Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
Alektronic said:
Maybe I should clarify my point. I was trying to say that WDI has very creative people and very incredible technology but it doesn't seem like the Disney Parks division wants to pay for high quality and technological breakthroughs. The Parks division, especially WDW, wants something simple to maintain and doesn't cost a lot. They would rather have simple AA figures or video screens instead of something that is going to blow everyones socks off. It is just a matter of money. OR maybe they are just afraid to take chances?
Click to expand...

If you are on the Operator's side of the fence, there are lots of examples of failed risks, look at the Yeti, collapsing Fantasmic! Dragon, Swordfighting Pirates, Indy Ice Machine, or other central "pushing the envelope" figures that work well for a while, then develop issues and finally die. Look at the DL Monorails which WDI designed in-house. Disaster. They inherit the mess and sometimes it blows the opening which affects marketing. I still have my readmission ticket to the Matterhorn when it would not open. So you have to keep trying to up the quality and take risks, but I'm sure there is a certain "gun-shy" emotion in the Park Operator's mind from time to time.
 
R

RandySavage

Well-Known Member
Eddie, Just wanted to voice my continued appreciation, particularly for recent posts 1876 (on retail), 1890 (on the Garner Holt deal) and 1906. It's a gift to be able to read this kind of measured insight & wisdom with respect to entertainment design industry, and I visit the thread daily to learn more.

And thanks for VirginVolcanic link... very funny.

Any thoughts on the future of Tokyo Disney in light of projected aging & shrinking of Japan's population over the next century. The parks are currently extremely popular and (over)crowded... at what point (if ever) do you think it OLC will go for a 3rd Gate?
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
RandySavage said:
Eddie, Just wanted to voice my continued appreciation, particularly for recent posts 1876 (on retail), 1890 (on the Garner Holt deal) and 1906. It's a gift to be able to read this kind of measured insight & wisdom with respect to entertainment design industry, and I visit the thread daily to learn more.

And thanks for VirginVolcanic link... very funny.

Any thoughts on the future of Tokyo Disney in light of projected aging & shrinking of Japan's population over the next century. The parks are currently extremely popular and (over)crowded... at what point (if ever) do you think it OLC will go for a 3rd Gate?
Click to expand...

Thanks for the kind words Randy. You're very welcome. It's nice to know those posts get read.

It's been a long time since I was involved in Tokyo, but given your statistic, I'd bet on the nostalgia factor of TDL as the older ones hand down their childhood love for the park to younger ones. I think those parks are strangely "analog" in a fast moving digital Japan and become more unique as time goes on. I remember once that a Japanese survey said that they saw Disney as

"Everything that was good about America".

TDR has been adopting western holiday celebrations (Christmas,Halloween, Valentines Day, etc.) and popularizing them as event drivers in a homogenized themed way. Interesting trend.

OLC tends to be derivative of other Disney successes, so that tells me that they may go for another WDC park if they see a smash hit elsewhere. I wonder how much the other Asian parks cannibalize TDR's business if at all.
 
coolbeans14

coolbeans14

Active Member
This has been a really interesting read for me, so thanks for doing it.

With Disneyland Paris slowly getting out of debt, what would you in hindsight have done differently in the design/ development to avoid the situation it is in? Was it just too lavish?
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
coolbeans14 said:
This has been a really interesting read for me, so thanks for doing it.

With Disneyland Paris slowly getting out of debt, what would you in hindsight have done differently in the design/ development to avoid the situation it is in? Was it just too lavish?
Click to expand...

I'd do less hotels. The Newport one is 5000 rooms. I'd probably start there and then add it later when there is demand. there are lots of business assumptions you'd have to reconsider saw well. I would not make it less lavish. Europeans already live in a lavish world that is free to walk around in, it's called Paris. You can't wimp out. One reason it has survived 20 years is because we made it good enough to just explore and that has helped make it repeatable without a new show every 18 months.
 
SeaCastle

SeaCastle

Well-Known Member
Eddie-

Thanks for the great discussions in these parts, they never fail to be intriguing reads.

I was recently reading the post on Long Forgotten Mansion blog, where you had mentioned that a New Orleans architecture book got you started drawing historic architecture. Firstly, do you recall the name of this book?

I have a deep interest in (particularly nautically-related) US history, and hope to eventually study urban/master planning. However, I cannot draw for the life of me, and am not artistically gifted in the way that many I know are. In essence, what is the best way to learn to sketch buildings and architecture (and related elements), short of going to a design school?
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
SeaCastle said:
Eddie-
I was recently reading the post on Long Forgotten Mansion blog, where you had mentioned that a New Orleans architecture book got you started drawing historic architecture. Firstly, do you recall the name of this book?
Click to expand...

It's now out in paperback and you can get it here.
http://www.amazon.com/New-Orleans-Its-Environs-Architecture/dp/0764330691

It's free here to download or browse.
http://archive.org/details/neworleansitsenv00riccrich

For me as a kid, I just loved to try and copy the details from the old images in the book. It was an obsession. The NOS area of the park is an elegant mashup of all those elements and facades. I loved going to the park and piecing the historical sources together with the art directors vision. I recently came across another copy of this same book in a used book store, only to find it had once been "checked out" of the library of Randal Duell, Six Flags Designer and Film Designer, by none other than Herb Ryman and John De Cuir. Two of my heroes! The store gave me the card with their signatures on it.

