Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Incomudro]

Reading through the discussion as to whether it was wise to close down “with a sledgehammer” at the beginning of the pandemic I feel there is no correct answer! We will never know how many extra deaths or serious illnesses were prevented but equally we will never know if keeping outside activities open would have been beneficial or not had any significant impact on the number of deaths. The thing perhaps we should remember is that no one knew at that time and to a lesser extent now, which mitigation methods were/are most effective. I can only imagine the problems and angst of Governors (?) and advisors who had to make these life changing / life saving/ life costing decisions knowing that whichever way they go people will complain. Perhaps the fact that we are still discussing the rights/wrongs of their decisions a year down the line and are still divided means they got it just about right! However 559,000 deaths in the USA and still climbing probably proves they didn’t.

I agree with your post very much.
I can only imagine the damned if they did and damned if they didn't decisions that governors had to make.
One thing I will say however, is that the US did poorly with covid because our population is so unhealthy to begin with.

You’re not suggesting we protect the most vulnerable, are you?

They could protect themselves as well.
I was often shocked at the age and condition of some people out and about when covid was raging.
Everything you need can be ordered.

 

[Incomudro]

But was touted here by many a year ago,April-may 2020 as the gold standard that the US should be following. Can you imagine.

I believe the Swedish people on the whole are quite happy with the outcome.

 

[GoofGoof]

You’re not suggesting we protect the most vulnerable, are you?

In a way yes, but not by locking them in their homes for 18 months, but by having a higher level of restrictions for the whole population is places where there is a higher concentration of vulnerable people. It would never actually happen that way in the real world, but it would be an efficient way to maximize protection where it was needed most.

Kinda like the most efficient way to board an airplane is to do window seats first from back to front, then middle seats back to front then aisle. If every flight boarded that way 100% of the time with no exceptions the boarding time would be cut in half, but nobody will actually agree to it because they want to board with their family or they have priority status or some other reason to not follow.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I believe the Swedish people on the whole are quite happy with the outcome.

In the beginning the Swedes for the most part liked the idea and was very supportive. Until around the June timeframe support waned and doing a quick google search from November until now will show that their initial reaction has turned all the way around. In fact they are saying if elections were held today the opposition has a higher approval rating because of the handling of the pandemic. That’s not even counting the neighboring countries who are disapproving of how it was handled and has affecting them.

Redirect Notice

Swedenâs population is losing confidence in the countryâs strategy to combat COVID-19

Rising Covid-19 cases in the country comes as Sweden's Prince Carl Philip and his wife test positive for coronavirus

www.google.com

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[GoofGoof]

I believe the Swedish people on the whole are quite happy with the outcome.

I doubt anyone in the world is quite happy with the outcome of this pandemic. They suffered great losses both in human life and economically just like the rest of the world.

 

[GoofGoof]

Sorry, I added something to my last post that it seems you did not have a chance to read, so I'll add it here as well:

My view is that many state mandates were irrelevant. Instead, how strictly private businesses and retail stores (places where non-family members are most likely to gather indoors) enforced masks and social distancing is a significant factor that often gets ignored.

IMO, there was not a huge amount of variance from state-to-state because even in those states that eased up more quickly than others, most large private businesses and chain stores continued to require masks and social distancing.

So although governor 'X' had such-and-such rules and eased up on those rules at such-and-such rates, large businesses and major realtors mostly ignored what those governors were doing and kept in place the rules they were being advised to follow by their health experts.

Yes, agreed. Mandates and requirements mean much less when they can’t be enforced. A government would have to either fine or arrest violators which didn’t happen a whole lot and wasn’t very successful. Private businesses on the other hand can just ban people from entering if they don’t follow masks and distancing. The most effective part of government mandates was setting a tone from the top. In states that had Governors who publicly supported sensible restrictions businesses met less resistance from customers.

Imagine if everyone actually just followed the covid restrictions 100% of the time, even if they thought they were unnecessary, because it was the right thing to do. We would have then known one way or the other if the restrictions actually worked. Instead we got constant resistance and then some of the same people who didn‘t follow the restrictions and recommendations then claimed they didn’t work because cases kept growing in numbers. It’s all an academic debate at this point since that ship has long ago sailed, but we may have actually had an easier time figuring out what worked and what didn’t if most or all of the people were actually following rules.

 

[havoc315]

I believe the Swedish people on the whole are quite happy with the outcome.

ah no. Which is why Sweden now has tons of lockdown restrictions.

 

[havoc315]

Yes, agreed. Mandates and requirements mean much less when they can’t be enforced. A government would have to either fine or arrest violators which didn’t happen a whole lot and wasn’t very successful. Private businesses on the other hand can just ban people from entering if they don’t follow masks and distancing. The most effective part of government mandates was setting a tone from the top. In states that had Governors who publicly supported sensible restrictions businesses met less resistance from customers.

Imagine if everyone actually just followed the covid restrictions 100% of the time, even if they thought they were unnecessary, because it was the right thing to do. We would have then known one way or the other if the restrictions actually worked. Instead we got constant resistance and then some of the same people who didn‘t follow the restrictions and recommendations then claimed they didn’t work because cases kept growing in numbers. It’s all an academic debate at this point since that ship has long ago sailed, but we may have actually had an easier time figuring out what worked and what didn’t if most or all of the people were actually following rules.

“the restrictions don’t work, so I’m not going to comply with the restrictions”

Covid cases increase as people ignore the restrictions.

“see.... the restrictions don’t work.”

