FP+ only Toy Story Midway Mania

[WDW1974]

I know you're joking, but really, I know that Disney's goal here is to get as many people out of queues and onto the streets, where they could be spending money.

Not really the case. That was FP's goal and it failed miserably at it.

FP+ is designed to better allocate guests throughout existing capacity in a park. That's why attractions that are often under 10 minutes (what I call walk-ons) like Pirates and Small World now routinely have waits of 25-45 minutes. FP+ simply moves guests from one queue to another and, should in theory allow Disney to have more guests in a park without adding more attractions.

HOWEVER, If you the people off by forcing them to use a system that half of them don't even know how or really want to use, are they going to want to spend any money at your park? I can't answer that question flat out, but even if they do still spend money, the key thing is, will they come back?

Well, I can tell you for a fact that Disney is aware that many guests are 'one and dones' and they are OK with current numbers, so I don't see that changing.

 

[BrianV]

I think Universal Express has very little import in a discussion about Disney's FP+.

I agree with much of what you say, but seems to me that how the competing theme parks treat their guests is very relevant. Theme parks, even disney, do indeed have to consider the competition.

I can say that I would absolutely HATE express pass as an off site guest. It would make me livid to the point of not wanting to go to universal. As I am always an on site guest, I of course partake of it.

If disney were to do something similar, I would of course use it if it were given freely (I.e. On site guests get it). But that wouldn't make it a good idea. And again I would hate it as an off site guest.

Universal needs to do this to get guests to stay in their hotels. Unless disney is cooking their books, they don't need to.

 

[MichWolv]

Wow, it turns out I have a lot more to say ... thanks to posts like yours above!

UNI isn't Disney and Disney isn't UNI and that has always and will always be the case. (Don't you love such deep statements?)

Disney based its parks on many tenets handed down from Uncle Walt and all those who followed. One of the most basic was that every guest was treated equally ... like a VIP ... (note: you don't see this one quote on any painted construction walls now, do you?)

If you paid, then you were all treated the same. It was fair, it was simple, it was all American!

Universal wasn't founded on that at all. They don't have to be held to Disney's standards. The only standards they should be held to are their own and what their visitors believe is fair and just. I haven't seen much outrage over Express Pass amongst the UNI fan community. It only bothers me on Horror Nights, but that's another subject (heck, and a Disney like deal of an upcharge within an upcharge!)

I think Universal Express has very little import in a discussion about Disney's FP+.

So if the only standards to assess a company against are the ones the company itself sets, then Disney can change its standards and we have to stop assessing them against the old ones. I don't buy it.

We can assess a company against whatever standards we wish. We can even decide to assess different companies against different standards (and clearly have decided to do so in regards to Uni Express Pass). But to wash our hands of it and say that we will only assess a company against its own standards just doesn't do it. Especially since you aren't willing (rightfully so) to do that with Disney.

I do agree that Uni Express Pass isn't particularly relevant in a discussion about FP+. I didn't bring it up, but just responded to the off-topic comment.

 

[WDW1974]

I agree with much of what you say, but seems to me that how the competing theme parks treat their guests is very relevant. Theme parks, even disney, do indeed have to consider the competition.

Fair enough. But the point of dragging UNI into a discussion to say ''Imagine if Disney did THAT?!?!'' doesn't add much. It just sorta moves the target. ... You are right, it certainly can be relevant, but to what end?

I remember when Al Lutz reported Paul Pressler's infamous ''If it's good enough for Six Flags...'' comment. That was so biting specifically because of where both companies resided in the pecking order of the business.

Even now, most Disney fans refuse to admit that UNI has even equaled Disney in O-Town in any sense, let alone surpassed them in many (which I would argue is true).

So, 'what ifs?' designed to simply take the focus off of one company's business practices doesn't do much for me.

I can say that I would absolutely HATE express pass as an off site guest. It would make me livid to the point of not wanting to go to universal. As I am always an on site guest, I of course partake of it.

If disney were to do something similar, I would of course use it if it were given freely (I.e. On site guests get it). But that wouldn't make it a good idea. And again I would hate it as an off site guest.

It has never bothered me. The number of guests who have it and use it are not significant enough to increase standby waits by more than a few minutes. I like having it ... sure. I even like having some special VIP friends who simply walk me on through the exit on some of the biggest attractions.

