Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

[KevinYee]

So the conversation was ignited by cutting out the little things that make the big things so special. One of my favorite places to go as a kid was Farrell's Ice Cream Parlor. http://www.farrellsusa.com/

A very fun place to go with lots of special items that triggered crazy waiter behavior including sirens. The longest sandwich in the world was the "Gastronomicaldelicatessenepicurean's Delight"! The founder, Bob Farrell has a site dedicated to "the Pickle Principle", meaning good customer service and more importantly, being generous on what you spend on those details and making the customer happy by not charging for every single tiny item.

Read the story of the Pickle and let me know your thoughts.

http://www.giveemthepickle.com/pickle_principle.htm

This was the heart of the Empowerment Evolution in the mid/late 90s, which today is talked about more in terms of Service Recovery. Unfortunately, it coincided with computerization and just in time inventory, meaning that there was a FORM to be filled out when you "just give them a pickle" at Disney (I don't know if this is still true).

Culture and institutional memory matter more than most people, including me once upon a time, think. The changing of the guard always occurs, but maybe especially as "the guard" finally started retiring 30 or 40 years after the park(s) opened (on either coast)... and were replaced by MBAs from outside the company rather than front line folks promoted up.

For outsiders, you could easily imagine them saying: "What pickle? What are you talking about?" (and yes, I used the C3PO voice in my head there)

 

[Eddie Sotto]

This was the heart of the Empowerment Evolution in the mid/late 90s, which today is talked about more in terms of Service Recovery. Unfortunately, it coincided with computerization and just in time inventory, meaning that there was a FORM to be filled out when you "just give them a pickle" at Disney (I don't know if this is still true).

Culture and institutional memory matter more than most people, including me once upon a time, think. The changing of the guard always occurs, but maybe especially as "the guard" finally started retiring 30 or 40 years after the park(s) opened (on either coast)... and were replaced by MBAs from outside the company rather than front line folks promoted up.

For outsiders, you could easily imagine them saying: "What pickle? What are you talking about?" (and yes, I used the C3PO voice in my head there)

Great insight. (translated R2D2) My point is that you need to care about what the guest is touching and experiencing in the moment, and that sometimes it's a small detail like a pickle (or a napkin) that becomes the pleasure factor of the whole experience. It's a tipping point. At times, it's the wholesale elimination of the pickle altogether, or the "nickel and diming" of the company to alert the guest that profit is more important than the tiniest pleasure, and break the "spell" it took millions to create in the process.

 

[John]

Bob Iger ( yoda's voice)... a pickle say you be....hmmmmmmmm

 

[Jeanine]

So the conversation was ignited by cutting out the little things that make the big things so special. One of my favorite places to go as a kid was Farrell's Ice Cream Parlor. http://www.farrellsusa.com/

Read the story of the Pickle and let me know your thoughts.

http://www.giveemthepickle.com/pickle_principle.htm

Great story. It reminds me of the story Randy Pausch told, about being at WDW when he was little and pooling all his money together to buy some ceramic item for his parents...which he walked outside and promptly dropped on the ground and shattered. A passerby noticing his misery encouraged him to tell the CMs inside what had happened, and when he did, they replaced it immediately, reassuring him that it must have been their fault for packing it poorly. After his parents found out, they were confirmed Disney fans for life.

I always think it's ironic, then, when I see his memorial there, that the tale in the book actually ends with him working with Disney as an adult, and reciting the story to Disney executives...who then have to admit that they would never empower a CM to do the same thing today...

 

[ChrisFL]

I always think it's ironic, then, when I see his memorial there, that the tale in the book actually ends with him working with Disney as an adult, and reciting the story to Disney executives...who then have to admit that they would never empower a CM to do the same thing today...

....and because of that, Disney in the future will not be able to attract the same passionate designers like Randy Pausch was.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

....and because of that, Disney in the future will not be able to attract the same passionate designers like Randy Pausch was.

Have heart. There are still many great stories of CM's going out of their way for guests. Just because they have the wrong napkin does not mean the bartenders were not wonderful. In the end, the CM's make or break the whole vacation.

 

[celluloid]

As a former College Programer who aspires to one day be in themed entertainment design in some form I can say that aspect of the company is still pretty classy.

