PhotoDave219
Well-Known Member
I'll clarify.
I think they'll replace the rope people fence with something else as time passes
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From the OS: Gator drags child into Seven Seas Lagoon
- Thread starter simba2
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I'll clarify.
I think they'll replace the rope people fence with something else as time passes
GhostHost1000
Premium Member
Some people associate no swimming to do not get in the water period but hopefully the new signs the fence and this unfortunately tragedy will make that more clear
G00fyDad
Well-Known Member
I agree. Taking a wild stab in the dark here, but I think that they are going to install a boardwalk style walkway and keep it in theme with the resort. I can just seriously see them removing the beaches completely. Although, doing something that extensive at every resort that has access to the water by the general public could be time-consuming and extremely costly. I'm sure they're going to want to keep the cost down so we may get something somewhere in between. I'm sure this rope fence is not the last we'll see of this.
Gators can climb chain link fences.
Some Humans can climb chain link fences, some can't
BrerJon
Well-Known Member
In 45 years there had only been one gator fatality, and with the publicity and new signs it will likely never happen again, and if it does, given now all anyone associates the lagoon with is gator attacks, then quite frankly they will only have themselves to blame with the new signage, so the fences are completely unnecessary. Increase the frequency of signs, let people know at check-in not to go into the water, sure, but no need for a fence.
They would have to modify yacht club, beach club, Swan and dolphin beaches. They would have to put up barriers all around swan and dolphin around the hotel and leading up to the boardwalk because it's just the river/lakes and grass up to the sidewalk. They would have to wall off all of Tom Sawyer island although I think most of it already has some kind of rope fence.
I think in the end it may just be easier to get rid of and drain all the lakes and rivers in the Disney area.
PhotoDave219
Well-Known Member
I beg to differ but these conversations are going in a circle.
draybook
Well-Known Member
Are they going to put fences/walls up in the parks and every other body of water? Heck, most of us have seen gators in the Magic Kingdom. There's the one at Splash Mountain, the RoA, even the one that was photographed in a bathroom. What happened to that kid was beyond horrible, no matter where the fault lies.
Unfortunately, these parents and Disney are the ones who have had to be an international example of what can happen. I hope this will become less of a blame situation and more of an awakening for people. Just because you're in the Disney bubble doesn't mean you can stop being aware. And honestly, Disney knows they have gators roaming freely and they learned the hard way that there should be better measures to ensure they at least stay away from guest areas. How will that be done, I don't know. I'm not an expert in that field. Hopefully they are able to solve that issue that is as much aesthetically pleasing as it is safe for guests.
I'm just glad that they were able to recover his body intact so they can have a proper service. My heart goes out to them, I can't even imagine losing a child no matter what the circumstances.
edit: in light of new information/misunderstanding of old information.
Unfortunately, these parents and Disney are the ones who have had to be an international example of what can happen. I hope this will become less of a blame situation and more of an awakening for people. Just because you're in the Disney bubble doesn't mean you can stop being aware. And honestly, Disney knows they have gators roaming freely and they learned the hard way that there should be better measures to ensure they at least stay away from guest areas. How will that be done, I don't know. I'm not an expert in that field. Hopefully they are able to solve that issue that is as much aesthetically pleasing as it is safe for guests.
I'm just glad that they were able to recover his body intact so they can have a proper service. My heart goes out to them, I can't even imagine losing a child no matter what the circumstances.
edit: in light of new information/misunderstanding of old information.
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G00fyDad
Well-Known Member
I agree. It would be more of a knee-jerk reaction than anything else. But honestly, I can seriously see some sort of additional barrier system happening at all resorts with water.
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
The following article from 2012 concerns Shipyard Plantation on Hilton Head Island (not Disney) and warns of the dangers of feeding alligators. The following sentence in particular was prophetic and gut-wrenching:
Article:
Disney has a large staff and monitoring cameras everywhere. Hopefully, these will enable Disney to enforce a strict "don't feed the alligators" policy.
"But I am not going to have an incident with a child either."
Article:
JUNE 24, 2012 11:35 PM
Shipyard Plantation working to protect alligators and people
By CASEY CONLEY- cconley@islandpacket.com
Less than a week after two alligators were removed and later killed, Shipyard Plantation on Hilton Head Island has launched an internal campaign to remind guests not to feed or bother the reptiles.
In a letter sent to property owners last week, Brian Pettersen, Shipyard's director of safety and security, urged residents to respect the animals and their habitat, noting "they were here first."
He also plans to install new state-issued signs near lagoons and golf courses with the message, "Fed alligators are dead alligators."
Those measures come about a month after an alligator bit a Georgia woman who had been fishing in a Shipyard lagoon, seriously injuring her foot. The gator, which experts believe had been fed repeatedly before the incident, was never caught.
Within the past week, two nuisance alligators were removed from Shipyard after they crept too close to humans -- a sign that they, too, had been fed.
Although guest safety is paramount, Pettersen said he also is concerned about the alligators' well-being.
