Disney confirms 'Frozen' makeover coming to Epcot's Norway Pavilion

[Castle Cake Apologist]

Not at all. You misunderstand the issue.

The Water Engine was animation and was very clever.

He's completely unable to grasp the point, he's made that abundantly clear. It's odd too, he used to be pretty cool but lately it feels like he's found a way to just play a giant game of Devil's advocate. I hate terms like "pixie duster" a lot, but it seems he just keeps defending things that shouldn't be.

Also, you've been conspicuously quiet about the photos posted a few pages back...

 

[marni1971]

You've been conspicuously quiet about the photos posted a few pages back...

Not intentionally.

 

[Castle Cake Apologist]

The fact that you use "dumb down" to refer to different tastes is a bit elitist and, quite frankly, just a bit insulting. It'd be like if I said, "I like Epcot the way it is now; why do some snobs insist on snootying the place up?"

Based on my avatar, I guess I'm an elitist. If it makes me an elitist to expect Disney to live up to the mission statement that they themselves gave the park at opening, then so be it.

 

[Castle Cake Apologist]

It's only "dumbing down" if you think the medium of animation as an expression of art or storytelling is dumb.

No. Don't mince words, nobody here is questioning the validity of animation as an artistic medium.

What people are questioning, however, is changing intellectually stimulating attractions that inspired hope and optimism for the future or paid tribute to rich traditions and folklore of the world's nations into book report rides about movies. I really cannot fathom how this could be more clear and how you're so unable to get it.

Epcot has a specific purpose. It's right on the dedication plaque. Watching poorly integrated screens of Nemo getting lost again does not live up to that purpose. Nor does celebrating the "Winter in Summer Festival" (could that be more forced? What on Earth has happened to WDI show writing?) with Elsa and friends in the fictional land of Arendelle when we're supposed to be in a place dedicated to exploring actual culture. How is any of this possibly anything other than the dumbing down of attractions and the concept of Epcot as a whole? In what way is the identity of this park now separated from Magic Kingdom?

 

[marni1971]

It's only "dumbing down" if you think the medium of animation as an expression of art or storytelling is dumb.

He's completely unable to grasp the point, he's made that abundantly clear. It's odd too, he used to be pretty cool but lately it feels like he's found a way to just play a giant game of Devil's advocate. I hate terms like "pixie duster" a lot, but it seems he just keeps defending things that shouldn't be.

Also, you've been conspicuously quiet about the photos posted a few pages back...

Thinking about it, the more you look the more EPCOT had plenty of great animation.

Earth Station

Two of Energys four films. Including the largest format multiplane animation to date.

Cranium Commands hysterical preshow.

Plenty of World of Motions screens

Imagination had several animated projections

Plus numerous other exhibits.

So no, the medium of animation being dumb is incorrect. The park has always used it well.

 

[RobotWolf]

"If only the bus was as predictable as the weather."

 

[Matt_Black]

He's completely unable to grasp the point, he's made that abundantly clear. It's odd too, he used to be pretty cool but lately it feels like he's found a way to just play a giant game of Devil's advocate. I hate terms like "pixie duster" a lot, but it seems he just keeps defending things that shouldn't be.

Also, you've been conspicuously quiet about the photos posted a few pages back...

I grasp the point, I just don't agree with it. Saying that Disney is no longer living up to the mission statement that they themselves made ignores the fact that that was essentially a different company with different personnel running it. A lot has changed over 40 years. Nintendo used to make playing cards; are they now failing to live up to their "mission statement"?

As far as the photos, they look fine to me. Forgive me for having a life outside the boards.

 

[MOM2FOUR]

Disney then and Disney now was about making money. They are a company that makes money off of entertaining us. Sadly, what entertained us 40 years ago, doesn't entertain us the same way as it did then, especially considering the advances in electronics and animation. Epcot no longer appeals to kids of today the way it did to us. And since Disney is about making money off of us (I'm sure they conveniently left that off their mission statements too), they are having to adapt and come up with ideas to get kids and their families to come to Epcot. A spoon full of sugar...

 

[Mike S]

I'm having trouble placing where in the fjord scene Marshmallow and those stupid snow boogers are. Are they in the middle, where the tree troll was? Like, did they legitimately just put fake snow over the rockwork and stick Marshmallow on top of the tree troll's existing mechanism? Also, is that the same rockwork that was already there, up in the ceiling? Everything about this screams overlay, when I thought we at least had confirmation that the ride was completely gutted.

Also, I lightened the troll picture and he seriously just looks very flat. I also don't think that's the lift hill. If you lighten it, it looks like he's just next to the flume somewhere.

I know we've only seen a couple things now, but this really seems a lot less rich and layered than Maelstrom. What exactly is taking so long if they didn't even gut the walls and ceiling as part of this? Major set pieces appear to have only been slightly altered. Why is Marshmallow so tiny and just kind cramped into a preexisting space? Hard to tell from a couple pictures I guess, but color me completely unimpressed so far.

Yeah the ceiling is a dead giveaway that it's the same room also the rest of the rock work. To me it looks like Marshmallow is somewhere behind where the river troll was. It also looks like the only thing he can move is his head.

I grasp the point, I just don't agree with it. Saying that Disney is no longer living up to the mission statement that they themselves made ignores the fact that that was essentially a different company with different personnel running it. A lot has changed over 40 years. Nintendo used to make playing cards; are they now failing to live up to their "mission statement"?