But even when I'm simply waiting, I have never found UEP to be something that makes me nearly as livid as seeing Disney putting FP on everything from Omnimovers to meet-greet-and-gropes to QSRs. What is next? Tangled Toilet FP+? Seriously.

Universal needs to do this to get guests to stay in their hotels. Unless disney is cooking their books, they don't need to.

No, they really don't. Those hotels do great business at price points significantly lower than Disney's. I was told that last week UNI was well into the 90s amongst all its resorts.

As for Disney, they take buildings out of inventory all the time (take a look around BWI and CBR right now as they have rehabs going on) ... they are also the company that is working feverishly to become a timeshare resort because they've priced a significant portion of their guests out of their resorts and they refuse to simply come up with a realistic pricing model.

 

[WDW1974]

So if the only standards to assess a company against are the ones the company itself sets, then Disney can change its standards and we have to stop assessing them against the old ones. I don't buy it.

Of course not. I judge WDW first and foremost on hundreds of visits to the place over the past 40 years. I then judge it against what the company is doing in its other P&R around the globe. And then I judge it against what other companies are doing.

But your point just seemed to be one of those typical message board pro-Disney posts of ''imagine if Disney did this horrible affront to humanity that the evil tyrants at Comcast do over at UNI'' ...

Bottom line is I want Disney to live up to ITS own standards and its PR and its history.

And, as I stated in the above post, Disney and UNI didn't come from the same place. They have different histories and legacies. I don't feel that Express in any way diminishes UNI's product to the masses (it also didn't cost $2 billion and counting too!)

We can assess a company against whatever standards we wish. We can even decide to assess different companies against different standards (and clearly have decided to do so in regards to Uni Express Pass). But to wash our hands of it and say that we will only assess a company against its own standards just doesn't do it. Especially since you aren't willing (rightfully so) to do that with Disney.

I do agree that Uni Express Pass isn't particularly relevant in a discussion about FP+. I didn't bring it up, but just responded to the off-topic comment.

Agreed.

 

[Next Big Thing]

It has never bothered me. The number of guests who have it and use it are not significant enough to increase standby waits by more than a few minutes. I like having it ... sure. I even like having some special VIP friends who simply walk me on through the exit on some of the biggest attractions.

But even when I'm simply waiting, I have never found UEP to be something that makes me nearly as livid as seeing Disney putting FP on everything from Omnimovers to meet-greet-and-gropes to QSRs. What is next? Tangled Toilet FP+? Seriously.




No, they really don't. Those hotels do great business at price points significantly lower than Disney's. I was told that last week UNI was well into the 90s amongst all its resorts.

As for Disney, they take buildings out of inventory all the time (take a look around BWI and CBR right now as they have rehabs going on) ... they are also the company that is working feverishly to become a timeshare resort because they've priced a significant portion of their guests out of their resorts and they refuse to simply come up with a realistic pricing model.

What the hell are you on Spirit? Has anyone bothered to click the little arrow that takes you to the original post in the quote? I never said ANY of that.

 

[TheRabbit]

Quick question. How many of the people complaining about this 4 day test are actually being affected by it?

Enough that Disney's stock dropped the past 2 days.....and people don't think this effects the financial side.

 

[jakeman]

Enough that Disney's stock dropped the past 2 days.....and people don't think this effects the financial side.

You know the Dow Jones dropped and recovered (along with Disney's stock) in the past 2 days right?

 

[TheRabbit]

You know the Dow Jones dropped and recovered (along with Disney's stock) in the past 2 days right?

Yes sir. But not all stocks fell. And it is a bit interesting that Disney did dip after the Sentinal and Money articles.

 

[WDW1974]

What the hell are you on Spirit? Has anyone bothered to click the little arrow that takes you to the original post in the quote? I never said ANY of that.

Someone informed me of the terrible transgression of quoting you by mistake (obviously) likely due to the fact I am ancient and not tech savvy and type with just my middle finger.

As to what I am on ... nah, I don't think this is worth a nasty exchange with our lovely mods.

Just go have a MAGICal night!

 

[jakeman]

Yes sir. But not all stocks fell. And it is a bit interesting that Disney did dip after the Sentinal and Money articles.

Seriously?

The Dow Jones average fell and recovered in almost the exact same fashion as DIS and you're just going to dismiss that with the excuse that not all the stocks fell? You superimpose their image and it's almost the exact same thing.