"We are trying to save our wildlife here," he said.
'FED GATOR IS A DEAD GATOR'
State law defines nuisance alligators as those whose behavior threatens people, pets or property. Often, gators that meet the criteria have been fed by humans, said Dean Harrigel, a wildlife biologist with the S.C. Department of Natural Resources.
"Fed alligators quickly become habituated to humans, and they are the ones most likely to cause problems," he said. "If you feed an alligator, at some point in time, it's going to have to be taken in and killed."
Shipyard Plantation has hired Hilton Head-based Critter Management to monitor its alligators. Company owner Joe Maffo said the two alligators removed last week showed signs of being comfortable around humans. He said other gators in the community might also be removed.
"I hate it. I hate destroying these animals. I am not God," Maffo said Friday. "But I am not going to have an incident with a child either. We make an evaluation, and if a gator acts up, I take him."
'A FINANCIAL IMPACT NEEDED'
State law also says it is "unlawful to feed, entice or molest an alligator," but Maffo says people routinely ignore signs warning against feeding. He believes "just about every alligator on Hilton Head has been fed."
He met with Pettersen last week to discuss ways to reduce human interaction with the animals, and hopes to have similar discussions with officials in other gated communities.
Maffo believes fines are part of the solution.
"A financial impact is what it's going to take. The signage and telling people that you don't do this is not working. When you hit them in the pocketbook, that's when you will get a change," he said.
State law also allows law enforcement to fine anyone caught feeding or harassing alligators. But catching violators in the act isn't easy, Pettersen said.
"By the time we get there, they are gone, or they are there and they aren't feeding them anymore," he said. "We have to see them doing it to give a citation, which makes it a little difficult."
Pettersen couldn't recall an incident in which his staff issued an alligator-related citation, which can carry fines up to $150 and 30 days in jail.
Fines also are rare at Hilton Head and Sea Pines plantations, the two largest developments on the island, according to officials there.
REPEATING THE MESSAGE
Harrigel says warnings about not feeding gators should be repeated often on Hilton Head and other vacation destinations because new guests are constantly coming and going.
"General reminders are one thing. Fines are another," he said. "The fact is, if you are feeding that animal, you are more than likely leading to its demise."
Shipyard Plantation working to protect alligators and people
By CASEY CONLEY- cconley@islandpacket.com
Less than a week after two alligators were removed and later killed, Shipyard Plantation on Hilton Head Island has launched an internal campaign to remind guests not to feed or bother the reptiles.
In a letter sent to property owners last week, Brian Pettersen, Shipyard's director of safety and security, urged residents to respect the animals and their habitat, noting "they were here first."
He also plans to install new state-issued signs near lagoons and golf courses with the message, "Fed alligators are dead alligators."
Those measures come about a month after an alligator bit a Georgia woman who had been fishing in a Shipyard lagoon, seriously injuring her foot. The gator, which experts believe had been fed repeatedly before the incident, was never caught.
Within the past week, two nuisance alligators were removed from Shipyard after they crept too close to humans -- a sign that they, too, had been fed.
Although guest safety is paramount, Pettersen said he also is concerned about the alligators' well-being.
"We are trying to save our wildlife here," he said.
'FED GATOR IS A DEAD GATOR'
State law defines nuisance alligators as those whose behavior threatens people, pets or property. Often, gators that meet the criteria have been fed by humans, said Dean Harrigel, a wildlife biologist with the S.C. Department of Natural Resources.
"Fed alligators quickly become habituated to humans, and they are the ones most likely to cause problems," he said. "If you feed an alligator, at some point in time, it's going to have to be taken in and killed."
Shipyard Plantation has hired Hilton Head-based Critter Management to monitor its alligators. Company owner Joe Maffo said the two alligators removed last week showed signs of being comfortable around humans. He said other gators in the community might also be removed.
"I hate it. I hate destroying these animals. I am not God," Maffo said Friday. "But I am not going to have an incident with a child either. We make an evaluation, and if a gator acts up, I take him."
'A FINANCIAL IMPACT NEEDED'
State law also says it is "unlawful to feed, entice or molest an alligator," but Maffo says people routinely ignore signs warning against feeding. He believes "just about every alligator on Hilton Head has been fed."
He met with Pettersen last week to discuss ways to reduce human interaction with the animals, and hopes to have similar discussions with officials in other gated communities.
Maffo believes fines are part of the solution.
"A financial impact is what it's going to take. The signage and telling people that you don't do this is not working. When you hit them in the pocketbook, that's when you will get a change," he said.
State law also allows law enforcement to fine anyone caught feeding or harassing alligators. But catching violators in the act isn't easy, Pettersen said.
"By the time we get there, they are gone, or they are there and they aren't feeding them anymore," he said. "We have to see them doing it to give a citation, which makes it a little difficult."
Pettersen couldn't recall an incident in which his staff issued an alligator-related citation, which can carry fines up to $150 and 30 days in jail.