If you cannot draw but love all that stuff you can build it in 3D I guess. The best thing to learn first is the concept of proportion and scale, then you can master any style. You have to develop the eye. I love this discussion on the divine mean, angle or proportion in nature. The greatest designs are the ones that were done by the ultimate designer! It's all been done.

http://www.keplersdiscovery.com/DivineProportion.html
 
T

trs518

Active Member
Eddie Sotto said:
Thanks for the kind words Randy. You're very welcome. It's nice to know those posts get read.

It's been a long time since I was involved in Tokyo, but given your statistic, I'd bet on the nostalgia factor of TDL as the older ones hand down their childhood love for the park to younger ones. I think those parks are strangely "analog" in a fast moving digital Japan and become more unique as time goes on. I remember once that a Japanese survey said that they saw Disney as

"Everything that was good about America".

TDR has been adopting western holiday celebrations (Christmas,Halloween, Valentines Day, etc.) and popularizing them as event drivers in a homogenized themed way. Interesting trend.

OLC tends to be derivative of other Disney successes, so that tells me that they may go for another WDC park if they see a smash hit elsewhere. I wonder how much the other Asian parks cannibalize TDR's business if at all.
Click to expand...

I just got back from Aulani and it was interesting to see that a large percentage of the people staying there are from Japan, such that all signs are written in both English and Japanese.

I think that Joe Rhode did an excellent job there. It was very interesting to read the articles in the in house magazine about how authentic they tried to make everything.

While we were there I participated in a research study on Aulani done by Disney Research. At times they wanted to know my thoughts on the design of Aulani, signs and stuff like that. It was fun.
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
trs518 said:
I just got back from Aulani and it was interesting to see that a large percentage of the people staying there are from Japan, such that all signs are written in both English and Japanese.

I think that Joe Rhode did an excellent job there. It was very interesting to read the articles in the in house magazine about how authentic they tried to make everything.

While we were there I participated in a research study on Aulani done by Disney Research. At times they wanted to know my thoughts on the design of Aulani, signs and stuff like that. It was fun.
Click to expand...

Glad you had a good time. My experience has been that there are a large percentage of Japanese that frequent the Islands (especially Oahu) and are also Disney fans, so it's not too surprising that they would head over there to check it out.
 
lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
A study of the old Russian aristocracy would probably provide a lot of information relevant to theming, they loved to import and recreate aspects of Western European culture.
 
CBOMB

CBOMB

Active Member
Eddie Sotto said:
Someone asked me a while back about themed places that exist that are really extraordinary. Here's one in Russia that is pretty outrageous and all made from wood. Reminds me of a Neuschwanstein of Russia. Lots of amazing pictures. A Russian pavilion at EPCOT could have been pretty.

http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2012/03/russian-fairy-tale-wooden-palace.html
Click to expand...

That makes me yearn for a Russian pavilion in the World Showcase. Has Russian architecture ever influenced any of your designs Eddie?
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
CBOMB said:
That makes me yearn for a Russian pavilion in the World Showcase. Has Russian architecture ever influenced any of your designs Eddie?
Click to expand...

Hmm. Not directly. I like the eclectic composition of the towers and elements in St. Basil's but never directly copied it. I was asked once to consult of the design of a park to be built in St. Petersburg, had that happened I guess I'd be really influenced!

Do you think HKDL's Mystic Manor has some "Russian Victorian Dressing"?
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_G61G-ABFZ9c/S1uFGm65qtI/AAAAAAAAAOs/E3n9fr0YWi0/s400/2994-O.jpg
 
CBOMB

CBOMB

Active Member
It would be difficult for me to look at any building with an onion dome, and not think of a Russian influence on it's architectural design.
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
Twitter-neering

I have a Twitter account (@boss_angeles), but seldom tweet. If I did get back into it, are you folks interested in that? :shrug:


FYI- The Avatar is Larry King's booking photo, not me.
 
ChrisFL

ChrisFL

Premium Member
CBOMB said:
It would be difficult for me to look at any building with an onion dome, and not think of a Russian influence on it's architectural design.
Click to expand...

Its interesting though, because some of the flat surfaces like the one link seem more arabian influence, but the beauty of Russia I suppose is there's possible influences from Europe through the middle east and to China/the rest of Asia.
 
Eddie Sotto

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
ChrisFL said:
Its interesting though, because some of the flat surfaces like the one link seem more arabian influence, but the beauty of Russia I suppose is there's possible influences from Europe through the middle east and to China/the rest of Asia.
Click to expand...

There is that "mash-up" kind of thing going on! Onion Domes are in Bavaria and the Tirol too.
 
Knothead

Knothead

Well-Known Member
I was wondering if you knew of any Sacred Geometry used in the parks, specifically WDW, whether intentionally or otherwise? I've seen a few Vesica Pisces and some other architecture and symbols that looks to be built Ad Quadratum. Do you know of any freemasons or any "occultists" who may have had influence during the design process? Strange question, I know, but I am fascinated on the subject and how these basic geometric patterns permeate our lives on a daily basis without us even noticing.

Thanks in advance, and I sure would miss this thread and your input if it was moved to the Twitterverse.
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom