News Mexican fine dining restaurant, Rosa Mexicano, coming to the Walt Disney World Swan and Dolphin in early 2023

danlb_2000

danlb_2000

Premium Member
UNCgolf said:
I don't understand why they're opening a chain restaurant period. Yes, it's an "elevated" chain, but they can't build something original?
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J Jonah Jameson Laughing GIF
 
Kamikaze

Kamikaze

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
Yeah, this is really what I meant. There's almost no way some random local start-up could open a restaurant there, but someone that already operates successful restaurants could open a unique location there instead of just copying something that already exists in 10 other locations.
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Because its less of a risk? Why would you come up with a restaurant - menu, theme, branding etc - for a space when you have a small chain ready to go that is at least successful enough to have 10 locations? Its not like they're putting an actual Chili's in there that has hundreds of locations. 10 is small enough that 99%+ of the diners there have never been to another one, so it might as well be 'original'.
UNCgolf said:
I mean... are you asking to have it explained to you? Because this comment in this context makes it sound like you don't understand how leasing works.
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I'm asking why its even a thought in your head as to why they would do this. It makes you seem to have, shall we say to put it nicely, a bit of tunnel vision on costs, risks, and business decisions.
 
UNCgolf

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
Kamikaze said:
Because its less of a risk? Why would you come up with a restaurant - menu, theme, branding etc - for a space when you have a small chain ready to go that is at least successful enough to have 10 locations? Its not like they're putting an actual Chili's in there that has hundreds of locations. 10 is small enough that 99%+ of the diners there have never been to another one, so it might as well be 'original'.

I'm asking why its even a thought in your head as to why they would do this. It makes you seem to have, shall we say to put it nicely, a bit of tunnel vision on costs, risks, and business decisions.
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Because this isn't that kind of forum. We aren't here to discuss the best short-term business decision; we're here to discuss what we want to see/what we think would offer the best experience for guests. Without some other context, it makes sense to assume posts here are expressing an opinion on what would make for a better experience rather than a statement on the business merits of any decision. That's not to say business realities don't matter at all in these conversations, or that they aren't sometimes part of a discussion, but there'd be little reason to have a forum at all if we were simply going to assume everything they do is the correct business decision.

That said, if we want to discuss a business perspective, automatically going for less risk isn't inherently good/right -- in fact, it's one way to run a business into the ground through stagnation. And I'm not just randomly opining here; I have significant knowledge of/experience with business decisions in both small local businesses and massive corporations (including ones larger than Marriott).

There is a lot of competition for dining in the immediate area, both from other restaurants at the Swan/Dolphin itself and from the Boardwalk and even EPCOT. It's not a stretch to think a unique concept could outperform/be a better investment than a chain even from a short-term business perspective. I also think there's a decent argument that it actually is risky to open a Mexican restaurant from the northeastern United States in a region that's overflowing with authentic Mexican food from actual Mexican immigrants (at a significantly cheaper price, too).
 
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Kamikaze

Kamikaze

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
Because this isn't that kind of forum. We aren't here to discuss the best short-term business decision; we're here to discuss what we want to see/what we think would offer the best experience for guests. Without some other context, it makes sense to assume posts here are expressing an opinion on what would make for a better experience rather than a statement on the business merits of any decision.

That said, if we want to discuss a business perspective, automatically going for less risk isn't inherently good/right -- in fact, it's one way to run a business into the ground through stagnation. And I'm not just randomly opining here; I have significant knowledge of/experience with business decisions in both small local businesses and massive corporations (including ones larger than Marriott).

There is a lot of competition for dining in the immediate area, both from other restaurants at the Swan/Dolphin itself and from the Boardwalk and even EPCOT. It's not a stretch to think a unique concept could outperform/be a better investment than a chain even from a short-term business perspective. I also think there's a decent argument that it actually is risky to open a Mexican restaurant from the northeastern United States in a region that's overflowing with authentic Mexican food from actual Mexican immigrants (at a significantly cheaper price, too).
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I'm glad you're the sole authority on what's supposed to be discussed on WDWMagic. I'm sure Steve appreciates the assistance of such a great mind of our time making such decisions.
UNCgolf said:
I don't understand why they're opening a chain restaurant period. Yes, it's an "elevated" chain, but they can't build something original?
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This was your original post. You didn't say 'I don't think this is the best choice for this spot' or 'Lets discuss what they should build here instead'. You said 'I don't know why they're opening a chain restaurant'. Because that's who paid to lease the space. That simple. Shula's is a chain too, you know. But lets not let facts get in the way of our silly opinions, right?
 
ToTBellHop

ToTBellHop

Well-Known Member
What distinguishes a fine taco from a street taco? Like, when the server asks how my meal is, what will make me say, “damn, girl. These tacos are fine!”
 
Ayla

Ayla

Well-Known Member
A food you eat with your hands will never be "fine dining", no matter how pretentious they are trying to make it seem. 😂
 
dmw

dmw

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
didn't the S&D used to have a different Mexican restaurant, Juan and Onlies (sp?)
 
JusticeDisney

JusticeDisney

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
I don't understand why they're opening a chain restaurant period. Yes, it's an "elevated" chain, but they can't build something original?
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Well, to be fair, Shula’s could be considered a chain and you’re not going to find a better steak anywhere. As long as the food is good at this new Mexican place, I’m in.
 
J

JMcMahonEsq

Well-Known Member
JusticeDisney said:
Well, to be fair, Shula’s could be considered a chain and you’re not going to find a better steak anywhere. As long as the food is good at this new Mexican place, I’m in.
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you beat me to that one.

They have Rain forest Cafe locations, both in AK and Springs, they have SKT Steakhouse in Disney Springs, also a chain, not to mention Don shulas. Its not like Disney has been historically chain adverse.

Plus Swan and Dolphin is BonVoys based property. There larger hotels have historically housed chain type restaurants, like Ruth Chris at their locations.

While I would agree in some markets the idea of a one off restaurant with unique dining experience, totally unique menu, concept could be a good business decision, is Swan and Dolphin inside the WDW bubble really that location? On whole are you truly marketing towards "foodies" looking for Michelann Star, unique cutting edge dining experiences?
 
JusticeDisney

JusticeDisney

Well-Known Member
JMcMahonEsq said:
you beat me to that one.

They have Rain forest Cafe locations, both in AK and Springs, they have SKT Steakhouse in Disney Springs, also a chain, not to mention Don shulas. Its not like Disney has been historically chain adverse.

Plus Swan and Dolphin is BonVoys based property. There larger hotels have historically housed chain type restaurants, like Ruth Chris at their locations.

While I would agree in some markets the idea of a one off restaurant with unique dining experience, totally unique menu, concept could be a good business decision, is Swan and Dolphin inside the WDW bubble really that location? On whole are you truly marketing towards "foodies" looking for Michelann Star, unique cutting edge dining experiences?
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Spot on.
 
UNCgolf

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
JusticeDisney said:
Well, to be fair, Shula’s could be considered a chain and you’re not going to find a better steak anywhere. As long as the food is good at this new Mexican place, I’m in.
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To an extent, sure, although it only has 6 locations and doesn't appear to be expanding. Rosa Mexicano already has 10 and is currently expanding further (this one at Disney and one in Las Vegas for sure; there may be others). But I also didn't say that they should never have any kind of restaurant that exists elsewhere; the fact that the Swan and Dolphin already has a couple just adds to the argument that it might be a good idea to try something new.

Plus, as I said above, the choice of Mexican feels a little risky to me, just because of how easy it is to find good, authentic Mexican food in the southeastern US (and southwestern US) and with so many other dining options nearby.

Also, unique restaurant doesn't automatically mean catering towards foodies looking for a Michelin star experience (almost all of the WDW restaurants are unique and only one or two are attempting anything like this). It just means it's not something you might go to in other cities/tourist locations.
 
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JusticeDisney

JusticeDisney

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
To an extent, sure, although it only has 6 locations and doesn't appear to be expanding. Rosa Mexicano already has 10 and is currently expanding further (this one at Disney and one in Las Vegas for sure; there may be others). But I also didn't say that they should never have any kind of restaurant that exists elsewhere; the fact that the Swan and Dolphin already has a couple just adds to the argument that it might be a good idea to try something new.

Plus, as I said above, the choice of Mexican feels a little risky to me, just because of how easy it is to find good, authentic Mexican food in the southeastern US (and southwestern US).

Also, unique restaurant doesn't automatically mean catering towards foodies looking for a Michelin star experience (almost all of the WDW restaurants are unique and only one or two are attempting anything like this). It just means it's not something you might go to in other cities/tourist locations.
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I hear what you’re saying, but a lot of your response is directed to what other posters said, not me. Anyway, as I originally stated, if it’s good Mexican food I’m all for it, whether or not there are some other locations for this restaurant.
 
UNCgolf

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
JusticeDisney said:
I hear what you’re saying, but a lot of your response is directed to what other posters said, not me. Anyway, as I originally stated, if it’s good Mexican food I’m all for it, whether or not there are some other locations for this restaurant.
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Yep, some of it was in response to other posters -- I was just lazy and didn't feel like quoting everyone.
 
J

JMcMahonEsq

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
Plus, as I said above, the choice of Mexican feels a little risky to me, just because of how easy it is to find good, authentic Mexican food in the southeastern US (and southwestern US).

Also, unique restaurant doesn't automatically mean catering towards foodies looking for a Michelin star experience (almost all of the WDW restaurants are unique and only one or two are attempting anything like this). It just means it's not something you might go to in other cities/tourist locations.
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The choice of does Mexican work is a much more fundamental question, it be a solo site place, an upscale chain, or chevy's. That question I am not sure demographic wise if its a good fit or not, but on property they already have Steak House covered, the have Italian covered, and moder/fusion covered, so going with another separate offering i can see being a good choice from a marketing perspective. Arguably you could have gone with an Asian themed or even seafood type place, but I don't see Mexican being all that big of a disadvantage.

As to unique vs chain, I am not sure of the benefits of going the totally unique route. What is the reason that WDW would want a restaurant at one of their resorts that people wouldn't got to in other cities/tourist locations? Disney has their character/themed dining experiences that serve this type of experience. I wouldn't go to a restaurant in NYC that has a bunch of furries hanging around and interacting with guests, but we will do that at Disney bc its the Disney characters we know and love. But here we are talking about a restaurant within a Hotel Space, and a non Disney Hotel at that. This is the Hotel that Bonvoy members spend their points on, and that conventioneers will be at. If anything for that demographic I want restaurants that people have a sense of familiarity with. We did Don Shulas on our trip to Chicago, it was great, lets eat there type of decision making. For anyone going with a family, especially with young kids, when we are sitting down after a long day at park, we aren't looking for a "Unique" restaurant experience just hoping all of us, and the kids will like.
 
JusticeDisney

JusticeDisney

Well-Known Member

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