Fines also are rare at Hilton Head and Sea Pines plantations, the two largest developments on the island, according to officials there.
REPEATING THE MESSAGE
Harrigel says warnings about not feeding gators should be repeated often on Hilton Head and other vacation destinations because new guests are constantly coming and going.
"General reminders are one thing. Fines are another," he said. "The fact is, if you are feeding that animal, you are more than likely leading to its demise."
Disney has a large staff and monitoring cameras everywhere. Hopefully, these will enable Disney to enforce a strict "don't feed the alligators" policy.
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Yup only solution is to close down Disney world. Alligators in splash mountain and in The bathrooms in the magic kingdom. We have to be safe. A child is dead.
JohnD
Well-Known Member
And we'll make the gators pay for it! (Sorry, couldn't resist)
Out of curiosity, where did you see the photos from the mother? I wouldn't think she'd bother to get on Facebook for a while after such a traumatic event, especially when it would for sure get her plenty of hate mail and cries of "you deserved it!" (judging by all the comments I've seen). Though I could be wrong, maybe she did post them. But I've seen dozens of people post pictures of their OWN children in the water to show solidarity with the mom. Are you sure those weren't the pictures you saw?
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
No Disney is not going to ignore the problem but since manangement has destroyed trust with their workforce how do they now get buy in from the CM's?
I volunteer for state/county emergency management so I get to think about the unthinkable. One of the problems in emergency manangement is that There is a mutual breakdown in trust between police and the community.
The SAME problem exists at Disney between management and the CM's
Yes its a huge tragedy but there is ZERO incentive for the average CM to 'get involved'
Disney has created a huge problem for themselves Yes this is a problem for Management but Disney has created a huge disconnect between the average CM and management. And that's going to make it virtually impossible to enforce wildlife safety programs
Basically they are going to have to create a wildlife safety patrol just to keep the animals and humans separate
JohnD
Well-Known Member
I think the poster is confused with another Mom who posted photos of her son ankle deep in the water in the same location just 30 minutes prior.
draybook
Well-Known Member
You are correct. I woke up and saw that I had misread the article. Corrected for clarification. Thank you.
rael ramone
Well-Known Member
If this actually *hits* court - $DIS will lose the battle that means the 2nd most to them - public relations. (And likely the one that means far more to them then even that - the stock price). Especially if other 'avenues of fault' appear, like, say, if it turns out budget cuts *were* a factor...
21stamps
Well-Known Member
I really wish people would stop saying that if you're upset about the fence it is disrespecting the boy. Or makes you less compassionate.
Let's be logical please.
A fence is being put up to protect from future liability and to prove to the world that something was "done".
New signage should have been good enough to keep people out and to not feed alligators. A fence will not stop some idiot who wants to give a gator food. A lot (most) people probably still feel safe on that beach without a fence.
But unfortunately this is 2016, and we need to be protected from ourselves.. Because obviously we can't be trusted to read a sign which in huge letters says -
DANGER
Alligators and Snakes in Area
Stay Away From The Water
Do Not Feed the Wildlife
We're that untrustworthy now. Because we live in a lawsuit happy world, so there must be a clear barrier so no speculation could arise if someone went over a barrier instead of ignoring a sign.
Let's be logical please.
A fence is being put up to protect from future liability and to prove to the world that something was "done".
New signage should have been good enough to keep people out and to not feed alligators. A fence will not stop some idiot who wants to give a gator food. A lot (most) people probably still feel safe on that beach without a fence.
But unfortunately this is 2016, and we need to be protected from ourselves.. Because obviously we can't be trusted to read a sign which in huge letters says -
DANGER
Alligators and Snakes in Area
Stay Away From The Water
Do Not Feed the Wildlife
We're that untrustworthy now. Because we live in a lawsuit happy world, so there must be a clear barrier so no speculation could arise if someone went over a barrier instead of ignoring a sign.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
Some people really need to get a grip.
The only areas Disney is likely to alter are the beach areas where they meet the water.
Not all of the grassy slopes, and not along every stretch of water throughout the park system.
They only need to protect where beach meets water so that a guest strolling the shoreline won't get picked off by an ambush predator.
And no, they don't need to build gator proof or people proof barriers. That's not the idea,
Probably install rocks, or boardwalk, or small walls - possibly a combination of all three depending on where they are doing it, and according to the design aesthetics of the particular area.
The only areas Disney is likely to alter are the beach areas where they meet the water.
Not all of the grassy slopes, and not along every stretch of water throughout the park system.
They only need to protect where beach meets water so that a guest strolling the shoreline won't get picked off by an ambush predator.
And no, they don't need to build gator proof or people proof barriers. That's not the idea,
Probably install rocks, or boardwalk, or small walls - possibly a combination of all three depending on where they are doing it, and according to the design aesthetics of the particular area.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
Well, you see - there was no such sign.
There was a no swimming sign, but nothing warning of not going down to the waters edge.
The whole set up was designed to bring you to the shoreline.
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