Don't worry this might be a bit long too hahaGreat, thought-provoking stuff recently. Thanks to Tom ("Thor")!
Like @JackWatkinson, I'm late to this party, and deciphering this project's goals can be tricky when our threads are for brainstorming and workshopping. Perhaps @spacemt354 (great leadership so far, BTW), you could create a centralized "precis" for the project. Make it something like a Design Bible, where we can continually fine-tune the macro stuff such as the park's overall organization, goal, tone, story, etc. It makes sense why new Magic Kingdoms are so popular for hobbyist designers, as they put us on the same page automatically. It's also a challenge, when in a place like Tomorrowland we might have conflicting ideas about IP use, optimism vs. pessimism, and such. Let's improve on that!
To that end, I'm interested now in our overall guiding principle. (Excuse me, I can get wordy sometimes.) There are maybe two park-wide topics we might want to readdress now before moving forward: General layout, and the tone of the park.
General layout: Okay, so hub & spoke. There's a great organizing principle here! Four fundamental points on the compass (N, S, E, W), and four diagonal points between them (NE, SE, SW, NW), for eight lands. (For now I'm ignoring Villains Land and Critter Country, but we'll get to those.) Running from north to south, we go from fantasy to romanticized reality. From west to east, we move from the past to the future. The lands reflect this. At true north is true fantasy, Fantasyland. South is romanticized reality, Main Street. (The hub is neutral ground. And like Tokyo Disneyland, I can see sour roads from Main Street leading to the SE and SW lands before reaching the hub.)
The three lands to the east are all futuristic. The NE land (Discoveryland) is the most fantasy-driven, while World's Fair at SE is the most like Main Street, using a real world "futuristic" setting. Tomorrowland at true east is pure future.
Same thing for the west side, representing the past. Here, I propose rearranging the layout a bit! At true west, a true western: Frontierland. At SW, fusing with Main Street is American Wharf (our variation on the New Orleans/Liberty Square idea, themed here to San Francisco). Towards Fantasyland at NW is Adventureland, done in a more fantastical style. Of course, all this is tentative, and just my own brainstorming, so respond as you like.
As for Critter Country and Villains Land, neither of which fit this scheme perfectly, I propose placing them outside of the railroad berm, similarly to Grizzly Gulch and Mystic Point in Hong Kong, or like how Star Wars Land at Disneyland is appearing behind the Rivers of America. Critter Country can extend outwards from Frontierland, and Villains Land from Fantasyland.
Tone of the park: Disneyland Paris reimagines a castle park in a more romanticized, fantastical way, reflecting and responding to the European culture. This starts with the castle, which is more storybook to set itself apart from Europe's real castles, and that style bleeds out to all other lands. In Shanghai, the castle is simply freaking gigantic, befitting China, which then defines the rest of the park's tone. Or take DisneySea (hello, Tom!), where a macro-theme of the sea, of nautical exploration, informs the icon volcano, which then informs the lands' individual weenies, which inform on down to the food carts. Are we doing something similar?
Fantasia Castle is a cool concept, and could inform the whole park. But how? I'm not sure, but we maybe need to really, REALLY perfect the castle before moving on. Maybe we could make an "adventure" park, like IOA or DisneySea or even DCA, or we could make something more somber and Gothic, or something more historical, or more optimistic, or whatever. A topic to discuss!
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So maybe we should create a parkwide story and tone first, and a layout to go with it. We then ID each land's weenies and E-tickets and stories before we then start to design any one land more specifically. I propose following a model that's been used by Imagineering, where someone (@spacemt354 perhaps) serves as project leader, and each land is developed at the same time by a different sub-lead.
Just some thoughts.
First off thank you for the compliment, that's really humbling as honestly just a little over a month ago I started this up not knowing if it was going to have legs or if people would be continually interested in team brainstorming over a long period of time. However now it's really exciting to see so many people involved and willing to help -- and the icing on the cake with Tom as our advice "guide" for the project, we all have the potential to create something truly special and never seen before if we put our heads together!
I would be honored to take the project "lead" and help oversee/organize everything. Fair warning in that I've been slightly holding back a bit in terms of organization and involvement because I didn't want to scare away any people who are trying imagineering for the first time, and I wanted everyone to have a say. So if at any time it's going too fast or a bit much you can yell at me to slow down lol. But with this newfound advice/feedback from Tom, you're on the right track Douglas with what you're talking about. The General Layout and Tone are the essential first steps...and I'll also add -- organization/vision.
What happened was...we started with just a land (Fantasyland) -- and a bunch of people chimed in with what they wanted to see. Mary Poppins, Tangled, Snow White, Pooh, etc and then someone said...what about a Villains Land...what about World's Fair...how about Tomorrowland...what's our castle?
I think that was in hindsight a very backwards approach to all of this. While we definitely have a ton of great concepts and attractions lined up....not only is there room to improve...but there is room to produce a finite objective to our "Magic Kingdom"
You're off to a great start with your analogy for N E W S (always find it cool how news is the cardinal coordinates haha) anyway -- getting off track...I wholeheartedly agree with that philosophy.
To add onto that -- somethings we might want to consider.
A - What do we want the "story" of the park to be. This can be told through art or narrative, but the natural progression of the park. While each area can have its own specific story, how does one area flow into the next?
For example -- the Columbia Harbor House transition into Liberty Square is one of my favorite narrative spots in all of Disney Parks. If you're in Fantasyland -- you're in medieval Europe - the sign out in front of the Fantasyland entrance to the CHH has an image of fish and chicken (rather than the words below) - this is because many people in medieval Europe were illiterate, so a picture of fish and chicken will tell them that this restaurant serves those foods.
As you transition into Liberty Square and Colonial America, the entrance to the Columbia Harbor House says "fish and chicken" -- because more people could read and it shows the progression in time.
This can be discussed throughout the whole park...but basically what I'm getting at is -- for instance I think one of our weaker points is the transition from Main Street to "Fantasia Gardens"
Why does this happen? As bizarre as it may sound...the transition from a turn of the century Main Street to a Castle setting is deliberate and flows progressively...but a turn of the century Main Street to Fantasia Gardens? How does that flow?
-- Perhaps we take a page out of @Tom Thordarson 's book -- think DIFFERENT! And dream BIG!
Let's not limit ourselves to the confines of Main Street U.S.A. -- let's brainstorm several possible entrances to the park -- and how each entrance would fit our park's overall "story" How does one transition into the other.
My last point for now as I've been rambling is ....I'm wondering if a few new "threads" for organizational purposes would help keep things together and concise.
I love long threads haha -- but for this specific project I think it might suit us better if we all don't have to catch up on a bunch of pages. If someone has work in the morning, they might be 5 pages behind by lunch for instance. I tried this before, but I found that even with the original recap thread....I still felt disorganized. I didn't think it was doing much of anything because we were always in the same land, if you know what I mean.
How about we keep this thread for brainstorming and our plethora of ideas...but once we've decided on a concept...or story point...we place that in our "Park Thread" -- the thread which organizes the park "from scratch"
By from scratch -- I mean from inception to the details. Starting with the overall "weenie" -- to create the "1,2,3 read!" aspect to the project...enticing readers/viewers/potential guests into looking forward to more if we don't overwhelm them at first.
This thread won't be started until we have a concrete concept for the overall park -- but just wanted to throw that out there along with any other potential threads.
Lastly (sorry I'm almost done haha)
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Sub-Leads....I like that idea.
Also people with special talents could possibly float in and out of these threads. For instance art directors (cough @MonorailRed ) who specialize in art and enjoy it, could possibly be on call for several lands. Just an idea! Let me know what you all think!