Kali River Rapids reopens.... and guess what??

[Lee]

I can't buy into the notion there was something a camera could not be setup to see and a cm out of sight could...

Agreed.
That excuse is nonsense.

 

[Alektronic]

Why should that be?

I think it is perfectly sensible that if a new workplace is added, that any nearby open fire effects are permanently removed. Common sense, really. Call me a socialist, but I don't think a $9 an hour worker should work in hazardous conditions. We don't need Kali to be a killing machine like Primeval Whirl, which kills employees for sports at an even higher rate than that alpha male killer whale at Sea World.

I do have a hard time figuring out where the CM spot near the fire is. I don't remember seeing any there, maybe I just haven't been paying attention. I don't know if CM working conditions is really the cause, or just fan speculation. Certainly, the fire was not deemed hazardous enough not to have it near guests strapped helplessly in a floating raft.

Where's Marni? In the OP he said that the fire was never intended to come back, so perhaps he knows why?

First of all, there is 12 fire effects, 4 on the left hand side and 4 on the right hand side and 4 on the bridge. So IF they had to disable any fire effects for safety it would be one or two at the most, not all of them. BUT for it to be UNSAFE you would almost have to be standing on top of it and there all hidden into rockwork not easy to get to even if you want to. There is a walkway up there with plenty of room to move around.

 

[Alektronic]

I can't buy into the notion there was something a camera could not be setup to see and a cm out of sight could...

There is cameras up there and through out the ride. So the problem is the PA system is working up there, they can stop the ride but can't tell them to sit down. The only time somebody would be standing up if they are stopped at the boat stops, that give them a chance to try and look down the downramp. But the boatstops only close when the ride is backed up at load/unload

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

Agreed.
That excuse is nonsense.

Yup, and thanks for commenting on the matter. That excuse always smelled like BS. Though with a little bit of common sense, I don't think we really needed an insider to chime in and tell everyone that this choice was motivated by anything other than wanting to fattening already bursting wallets. No offense to you of course Lee, I just think it should be a given in everyone's heads at this point that show cuts are signs not of benefiting guests or cast members, but rather due to penny pinching and greed.

The removal of show elements (in this day and age at least) is essentially exclusively due to the Disney company not wanting to not spend the money necessary to maintain them. At this point, fans just need to stop trying to pretend anything else matters to the Disney company anymore and cease providing them with ridiculous BS justification for their actions at screwing over paying customers (including yourselves)...

 

[unkadug]

There is cameras up there and through out the ride. So the problem is the PA system is working up there, they can stop the ride but can't tell them to sit down. The only time somebody would be standing up if they are stopped at the boat stops, that give them a chance to try and look down the downramp. But the boatstops only close when the ride is backed up at load/unload

If the PA is working then why don't they use it?

 

[Alektronic]

If the PA is working then why don't they use it?

Sorry. I meant to say NOT working.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

Yup, and thanks for commenting on the matter. That excuse always smelled like BS. Though with a little bit of common sense, I don't think we really needed an insider to chime in and tell everyone that this choice was motivated by anything other than wanting to fattening already bursting wallets. No offense to you of course Lee, I just think it should be a given in everyone's heads at this point that show cuts are signs not of benefiting guests or cast members, but rather due to penny pinching and greed.

The removal of show elements (in this day and age at least) is essentially exclusively due to the Disney company not wanting to not spend the money necessary to maintain them. At this point, fans just need to stop trying to pretend anything else matters to the Disney company anymore and cease providing them with ridiculous BS justification for their actions at screwing over paying customers (including yourselves)...

The point isn't about health and safety or working conditions being the cause. It is about a poster speculating about health and safety or working conditions being the cause. Which is a perfectly sensible suggestion to make. One that does not warrant unsympathetic reply.

TWDC does add and remove a great deal to rides out of safety concerns, whether of its own accord or because it is forced to by unions or governmental regulation. In the recent past, even such innocent rides as Casey Jr., Alice, Primeval Whirl and even Small World have been adapted for safety.

'Safety' and 'penny-pinching' don't exclude each other. Often, when there are safety concerns, TWDC takes the cost-cutting way of dealing with it. See the tarps at Splash and the ToL. The interplay between safety, CM comfort and penny-pinching are the very reason we are stuck with tarps everywhere. And now possibly without fire on Kali too.

I can well imagine a meeting prior to the Kali refurb: Says suit one, "those fires pose a health and safety risk, and are uncomfortable at that. What shall we do?". To which suit two replies: "Well, my technician filed a report that says it will cost $800k to adress the safety issues. $1,2 million for a solution that also takes CM comfort into account. This is outside our budget. So lets just remove the effect".

 

[The Empress Lilly]

I can't buy into the notion there was something a camera could not be setup to see and a cm out of sight could...

Cameras are not much good to check safety belts. Plus, they can't give instructions to guests.

There is a camera there and they do stop the ride, but the camera isn't angled to where you can see the belts. You can only see if someone is standing, so they have to send a CM up there to verify they are seated and buckled. Problem is that it is a LONG hike up there. There's not a direct route, and it can take a good 10 minutes each way. That's a 20min downtime for each person standing. Put a CM there, the downtime goes down to about 2-3 minutes.

 

[flynnibus]

Cameras are not much good to check safety belts. Plus, they can't give instructions to guests.

And a CM 'hidden' away is going to see better than cameras with zoom lens that can be in the open? Ok...

The camera isn't angled right? Then setup one that is. Human's can't see around corners any better than a camera can...

And cameras don't talk.. but speakers do.

Is this a mission to mars we are talking about? It's stupid on-ride video and audio that is used in nearly every modern attraction.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

And a CM 'hidden' away is going to see better than cameras with zoom lens that can be in the open? Ok...

The camera isn't angled right? Then setup one that is. Human's can't see around corners any better than a camera can...

And cameras don't talk.. but speakers do.

Is this a mission to mars we are talking about? It's stupid on-ride video and audio that is used in nearly every modern attraction.

It's not Disney that is stupid, it is the guests, misbehaved and infinite in finding ways to put themselves in danger. It is dumb guests, and a litigious society, and lawyers who cry murder in court and do great damage to Disney's family reputation at every mishap.

TWDC doesn't care about you getting hurt. It cares about your lawyer crying in court that there was no Disney personnel on the spot preventing you from getting hurt. Even more than preventing accidents, a CM prevents legal liability in the case of accidents.

We live in a 'lap-bar on Splash' world. And soon, we'll have restraints on CoP, guests insist on not staying seated, seemingly oblivious it is a moving theater that can crush a truck like a soda can.

(That said, I still don't know where that CM is located, if at all. I guess I'm too busy checking the amazing sights of Kali!)

 

[Tom Morrow]

Anyone have any pictures of video of the fire effects working? Or video of the truck working? I know I saw it back in the day, but its been a long time so I don't really remember.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

Anyone have any pictures of video of the fire effects working? Or video of the truck working? I know I saw it back in the day, but its been a long time so I don't really remember.

DAK's original rides are even more elusive experiences than any obscure EPCOT Center or 50s Disneyland rides!

Who has ridden Countdown to Extinction (Dinosaur before it was crap), had the Yeti lunge at him, seen Kali with fire, walked the secret path from Africa to Asia, sailed the Discovery River Boats?

I predict that these will become the most exclusive Disney Park experiences around, the stuff of legend, of bragging rights at D23 conventions.

Och, poor DAK! Overdesigned and underbuild. Reliant on discovery but nothing there to discover. The Discovery Park turned Disco Park. It is for a reason that the Yeti is always mentioned. It is such a potent symbol for all of DAK. So much ambition, so close, almost greatness, and therefore all the more painful in its lacking. A small raccoon AA that doesn't work is fine. A small modest park that doesn't work is fine too. But DAK is one big Yeti, one massively ambitious project whose A mode fails to deliver, and which to add insult to injury is forever stuck in B mode too.