In my five month emplyment as Main Street Custodial I was able to witness a good number of free socks, shoes and other clothing items for children who needed it. I saw people walk right back in the emporium with damaged goods(that were likely the result of them breaking them from the small child in their party dropping them) and the CMs quickly get a manager and make sure a new one is issued.

A common system with non merch direct employees are the "No Strings Attached" slips. Managers at the WDW parks and resorts have these for such cases of losing a shoe on a ride or having something damaged. Within reasons seen fit a CM is told to go to a leader to get one written up and then give it to the guest/party so they can redeem what they need.

Also I can personally say I have countless stories of giving new ice cream bars and fresh full popcorn to those spilled and dropped by guests of all types and ages.

I am saddened by many things in WDW with the way things are lacking upkeep or budgeted, but that sort of magic of keeping guest satisfaction is not one that has slipped. There is still tons of pride in that.

Sorry for distracting the thread, just had to share that.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

As a former College Programer who aspires to one day be in themed entertainment design in some form I can say that aspect of the company is still pretty classy.

In my five month emplyment as Main Street Custodial I was able to witness a good number of free socks, shoes and other clothing items for children who needed it. I saw people walk right back in the emporium with damaged goods(that were likely the result of them breaking them from the small child in their party dropping them) and the CMs quickly get a manager and make sure a new one is issued.

A common system with non merch direct employees are the "No Strings Attached" slips. Managers at the WDW parks and resorts have these for such cases of losing a shoe on a ride or having something damaged. Within reasons seen fit a CM is told to go to a leader to get one written up and then give it to the guest/party so they can redeem what they need.

Also I can personally say I have countless stories of giving new ice cream bars and fresh full popcorn to those spilled and dropped by guests of all types and ages.

I am saddened by many things in WDW with the way things are lacking upkeep or budgeted, but that sort of magic of keeping guest satisfaction is not one that has slipped. There is still tons of pride in that.

Sorry for distracting the thread, just had to share that.

A dose of positive reality is always welcome! Thanks for posting.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

I dislike the "Walmarting" term and I disagree that WDW was ever only supposed to be for the well-to-do. I think of the Wal-Mart experience as cutting out all the frills to deliver the lowest possible price. Charging less for less. What has been happening is that Disney has been charging MORE for less. A one day ticket cost $15 in 1982; inflation would bring that up to about $36 today. Instead, a one day ticket costs $85 today. Look at the dining plan: you used to get tip and an appetizer with your table service meals, and the dining plan cost less then than it does now.

Disney has always been for everyone as every guest is a VIP. Not elitist, just the best. However, it was also true that Disneyland was a quality experience and like many families, we valued that and saved up for it. We saved trading stamps to have tickets when I was a boy. Once a year was it.

 

[Uncle Lupe]

The parks still offer a quality experience but with current social media the world can nit pick every detail.

The public has changed also, people feel they are entitled to things without paying for them. I work retail and every pin station and shop I noticed empty cards,( stuff like that jumps out at you when you are trained to look.) People had stolen pins. So if people who visit now cannot appreciate all the work that goes into the parks like they did in the good old days. Then it is only natural for Disney to cut back on frills.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

The parks still offer a quality experience but with current social media the world can nit pick every detail.

The public has changed also, people feel they are entitled to things without paying for them. I work retail and every pin station and shop I noticed empty cards,( stuff like that jumps out at you when you are trained to look.) People had stolen pins. So if people who visit now cannot appreciate all the work that goes into the parks like they did in the good old days. Then it is only natural for Disney to cut back on frills.

The world has changed. True. I think they DO think they are entitled to everything because they believe they have already paid for it via huge admissions and packages. Morals have gone by the wayside for many, true as well, but when you feel gouged you want just as much value. When you perceived you are getting charged a lot for everyday things you tend to think in a predatory way.

The Eisner Era was about raising all the prices in increments till they hit "price resistance" from the public. At that point, people are not happy and staying away. So you are charging what the traffic will bear, so people see the parks as a "getting your money's worth" proposition with all the unlimited passports and so forth. A "Get it all it in because the meter is running" mentality.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

Thought I'd never see this.

