Management about to change Expedition Everest

[speck76]

manage the rule, not the exception

the vast majority of the time, as long as labor does its job correctly, the 5 train system should work well.

even if it does not work well 20% of the time, that would mean 80% of the time more guests will get a shorter wait....

It sounds like a low-risk solution to better guest service....

 

[the-reason14]

Well IMO, Fastpass is Gods gift to WDW. Like it or hate, use it or not, it doesnt seem like its going anywhere anytime soon Thank God.

Hopefully the next post will be back on the everest topic.

 

[Lynx04]

Adding a 5th train will increase capacity, if not, then there is no reason to allow a 5th train. Having 5 trains on the track means you have 5 trains and extra wheels depreciating in service life. Trust me if Disney could get away with running 2 trains, it would.

Stacking is something that always has the potential to happen, even if you only have running 3 trains.

Also, fastpass has no effect on load and unload times. People are at the load station no matter if they come from fastpass, standby, or singles. The only effect fastpass has on is the standby line. That is why I always chose singles line, shortest line of them all.

 

[bob0012]

Yea. That's actully the problem, and why the chain would stop. There'd be a train at unload, and a train at the hold area before unload, and because they're not having trains stop in the hold area before the Yeti like I stated, means that the trains at Shadow of the Yeti and Broken Trestle would stop, stopping the chain.

Some peopel here have stated they stopped before they yeti room, and if they have that block turned off, and the block prior is such a long block (Drop and helix), I see no reason why they would want to wait the exta 15 seconds to clear the yeti room and wait station outside the unload to send the next train from shadow room, which is what they would have to do if it that piece wasn't acting as block brakes.

 

[EpcotServo]

Adding a 5th train will increase capacity, if not, then there is no reason to allow a 5th train. Having 5 trains on the track means you have 5 trains and extra wheels depreciating in service life. Trust me if Disney could get away with running 2 trains, it would.

Actully the 5th train will not increase the OHRC. (How many people you get through in an hour) Because no matter what, it'll still be sending out a train every 50-something seconds. That's the timing, and that can't change. It'll just have another train full of people on the track. And that way they can give some more Fastpasses.

Stacking is something that always has the potential to happen, even if you only have running 3 trains.

Yea, but the more trains you have on the track, the more you'll cascade the system. If you have RCT3, try that out and you'll see what I mean! It can be quite the problem if you need to get your ride opened on time in the game.
:lol:

I've got a update on the matter, and it's that there are really going ahead with this, and that they want to buy and make a sixth train. It's a smart idea if they're really going to do this. (Only problem with this, is that the Roundhouse only holds five trains.) I just think that they're really going to wear the system thin, IMHO.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Nobody has explained to me how adding a 5th train logically increases the number of fastpasses you can give out if the Hourly Capacity doesn't change. That doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[EpcotServo]

Nobody has explained to me how adding a 5th train logically increases the number of fastpasses you can give out if the Hourly Capacity doesn't change. That doesn't make any sense to me.

Yea, the logic behind the move baffles me too. It's not by much though. Only around like 500 more Fastpasses. (Which on a busy day, takes maybe around 10-15 more time the machines are open.)

 

[bob0012]

Nobody has explained to me how adding a 5th train logically increases the number of fastpasses you can give out if the Hourly Capacity doesn't change. That doesn't make any sense to me.

The problem is if your taking the word of people on message board that it doesn't increase the hourly capacity. It's not as though someone at disney just decided to do this for no good reason, the math from their side obviously makes sense.

The way I look at it is we all know there are times that your standing at the load waiting for the train to pull into unload, then up to you. So if you can cover that gap with another train then it would obviously increase capacity. That would allow them to hand out more passes, although not a lot more.

 

[palmage]

I'll add this to my list of reasons why I don't like Fastpass. :brick:

What does fastpass have to do with loading?

 

[Vernonpush]

This problem will disappear once Disney decides to build another (or two) E-ticket(s) for AK. This is only the second E-ticket attraction for the park (if you count the safari). :shrug:

 

[marni1971]

Or 3rd, which CTX certainly was.

 

[ToTBellHop]

I'm gonna go ahead and trust that Disney's math here is accurate and that there will be an increase in capacity--there are too many estimates that the armchair imagineers are using in this thread to make the capacity calculations here reliable. I'm sure there will be enough added capacity to warrant the change if it does, indeed, happen. Disney would not waste money on something that is so incredibly easy to calculate for the folks who have the REAL numbers, not our estimates.

 

[EpcotServo]

I'm gonna go ahead and trust that Disney's math here is accurate and that there will be an increase in capacity--there are too many estimates that the armchair imagineers are using in this thread to make the capacity calculations here reliable. I'm sure there will be enough added capacity to warrant the change if it does, indeed, happen. Disney would not waste money on something that is so incredibly easy to calculate for the folks who have the REAL numbers, not our estimates.

They're doing their math right. The problem is that they aren't factoring in how the ride system works with real people, in everyday situations. WDI tried all these things before opening, but sadly the managers and most of the opening crew have now gone on to new places, and the new people who make these choices aren't listening to the few people left who actully saw how this worked. While I agree with the arm-chair guesses being off, I gurantee you that this will not increase the OHRC as told to me. It will just add like 500-something Fastpasses, and will increase the ride time. The major problem with this (Right now at least.) is that if one train has to go offline, (Which usually happens once or twice during the day) they'll actully lower the OHRC, because they're running a longer ride. This is going to be a problem until they get a sixth train to switch out. I just hope if they're going to be blowing all this money into this, that they at least buy and install a few fog machines to replace the mist! Please, oh please grant me that Disney and Management!

 

[bob0012]

They're doing their math right. The problem is that they aren't factoring in how the ride system works with real people, in everyday situations. WDI tried all these things before opening, but sadly the managers and most of the opening crew have now gone on to new places, and the new people who make these choices aren't listening to the few people left who actully saw how this worked. While I agree with the arm-chair guesses being off, I gurantee you that this will not increase the OHRC as told to me. It will just add like 500-something Fastpasses, and will increase the ride time. The major problem with this (Right now at least.) is that if one train has to go offline, (Which usually happens once or twice during the day) they'll actully lower the OHRC, because they're running a longer ride. This is going to be a problem until they get a sixth train to switch out. I just hope if they're going to be blowing all this money into this, that they at least buy and install a few fog machines to replace the mist! Please, oh please grant me that Disney and Management!

I still don't see why they would have to slow the ride down. That makes no sense. If the staff up there is working at their peak then there is a noticable gap, the extra train will just fill that.

 

[RSoxNo1]

They can distribute 500 more fast passes now if they wanted to. The # of cars on the track should have nothing to do with the # of fastpasses, the hourly capacity is what will effect it. If somehow they can increase the hourly capacity by 50 or so by adding that 5th car, then you can add more fastpasses, otherwise there is no logic here whatsoever.

 

[EpcotServo]

I can't tell you guys what they are thinking, all I can say is that Fastpasses ARE the reason they're doing it, and everything I've told you is coming right from the sources, and I've checked and re-checked what I've been told, and that's the way it is. As one who hates crazy rumors, just trust me that I wouldn't share this information had I not been sure that this is 100% true. I know I might be coming across as smug, I just want everyone to be sure that I really can't tell you what they're thinking. What I posted has been exactly as I've heard it told about everything.

And I've been going on Everest nearly every week ever since January 06 and I've never seen an empty loading station for no reason. If load is empty, it's because it's about to back up. This fifth train that would fill the load area would just dispatch and stop a little up the track, so I think that's kind defeats the purpose IMHO.

I just can't believe this has turned into such a big thread. I didn't think it would be such a heated topic!
:shrug:

 

[Madison]

Disney has a year's worth of ride capacity data to sort through regarding this attraction. If they are genuinely considering bringing another train into regular service, you can bet that they've looked at that data and feel that there's a benefit. There's no other reason why they'd do it and, despite what many may feel, there're some amazingly smart folks at the company.

If Everest has CMs waiting for another train to come into the station more often than not, there is a potential to increase OHRC by adding an additional train. There's some threshold that must be crossed, of course, but the math isn't too difficult to figure out. Say, on average, CMs are waiting ten seconds longer than the absolute minimum time required to get a train from unload to load and there are, I don't know -- 100 trains passing through per hour... you're looking at something like fifteen minutes of downtime. If you can make operations efficient enough to lower the time between train arrivals, that fifteen minutes could be used to load several more trainloads of people, increasing your OHRC.

As best as I'm aware, Fastpasses are distributed as some percentage of OHRC. This helps to maintain the advertised benefit of the system -- otherwise with time, one could expect the standby and Fastpass lines to equalize. If Fastpass was distributing tickets for 25% of its OHRC and adding a fifth train increased such OHRC by, say, 200 people -- you're increasing the number of fastpasses distributed by 50 per hour or 600 per day. That may, in turn, mean that Fastpass distribution for a given day may end 30 minutes later than it does now, making a family that arrived to Animal Kingdom late in the day just a little bit happier.

I've made up all of these numbers, of course, but it's not far-fetched to imagine that cleaning up operational inefficiencies can have some positive effects reaching pretty far down the line.

 

[ToTBellHop]

if no one can understand what is going on, then we don't really need to continue on for another 7 pages explaining that we don't know what's going on. Let's let this pan out. We'll know more once the changes occur. Maybe we'll find out that after 52 years, Disney knows what it's doing with its decisions--at least from a "making things work properly" standpoint. And I agree with Madison. 500 extra guests per day is only 15 extra train loads in an ENTIRE day. It is not at all hard for me to imagine them fitting in an extra 15 train loads with the small, unnecessary gaps that I would witness from time to time.

 

[Yen_Sid1]

Right now, they are still having problems with it. They are still having some software problems. And it only supposed to be for 2 weeks during the first 2 weeks in April when then are going to be really busy. Then they will go back just running 4 trains again, if they get all the bugs worked out first.

 

[Scar Junior]

okay, ive just finished reading this whole thread. to me, i'd have say its pretty much a non-issue. i'm with those whose sentiments trust the move (if its even true) will be for the better. if not, then theres a good chance it will be changed back. if it is true, it is for the worse and then is not changed back... then perhaps there will be an issue. as of this point im pretty apathetic to the whole thing.

ps. kyle, i'm loving the 'armchair imagineers' nickname. just to warn you, im going to steal it. :wave: