ttalovebug
Active Member
Which features? FP+ is available with just the card, correct?
If it's more limited, than it's not really a choice, is it? It's "chose what we want you to, or have a lesser experience than the family next to you."
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Largest test to date of MyMagic+ will use all features including guest use of the MagicBand
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
Which features? FP+ is available with just the card, correct?
If it's more limited, than it's not really a choice, is it? It's "chose what we want you to, or have a lesser experience than the family next to you."
englanddg
One Little Spark...
Disney won't be able to track you on park without the bluetooth, which is only available with the band...and therefore special events and offerings will not be texted to your phone and characters will not your name in advance (not kidding, that is exactly what they are saying, at least for now)...
I might be wrong but I don't believe that the bands have any bluetooth technology. I think that they are just RFID.
englanddg
One Little Spark...
I thought so at first, but no, they are using Bluetooth SMART as well in the bands...that's how they will be able to track your movements in the park beyond the limited range of RFID.
http://thenextweb.com/insider/2013/05/29/disney-goes-into-wearable-tech-with-the-magic-band/
articos
Well-Known Member
They have UHF & HF RFID and Bluetooth inside.
englanddg
One Little Spark...
The link I posted had a high level Disney exec involved with the project flat out saying that bluetooth is involved.
The news is not "new"...it could be accomplished with RFID readers and HFRF all over the parks...
But, it's been revealed they are using LFBT for it.
But, I get your point. ISM non-intrusive techs at the most viable marketable tech right now are good for 2 - 4 meters at best, and even then sketchy.
LE Bluetooth is nearly 100 - 150m...
articos
Well-Known Member
The privacy FAQ page has been updated to specifically spell it out. Last section of the below page specifies the cards only carry passive HF chips. No battery, no transmitter - unlike the bands.
https://disneyworld.disney.go.com/faq/my-disney-experience/frequency-technology/
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
Thanks! I last read the FAQ a couple of months ago and it did not contain this information at that time:
The updated FAQ is consistent with Iger's original letter. For the RFID cards, read ranges should be limited to a few feet.
I've deleted my previous post to avoid confusion.
articos
Well-Known Member
Settle in, this is a long response!
Let me preface by saying I don't know everything about the new system yet, and changes are still being implemented as it is being tested in real world applications. I have mixed feelings on MM+/FP+, and I'm going to cover both here, not just FP+, since they're essentially one package deal. I'm not a fan of the direction Disney is going in requesting guests to plan out your entire vacation in advance (by necessity). I like the spontaneity of discovering WDW on your own, and I would prefer they simply do more going back to their roots, which worked well: keeping standby tables for walk-ups, and better staffing and training to move people quicker. I have to wonder, even with the higher numbers each year, if they didn't create artificial urgency by asking for ADR's, and they kept blocks of standby tables for release as dates got closer, would there be as many problems with getting reservations? I'm also curious what would happen if they simply restricted the numbers allowed sold per day based on the staffing, and got rid of FP altogether. Once lines get to 90-120 mins, around the park, phase close the gates and/or direct guests to other parks. Of course, if someone really wants to go that specific park, fine, give them good guest service, but otherwise, don't be afraid to say "this park is not going to be a fun experience, we suggest this instead." I think the industry needs to really look at the guest experience, as opposed to numbers numbers numbers, which is an artificially created metric. Who cares if you're doing 40 million people a year if they're all miserable standing in line and only getting to 5 attractions in a day? Unfortunately, the sheer numbers combined with limited staffing/budgets has created a situation at WDW where something needs to be done - only being able to book certain restaurants months out, or not getting any standby tables, or having to get to the park at opening to get fast passes has really killed some of the vacation magic of Disney, and therefore I understand the desire to address that as crowds grow. I don't think this is the way to do that. I think it's a great way to make guests lives easier with one-stop shopping via the band being a multi-use personalization device. And with FP+ limiting experiences to 3 per day in one park, that definitely does address my issue with not allowing for spontaneity in the parks, but very much at the expense of being able to actually hop through the park using Fast Passes if you know what to do - I think you should have that choice if you want to use it, as long as Disney is offering Fast Pass. You may end up riding/seeing less now, and your exploration is definitely tempered by spending more time standing in line, unfortunately.
Now, the positive:
MyMagic+ has multiple reasons for existing, all of which have been discussed here ad nauseum:
For the company, it manages crowd flow and allows the company to stay ahead of its guests, thereby in theory creating a better guest experience. It allows for more personalized interactions, in theory creating a better guest experience. It simplifies payments, ticketing, room access, photo pass, identification, Fast Pass and limited guest tracking (i.e., if they need to bring you your food at BoG of if a child gets lost, they can look for the band) - all of which create a better guest experience. It allows the company to send you something (the bands) to help build excitement ahead of time, while also giving guests a litany of interesting things to do and discover through their phone or online, allowing the guest to plan out and take care of reservations and dining, again...creating a better guest experience. Beyond those, it allows the company to collect aggregate data on how consumers use the parks, buy merch, traffic patterns, who uses what attractions and how often, where people go, etc. etc. etc. And it creates an ancillary revenue stream with the bands themselves. So all of the above are well and good. In theory, it all works out to a better guest experience, and I think on the whole, much of this is actually the case.
For the guest, it simplifies a rather intimidating vacation experience: as above, it allows you to have one band to rule them all. Room key, payment fob, personalization around the property, park tickets, photo pass and Fast Pass. I like having one RFID tag that is used for everything, be it a band or a card or a clip or whatever. Makes my life simpler in the parks. And I can go anywhere, from Blizzard Beach to the golf course to the parks to the hotel to DtD Springs. It's somewhat personal and kinda cool, too, and creates a semi-permanent connection to my Disney visits - that band is going in a drawer when you get home, and when you look at it, you think "Hey, that's my free pass into the parks" if an AP or it reminds you of the great time you had and that all you have to do is call to plan your next vacation with that same band. It's an emotional key. It also brings you into "the club" when you see others with them. And it may allow parents to give their kids a major wow moment when their kids are addressed by name, which may be a grin you can't buy at any price.
That's all the good. Here's where it gets complicated. With regards to Fast Pass+, if this was implemented as a one key fits all solution with the emotional components above just to make life easier, while leaving certain things alone (like making Fast Pass electronic without the new parameters) that's one thing. But MM+/FP+ are also being implemented to get a handle on ever-increasing crowds with less to do. It's being used to direct those crowds and essentially get in the middle of the natural guest patterns and traffic flow, in an effort to move people around and reduce wait times. They are doing this by adding more Fast Pass locations, which you would think would be good, even if they decrease the number of Fast Passes given out, which would be bad. It's spreading more people out and making the system more equitable to all, in theory, while allowing Disney more control over the entire deal. I think it's going to have the opposite effect, rather than what the company is hoping for. Which is bad. I don't think it's going to be all that noticeable, especially in the summer. But it will be incrementally worse year by year as far as crowd flow is concerned on busy days, and some days could be a complete mess. I'm also not convinced Disney will be able to stay on top of things quickly or competently enough to manage the crowd flow. They get a back-up at TSMM, so they send some characters out - they think that will help, but there's all sorts of things they can't control here. Also, by the time they send those characters, maybe that line is back to normal. Disney isn't one to act proactively or to move quickly, especially when relying on overworked staff in the Florida summer heat.
Let's break things down and get into your specific questions:
- Will it improve the experience of the first time vacationer? Yes. Absolutely. They don't know any better,and everything about this is good for them. From being able to learn ahead of time and get restaurant reservations, to picking experiences to reserve, it's great for them. They don't have experience with learning how to deal with the current Fast Pass system, so they won't know they missed out on being able to pull more than 3 experiences or being able to hop parks and still be able to pull Fast Passes. Add that to the experience of the band being a one stop shop, it's a dream vacation. They'll wait in line, and be blissfully happy, because everyone else is waiting in line too.
- Will it improve the experience of regulars? Yes and No. With regards to the one stop shop, yes. With regards to improving personalization, yes. Being able to reserve a viewing area for Illuminations that may not have been available before on peak days, sure. Being able to work the crowds because you know where to go and pull Fast Passes on moderate or busy days, no. Noticing that attractions that didn't have lines now do? No. Noticing lines are now moving differently? No. The thought process is if everyone only has 3 experiences, then they'll spread out more evenly - because instead of people hitting the most popular attractions with both Fast Pass and Standby, they'll now have to spread out and those who cannot get the popular Fast Pass+ will take the less popular/new Fast Pass+ attractions. Unfortunately, I think that's a flawed theory. The new, less popular FP+ attractions will get some people who will FP for them, but not in great numbers, which will keep the patterns lopsided and still keep crowds at the popular attractions, with many more in the standby line. If they have significantly reduced the number of FP's given out per day, that will definitely keep things moving a bit better, but I don't know that's the case, and I don't think that would stay that way. And there are more people in the parks. As I said above, all of this will simply increase the standby lines, which everyone must now wait in more of, being limited to 3 FP+'s. The theory of spreading the crowds and making everyone stand in line what to them is a fraction longer - they figured everyone waits a few minutes longer, which is negligible - that theory is definitely to the benefit of the company, but it's not likely how it will end up working in real life, and everyone will end up dealing with new crowd flow patterns that Ops isn't going to be prepared for. And even on low crowd days, because they are making people pick FP+ attractions in advance, the patterns will end up creating (short) lines where there may not have been before, because new visitors will pick them. Going to be curious to see how things work out.