As far as the photos, they look fine to me. Forgive me for having a life outside the boards.

They still do.

Check, and, mate

 

[Matt_Black]

Yeah the ceiling is a dead giveaway that it's the same room also the rest of the rock work. To me it looks like Marshmallow is somewhere behind where the river troll was. It also looks like the only thing he can move is his head.

They still do.

Check, and, mate

Yes, focusing on the characters from their video games. They "dumbed them down"! You set up the house of cards, and I hit that bull's eye, sending the dominoes toppling.

 

[marni1971]

 

[Mike S]

Yes, focusing on the characters from their video games. They "dumbed them down"! You set up the house of cards, and I hit that bull's eye, sending the dominoes toppling.

Because dime a dozen cards are the same thing as a theme park requiring $100 entrance fee. Keep trying buddy.

 

[wdisney9000]

Yes, focusing on the characters from their video games. They "dumbed them down"! You set up the house of cards, and I hit that bull's eye, sending the dominoes toppling.

Your original accusation was that Nintendo was no longer living up to their mission statemet because they stopped producing playing cards. You then compared that to the TWDC and their mission statement (which has been abandoned). Thats the worst analogy Ive seen in awhile. Was Nintendo founded on playing cards? Was there ever any speeches made byt eh founder about their passion and drive to bring people together through playing cards? Were Nintendos playing cards a revolutionary game changer in the industry that every other company began to mimic but could not replicate the quality, creativity and customer service that Nintendo put forth? Obvious answer: NO. Absolutely the worst analogy ever.

Im not even sure what you meant by "You set up the house of cards, and I hit that bull's eye, sending the dominoes toppling"??? How did the house of cards turn into dominoes as they went toppling down? And was that a claim of some type of victory? If so, its akin to a "thanks for participating" trophy that the loosing teams get because nowadays everybody has to get a trophy or its mean.

 

[Mike S]

Your original accusation was that Nintendo was no longer living up to their mission statemet because they stopped producing playing cards. You then compared that to the TWDC and their mission statement (which has been abandoned). Thats the worst analogy Ive seen in awhile. Was Nintendo founded on playing cards? Was there ever any speeches made byt eh founder about their passion and drive to bring people together through playing cards? Were Nintendos playing cards a revolutionary game changer in the industry that every other company began to mimic but could not replicate the quality, creativity and customer service that Nintendo put forth? Obvious answer: NO. Absolutely the worst analogy ever.

Im not even sure what you meant by "You set up the house of cards, and I hit that bull's eye, sending the dominoes toppling"??? How did the house of cards turn into dominoes as they went toppling down? And was that a claim of some type of victory? If so, its akin to a "thanks for participating" trophy that the loosing teams get because nowadays everybody has to get a trophy or its mean.

They were founded as a playing card company but the rest of your point is solid. Their biggest success was when they started making video games so in that case the better analogy to Walt Disney World would be the Wii U. Some good things here and there, sure, but overall.....

 

[wdisney9000]

They were founded as a playing card company but the rest of your point is solid. Their biggest success was when that started making video games so in that case the better analogy to Walt Disney World would be the Wii U. Some good things here and there, sure, but overall.....

I guess it still makes sense as Disney was founded on cartoons then movies. Theme parks came later. I think he has me on ignore because he never responds to my questions or posts, lol. or maybe he just doesnt want to talk to me.

 

[CastleBound]

Yeah the ceiling is a dead giveaway that it's the same room also the rest of the rock work. To me it looks like Marshmallow is somewhere behind where the river troll was. It also looks like the only thing he can move is his head.

I've been doing a bit of comparing for the past few minutes and the rock work above is definitely the same, but the rock work below is definitely different. On the drop, the rocks on the left are definitely different than what was there before. Glad to see they didn't just sprinkle white flakes over the old rock work.

 

[Mike S]

I've been doing a bit of comparing for the past few minutes and the rock work above is definitely the same, but the rock work below is definitely different. On the drop, the rocks on the left are definitely different than what was there before. Glad to see they didn't just sprinkle white flakes over the old rock work.

Here's some other angles to look at. At least around Marshmallow, it still looks the same. Just some of it completely removed for the new scene.

The rock his hand is on looks to be in the background partially obscured by a tree branch.

 

[aw14]

I am looking forward to trying this when we return in November. However, I will be wearing my Maelstrom shirt for that ride

 

[THECARISMINE]

... I know I shouldn't have expected any optimism on a thread that started with the closing of Maelstrom, but from the pictures I'm imagining Marshmallow will stand up before the drop and that empty background will be full of projections of the mountain scape from the film. I'm not happy with Maelstrom being replaced either but now that acceptance has set in nothing looks any worse then what was expected from the start of the project. Holding judgements till it actually opens, doesn't look like a bad dark ride or anything yet, just a bad location.

 

[Horizons1]

I grasp the point, I just don't agree with it. Saying that Disney is no longer living up to the mission statement that they themselves made ignores the fact that that was essentially a different company with different personnel running it. A lot has changed over 40 years. Nintendo used to make playing cards; are they now failing to live up to their "mission statement"?

As far as the photos, they look fine to me. Forgive me for having a life outside the boards.

...duster.