Cameron has given the OK ...

[cheezbat]

I hear they're scrapping all Avatarland attractions entirely, and replacing them with an Avatarland themed carousel! Oh, and restrooms!

Eeh wrong! They're building a dumbo style spinner instead of a carousel! They have to have more than one spinner in the park ya know!

 

[unkadug]

As a DVC member, and lots of posts here on this site seem to hate us, but we are WDW/DL Disney fans too.
I'm not loving the Avatarland thing, but I am loving the expansion at Universal. We haven't been in years to Universal, but will make an exception once it is completed. Yes, we'll be staying at our DVC villa, and probably rent a car to go off property. We're from CA, and already have enjoyed Carsland, and Mermaid, there is no reason for us to see a clone in FLA. other than to enjoy the different Mermaid queue. We'll go to Universal instead of eating a lunch or dinner at Be Our Guest in FLE, which is a restaurant version of the Belle/Beast Library exhibit at DCA's Art Of Animation building and gift store that's been around since DCA opened. The only new attraction would be the Mine Train for us, and that isn't opening for a few years.
I'm not looking for an arguement about WDW vrs DL, I'm looking at Disney vrs the competition here in CA, and FLA. We've been using our DVC membership exclusively in CA the last few years. Boiled down for a reason to go back to FLA in the first place is a mine train, or Hogwart's Express. One of them will get us back to our DVC in WDW, but which one?

Yeah WDW has nothing. It's all about the Magic Kingdom ONLY. The other parks don't exist. The whole resort area is a wash

Typical Westcoaster attitude. Been there, done that, bought the DVD, Our park is better than your park, we have the original.

 

[dreamscometrue]

For myself, I'll have to say I'm excited. As I've gotten older, I realize more and more that we have very little control of most things in life. But I can choose my attitude, and I'd rather be excited, hopeful, and retain some of that childlike wonder that made me fall for Disney in the first place. I haven't been to UNI or IOA so I'm excited about that too. Sometimes it's hard being the glass half full kind of guy, but that's what I try to be. I've had real heartache in my life, and I know people who, because of circumstance, will NEVER be able to go to Disney, so I'm not going to get too upset that WDW doesn't build 100% of what I want. Raising prices, no direction (DTD), suffering maintenance, yes, I'll complain about that, but I promise, in the grand scheme of things, it will not make me miserable. If Avatar/Pandora is to be, then I'll be there to see for myself what it's like. I'm sure I won't be alone.

Ok, I'm finished.

Great post!

As for the bolded part, I'd like to add that surrounding yourself with positive people instead of negative, can make a huge difference as to how each of us sees the world. In daily life we can often choose those with whom we want to associate. It's tougher on here, but thankfully, there's 'Ignore'...the greatest feature slice sliced bread.

 

[CinematicFusion]

If done right, this soarin 2.o could be awesome. It will be all about flight and with Cameron's level of detail....it could be one of the best visceral attractions to date. Combine it with exceptional theming and I think it will a wonderful attraction. Who knows, maybe we start at a space port and fly down into the atmosphere of pandora. I think it will be a very cool ride.

Plus it's indoors...much needed at ak.
Can't wait to here what the boat ride is all about...looks like another much needed indoor attraction

 

[RSoxNo1]

i believe with 4 pods that would be 3600 per hour but i could be wrong

I really don't think it would be that high. Take a look at the prints that are out there. Each bay appears to have 16 seats per level, and it has been established that each bay will have 3 levels. That means 48 seats per bay, and 192 seats per cycle across all 4 bays. Assuming there are no additional hidden seats that would mean the following:
10 minute cycle time: 1152 guests per hour
9 minute cycle time: 1280 guests per hour
8 minute cycle time: 1440 guests per hour
7 minute cycle time: 1646 guests per hour
6 minute cycle time: 1920 guests per hour

 

[unkadug]

I really don't think it would be that high. Take a look at the prints that are out there. Each bay appears to have 16 seats per level, and it has been established that each bay will have 3 levels. That means 48 seats per bay, and 192 seats per cycle across all 4 bays. Assuming there are no additional hidden seats that would mean the following:
10 minute cycle time: 1152 guests per hour
9 minute cycle time: 1280 guests per hour
8 minute cycle time: 1440 guests per hour
7 minute cycle time: 1646 guests per hour
6 minute cycle time: 1920 guests per hour

I was simply going by Vekoma's numbers. Vekoma says 10 seats per vehicle. 3 rows. 3 levels.

Which would equate to 360 seats per cycle.

 

[Beholder]

One of the big unknowns for me is if they intend to expand this initial build if the sequels warrant it. Of course I realize this may never happen at all, or in this form, but like Harry Potter, if it proves successful enough, I could see an expansion of sorts that contains elements from one or both sequels. Getting ahead of myself, but just thinking.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I was simply going by Vekoma's numbers. Vekoma says 10 seats per vehicle. 3 rows. 3 levels.

Which would equate to 360 seats per cycle.

Looking at the bays I don't see 30 seats per level, I only see 16. If we're going on the 360 seats per cycle than this could be a very efficient ride. I look at it as each level only has the 16 seats, I don't think the seats are stacked on top of each other - the levels don't appear large enough to allow for multiple elevations of rows within the same level.

 

[CinematicFusion]

So these are the three areas that were on the table...
Flora and Fauna of Pandora walk through: This would be a family attraction, and possibly the entrance to the land.
Soarin’ over Pandora (Not a real name): This would use a simulator similar to the existing Soarin’ simulator but with 3D components
Motorbike Coaster: Designed by ride manufacturer Vekoma, the Motorbike design was proposed for Shanghai Disneyland for a Tron attraction. The vehicle seating is similar to that of a motor cycle (guests leaning forward with their feet back) and would face potential capacity issues. The theming of this ride would be elaborate, and it is the likeliest thing to be cut if they’re trying to reduce the budget. It also seems this is the project that James Cameron is most enthusiastic about.
(Info taken from wdw fanboys)

So the coaster attraction is scratched, soarin is kept and enhanced for 3d and the flora and fauna walk through becomes a boat ride....the inside portion of the boat ride will be pandora at night. Am I on the right track

 

[Captain Chaos]

Looking at the bays I don't see 30 seats per level, I only see 16. If we're going on the 360 seats per cycle than this could be a very efficient ride. I look at it as each level only has the 16 seats, I don't think the seats are stacked on top of each other - the levels don't appear large enough to allow for multiple elevations of rows within the same level.

Look at the computer rendering UNK posted. The rendering clearly shows 10 seats per row, 30 seats per vehicle. The photos show something different. It is possible the system is designed to hold 30 seats per vehicle, but the mock up design only shows half that. I think we should be taking the word of the company who actually designs the system.

 

[doctornick]

So these are the three areas that were on the table...
Flora and Fauna of Pandora walk through: This would be a family attraction, and possibly the entrance to the land.
Soarin’ over Pandora (Not a real name): This would use a simulator similar to the existing Soarin’ simulator but with 3D components
Motorbike Coaster: Designed by ride manufacturer Vekoma, the Motorbike design was proposed for Shanghai Disneyland for a Tron attraction. The vehicle seating is similar to that of a motor cycle (guests leaning forward with their feet back) and would face potential capacity issues. The theming of this ride would be elaborate, and it is the likeliest thing to be cut if they’re trying to reduce the budget. It also seems this is the project that James Cameron is most enthusiastic about.
(Info taken from wdw fanboys)

So the coaster attraction is scratched, soarin is kept and enhanced for 3d and the flora and fauna walk through becomes a boat ride....the inside portion of the boat ride will be pandora at night. Am I on the right track

You are correct. Basically, the simulator has remained pretty constant throughout, so the change is going from the bike coaster and walk through to a boat ride. While the bike coaster would certainly be a far more interesting ride and draw, I don't think this is as bad of a downgrade as one might think -- the boat ride is going to be accessable to all and is almost certainly going to allow for more theming that the bike coaster because it will be slower and more open to details of the world of Pandora. Also, DAK has a relative lack of "family friendly" rides -- Everest, Kali, Dinosaur and Primeval Whirl all have height restrictions (as will the Soarin' ride) and Kilimanjaro can be rough and not tolerated by some guests. So, there is certainly a need for rides that anyone can enjoy -- which is a niche that the boat ride can fill and wouldn't have been filled under the original plan. It's not like DAK needs another walk through.

Also, I'm curious how much the plans for the simulator have changed. I wouldn't be surprised if they increased the number of bays to allow for more capacity once they cut the bike coaster.

 

[WED Purist]

I haven't been here in a while, is it worth reading 51 pages of this?

 

[Skyway]

the boat ride is going to be accessable to all and is almost certainly going to allow for more theming that the bike coaster because it will be slower and more open to details of the world of Pandora. Also, DAK has a relative lack of "family friendly" rides.

Great point.

I was excited about the bike coaster, but you're right, AK doesn't have a great mix of family attractions (neither does DHS, which is why I've always been surprised at the Monster's Inc coaster. TSMM's lines prove there is a shortage of family rides)

I wonder if there's any truth to your theory that the walk-thru was upgraded to a boat ride when the bikes were cut. From a business and park ops perspective, that seems like a brilliant compromise, especially if there was hesitation to spend too much money on Avatar's questionable franchise.

 

[misterID]

I haven't been here in a while, is it worth reading 51 pages of this?

Nah, just know it loooks like Avatar/pandoraland is a go. It looks ot be pretty cool with (I think) three attractions and two big ones. The rest of the discussions in this thread you can find in your local middle school cafeteria.

 

[JustInTime]

Nah, just know it loooks like Avatar/pandoraland is a go. It looks ot be pretty cool with (I think) three attractions and two big ones. The rest of the discussions in this thread you can find in your local middle school cafeteria.

