Mouse Detective
Well-Known Member
Yes, many singles, adults without children, adults with children that have access to a babysitter, people attending meetings and conventions. Nightlife is needed.
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Disney Springs Plans: What do they mean?
- Thread starter WDW1974
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Yes, many singles, adults without children, adults with children that have access to a babysitter, people attending meetings and conventions. Nightlife is needed.
GoofGoof
Premium Member
I never saw a break down of the demographics, but there doesn't seem to be a huge focus on attracting that crowd. It may be because the time is relatively limited between when you are old enough to visit (and afford) WDW on your own as a young adult and when you have kids of your own to bring back. I also think they are focused on bringing in more money per guest and the average 20 something doesn't have the disposable income of an older couple with kids. I know my trips in my early 20s were food courts and value resorts. I almost see it like they are willing to "let you go" for a few years to a decade and then lure you back in when you have kids. Not everyone has kids and there are plenty of adult couples well out of their 20s who visit without kids, but it seems they are just not focused on that group. Universal also caters to the teen to young adult crowd so maybe they just don't see the point in fighting that battle.
PREMiERdrum
Well-Known Member
Per caps are likely much, much higher for families, and WDW's push has seemed to aim squarely on the family with young children and multi-generational family demos.
Something else to think about - as standards in show quality, food quality, and overall experience have declined, they seem to have adjusted their marketing focus onto less discerning groups.
71jason
Well-Known Member
It's not just booze. At Food & Wine, I recall seeing a line 50-people deep on either side of the booth for ... sushi. Haines City, the most hillbilly place I can think of in a 15-minute radius of WDW, has THREE sushi places (not counting Publix!). This isn't the 70s/early 80s when it was the hip new cuisine you could only get in NY or LA, this is the equivalent of lining up for pizza to me.
Along Park Avenue (Winter Park not NYC) I'm sure you can find many more innovative/exotic dishes than you will around World Showcase--start at Ravenous Pig--but the marketing mystique still holds real power. F&W is coasting on a reputation built over a decade ago, like everything else at WDW.
OFTeric
Well-Known Member
After looking over all of this, and talking with people all over Central Florida about this leaked plan, it seems there is a consensus among all of us who have a vested interest in how money is spent here in Central Florida.
Disney Springs is Disney's way of attacking 2 big businesses they feel like they are missing out on:
1. Destination shoppers
2. Tour Group Shopping
Right now the Mall of Millenia and the Florida Mall have those two markets covered, with the Premium and Prime Outlets rounding out the major shopping venues here in Central Florida. Right around the corner you have the complete redevelopment of Festival Bay Mall and the expansion of the Premium Outlets happening.
What Disney is looking to do, is make Downtown Disney or Disney Springs or whatever they end up calling it a Destination shopping experience where tour buses once again drop off their large groups to go shopping to spend a day, and where the Whales of the shopping industry Destination shoppers actually stop and spend their money at the "couture" shops that Disney has at this new expansion.
Looking at the retailers and the restaurant concepts they have, I am not convinced they will pull this off. But like with anything with Downtown Disney... I will wait and see.
Disney Springs is Disney's way of attacking 2 big businesses they feel like they are missing out on:
1. Destination shoppers
2. Tour Group Shopping
Right now the Mall of Millenia and the Florida Mall have those two markets covered, with the Premium and Prime Outlets rounding out the major shopping venues here in Central Florida. Right around the corner you have the complete redevelopment of Festival Bay Mall and the expansion of the Premium Outlets happening.
What Disney is looking to do, is make Downtown Disney or Disney Springs or whatever they end up calling it a Destination shopping experience where tour buses once again drop off their large groups to go shopping to spend a day, and where the Whales of the shopping industry Destination shoppers actually stop and spend their money at the "couture" shops that Disney has at this new expansion.
Looking at the retailers and the restaurant concepts they have, I am not convinced they will pull this off. But like with anything with Downtown Disney... I will wait and see.
The Cirque parking structure is a goer.
muteki
Well-Known Member
I don't know about the overall percentage, but while I think us 20-somethings may be a significant portion, I don't think we spend as much as the average family does. I think that is a big reason why Disney targets the family crowd more, as they spend more while they are down.
Now one way to increase the spending of 20-somethings with no kids would be to create some nightlife, certainly. What's been keeping them from doing that (and getting rid of what they had) I don't know.
Mouse Detective
Well-Known Member
What's been keeping them from doing it is a corporate culture that refuses to ever acknowledge that they made a mistake.
It's not just 20-somethings that want nightlife, btw.
DougK
Well-Known Member
Steve do you mean goner?
imagineer boy
Well-Known Member
Here are my over all thoughts on the proposals:
-I do like the layout and the addition of the parking garage. Quite frankly this should've been done a LONG time ago.
-Please don't use the name "Disney Springs." Like other people have pointed out, it sounds like a retirement home rather than a shopping district. DTD is just a perfectly fine name.
