Twilight_Roxas
Well-Known Member
Plus about the change did everyone forgot Walt's quote. "As long as there's imagination left in the world. Disneyland will never be complete."
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Guardians of the Galaxy Mission Breakout announced for Disney California Adventure
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brb1006
Well-Known Member
Here are some examplesI have to respectfully disagree, as I can think of two examples where fan outcry on web forums online made real changes.
Changed Disney's mind on a couple of matters.
One such change happened on his very Forum.
Every time someone says 'it won't make any difference', ' you can't change anything', or ' Disney does not listen to fans message forums' I feel a need to tell the tale of these two examples that DID make a difference.
Particularly the first tale....
Back in February 2007, it was learned that there was to be no official public acknowledgement or celebration of Epcot's 25th Anniversary.
People were very angry about it post-announcement and voiced their opinions on this Forum.
I remember it well.
Lots of groaning and disappointment.
A certain purple dragon here decided that instead of us all just sitting around being dissapointments about it and moaning online about Epcot being ignored, we should all get together and have our OWN 'celebration' in the Park.
A positive 'fan rally' showing Epcot some love.
The seed was planted in a thread that said purple dragon started right here and it spawned a bonified web 'movement'.
Fans joined together to offer help amd support for putting this together and it snowballed into a major Event.
The snowball started rolling and turned into a massive boulder within a couple of months time.
It garnered so much attention on this Forum it carried over into others.
Other websites started talking about it...blogs were being writte about it.
When 'registration' opened for the free Event, it attracted so many attendees signing up for the home grown 'Epcot celebration' that it made the Orlando Sentinel run a story about it in the press.
The story was Disney is 'doing nothing publically' but fans are rising up to celebrate in the Park that day regardless.
Then things really took off....like a rocket.....
After the press story happened, Disney suddenl did a complete turnaround in attitude regarding the Anniversary and soon a fantastic public celebration for the Park was announced.
Lots of bells and whistles.
Special presentations / ceremonies...and of course lots of Limited Edition 25th merchandise.
Thousands of people from around the country attended the Event, and thousands more just showed up for the day to be a part of what they had been following the story of online for months.
None of it was originally going to happen.
It was awesome...and in my opinion a huge victory for the Epcot fans.
They truly made a difference and turned things around.
Many reps from Disney, including management, Disney Legends, etc. came to Epcot that day as well and actively participated in the celebration.
The merch sold out completely within a couple of hours ( some peices within an hour )
Certain people took notice of all of this.
Research 'Epcot's 25 Anniversary' or 'Celebration 25' to learn the details.
It was a amazing story of how it all developed and what the end result was.
A great example of how fans CAN make a difference and change things via a web Forum...this one!
I should know...
I had a little to do with that Epcot Anniversary happening.....see, I was the 'purple dragon'.
The other incident that comes to mind is the group of fans known as 'The Friends of Figment'.
This was a website set up some years ago by fans of the original 'Journey Into Imagination' Attraction.
In 1998 the Original beloved Attraction was closed, shamelessly gutted, and repurposed into a truly terrible excuse for a 'replacement' called 'Journey Into YOUR Imagination'.....with NO Dreamfinder or Figment.
Oh, and hardly any imagination contained with it, either!
Fans were outraged and disgusted.
The fallout after opening was heard all the way to Burbank and Glendale.
People were livid at the removal of the Original Attraction for this utter garbage, but also for the removal of Figment ( and Dreamfinder, it must be said ).
They wanted these characters back, and a imaginative Attraction again.
It was clear fans of e Park(s) HATED the '2nd version' with a seething displeasure.
The 'replacement' was a horribly lame and cheap effort.
I don't think there has ever been a ride closure that has generated such active and loud backlash against Disney as the opening of the poorly executed '2nd version'.
Fans let their voices be heard and web sites like 'The Friends of Figment' played a key role in getting the terrible '2nd try' closed and a new '3rd version' opened.
A online petition and direct letter writing campaign to Disney sent a clear message - we want Figment BACK!
The terrible '2nd version' closed shortly later, only being open for about a year.
Soon afterwards it was announced Figment would return in a brand new Attraction slated to open the following year.
When the Attraction re-opened in the early 2000s, as 'Journey Into Your Imagination with Figment', fans rejoiced at their purple buddies' return.
He was back in the Pavilion and in the Park he belonged after being sorely missed.
In general folks felt the new ( current ) Attraction was far better then the lame '2nd version', but in no way could it match the brilliance and appeal of the Original.
Still, because of the public outcry and web forum efforts, fans made a difference in convincing Disney that this character and what he represents was important.
They played a role, and still do, in letting them know this characters means something.
So you see, people do have the power to make a difference...even through fan forums on the Internet.
I'm living proof.
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You do have a valid point, however, in that fans cannot just complain and expect changes.
A fan, or group of fans, need to actively seek a means to make those changes happen...or at the very least actively try.
Just sitting on your duff and typing on a web forum is not enough.
Action is essential, not just words.
That is the difference between success and non-success.
Disney will never satisfy everyone, and it's probably for the best that they do not even try.
It's better for them to offer a little variety instead of the same type of offering over and over again.
We already see that in the Parks ....over saturation of certain aspects.
The 'kidified' aspects encroaching within concepts that would have been better going in a more interesting direction.
It's good people have such vastly different tastes and opinions on those tastes.
Sure makes reading the Forums a lot more entertaining!
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http://www.yesterland.com/epcot25.html
http://land.allears.net/blogs/debwills/2007/10/epcots_25th_celebration_rededi.html
I hope we might do something like this if WDW doesn't have any special plans for its 50th Anniversary.
Californian Elitist
Well-Known Member
This quote is always misused, such as now. And imagination? What imagination?
SSG
Well-Known Member
I don't think it was anyone's dream to take out the Tower and replace it with GotG (not mine, for sure). Rather than excited, I think right now a lot of people are where I am now, which is cautiously optimistic that the change will be well done and be a worthwhile addition. The idea of going through the Collector's collection in the queue looks fun and the story has possibilities. The bigger slice of my optimism comes from hope of this being the start of a well executed Marvel Land, which could be very positive for DCA down the line.
Curious Constance
Well-Known Member
I have no clue what any of that means, but I'm gonna go ahead and give it a like anyway. What the heck.
Curious Constance
Well-Known Member
I think one reason why it seems like the casual DL guest is upset is because the casual guest is confused and thinks the entire ride is going away. I don't think they realize it's just a re-theme. My friend at work today said, "My favorite ride at DL,TOT, is being taken out. " She is not a big fan like me, just an average, periodic visitor. When I explained it's actually not being removed, but enhanced and getting a new theme, she felt better. She also made a note to watch GotG. Lol
Look at that! Synergy working!
" She is not a big fan like me, just an average, periodic visitor. When I explained it's actually not being removed, but enhanced and getting a new theme, she felt better. She also made a note to watch GotG. LolLook at that! Synergy working!
Curious Constance
Well-Known Member
Have I told you lately that I love you? I could listen to your inside gossip all day!!!
Stevek
Well-Known Member
Prominent WDW bloggers and or podcasters. Basically folks who's sole purpose is to live in the magic every day and would do nothing to get kicked off the Disney gravy train.I have no clue what any of that means, but I'm gonna go ahead and give it a like anyway. What the heck.
GiveMeTheMusic
Well-Known Member
This is what it boils down to.
Disney doesn't care what you think. They know that even if they change out TOT, most upset fans won't actually cancel their APs (and if they do, no big loss - there are too many APs anyway). Most upset fans will keep going to the parks in some capacity. Most of the general non-fan public won't know/care. Disney knows they'd make headlines for closing Pirates of the Caribbean or the Haunted Mansion - they're not gonna do that. Angering the fans is not a big deal.
They want to put Marvel in Hollywood Land and they've decided the first step is redoing TOT. Just like when there was fan backlash over Aladdin closing, they're going ahead anyway. They knew fans would be angry and they don't care.
In some ways, that's good. Disney shouldn't run its parks on the anger of fans - for example, Aladdin needed to close. It was old and tired and had outlived itself. Frozen is far superior in every way.
But sometimes the fans are right. The problem is that the people who run Disney aren't fans of their own product, so they can't know when they're right or wrong. They just make decisions and bulldoze through. Sometimes that works and benefits everything in the long run.
It's not much to change really. The biggest work will be the queue and boiler room areas. The show scenes are small spaces made up of screens that can be ripped out and replaced very quickly.
BrianLo
Well-Known Member
Fans are not coordinated enough and don't pick their battles. It's causing modern Disney to be increasingly bold and rash with their decisions.
If it was up to the fan community something like Carsland would have never been built. The more times everyone throws a fit and then shows up en mass, the more they will be ignored.
The same thing will happen with Star Wars Experience no doubt, it will essentially give them free reign to completely ignore any and every complaint going forward. Things like whining about a Frozen E-ticket entering Fantasyland is counter intuitive and useless, it's basically giving Disney permission to dismiss your opinion(s). There is just no unifying voice to separate the good decisions from the bad. The pessimists hate everything, the Pixie Dusters love it no matter what.
mickEblu
Well-Known Member
This is all true. I believe Disney is usually right and this is one of the times where they got it wrong.
I get it. They want Marvel in the parks because they believe it will generate more revenue and overlaying TOT is the fastest way to do it and it's in close enough proximity to where they will eventually build Marvel Land. But...why not build a new GOTG ride in Marvel Land? Now that would have generated genuine excitement. Seems like there will be plenty of space if the new rumors are to be believed. But no, they chose the easiest , cheapest way to generate some buzz and extra revenue short term and killed a fan favorite in the process.
It's just really odd to me. I want to say they are out of touch with their fans/ product here but I have to believe they knew they were going to get this mostly negative response from the fans AKA the people that spend their time and money at the park AKA their bread and butter at DLR. I understand how Marvel Land will generate more revenue but will this overlay result in any more than Minor short term gains? Is that worth destroying a fan favorite that IMO appeals to a much broader audience and has a theme that is timeless?
I think TOT is one of the few attractions that should have been on the untouchable list.
Andrew_Ryan
Well-Known Member
We're supposed to be considerate of the Disney corporation when sharing our opinons now? Good gravy.
yookeroo
Well-Known Member
I've not seen one comment about it in my Facebook or Twitter feed either way. So my takeaway is that most people don't care.
So, any guesses on completion/reopening dates now that the time line has been moved back? TOT was DD1's favorite ride at DHS, and I was happy to hear that it didn't look like the new ride would be closed on our trip next summer to DLR. But with the moved timeline, I'm wondering if I should push our trip further into summer to make sure she can ride it. (And maybe DS will to since he hated TOT because of the spooky factor, not because of the ride itself.)
danlb_2000
Premium Member
The only talk about the ride closing in January, I wonder if they might start exterior work with the ride still open.
dweezil78
Well-Known Member
They did the (pretty substantial) reskin of Test Track in about the same amount of time. Closed in April and officially reopened in December. If you've been on it, with exception of the track itself, it's barely recognizable to what was there 8 months earlier -- and ride-wise, there was a lot more to change than we'll have with ToT. I'm sure a lot of it is being worked on right now and will just be put into place once it goes down.