Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Polynesia]

People will do it or else? Or things have to reopen no matter what?

We’re crossing the streams here.

I didn’t mean the two extremes. Sorry I wasn’t clear

 

[DisneyCane]

The point is to discourage people from making needless shopping trips—and hence being around others for longer than necessary—in the first place. Wearing masks and keeping your distance may mitigate the risk, but they don’t remove it entirely, and that risk grows the more time you spend in public settings.

This.

I don't agree that the risk increases significantly if everybody is wearing masks and keeping distance. You might say that by making more trips there is more chance to encounter somebody that is infected. That is true but with masks and distancing the chance of getting infected, especially by somebody asymptomatic is going to be EXTREMELY low. It lowers the risk of transmission far below the point where it is worth the harm to the "non essential" businesses to keep them from operating.

Again, your assuming that everyone plays by the same game. It won’t work. It’s not working now. Go into any essential business right now and some people aren’t wearing masks or gloves or keeping distance. Please don’t say well then they should be fined to get them to do it. They tried it here in PA and it hasn’t worked.
PA just came out with a order from the governor yesterday saying this Sunday will start mandatory masks for all employees and all customers for all people at essential businesses and they have tilhe right to not let anyone in if not complying. . Sounds
great right? Well when you look into it a bit more.. also says if.. “if the business sells food or medical supplies or medicine you can’t stop them from going in. Well that’s almost all essential business right now so it won’t change anything for anyone that doesn’t want to help stop the spread.
I don’t know the answer but this isn’t it.

The fines should be on the businesses for allowing people to enter without masks. Even have a "3 strikes" rule that if you are fined 3 times, you can't open your business anymore. The distancing is on the customers to self police. The business should be required to make best efforts like marks on the floor, limiting capacity, etc. No business can or should be expected to operate with having to police distancing policies.

We need to come to terms with the fact that this virus can not be completely controlled until there is a vaccine (which will hopefully be available in mid 2021). People will be infected and some percentage of those people will die. You CAN NOT keep the economy shut down for much longer. The entire world economy will collapse and tens of millions of people, especially in poor, developing countries, will die as a result.

Sane measures should be taken to try and minimize the spread and resulting deaths but things need to be closer to "normal" than not in the not too distant future. I remember I was mocked for saying there would be civil unrest. I think we saw the seeds of that yesterday in Michigan and it's only been a little over a month since "15 days to slow the spread" started.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Museums can put in tight capacity controls to allow social distancing. And also require facial coverings.

Is social distancing a problem in national parks?

Depends on the park.
Also, do you mean just National Parks, or NP, National Historic Sites/Parks/Parkways, National Seashores/Lakeshores/Riverways, National Battlefields, National Military Parks, and National Monuments? All are run by the National Park Service.

Earlier this year, Washington DC had a very hard time keeping people from the cherry blossoms along the Tidal Basin NP. When the blossoms are blooming, it is normally VERY crowded!

Have you ever been to DC? Picture the July 4th National Mall. It is run by the NPS, but is kind of mishmash of park, memorial, and monument space. It includes the U.S Capitol grounds, Washington Monument, Smithsonian Sculpture Garden, Lincoln Memorial, and more.

To answer your question further, picture the Vietnam Veterans Memorial, Ford's Theater, Cape Cod/Canaveral National Seashores, Gettysburg, Castillo de San Marcos NM (St. Augustine), Fort McHenry NM (where National Anthem was written), and Wolf Trap Park for the Performing Arts (Steely Dan, Little Big Town, Pitbull, etc. Sadly, John Prine was scheduled to perform at Wolf trap in June.) They are all part of the NPS.

 

[LittleBuford]

Schools will be transitioning away from brick and Mortar anyway...that has been predicted and will now accelerate. It’s just too expensive to operate bloated campuses and the funding will not be there

You can’t replicate a college experience online. There is no substitute for in-class teaching and learning, quite apart from the fact that students are missing out on the social interactions and extracurricular activities that are so key to their formation. Everyone I know in academia is itching to return to campus when it is safe to do so.

 

[Parker in NYC]

The fines should be on the businesses for allowing people to enter without masks. Even have a "3 strikes" rule that if you are fined 3 times, you can't open your business anymore. The distancing is on the customers to self police. The business should be required to make best efforts like marks on the floor, limiting capacity, etc. No business can or should be expected to operate with having to police distancing policies.

This is a lovely theory. However, not all stores can hire bouncers. I saw two very intimidating folks in front of me in line trying to get into our local mom and pop grocery store despite the fact they weren't wearing masks. One of them threatened the employee at the door. So, let's just assume everyone plays along in this fantasyland you've devised.

 

[Mander]

Museums can put in tight capacity controls to allow social distancing. And also require facial coverings.

Is social distancing a problem in national parks? I've never had much of an issue keeping my space except maybe crossing paths on a hike for a very brief second.

National parks would be okay in some spots, especially the smaller ones. Places like Yellowstone? Not so much. Once you get into the interior it isn't crowded but otherwise it is. I worked a summer at the Old Faithful Inn. The viewing area for the geyser is just as crowded as Disney on any given day June-August.

As of now, my friends who still work out there have a delayed opening at the end of May (they should already be in park for training but haven't been called back yet). I don't see how it opens with the current measures in place. It's just too crowded.

I'm sure the Grand Canyon and Yosemite are in similar positions.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

Sane measures should be taken to try and minimize the spread and resulting deaths but things need to be closer to "normal" than not in the not too distant future. I remember I was mocked for saying there would be civil unrest. I think we saw the seeds of that yesterday in Michigan and it's only been a little over a month since "15 days to slow the spread" started.

Don’t really think what happened in Michigan is what you were referring to in past posts. That event was more political then what it’s made out to be. I called a friend that lives close to where it happened last night and he said if you think this is because people are just cooped up in the house I have a bridge to sell you.

 

[GoofGoof]

This is a lovely theory. However, not all stores can hire bouncers. I saw two very intimidating folks in front of me at line trying to get into our local mom and pop grocery store despite the fact they weren't wearing masks. One of them threatened the employee at the door. So, let's just assume everyone plays along in this fantasyland you've devised.

We already talked about it earlier, but when SEPTA had the police remove a guy from a bus in Philly for violating the requirement to wear a mask the public outcry was so bad they removed the rule and masks are now just suggested but not required.

 

[Parker in NYC]

We already talked about it earlier, but when SEPTA had the police remove a guy from a bus in Philly for violating the requirement to wear a mask the public outcry was so bad they removed the rule and masks are now just suggested but not required.

I made the decision of getting out of line because I thought a brawl was on the brink. CVS and other chain stores have much better security. You know who loses in this because of customers like these - ones who claim there's no reason for them to fall in line? The loss of small business.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I’m in the same boat for August. If I cancel I lose points I borrowed from 2021 because I can’t put them back. If they cancel on me they automatically put them back to 2021. Either way I will lose a few points carried over from 2019. Simce my use year is March I can still bank my 2020 points into 2021 in August.

Selfishly I really hope the open date isn’t August 1st. I’d rather not be there a few weeks after opening. I’d rather just defer to next summer when hopefully a vaccine will be around.

I thought I was the only one borrowing points from the next years contract every year. Glad to see I’m not alone.

 

[marni1971]

We need to come to terms with the fact that this virus can not be completely controlled until there is a vaccine (which will hopefully be available in mid 2021).

That bit I mostly agree with.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

You can’t replicate a college experience online. There is no substitute for in-class teaching and learning, quite apart from the fact that students are missing out on the social interactions and extracurricular activities that are so key to their formation. Everyone I know in academia is itching to return to campus when it is safe to do so.

I’m not advocating that approach. I’m just saying it will happen.

You know that federal and state funding for universities has fallen dramatically for 25+ years...and the costs have already risen a factor of 3 since that time - conveniently since they took out the student debt bankruptcy blocks.