-Of course if I had things my way I'd bring back the PI clubs as the expansion would make a perfect solution for diverting families with kids around the adult oriented area.
-Imagineers, I love you and respect what you do. However, not everything needs a back story. It's just a shopping district for crying out loud. Spend more time on creating a nice atmosphere.
-The "fake overhead railway" on the west side does not sound very good. Why make any changes to the West Side at all? It's fine the way it is look-wise and the efforts need to be concentrated on the expansion anyways.
-They should at least build a trolly (either one on rails, or a fake one on tires would suffice) that connects the west side, expansion, and market place to transport all the lazy bums who can't walk.
-I like the idea of each district having it's own theme and feel and hope they continue that with the expansion. West side is contemporary and Urban, PI is the nightclub scene, and Marketplace is relaxed and laid back. I'd like to see the expansion maybe have a colorful 50s/90s look to it like the Disney Village in Disneyland Paris.
-I do like the layout and the addition of the parking garage. Quite frankly this should've been done a LONG time ago.
-Please don't use the name "Disney Springs." Like other people have pointed out, it sounds like a retirement home rather than a shopping district. DTD is just a perfectly fine name.
-Of course if I had things my way I'd bring back the PI clubs as the expansion would make a perfect solution for diverting families with kids around the adult oriented area.
-Imagineers, I love you and respect what you do. However, not everything needs a back story. It's just a shopping district for crying out loud. Spend more time on creating a nice atmosphere.
-The "fake overhead railway" on the west side does not sound very good. Why make any changes to the West Side at all? It's fine the way it is look-wise and the efforts need to be concentrated on the expansion anyways.
-They should at least build a trolly (either one on rails, or a fake one on tires would suffice) that connects the west side, expansion, and market place to transport all the lazy bums who can't walk.
-I like the idea of each district having it's own theme and feel and hope they continue that with the expansion. West side is contemporary and Urban, PI is the nightclub scene, and Marketplace is relaxed and laid back. I'd like to see the expansion maybe have a colorful 50s/90s look to it like the Disney Village in Disneyland Paris.
Sorry no, I mean it is on. There are firm plans for a second parking structure. The single parking structure plan is old.
muteki
Well-Known Member
Lee
Adventurer
Hmmmm....
Gonna go back and check my stuff. It's from December, and I don't recall a second garage.
Interesting. Are two really needed?
If there's one central entrance to Disney Springs, then I guess it allows people to enter it from both sides?
Could also cut the queue in half for the parking garage (although if it's true that people don't park at West Side now, then the addition of a garage isn't going to get them to park there now...)
Or, DIsney expect this to do SO well for them, that they think that the extra spaces will be needed...
Didn't someone on here say that there could be further plans behind Cirque? (possibly bars/clubs?) Maybe this parking garage would replace those spaces?
There are folks who would like to see it, but with DCA 2.0's success ... I am not sure.
COProgressFan
Well-Known Member
Long are they days when they promoted the classy Disney resorts to empty-nester couples and promotional images showed nicely dressed folks eating in restaurants with strolling musicians.
Nowadays, I think they are going after rubes (credit due to WDW74) who are not well traveled and perhaps less savvy about the actual value of the product they are spending their money on. The touristy "Rizzos", if you will (credit to Kevin Yee).
Yet at the same time the prices of deluxe resorts are at the point that only a 1 percenter could afford them, and they are building the Four Seasons and Golden Oak for a perhaps more discerning crowd. Its certainly interesting.
By the way, any insiders know how sales are going at Golden Oak? Aside from promoting the first family that bought in, and of course the big home to be purchased by George K. and Andy, are houses selling? I personally don't see the market for it, but am curious if that project is moving along.
Michael Eisner sued my father, then tried to hire him to take over Resort marketing for WDW, while UNI tried to hire him for same position and adviser to take on Disney. Those free Disney DVDs... That idea came from my dad. The first was a video that included most of Orlando tourism, including Disney. No groupies, though.
Central Florida tourism was much different in the 1980-90s. Nowhere near as big as it used to be in regards to Travel Agencies. Free admittance, free merch, VIP treatment, getting into new parks before the general public, etc.
That's a fascinating outline of a story ... will try and send you a note this week as I'd love to hear more.
Disney fans get excited by new toilets. They are bored and tired. And it seems the smaller the 'new' thing or the 'less impressive', the more lathered up the fan community gets.
I don't care about this project because I don't travel to WDW to visit a Disney shopping mall, even if I often wind up there for a meal or a walk.
If the four parks didn't exist, then it would have the same pull to me as my local mall.
There's a market, as to what size, who knows? I firmly believe George and Andy's purchase was largely PR-related. I wouldn't even be surprised if Disney helped them out considerably with 'relocation expenses' ... when last I heard they had firm plans for about 40 homes, now whether that means they have sold that many, have deposits etc, I dunno.
Don't really care as I wish the area was never built. Yeah, poor Andy and George would have to live at Saratoga Springs forever.
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