- Is there any scenario it would be considered a failure? No. The company has poured huge dollars into this project, and it is a win-win on multiple levels even if some of parts of the project aren't working the way they were intended. They will simply keep iterating until they get it somewhat right. It's also an IT project - they are going to have random projects and ideas from the code teams who have no practical experience in the parks that are going to come and go as "added value", like the augmented reality stuff for resort guests. It serves very little purpose other than a team member thought it would be cool. Will it be there in a year? Probably not. Do I think they'll keep it at 3 experiences, 1 park per day long-term? No. I don't think that's a viable long term option, and expect it will be opened to multiple parks in one day, with maybe a few more FP+'s as they get a handle on how many guests can practically use. Will they potentially ask people to pay for above 3 in one park? Maybe. I can see that happening, much to Uncle Walt's displeasure. They definitely see revenue potential, and everyone else charges for front of the line. The more Disney execs come and go between other parks, the more the Disney difference goes, and the other policies become acceptable. The bands are also good for other aspects of the Disney businesses, which may come to fruition later. Or may not. Suffice it to say when you have execs who have poured this much into a project, they will do whatever it takes to make it work.
That's my take on it all.
articos
Well-Known Member
One more note to add: I love the smartphone usage and applications - I think the app portion of MM+/FP+ is a brilliant use of technology, with the park maps, FP info, wait times, dining res, etc. at your fingertips. Excellent way to make your life easier. I fear, however, for people simply being engrossed in their phones all the time, instead of enjoying the parks around them. Unfortunately 6 of 1, half dozen of the other. Hopefully people will not forget to literally smell the roses.
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
MyMagic+ in general and FP+ in particular could help inexperienced WDW guests. However, it seems to make a complicated vacation even more completed. We've been studying this thing for months and still don't fully comprehend it. I'm not sure casual vacationers will even begin to get their arms around it. It makes a complicated vacation even more complicated. I wonder if inexperienced WDW guests will simply throw their hands up in frustration.
Experienced WDW guests will be frustrated at the 3 FP+ limit and the changed traffic patterns. ("What, I actually have to wait 30 minutes to ride Pirates of the Caribbean?") They know the best spots for parades, for fireworks. They know which rides need to be FP'ed and which don't. Adding FP+ to attractions that don't need them is only going to mess with their hard-earned experience.
I do think MM+ will help uber planners.
Mom and Dad didn't have a great WDW vacation last time. They called late and couldn't get the ADRs they wanted. They stood in line over an hour for Peter Pan and, after that experience, Dad went running around the park trying to get FP, leaving Mom and Little Johnny and Little Sue all alone. They never did find the Winnie the Pooh meet & greet and Little Johnny was so disappointed he just cried and cried. They tried watching the parade but they didn't know you need to camp out 2 hours before and there were these guests all over 6 feet who refused to let Little Johnny and Little Sue stand in front of them.
This time, they are desperate, absolutely desperate, to have a “perfect” WDW vacation. That’s why they are calling exactly at 9 AM (or whatever the time) 180 days out so they can get their ADRs. That’s why they are spending $50/adult on a character buffet for food that costs them $10/adult offsite. That’s why they’re shelling out big bucks for the Bibbidi Bobbidi Boutique and Pirates League. Little Johnny is 7 and Little Sue is 4 only once. If Mom and Dad don’t get this vacation exactly right, their little ones’ lives will be lessened and they’ll miss out on a memory of a lifetime. They are just begging WDW to make it better.
MM+ will make it better for them. They are, after all, WDW's bread and butter.
Experienced WDW guests will be frustrated at the 3 FP+ limit and the changed traffic patterns. ("What, I actually have to wait 30 minutes to ride Pirates of the Caribbean?") They know the best spots for parades, for fireworks. They know which rides need to be FP'ed and which don't. Adding FP+ to attractions that don't need them is only going to mess with their hard-earned experience.
I do think MM+ will help uber planners.
Mom and Dad didn't have a great WDW vacation last time. They called late and couldn't get the ADRs they wanted. They stood in line over an hour for Peter Pan and, after that experience, Dad went running around the park trying to get FP, leaving Mom and Little Johnny and Little Sue all alone. They never did find the Winnie the Pooh meet & greet and Little Johnny was so disappointed he just cried and cried. They tried watching the parade but they didn't know you need to camp out 2 hours before and there were these guests all over 6 feet who refused to let Little Johnny and Little Sue stand in front of them.
This time, they are desperate, absolutely desperate, to have a “perfect” WDW vacation. That’s why they are calling exactly at 9 AM (or whatever the time) 180 days out so they can get their ADRs. That’s why they are spending $50/adult on a character buffet for food that costs them $10/adult offsite. That’s why they’re shelling out big bucks for the Bibbidi Bobbidi Boutique and Pirates League. Little Johnny is 7 and Little Sue is 4 only once. If Mom and Dad don’t get this vacation exactly right, their little ones’ lives will be lessened and they’ll miss out on a memory of a lifetime. They are just begging WDW to make it better.
MM+ will make it better for them. They are, after all, WDW's bread and butter.
These 2 responses outline my main problem with Fastpass+.
What @articos describes is the ideal situation, a family does their research, identifies everything they want to do and they are willing to be ready at that 180 day mark for ADR's and that 60 day mark for FP+ to make all their plans so their vacation works out perfectly.
What @ParentsOf4 describes is more of the reality I have seen by helping friends and family plan disney vacations. In my limited personal expieience, these sort of questions never pop up. Now, my social circle consists mostly of mid-middle class families, so maybe this isn't the demographic that Disney is going for but never has someone started a conversation by asking what is the best way to get an ADR for Le Cellier. I have tried to explain the current Fastpass system, but most seem uninterested. Those that try to understand it, still aren't successful in maximizing its benefits. They simply want to pay for the trip and go. They have no idea about what they want to do or where they want to eat and are way too busy to be on the phone at 7:00am 180 days out to guarantee a restaurant seat.
(I realize the above is from a very limited sample, I have probably personally helped around 10 couples/families plan vacations, maybe Master Yoda or some of the other travel agents could jump in with expierience from a larger sample size.)
This leads me to:
My biggest issue with FP+ as a whole is that I believe it is wishful thinking to expect first time and casual visitors to benefit greatly from this. At the same time this will just make things worse for the regulars. Once implemented, I will guarantee that the regulars fully understand the system and know how to make the most of it. They will suck up all of the FP+ reservations for the main rides and simply skip the lesser rides if they have lines. So it's great that great that a first timer only waited 3 minutes instead of 20 for muppet vision 3d, but then had to wait 120 minutes for RnRC, while the regular used thier FP+ for RnRC and decided to skip muppet vision 3d becuase of a 20 minute wait and just decided to leave the park early for the day. And I can only imagine how upset I would be as a first timer realizing I wasted a FP+ on one of the lesser rides. I could easily see a first time family watching a promo DVD and thinking that The Legend of Jack Sparrow looks like the coolest thing in the world and saying, "We should get a FP+ for that!", then how disappointing it will be when they actually go and see it. I feel for the Guest Relations CM's that are going to deal with these headaches.
If you have family and friends set up, you can get to their Magic Bands by clicking on their profile. I have not found a way to get to that section for the primary account holder, because there is no mention of it on My Account profile.
just in case any Disney MM+ execs wander thru thread. Would hate for them to miss this.
jrlang1
Active Member
muteki
Well-Known Member
++
I don't know if this makes you feel better or worse, but it is like this everywhere
jaklgreen
Well-Known Member
I have a ? If you get your 3 fastpasses ahead of time and they go on your wristband, are you just supposed to keep track of it and remember when your times are or will they be printed up somewhere? I assume it will by on the phone app, but not everyone has a smart phone.
Nemo14
Well-Known Member
I've wondered the same thing - I'm sure I'm not the only person who has a dumb phone.
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
It should be possible to check return times using kiosks but it doesn't seem like there will be many of these.
Perhaps CMs stationed at the front of FP+ lines will be able to scan RF devices and tell return times for all FP+ experiences.