It is what it is.

 

[Parker in NYC]

I made the decision of getting out of line because I thought a brawl was on the brink. CVS and other chain stores have much better security. You know who loses in this because of customers like these - ones who claim there's no reason for them to fall in line? The loss of small business.

Also, this was a private business - they set their own rules.

 

[GoofGoof]

I made the decision of getting out of line because I thought a brawl was on the brink. CVS and other chain stores have much better security. You know who loses in this because of customers like these - ones who claim there's no reason for them to fall in line? The loss of small business.

That and the workers suffer. SEPTA already lost some employees to the virus so they tried to be proactive with a rule, but it’s impossible to enforce.

 

[Mander]

You can’t replicate a college experience online. There is no substitute for in-class teaching and learning, quite apart from the fact that students are missing out on the social interactions and extracurricular activities that are so key to their formation. Everyone I know in academia is itching to return to campus when it is safe to do so.

Can confirm! I manage our school's Peer Tutoring program (among other things) and we made a quick transition to online tutoring when our classes went online. It isn't ideal at all. The feedback we get from students is that they're struggling and can't wait to be back on campus. Will that happen this Fall? No idea but the idea that this is going to replace in person instruction long term doesn't add up if you look at what students are saying. Online works well for many people but it takes a certain kind of student to be successful. It also takes time to build a strong online program, so if a school didn't already have one I don't see that happening in one summer. Not saying it can't be done but it will be extremely difficult.

My guess is that if we're still online in the fall, we'll see a big drop off in enrollment. The students I've spoken to would rather wait than deal with this again. I certainly don't blame them.

 

[havoc315]

I don’t see it as a situation of Disney “waiting for the thumbs up” from some Governor...certainly not DC...

Here in the US they have the “yin and yang” of governors to deal with as is...

This is a deeper, unique socio-economic thing going on here.

I agree they probably have more of a “wait and see” approach. But Disney is a huge conglomerate leaking oil by the minute. That money isn’t coming back and their stock will begin to tank...
They have to have several drastic plans/outlook in place already...and will adjust accordingly

No, they aren't sitting on their thumbs. I'm sure they have lots of different contingency plans being drawn up.
But yes -- they are waiting for the government, as one of the biggest factors in determining which plan they put in place. So yes, they have lots of plans -- but none are really in place yet.
It's not a matter of having a set plan, which they may make minor adjustments to.
I'm sure they have a June 2020 re-opening plan... I'm sure they also have a 2021 re-opening plan... I'm sure they have a plan for "re-open with 30% attendance limits"... I'm sure they have a plan for "re-open with masks and 6-foot social distancing in place"... I'm sure they have a plan of "re-open Magic Kingdom only, with only 1,000 people admitted per day"
They probably have lots of completely different things mapped out. And right now, they really don't know which plan will come to fruition.

 

[Parker in NYC]

That and the workers suffer. SEPTA already lost some employees to the virus so they tried to be proactive with a rule, but it’s impossible to enforce.

I find it funny that so many people wanting the economy to reopen to save small business are doing their damndest to make it even harder for them.

 

[GoofGoof]

I thought I was the only one borrowing points from the next years contract every year. Glad to see I’m not alone.

I usually go every other year so I use this year’s points and borrow most of next years each trip. This time around we had some points left from 2019 plus 2020s and borrowed most of 2021s to book a 2 bedroom for 10 nights.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I usually go every other year so I use this year’s points and borrow most of next years each trip. This time around we had some points left from 2019 plus 2020s and borrowed most of 2021s to book a 2 bedroom for 10 nights.

We go every year and stay way to long. The reason for my borrowing.

 

[GoofGoof]

I find it funny that so many people wanting the economy to reopen to save small business are doing their damndest to make it even harder for them.

It was ironic to see a bunch of people wanting to see the country open again gathered in a mass of bodies and less than half had masks on. Not exactly encouraging anyone to feel people are ready to do this. If people could actually follow the rules we would get out of this much faster, but some people just can’t help themselves.