DTD: The hits just keep on coming...

[Pumbas Nakasak]

It would help if you would actually explain what you mean.

Simply that you have your viewpoint based on your expectations, the fact that they are at odds with others is dismissed. Surely Disney World given its size and popularity should be catering for all sorts of diverse tastes and interests, not just parents and their brats?

 

[jt04]

Personally, I don't want them at Walt Disney World anyway if they are that closed minded. Should we shut down World Showcase too? I bet more alcohol is consumed there on a daily basis than at PI.

I bet these are the same people that....:zipit: I'm not gonna say anymore.

Emotions getting the best of you.

There is a huge difference between WS and PI. While many were disappointed by the decision to brink alcohol into Disney parks in masse, WS did not glamorize excess drinking. Instead it was presented as a cultural experience. Of course there are those that can't stand drinking that does not equal drunkeness and they can now be found staggering around WS as they drink "around the world" while tripping over kids trying to enjoy their Kim Possible adventure.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

I knew I would get that. Not true except to say Disney is at it's best when providing family entertainment. When they forget that, they fail in ways they can't conceieve of. That is why PI was a mistake from day 1. Poor idea on top of a poor business model. Destined to fail. Eisner's folly. But then Eisner does not drink.


:ROFLOL:

Pirates of the Caribbean had a PG-13 rating and made $654 million worldwide. Prince of Persia intentionally has the same rating to attract an older audience.

Touchstone titles like Splash, Down and Out in Beverly Hills (first R rated film made by Disney), Who Framed Roger Rabbit and D*ck Tracy all were box office hits.

The Food and Wine festivals at Epcot and DCA are also annual hits and so is Tower of Terror, a mature thrill ride with a height restriction.

You seem to assume "family" is Mom Dad boy age 10 and girl age 7 when it obviously is not. Disney thinks it is because it wants your money and that's apparently the best way to get it.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Oh I think you will see plenty of options offered on property for evening entertainment. They just won't revolve around the glamorization of drinking which the "high school" crowd can't legally do anyway.

As for 21 and up, there are a ton of clubs/lounges on property. They are even opening one on the land formerly known as PI this month. I don't see the problem. :shrug:

You know... You and I don't usually see eye to eye, but I believe that we've always debated in a fair, fun, and respectful way.

But I gotta tell ya. I'm really starting to wonder if at this point you're not "swimming against the current" just to get a rise out of people now.

It's felt lately like you're very focused on taking the position opposite of the general consensus, and in most cases, common sense.

Truthfully, because of this, your comments have started to mean less in my mind. Which is a bummer.

 

[hardcard]

shouldn't that be think?

This is only my opinion but I think that the perception of a "kids" holiday destination will ultimately be damaging to Disney. A visit to UK discussion boards will show you that many with kids over 8 dont see it as a must do on a Florida trip, and that view is being entrenched by replies to questions about trip planning.

yeah... but to be honest.. thats not a REAL concern... new 1-7 year olds are born every day.......

Again, people tend to forget, Disney wants to attract NEW customers consistantly.. the people that go once a year (or more) matter.... just not as much as new blood..


sad, true, fact......

Disney has gone on record as saying the PI clubs are gone.... I really don't know if they will get rid of the PI name or not.... that could cause more issues than the clubs being closed, etc... will AC reopen or reopen in a new locale? who knows... but, I wouldn't bet DTD's future on starbillas.

 

[chaggy102]

Emotions getting the best of you.

There is a huge difference between WS and PI. While many were disappointed by the decision to brink alcohol into Disney parks in masse, WS did not glamorize excess drinking. Instead it was presented as a cultural experience. Of course there are those that can't stand drinking that does not equal drunkeness and they can now be found staggering around WS as they drink "around the world" while tripping over kids trying to enjoy their Kim Possible adventure.

Right Epcot didn't promote drinking...oh wait Food and Wine fest anybody?

 

[jt04]

Simply that you have your viewpoint based on your expectations, the fact that they are at odds with others is dismissed. Surely Disney World given its size and popularity should be catering for all sorts of diverse tastes and interests, not just parents and their brats?

I think it best to just let this statement stand or fall under it's own weight.

 

[Lee]

But I know for a fact that many long time WDW vistors were so perplexed by the concept and how it was such a radical departure from what WDW and TWDC had been that they never set foot on property again. And we are not talking fundamentalist necessarily but those that were offended by Disney glamorizing drinking. Not passing judgement on either the PI fans or those offended by it.

Seriously, my mind can't fathom the depth of absurdity that that sort of mindset implies. Silly...that's the only way I can verbalize it, I guess.
And yes, I am passing judgement. Silly is what they are. Epcot and it's many bars didn't bother them?:hammer:
But in all honestly, the number of those types is so small that they really don't make any difference at all. :shrug:

And it could even be argued that when PI opened was just about the exact time if not THE exact time standards at WDW began to decline. Coincidence? I don't think so.

No. As I recall, the late '80s and early '90s was a time of very high standards at WDW. The decline began much later.

And when PI is officially declared dead and WDW decides to cater to families again, then you will see the beginning of the WDW renaissance!:sohappy:

And they stopped catering to families when exactly? :shrug:
Never.
It is, and always has been the number 1 family vacation destination in the world. It was that even when PI was thriving.

 

[jt04]

Right Epcot didn't promote drinking...oh wait Food and Wine fest anybody?

