Tigger1988
Well-Known Member
It's supposed to be a mouse and yet...
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Just who IS in those costumes? AND are they coached how to act?
- Thread starter MIKETFROMRI
- Start date
It's supposed to be a mouse and yet...
blm07
Active Member
...and yet that mouse and all of the characters have been acting human for 80 years. Who do you want to play the part of a human sized human like mouse, A MOUSE?!
Ravenclawdia
Member
Oh. Gender norms and other such social constructs. How boringly narrow-minded. Thank you for the answer.
blm07
Active Member
Ah, not accepting that other people have other points of view. How boringly boring.
Ravenclawdia
Member
No, I understand all too well that people put other people in boxes based on their gender or what's in their pants... or Disney character costumes. And while I do respect that and do not think less of people for a mindset that is basically universal in our society, that doesn't mean that I have to be fine with something that is a detriment to other people. As a human being with a gender, I resent being defined by what others think I should be and I resent being looked down upon for not being the most feminine person on earth-- which does happen.
Being that I experience that firsthand, I can't just be fine with it when it happens to be detrimental to the guys instead of to me or people of my gender.
That doesn't infringe upon my respect of others, and my respect of others does not infringe upon my ability to stand by my opinions.
I apologize if my statement came across as rude or as though I were trying to insult you; I'm a very sarcastic person and that tends to translate less over ye olde interwebs.
Tigger1988
Well-Known Member
Whoever fits the costume. Male, female...whatever. Wouldn't be the first time a performer played the opposite gender.
tinkerbell1985
New Member
:ROFLOL:bahahahahahaha oh. em. gee.:ROFLOL:
I agree with some of you on here, when I'm there, I lose myself in it! Who freaking cares what/who is under the costume? for all I care it could be an AA and I still wouldn't wonder while I'm in the parks. Maybe yes, outside the parks we do wonder but IMO if that's on your mind when you're there, don't waste your time waiting for a M&G (unless you have little ones with you) and go ride Splash Mountain again! :wave:
Mansion Butler
Active Member
Wait, am I missing something, or was the joke botched in the last panel? Lassie was supposed to be a girl but was played by males. . .
unkadug
Follower of "Saget"The Cult
That was my point earlier. This is all a performance of bringing to life an animated celluloid character. Is it any worse than Bugs Bunny dressed as a woman? Porky Pig wearing no pants? If you can suspend disbelief long enough to get past those issues, then in-park performers should be no problem.
captainkidd
Well-Known Member
I love a good spirited debate just as much as anyone on these boards, but honestly, it seems as though some are just looking for a fight on this. I can't speak for anyone else, but for me, I made a comment in passing based on reading about it on this thread. It never crosses my mind in the park. But if you want an explanation, I'll try again:
When I see the characters in the parks, of course I know they're not real. However, I know the person underneath is. I want to believe that that person is a CM who loves their job with an extreme passion and is not just putting on a show or being fake. That sounds dumb, because obviously they are putting on a show, but part of the illusion of the characters (for me at least), is that the person under the costume is living that character while on the clock. If the character is a male, I want to believe it's a male under there. Female, same thing. Nothing to do with being PC. If Cinderella was in her carriage during the MSEP and had a beard and was smoking, would people say "Eh, we know Cinderella's not real anyway?"
For me, as cynical as I am, I want to believe in the magic at the parks. While I'm there, I'm willing to suspend belief to accept that's a 5 foot mouse. Back in the real world, I simply want to believe that the person playing that character is as true to it as possible, and isn't some person faking their way through the day, rolling their eyes the entire time. Honestly, I'd feel no different if it was a girl playing Minnie who was hating her job and cussing the kids out backstage.
Not sure if that makes any sense, but it's the best way I can explain it.
When I see the characters in the parks, of course I know they're not real. However, I know the person underneath is. I want to believe that that person is a CM who loves their job with an extreme passion and is not just putting on a show or being fake. That sounds dumb, because obviously they are putting on a show, but part of the illusion of the characters (for me at least), is that the person under the costume is living that character while on the clock. If the character is a male, I want to believe it's a male under there. Female, same thing. Nothing to do with being PC. If Cinderella was in her carriage during the MSEP and had a beard and was smoking, would people say "Eh, we know Cinderella's not real anyway?"