What else do you need for proof? How about the S&P 500? Yep...same thing:

NASDAQ Composite:

Maybe try again...

 

[George]

Yes sir. But not all stocks fell. And it is a bit interesting that Disney did dip after the Sentinal and Money articles.

Not really since the modern stock market is a consensual mass delusion almost completely untethered from the true worth of a company.

 

[TheRabbit]

Not really since the modern stock market is a consensual mass delusion almost completely untethered from the true worth of a company.

Ok, guess I was wrong.

 

[TheRabbit]

Seriously?

The Dow Jones average fell and recovered in almost the exact same fashion as DIS and you're just going to dismiss that with the excuse that not all the stocks fell? You superimpose their image and it's almost the exact same thing.

What else do you need for proof? How about the S&P 500? Yep...same thing:

NASDAQ Composite:

Maybe try again...

Guess I was wrong. This whole thing with the fast pass only test was a great idea! There, is that better?

 

[jakeman]

Guess I was wrong. This whole thing with the fast pass only test was a great idea! There, is that better?

I never said it was a good idea, just that the FastPass test in one attraction, of one park, of one property, of one division of The Walt Disney Company wasn't responsible for a drop in the stock price when correlated to the rest of the market's performance over the same time period.

It seems like a pretty standard thing to check before throwing it out there as an indicator of a corporation level failure.

However, the desire for folks to use actual facts left this thread a long time ago.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I never said it was a good idea, just that the FastPass test in one attraction, of one park, of one property, of one division of The Walt Disney Company wasn't responsible for a drop in the stock price when correlated to the rest of the market's performance over the same time period.

It seems like a pretty standard thing to check before throwing it out there as an indicator of a corporation level failure.

However, the desire for folks to use actual facts left this thread a long time ago.

That's because there are no actual facts. If it isn't actually visible, it is nothing but conjecture, panic induced rumors and wild a$$ guesses.

 

[BigTxEars]

Wow missed a few days and this moved over to Wall Street?

I saw this in a movie once....

 

[BigTxEars]

What the hell are you on Spirit? Has anyone bothered to click the little arrow that takes you to the original post in the quote? I never said ANY of that.

Well now I know what the arrow is for.....or even that there is an arrow

People read what they want to read not what is written or intended some times, that is not unique to this board either

 

[CDavid]

Well now I know what the arrow is for.....or even that there is an arrow

People read what they want to read not what is written or intended some times, that is not unique to this board either

Oh, good. I thought I must be the only one who had never even seen that little arrow before, let alone know what it was there for.

What I am about to say next is not directed at anyone in particular, and certainly not yourself or @Next Big Thing , but this is a discussion forum - not a peer reviewed journal. We all see a lot of rumors, speculation, and even fanboy dreaming in various threads, and I doubt any of us can completely recall just where or when or in what context we first heard something mentioned. Most (reputable) posters aren't deliberately making stuff up; All the details just get jumbled in people's minds and it is too easy to confuse baseless rumor with confirmed Disney policy. Surely we aren't going to have to begin citing sources whenever we discuss things.

 

[AEfx]

I called this one with BoG. I knew it was only a matter of time until it happened to an attraction/ride.

It's deplorable. It wasn't even that long ago, that the entrance to an attraction was open until closing time and you could get in line up until the very minute before the park "closed" - so if MGM closed at 9 you could get in line at 8:59PM and wait inside and get to ride the attraction to end your day. That was part of that "quality" that differentiated WDW from every other park. The value that the always premium priced Disney experience was about where you didn't mind so much the cost because you got the best level of service.

I'm disgusted, honestly - even though I knew it was coming one way or another. This may just be a "test" - but tests are done in preparation for implementation, one of the last steps. Now, if you don't get to MGM by lunch you can forget riding, best case scenario is you get one near park closing.

We get the short end of the stick on attraction quality (or new attractions at all), prices keep skyrocketing, overall guest service has declined over the years as the staff has switched from career CM's to lower-than-minimum wage CP "I'm outta here in X-months" types, yet - I have to be honest, this is really the worst thing I have heard in quite some time that really has me losing what faith I had left in WDW as a quality experience.

At least there is still Disneyland, where they wouldn't dare attempt anything as outrageous as this.