 

[Nubs70]

Nope. The early estimates were not based on less contagious variants. Fauci himself said something to the effect that he used the lower number because the public wasn't ready to hear the real number and then when polls indicated higher acceptance he felt he could give he higher estimate.

The lower number was either a lie or something he just made up.

I would like to hear Fauci's stance on the ethics of gain of function research.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I just don’t get it.

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[DCBaker]

 

[GoofGoof]

I just don’t get it.

Redirect Notice

Woods said service members may have declined the offer for any one of a variety of reasons, including wanting to allow others to get the vaccine before them; having already received the vaccine through other channels; or waiting until the military makes receiving the vaccine mandatory, which it has yet to do.

It would be more informative if they could quantify how many of the Marines who said “no thanks” fall into the 2 bolded categories. It’s much less of a story if half the no’s either already went or plan to go later. The general population acceptance rate in polling is still around 70% so if even 10% of the people got the vaccine through other channels that would make it about where the average poll is.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Wonder how those who coughed and spat on CMs are doing in the criminal justice system of Florida (if charged at all in the first place). One such resolution elsewhere in FL:

A Florida woman who coughed in a shopper’s face last year at Pier 1 was sentenced to 30 days in jail. (Published 2021)

www.nytimes.com

A Florida woman who was seen in a widely watched video intentionally coughing on a shopper at a Pier 1 home-goods store over the summer, as fears about the pandemic were raging, was sentenced on Thursday to 30 days in jail, court records show.​

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The woman, Debra Hunter, 53, had been charged with misdemeanor assault in June after she walked up and coughed on the shopper, Heather Sprague, who had been recording video of Ms. Hunter’s dispute with employees at the store, in Jacksonville....​

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“I think I’ll get real close to you and cough on you, then — how’s that?” Ms. Hunter is heard saying in the video footage as she approaches the camera lens and then coughs. Ms. Sprague, who said she was wearing a mask at the time, testified in court that Ms. Hunter had left spittle on her face.​

​

The episode came during a period during the pandemic when the authorities were responding to heated confrontations across the country over mask mandates and other precautions, with some of those disputes leading to criminal charges for people who spat or coughed on ride-share drivers, store employees and police officers. Retail workers also reported being subjected to verbal abuse — and even threats involving guns — for enforcing mask rules at their workplaces.​

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In addition to 30 days in jail, Ms. Hunter was sentenced to six months of probation and ordered to pay a $500 fine. The judge in the sentencing hearing, James A. Ruth of Duval County Court, also ordered her to take an anger-management class and to undergo a mental-health evaluation and participate in follow-up treatment, if appropriate.​

 

[GoofGoof]

Good news

We are right back on track after the Easter weekend slow down. 12M doses administered over the last 3 days and 7 day average is over 3.1M a day. 45% of adults received at least 1 shot, inching closer to hitting the point where the majority of adults have started the vaccine process. 65+ still rising and now at 78.1% at least started.

 

[JoeCamel]

Woods said service members may have declined the offer for any one of a variety of reasons, including wanting to allow others to get the vaccine before them; having already received the vaccine through other channels; or waiting until the military makes receiving the vaccine mandatory, which it has yet to do.

It would be more informative if they could quantify how many of the Marines who said “no thanks” fall into the 2 bolded categories. It’s much less of a story if half the no’s either already went or plan to go later. The general population acceptance rate in polling is still around 70% so if even 10% of the people got the vaccine through other channels that would make it about where the average poll is.

Someone needs to tell those who want others to go first that they need to be on the front lines and ready to serve?

 

[GoofGoof]

Someone needs to tell those who want others to go first that they need to be on the front lines and ready to serve?

Agreed. In their defense it depends on when the response was given. If it was back in Jan/Feb when doses were very scarce I could see a 20 year old marine wanting to wait if his grandparents and other elderly relatives hadn’t gone yet. At this point nobody should be waiting for others to go. Once the vaccine gets full FDA approval I assume the DoD will mandate it for all soldiers so the ones left will get done.

 

[Horizons '83]

Agreed. In their defense it depends on when the response was given. If it was back in Jan/Feb when doses were very scarce I could see a 20 year old marine wanting to wait if his grandparents and other elderly relatives hadn’t gone yet. At this point nobody should be waiting for others to go. Once the vaccine gets full FDA approval I assume the DoD will mandate it for all soldiers so the ones left will get done.

Unfortunately the trial technically ends in 2023, so that might be awhile.

 

[Touchdown]

I think with younger employed people getting vaccinated now that we need to adjust our vaccine appointment schedules, with the widely known side effects occurring 24 hours after the shot most employed people are going to want a Friday or Saturday appointment so as not to miss a day of work. We need to stop bemoaning low numbers Mon-Thur and wait for the weekly number. We have had record days Fri and Sat for weeks now.

Also with the J&J slowdown after today, we won’t likely have a record day for the next few weeks.

 

[Heppenheimer]

I just don’t get it.

Redirect Notice

For about a year during my army career, I ran sick call for the Marines stationed at Fort Sill for artillery AIT. There seems to be something about the type of individual who joins the Marines. Generally really tough, but they turn white as a ghost if they need to receive a needle. I never noticed the same with the army.

I'm not claiming this is the reason, just an observation.

 

[correcaminos]

Unfortunately the trial technically ends in 2023, so that might be awhile.

Does not mean they have to wait

In-Depth: How full FDA approval would impact vaccine mandates, competition

Pfizer could apply for full FDA approval of its COVID-19 vaccine as early as this month, and Moderna could follow soon after. If regulators sign off, that status change would have significant impacts on vaccine mandates in workplaces and other experimental vaccine candidates still in development.

www.10news.com