As you know, there is a tradition of graphically "shrink wrapping" urban rapid transit systems, and the WDW Monorail is no longer exempt from this. This started as a means of celebrating and tying the trains into on-property celebration decor like anniversaries, etc. Now we have moved into promoting movies. Just like on a city Bus. Ok, it's true that the company promotes their movies and properties in the parks sometimes in ways that are blatant, like poster cabinets outside the gate, etc.

In scanning the Miceage weekend update, they showed the heroic new "Marvel Avengers" promo Monorail. It features dynamically posed Superheroes with electricity in photorealistic fashion. The one thing that stood out to me was the image of one of the characters pointing a gun. It really bothered me and in that context, conflicted with what I see as the values or "tone" of the Resort. So Universal. What do you think?

When I think of WDW and it's vast pastoral property with the monorail at Sunset gliding through the Contemporary, images of Superheroes fighting (and especially kids in the station seeing someone pointing a gun in that way) just feels so urban, so "real world". I guess I pay to go to WDW to escape all the mayhem of life to a more optimistic place, not reminded of it with movie ads on the park Icons. I do think there's a way for Marvel to be on the property, but this is the first time I've sensed them in this way.

You may disagree, and the gun aspect is just a part of it, as there are Guns you shoot (or can buy as toys) in Frontierland, you even shoot them in Buzz Lightyear and they are being pointed at you in Pirates, there are lots of examples like that. I suppose they live in a thematic context that makes them part of something bigger. It must be a tipping point, as even more than just the gun, it felt so LA City Bus, not the sleek future that the monorail represents. Like putting a cheap bumper sticker on a Porsche 911. What you say? Overreaction? How much real world is enough and where?

http://micechat.com/blogs/weekend-u...-london;-dreamworks-experience;-route-66.html

 

[KevinYee]

I echo the objection to guns. The other thing that irritates me is that the Hulk is WAY too scary, as CGI-drawn here, for the MK. He honestly looks like a monster. Won't little girls fresh from their princess makeover feel threatened?

 

[COProgressFan]

As you know, there is a tradition of graphically "shrink wrapping" urban rapid transit systems, and the WDW Monorail is no longer exempt from this. This started as a means of celebrating and tying the trains into on-property celebration decor like anniversaries, etc. Now we have moved into promoting movies. Just like on a city Bus. Ok, it's true that the company promotes their movies and properties in the parks sometimes in ways that are blatant, like poster cabinets outside the gate, etc.

In scanning the Miceage weekend update, they showed the heroic new "Marvel Avengers" promo Monorail. It features dynamically posed Superheroes with electricity in photorealistic fashion. The one thing that stood out to me was the image of one of the characters pointing a gun. It really bothered me and in that context, conflicted with what I see as the values or "tone" of the Resort. So Universal. What do you think?

When I think of WDW and it's vast pastoral property with the monorail at Sunset gliding through the Contemporary, images of Superheroes fighting (and especially kids in the station seeing someone pointing a gun in that way) just feels so urban, so "real world". I guess I pay to go to WDW to escape all the mayhem of life to a more optimistic place, not reminded of it with movie ads on the park Icons. I do think there's a way for Marvel to be on the property, but this is the first time I've sensed them in this way.

You may disagree, and the gun aspect is just a part of it, as there are Guns you shoot (or can buy as toys) in Frontierland, you even shoot them in Buzz Lightyear and they are being pointed at you in Pirates, there are lots of examples like that. I suppose they live in a thematic context that makes them part of something bigger. It must be a tipping point, as even more than just the gun, it felt so LA City Bus, not the sleek future that the monorail represents. Like putting a cheap bumper sticker on a Porsche 911. What you say? Overreaction? How much real world is enough and where?

http://micechat.com/blogs/weekend-u...-london;-dreamworks-experience;-route-66.html

Completely agree with your sentiment here. The look of the monorail wrap is tacky and "real world" enough, but the gun pointing is juts pushing it over the edge. And I'm sure it looks just lovely in the MK station or driving by the $500 +/night rooms at the GF.

When these sorts of things appear, it signals to me that WDW has really lost touch with its own identity (meaning execs really don't know what WDW was and it what it should be).

 

[trs518]

It's the monorail. It's an icon. You don't mess with icons. Don't they remember the birthday cake castle?

 

[ChrisFL]

As you know, there is a tradition of graphically "shrink wrapping" urban rapid transit systems, and the WDW Monorail is no longer exempt from this. This started as a means of celebrating and tying the trains into on-property celebration decor like anniversaries, etc. Now we have moved into promoting movies. Just like on a city Bus. Ok, it's true that the company promotes their movies and properties in the parks sometimes in ways that are blatant, like poster cabinets outside the gate, etc.

In scanning the Miceage weekend update, they showed the heroic new "Marvel Avengers" promo Monorail. It features dynamically posed Superheroes with electricity in photorealistic fashion. The one thing that stood out to me was the image of one of the characters pointing a gun. It really bothered me and in that context, conflicted with what I see as the values or "tone" of the Resort. So Universal. What do you think?

When I think of WDW and it's vast pastoral property with the monorail at Sunset gliding through the Contemporary, images of Superheroes fighting (and especially kids in the station seeing someone pointing a gun in that way) just feels so urban, so "real world". I guess I pay to go to WDW to escape all the mayhem of life to a more optimistic place, not reminded of it with movie ads on the park Icons. I do think there's a way for Marvel to be on the property, but this is the first time I've sensed them in this way.

You may disagree, and the gun aspect is just a part of it, as there are Guns you shoot (or can buy as toys) in Frontierland, you even shoot them in Buzz Lightyear and they are being pointed at you in Pirates, there are lots of examples like that. I suppose they live in a thematic context that makes them part of something bigger. It must be a tipping point, as even more than just the gun, it felt so LA City Bus, not the sleek future that the monorail represents. Like putting a cheap bumper sticker on a Porsche 911. What you say? Overreaction? How much real world is enough and where?

http://micechat.com/blogs/weekend-u...-london;-dreamworks-experience;-route-66.html

I was already against the idea of the Avengers monorail for several reasons, didn't even know they actually showed a gun on it. They couldn't have found a better picture?

Anyway, I agree 100% with the problem. The TRON monorail overlay for me was not bad because

A.) It was the first time they tried something like it, so it was unique
B.) The lightcycle was represented as a single form of transport, like the monorail itself, therefore it "fit" better IMO
C.) TRON was Disney's own franchise from the start, they didn't just buy it (relatively speaking)

although I wished somehow they got the lightcycle to glow in the dark, that would have made it extra special.

So now, People will start to wonder what they'll do next, will we see the next teen pop star on monorails, and are they going to start wrapping more than one? The monorail has always been a clean, warm (in appearance) vehicle, now its just a moving billboard like city buses, as you said.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

As you know, there is a tradition of graphically "shrink wrapping" urban rapid transit systems, and the WDW Monorail is no longer exempt from this. This started as a means of celebrating and tying the trains into on-property celebration decor like anniversaries, etc. Now we have moved into promoting movies. Just like on a city Bus. Ok, it's true that the company promotes their movies and properties in the parks sometimes in ways that are blatant, like poster cabinets outside the gate, etc.

In scanning the Miceage weekend update, they showed the heroic new "Marvel Avengers" promo Monorail. It features dynamically posed Superheroes with electricity in photorealistic fashion. The one thing that stood out to me was the image of one of the characters pointing a gun. It really bothered me and in that context, conflicted with what I see as the values or "tone" of the Resort. So Universal. What do you think?


http://micechat.com/blogs/weekend-u...-london;-dreamworks-experience;-route-66.html

Spot on, my thoughts exactly. When I saw the new monorail with the Avengers wrap I thought it screamed Universal which has all of the superheroes plastered around with any thought about atmosphere.

The TRON monorail was cool, TRON is an established Disney franchise, plus, the first film wasn’t commercially successful but helped introduced computer graphics in movies, and to come out with a sequel decades later was a special event. The light cycle zooming on the monorail track made sense, in Future World at least, and while it was an advertisement, it had a certain optimism and mystique about it as it was well thought out.

The Avengers wrap might as well have been put on a bus, it is pretty generic and doesn’t look like it was made especially for the monorail. I didn’t notice the issue with the gun, but now that I do, I think it shouldn’t have been done as Disney typically doesn’t wave a lot images of guns around in the parks, which are supposed to be a sort of G-movie-rating experience for the whole family. Yes, I would characterize it as having that same 'gritty urban' feel of Universal, which doesn't match with the vast majority of WDW's bucolic background and hence makes it look cheap.

