
For example, we were at MK Saturday the 13th, and it was packed. I'd seen it busier, but the place was wall to wall people, to the point where it was difficult to move around. Even so, the wait times were very reasonable - generally only 10 to 15 minutes.
I'd been to the parks when you could walk on almost any ride, and I'd been when you'd have to wait an hour for Small World, but I'd never seen the parks like this. If that's the result of MM+, it'll be worth every penny.
I was of the belief that MM+ was neat, but generally a big waste of money. That said, we just got back from WDW a few days ago, and I can tell you that I had never seen the parks like they were last week.
For example, we were at MK Saturday the 13th, and it was packed. I'd seen it busier, but the place was wall to wall people, to the point where it was difficult to move around. Even so, the wait times were very reasonable - generally only 10 to 15 minutes.
I'd been to the parks when you could walk on almost any ride, and I'd been when you'd have to wait an hour for Small World, but I'd never seen the parks like this. If that's the result of MM+, it'll be worth every penny.
WDWDad13
Well-Known Member
The same could be said for repaving a parking lot, or changing the bus paint scheme, or even having castle icicle lights...but they do it because they "keep moving forward"
Nubs70
Well-Known Member
I ask because if someone takes the time to break things down to statistical levels, please take the time to gain an understanding of statistics. Please don't fall back on the mantra of lies, damn lies, and statistics.
In my line of work, I only report statistics on the most basic level because my audience does not understand anything beyond mean and standard deviation. To go any deeper would muddle the message.
The MM+ effect will be a multivariate relationship with crowd level having a degree of influence. The question is to what degree. Will crowd level be the primary affect, secondary, tertiary, 10th degree? Who knows, but the data will tell.
Pumbas Nakasak
Heading for the great escape.
Because many have not used it, many do not have an open mind and couldn't acknowledge anything good Disney actually does, many are too busy slobbering over a geek wizard boy on a broomstick, and if WDW isn't doing exactly what they think they should be doing then they are just ridiculously awful and will be closing down for good when Uni takes over the world soon. I think that covers much of it
what a plank