"Didn't" as when it first opened. Things have changed a bit in our culture since 1982. Not judging just saying. F&W does not glamorize drinking in the manner the former land known as PI did.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Emotions getting the best of you.

There is a huge difference between WS and PI. While many were disappointed by the decision to brink alcohol into Disney parks in masse, WS did not glamorize excess drinking. Instead it was presented as a cultural experience. Of course there are those that can't stand drinking that does not equal drunkeness and they can now be found staggering around WS as they drink "around the world" while tripping over kids trying to enjoy their Kim Possible adventure.

What number is "many"? Enough not to make Jiko the North American restaurant with the largest South African wine list? No.

You personal and comical hatred of "booze hounds" is probably the real reason you dislike PI whether you care to admit it or not.

 

[tirian]

I absolutely do not believe the statement I bolded. There was a huge but silent group that did not complain a peep. They just faded away. And WDW still has not gotten them back. Trust me, I know what I am saying.

They complained. They all spoke by not going to PI, and PI eventually failed.

I'm not saying PI should come back; I agree with the Company line that the dance clubs weren't profitable enough to remain open. Even the current 80s renaissance wouldn't save PI, because it's popular with teenagers who couldn't get into the clubs anyway. But to claim PI never was popular is a lie. The place attracted A-list talent and effectively killed Church Street Station until the early 2000s.

Personally, I'm not into the club scene anyway, and the only thing I miss is the AC; but I'd rather stick to the facts than spout my own opinion as an unchangeable truth.

 

[chaggy102]

"Didn't" as when it first opened. Things have changed a bit in our culture since 1982. Not judging just saying. F&W does not glamorize drinking in the manner the former land known as PI did.

How doesn't this glamorize drinking more. Pleasure Island wasn't called Drinking Island...the wine is right in the name. Go and drink around the world and sample wines and beers. Yep you're right, didn't promote it nor glamorize it.

 

[CaptainMichael]

Emotions getting the best of you.

There is a huge difference between WS and PI. While many were disappointed by the decision to brink alcohol into Disney parks in masse, WS did not glamorize excess drinking. Instead it was presented as a cultural experience. Of course there are those that can't stand drinking that does not equal drunkeness and they can now be found staggering around WS as they drink "around the world" while tripping over kids trying to enjoy their Kim Possible adventure.

Isn't the "cultural experience" of drinking just a way of glamorizing it?

In southern Louisiana (read: New Orleans Area) drinking is very much a "cultural experience" and because of that, I feel it is very glamorized. If you think PI is bad....

 

[tirian]

"Didn't" as when it first opened. Things have changed a bit in our culture since 1982. Not judging just saying. F&W does not glamorize drinking in the manner the former land known as PI did.

That is true; the F&W is classy, not an all-out beer and tequila-shot fest. :lol:

 

[JWG]

"Didn't" as when it first opened. Things have changed a bit in our culture since 1982. Not judging just saying. F&W does not glamorize drinking in the manner the former land known as PI did.

More than Food & Wine are the "Drink around the World" t-shirts I see on every visit. This last visit there was a group with "team" shirts. Their names on the front and the counties with a box to check on the back. I don't know if there was a contest associated, but clearly a competition.

I get, not Disney sanctioned. But, as a parent or "family advocate" of the extreme kind, this would bother me more than PI. I could shield my kids from PI. I can't shield them from public displays in the theme park.

Either way, no on will ever please 100% of the people so we'll all be here arguing with each other for eternity. Happy Tuesday and isn't the internet awesome!

 

[Pumbas Nakasak]

yeah... but to be honest.. thats not a REAL concern... new 1-7 year olds are born every day.......

Again, people tend to forget, Disney wants to attract NEW customers consistantly.. the people that go once a year (or more) matter.... just not as much as new blood..


sad, true, fact......

Disney has gone on record as saying the PI clubs are gone.... I really don't know if they will get rid of the PI name or not.... that could cause more issues than the clubs being closed, etc... will AC reopen or reopen in a new locale? who knows... but, I wouldn't bet DTD's future on starbillas.

Trouble is, whos going to take the youngsters if its not as big a part of family life?

 

[sknydave]

And the tequila bar in the Mexico pavilion will strictly be for educational purposes only.

 

[jt04]

They complained. They all spoke by not going to PI, and PI eventually failed.

I'm not saying PI should come back; I agree with the Company line that the dance clubs weren't profitable enough to remain open. Even the current 80s renaissance wouldn't save PI, because it's popular with teenagers who couldn't get into the clubs anyway. But to claim PI never was popular is a lie. The place attracted A-list talent and effectively killed Church Street Station until the early 2000s.

Personally, I'm not into the club scene anyway, and the only thing I miss is the AC; but I'd rather stick to the facts than spout my own opinion as an unchangeable truth.

I am just saying that for everyone that complained there were those that didn't. They just went away. Never visited WDW again. I know some of them and it is a large number. And I do know people on both sides of this issue.

 

[chaggy102]

I am just saying that for everyone that complained there were those that didn't. They just went away. Never visited WDW again. I know some of them and it is a large number. And I do know people on both sides of this issue.

And yet even with this large number during peak seasons it's still next to impossible to get a room so rock on.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

I know some of them and it is a large number.

So large you don't dare mention it because if you did it would look pathetically small next the number of people in WDW at any given basis?