It could have worked better, like simply have Iron Man zooming in a line across the monorail with a contrail with a small Avengers logo/release date in back. Almost everybody likes Iron Man, and showcasing one character would make it look less cluttered, pus Iron Man is more futuristic than Scarlett Johanasson with a gun.

 

[Pixiedustmaker]

While Disneyland always needed to eventually make a profit to stay in business, you now have close to a dozen theme parks and the perpetual temptation to offer a little less or a little more to make millions each year. Ticket prices have gone up much faster than inflation, and food and beverages are always overcharged for as guests are viewed as a captive audience by some higher ups. The average cast member knows that the executives are focused on the bottom line, and making their bonuses, and the Tram drivers at WDW always used to make jokes about it.

A while ago I had a meal at the Boardwalk Past and Pizza . . . it was one of the worst meals I ever had, a slice of cold pizza I almost returned that had little cheese and costed around $8! For that price I could have gotten three edible slices of pizza in Brooklyn. It was literally cold, and very small when compared to Red Rockets. The castmember argued with me for two minutes over a discount I should have been given . . . All of the castmembers pretended that a cold slice of $8 pizza one third the size of Red Rockets was perfectly normal, and gave it to me with a straight look on their faces, I doubt they’d eat the same thing. I had to buy an overpriced pretzel just to fill up my stomach.

Last summer at the River Belle Terrace I ate the worst meal I have ever had in Disneyland, it was cold roast beef that tasted like cardboard, and a small plastic cup of beans and cold frozen vegetables. The castmembers were nice, probably too nice too make up for the food as I should have returned it.

I used to love getting big paper cups full of soda and ice, but all the parks sell is over priced plastic bottles now.

So on the one hand you have cast members who were trained in the traditional Disney way to make guests have a happier stay, and then you have the nickel-and-diming and poorly upkept attractions like Splash which aren’t held to the higher standards of the same attraction in Tokyo Disneyland.

At least Carsland looks great and hopefully will offer decent, yet still expensive, food.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

Advertising space

What's next? I won't be surprised when they "shrink-wrap" the massive glass windows of the Contemporary, like they do giant billboards here on the Sunset Strip. Or adding text signage to the Monorail beamways. ("follow me to the wine and food event").

I think what has happened is that the Monorails have set a precident as "advertising space" for the divisions to fight over so they will always have something on them. The horse is out of the monorail barn.

 

[HMF]

As you know, there is a tradition of graphically "shrink wrapping" urban rapid transit systems, and the WDW Monorail is no longer exempt from this. This started as a means of celebrating and tying the trains into on-property celebration decor like anniversaries, etc. Now we have moved into promoting movies. Just like on a city Bus. Ok, it's true that the company promotes their movies and properties in the parks sometimes in ways that are blatant, like poster cabinets outside the gate, etc.

In scanning the Miceage weekend update, they showed the heroic new "Marvel Avengers" promo Monorail. It features dynamically posed Superheroes with electricity in photorealistic fashion. The one thing that stood out to me was the image of one of the characters pointing a gun. It really bothered me and in that context, conflicted with what I see as the values or "tone" of the Resort. So Universal. What do you think?

When I think of WDW and it's vast pastoral property with the monorail at Sunset gliding through the Contemporary, images of Superheroes fighting (and especially kids in the station seeing someone pointing a gun in that way) just feels so urban, so "real world". I guess I pay to go to WDW to escape all the mayhem of life to a more optimistic place, not reminded of it with movie ads on the park Icons. I do think there's a way for Marvel to be on the property, but this is the first time I've sensed them in this way.

You may disagree, and the gun aspect is just a part of it, as there are Guns you shoot (or can buy as toys) in Frontierland, you even shoot them in Buzz Lightyear and they are being pointed at you in Pirates, there are lots of examples like that. I suppose they live in a thematic context that makes them part of something bigger. It must be a tipping point, as even more than just the gun, it felt so LA City Bus, not the sleek future that the monorail represents. Like putting a cheap bumper sticker on a Porsche 911. What you say? Overreaction? How much real world is enough and where?

http://micechat.com/blogs/weekend-u...-london;-dreamworks-experience;-route-66.html

Personally, I think it is a horrible concept to dress up the monorails. Let them be the sleek transportation system they are, Not billboards.