 

[Tom Morrow]

Was the "secret path" from Africa to Asia what's now between Flights of Wonder and Africa?

 

[yoyoflamingo]

Who has ridden Countdown to Extinction (Dinosaur before it was crap), had the Yeti lunge at him, seen Kali with fire, walked the secret path from Africa to Asia, sailed the Discovery River Boats?

Feel so old to say I have done all these - was actually reading this thread tonight trying to figure out if I remembered correctly that there was fire above the guests' rafts before the drop.

Animal Kingdom is becoming (or has become) a place that effects go to die - but that seems to be a common trend all over WDW. Hoping the Splash refurb is at least done right...

 

[Cosmic Commando]

Was the "secret path" from Africa to Asia what's now between Flights of Wonder and Africa?

No, it was seriously like an "up into the landscaping and over a stream" kind of path. Marked enough that you could tell it was meant to be there, but wild enough that it probably felt like you weren't supposed to be there. Never had the chance to do it myself. It was plantered off a while ago.

Edit:
http://www.parkeology.com/2010/02/lost-in-animal-kingdom.html
http://www.parkeology.com/2010/06/even-more-lost-perhaps-for-good-in.html

 

[Spideyfreak110]

Sorry. I meant to say NOT working.

Hold the phone... this is a BIG safety problem. From what I understand, all Disney rides have to do some sort of a "Clear the track" announcement before a Ride Start happens. If the PA is dead in this area, then there can be no proper warning should there be somebody in that area. If you can't do a proper clear track announcement, then the ride should not be operating. I'm sure the lawyers would love that one.

At UO, one of the daily requirements for a ride is that the entire PA and spiel system is working properly. If it's not, the ride is not allowed to operate.

 

[Tom Morrow]

No, it was seriously like an "up into the landscaping and over a stream" kind of path. Marked enough that you could tell it was meant to be there, but wild enough that it probably felt like you weren't supposed to be there. Never had the chance to do it myself. It was plantered off a while ago.

Edit:
http://www.parkeology.com/2010/02/lost-in-animal-kingdom.html
http://www.parkeology.com/2010/06/even-more-lost-perhaps-for-good-in.html

Wow! I totally forgot about that, but after seeing pictures I definitely remember exploring that path waaay back in the day. I remember how that and a couple other pathways gave this impression that you were really exploring the wilderness and not just following designated theme park walkways.

 

[Scuttle]

This is getting so f*cking out of control!!! My only SLIM hope is that with social media taking over the way it is that we can get the word out to enough people, even first time guests, hell even the pixie dust snorting brigade has to be noticing this sh*t by now.

 

[WDW1974]

I don't believe anyone wrote they don't want to get wet; they simply don't want to get soaked.

To use your analogy, when people ski they don't usually like being buried in the snow.

I'll write it. I don't like to get wet ... well, OK, I don't like to get a lot wet and I NEVER want to be soaked on a theme park ride while in my clothes.
I tried to ride KRR naked one day and while a couple of fanbois were enjoying my monorail, security didn't find it as impressive (no taste).

Getting people soaked in theme parks is a bad trend and one I had hoped Disney was above. They aren't.

 

[WDW1974]

Yup, and thanks for commenting on the matter. That excuse always smelled like BS. Though with a little bit of common sense, I don't think we really needed an insider to chime in and tell everyone that this choice was motivated by anything other than wanting to fattening already bursting wallets. No offense to you of course Lee, I just think it should be a given in everyone's heads at this point that show cuts are signs not of benefiting guests or cast members, but rather due to penny pinching and greed.

The removal of show elements (in this day and age at least) is essentially exclusively due to the Disney company not wanting to not spend the money necessary to maintain them. At this point, fans just need to stop trying to pretend anything else matters to the Disney company anymore and cease providing them with ridiculous BS justification for their actions at screwing over paying customers (including yourselves)...

Much easier to justify an addiction to a product when you can make excuses for why said product is crappier every year ...
... I really want to go back to TDR and HKDL!