3 attractions? I thought only 2 were confirmed with a promise of a fabled "phase II".

 

[doctornick]

Nah, just know it loooks like Avatar/pandoraland is a go. It looks ot be pretty cool with (I think) three attractions and two big ones. The rest of the discussions in this thread you can find in your local middle school cafeteria.

No, that's not really a good summary. Yes, it looks like Pandora is a go and Cameron has signed off on the current makeup of the land. The current plan for the entire land is:

1. An "e-ticket" simulator similar to Soarin' but plussed -- with 3D and more independent vehicles that allow for greater movement. This will be indoors in a very large building featuring 4 theaters.
2. A "c-ticket" (presumed) boat ride that will be partially indoors and outdoors
3. A quick serve restaurant
4. A small gift shop at the end of the simulator ride and a larger free standing one in the area
5. Bathrooms

There's also been some blueprints that have been leaked (but is only a fraction of the 50 pages that exist).

 

[Hakunamatata]

3 attractions? I thought only 2 were confirmed with a promise of a fabled "phase II".

I think if done to the level it could be, the show building itself will be an attraction.

 

[doctornick]

Great point.

I was excited about the bike coaster, but you're right, AK doesn't have a great mix of family attractions (neither does DHS, which is why I've always been surprised at the Monster's Inc coaster. TSMM's lines prove there is a shortage of family rides)

I wonder if there's any truth to your theory that the walk-thru was upgraded to a boat ride when the bikes were cut. From a business and park ops perspective, that seems like a brilliant compromise, especially if there was hesitation to spend too much money on Avatar's questionable franchise.

Yeah, I think that the standard response to the news is that "they cut the bike coaster", which is true but isn't an accurate summary of the changes. It's more like "the cut the bike coaster and upgraded the walk through to a boat ride" which is much more like a compromise. Now, I'd have preferred the boat ride and the bike coaster, but that wasn't going to happen so... I think a good way to look at it is that we are getting two legit rides plus theming with either plan, the walk through was just superfluous. So, the trade off is losing a more thrilling ride that would be a big draw in exchange for a more accessible ride that would have more "show". I don't think it's as bad a tradeoff as it seems superficially.

 

[unkadug]

Looking at the bays I don't see 30 seats per level, I only see 16. If we're going on the 360 seats per cycle than this could be a very efficient ride. I look at it as each level only has the 16 seats, I don't think the seats are stacked on top of each other - the levels don't appear large enough to allow for multiple elevations of rows within the same level.

Per Vekoma's website
http://www.vekoma.com/index.php/specialities-and-attractions/panoramic-flight-simulator

​

Specifications 90 Seat I-RIde​

​

Size in total (LxWxh): 22x23x17.5m​

Base Vehicle (LxWxh): 5.60x2.10x2.70m​

total number of passengers: 90​

passenger carrying unit: 10-seat gondolas​

Allowable passenger size: 1.0 to 1.95 m​

Maximum capacity 900 pph​

(hourly capacity may vary depending on film duration)​

Available in various configurations for 90 or 160 passengers with 2 DOF or 6 DOF as well as custom designed to your specifications.​

Of course these are only sample specs just as the pictures are artists renderings ...we really have nothing to go on so far.

 

[Tom]

I really don't think it would be that high. Take a look at the prints that are out there. Each bay appears to have 16 seats per level, and it has been established that each bay will have 3 levels. That means 48 seats per bay, and 192 seats per cycle across all 4 bays. Assuming there are no additional hidden seats that would mean the following:
10 minute cycle time: 1152 guests per hour
9 minute cycle time: 1280 guests per hour
8 minute cycle time: 1440 guests per hour
7 minute cycle time: 1646 guests per hour
6 minute cycle time: 1920 guests per hour

I was simply going by Vekoma's numbers. Vekoma says 10 seats per vehicle. 3 rows. 3 levels.

Which would equate to 360 seats per cycle.

Tim's assessment is correct. The Vekoma site just shows their standard model, and a few images of other's they've installed.

If Disney does indeed use this system, it appears as if they would customize it to only have 2 carriages per floor, and 3 floors per theater. If you look at the plans on the web, it LOOKS like there are 8 individual seats per carriage.

So, 8 seats per carriage X 2 carriages across x 3 tiers = 48 guests per performance/ride. Or 192 guests per performance/ride if all 4 theaters are running.

Then it all comes down to cycle time. Keep in mind that this ride system should load/unload much faster than Soarin. Instead of a handful of CMs having to continually run around between 9 carriages on one floor to check seatbelts, child lap-loops, and stowed junk....they'll probably be able to do it with 2 CMs per floor with far fewer seats and all of them in one tidy row. Plus when it's over, guests unlatch and exit straight to their right, while the next group enters from the left. None of the confusing "which way to I go" mess that Soarin's queuing and boarding system has now.