For me, as cynical as I am, I want to believe in the magic at the parks. While I'm there, I'm willing to suspend belief to accept that's a 5 foot mouse. Back in the real world, I simply want to believe that the person playing that character is as true to it as possible, and isn't some person faking their way through the day, rolling their eyes the entire time. Honestly, I'd feel no different if it was a girl playing Minnie who was hating her job and cussing the kids out backstage.
Not sure if that makes any sense, but it's the best way I can explain it.
ChrisFL
Premium Member
More magic ruining:
When I was a contractor at WDW, I recall being in the utilidors under MK once when I saw something funny, it was Mickey, Minnie and another Mickey...all arms crossed hopping happily through the utilidors. One Mickey was about 5 or 6 inches taller than the other one.
It was quite funny that they were doing this just in the employee area, definitely seemed to be having fun.
When I was a contractor at WDW, I recall being in the utilidors under MK once when I saw something funny, it was Mickey, Minnie and another Mickey...all arms crossed hopping happily through the utilidors. One Mickey was about 5 or 6 inches taller than the other one.
It was quite funny that they were doing this just in the employee area, definitely seemed to be having fun.
Walt Disney1955
Well-Known Member
You know this thread got me thinking for a second (and in all honesty this is the most tame message board I have ever seen and when a "fight" breaks out on here it pales in comparison to any other board or Youtube for example).
But anyway, in 2009 we were at Animal Kingdom. We went to Rafiki's Planet watch. My wife had her picture taken with Rafiki. He sort of gave her a hug and I looked at him jokingly and told him I was watching him. After the picture he took her hand and started walking away with her trying to goad me into chasing them. I did just for fun and we ran around this one tree. It was a funny memory and all was cool of course.
It just got me thinking, that would actually have been comical if a female was in there. Since our instincts would have told us that was a male (and it probably was) it goes to show you that at the moment it really doesn't matter because if a female can pull off that whole "I'm running away with your woman" routine, then that's just another point for Disney.
If I knew how to post a picture on here, I'd show you.
But anyway, in 2009 we were at Animal Kingdom. We went to Rafiki's Planet watch. My wife had her picture taken with Rafiki. He sort of gave her a hug and I looked at him jokingly and told him I was watching him. After the picture he took her hand and started walking away with her trying to goad me into chasing them. I did just for fun and we ran around this one tree. It was a funny memory and all was cool of course.
It just got me thinking, that would actually have been comical if a female was in there. Since our instincts would have told us that was a male (and it probably was) it goes to show you that at the moment it really doesn't matter because if a female can pull off that whole "I'm running away with your woman" routine, then that's just another point for Disney.
If I knew how to post a picture on here, I'd show you.
rsoxguy
Well-Known Member
OK, you're trying to bring pure logic into a cartoon strip that includes talking animals?
Ravenclawdia
Member
captainkidd-- First of all, I apologize if I came across as "looking for a fight." That's not what I'm doing. I just love intellectual discussion, especially when it's founded on a disagreement such as ours, and I think that this entire topic brings up a lot to be discussed and a lot that I want to discuss with people who will respond. And I do enjoy it! That's what I come on forums for. Not to pick fights, no, but to discuss at length different aspects of things like, in this instance, my favorite place on Earth. The tame, inconsequential discussions on here are nice and I enjoy them, too, but think I would go crazy if that's all I had in the discussion pool. It already happens in "real life."
That said, I'm starting to understand your point a bit more, but it's also painting a picture in my mind of further gender normative ideas. If I've understood correctly, the idea of a male character being portrayed by a female or a female character being portrayed by a male ruins your very understandable hope that every "friend" is having lots of fun with their job and portraying their character with all the genuineness in the world, right?
Well, I'm not going to pretend that I believe that every character performer is happy or happy-all-the-time, as much as I really would love to, but I don't think that possible unhappiness is a product of the gender of their character. It might be the less polite guests, the heat, the unexpected disappointments of life, but the gender? I would hope not.
And when you say that their gender possibly makes them unhappy, you are implying that a person can only be happy and not humiliated and, well, normal if their actions are always in line with what society says their gender's actions should be.
You know, maybe women don't enjoy having to be feminine. Some of them genuinely do, sure, but that's not because they're women-- that's because they're feminine. There are feminine women and feminine men, and the only thing rendering one of the two "unacceptable" is society's weird, illogical, convoluted conclusions. Who's to say that a woman doesn't enjoy hopping in a Donald costume and acting grumpy? I mean, when Donald's grumpy it's hilarious and we just call him Donald, but were that a female character we'd likely find grumpiness too unladylike for her and she'd earn herself a certain title that happens to rhyme with witch.
And who's to say that a guy wouldn't mind hopping in a Minnie costume and having fun with it? Minnie is flamboyantly, stereotypically feminine, and while I have trouble understanding why any actual person ever would genuinely want to act like all of the time, I understand that some people do. And some people like acting like that some of the time. And some people happen to be guys who might get flipping tired of having to channel the stereotypically manly attitude that society says should be natural for them. Again, some guys are very much masculine. That's not because they're men. That's because they're masculine.
Nobody who is hired as a character actor is forced into that costume. If they were that unhappy acting as a certain character, surely they would quit. I like to think it takes a certain level of genuineness for anybody to execute the performances these actors do on a daily basis-- the tomfoolery, the interaction with kids, the unconditional attention. And I think that speaks of a very happy Mickey and Minnie and everybody else, regardless of the gender of the person inside the costume.
This just got my day off to a great start. Thank you for sharing! :wave:
That said, I'm starting to understand your point a bit more, but it's also painting a picture in my mind of further gender normative ideas. If I've understood correctly, the idea of a male character being portrayed by a female or a female character being portrayed by a male ruins your very understandable hope that every "friend" is having lots of fun with their job and portraying their character with all the genuineness in the world, right?
Well, I'm not going to pretend that I believe that every character performer is happy or happy-all-the-time, as much as I really would love to, but I don't think that possible unhappiness is a product of the gender of their character. It might be the less polite guests, the heat, the unexpected disappointments of life, but the gender? I would hope not.
And when you say that their gender possibly makes them unhappy, you are implying that a person can only be happy and not humiliated and, well, normal if their actions are always in line with what society says their gender's actions should be.
You know, maybe women don't enjoy having to be feminine. Some of them genuinely do, sure, but that's not because they're women-- that's because they're feminine. There are feminine women and feminine men, and the only thing rendering one of the two "unacceptable" is society's weird, illogical, convoluted conclusions. Who's to say that a woman doesn't enjoy hopping in a Donald costume and acting grumpy? I mean, when Donald's grumpy it's hilarious and we just call him Donald, but were that a female character we'd likely find grumpiness too unladylike for her and she'd earn herself a certain title that happens to rhyme with witch.
And who's to say that a guy wouldn't mind hopping in a Minnie costume and having fun with it? Minnie is flamboyantly, stereotypically feminine, and while I have trouble understanding why any actual person ever would genuinely want to act like all of the time, I understand that some people do. And some people like acting like that some of the time. And some people happen to be guys who might get flipping tired of having to channel the stereotypically manly attitude that society says should be natural for them. Again, some guys are very much masculine. That's not because they're men. That's because they're masculine.
Nobody who is hired as a character actor is forced into that costume. If they were that unhappy acting as a certain character, surely they would quit. I like to think it takes a certain level of genuineness for anybody to execute the performances these actors do on a daily basis-- the tomfoolery, the interaction with kids, the unconditional attention. And I think that speaks of a very happy Mickey and Minnie and everybody else, regardless of the gender of the person inside the costume.
This just got my day off to a great start. Thank you for sharing! :wave:
timoteo
Member
Exactly and so funny. I hope those Chip and Dale guys I hug everytime I go to are women in there and can only hope, hope, hope the white aristocat with the pink bow who I always hug and kiss the hand of is a college kid named Chip. Oh please let it be true
captainkidd
Well-Known Member
Sounds about right.
timoteo
Member
Ravenclaw. You are good. I mean it. That summary was well crafted. If you are a therapist or studying to be one I honestly hope you use your powers for good.
Been waiting for the same.
So you don't like the thought of a guy acting "girly" while masquerading as a 5 foot tall mouse. OK.
Many definition of of accept are out there. I believe we're talking about
6. to accommodate or reconcile oneself to: to accept the situation.
Actually, I think everybody on here "accepts" that other people have other points of view, in terms of definition 6, quoted above.
Just becuase we agree that different opinions are held doesn't mean we understand why. And so we ask. And what is wrong with that?
Now that is an explanation. Thank you.
dreamfinder
Well-Known Member
Maybe its just me, but if I'm running up to get a hug from Tigger or Stitch, the last thing on my mind is who is friends with that given character. I've already had to step outside the real world to accept that a 6 foot walking tiger wants to give me a hug and that a 5 1/2 foot blue alien wants to hang ten.