News Bob Iger is back! Chapek is out!!

Casper Gutman

Well-Known Member
It would definitely be a retirement…not a “firing”…

And if Disney were to decide they needed to move on…it would be TO CAPITULATE to the disgruntled fans. That’s the point. They wouldn’t admit it…but that would be the point.
The worst piece of filmed Star Wars media ever created (well, maybe excluding the Holiday Special) was a direct result of capitulation to disgruntled fans.
 

"El Gran Magnifico"

Bring Me A Shrubbery
Premium Member
If the issue is that they didn’t adapt the almost universally awful novels?

No. The issue is that they didn’t stay true to the concept, the idea, the storytelling, the characters, and the general narrative.

She should have made her own “space movie” and left Star Wars out of it

Oh wait.

Maybe she did. A space ship running out of gas.

She even had to steal that

A4F34822-6E83-4DA2-B512-31A38084FD55.jpeg
 

erasure fan1

Well-Known Member
What is the evidence of “her lack of love or knowledge of Star Wars?”
Just go back and listen to or read her interviews. I'll give you one example. When asked about the movies and how marvel does things, se responded with, unlike marvel we don't have years of comics, novels and stories to go off of. Really? What about the years of comics, novels and stories that you relegated to the trash heap?
 

MerlinTheGoat

Well-Known Member
If the issue is that they didn’t adapt the almost universally awful novels? That seems like an absurd criticism. Marvel fans don’t kvetch that the films are only borrowing elements from thousands of pages of comics rather then directly adapting storylines despite the fact that their is far more quality content scattered throughout seventy-some years of comics. In fact, Star Wars’ approach to the EU stuff is very similar to the MCU’s approach to the comics, cherry-picking interesting ideas like Thrawn that serve the broader story.

Is the real issue that we don’t have giant sentient otters running around the Star Wars films?
The comparison of Star Wars' EU to how the MCU correlates to the comics is nonsense. Marvel movies have pretty much NEVER followed the canon of the comics. Hell, super hero comics are frequently rebooted and don't follow their OWN prior continuity.

Star Wars EU novels and comics on the other hand (prior to Disney) had always at least attempted to follow and tie-in with the current movie canon. They didn't always REMAIN canon over time, sometimes their plots were over-written by newer media (generally the plotlines that covered the Clone Wars). But at the time they were written, they were not a split alternate reality continuity. The comics, novels, games etc filled in the gaps between the movies, as well as the events before and after the Lucas films.

Your opinion on their quality is subjective and you're within your right not to enjoy them. I don't think the post-ROTJ EU is perfect either (they also went through the "somehow Palpatine returned" motions). But in my opinion, there's also some great content in there and would still have been preferable to the sequel trilogy by far. Even the Palpatine return was at least more enjoyable than the crap they came up with for the movies.
 
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Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
The worst piece of filmed Star Wars media ever created (well, maybe excluding the Holiday Special) was a direct result of capitulation to disgruntled fans.
The worst 3 are the “sequel” trilogy. The fans didn’t have much say on any of that.

The last Johnson was what a non-star was fan thinks you can do with Star Wars. The mythology was key…you don’t put “your spin” on it.

Plenty of other stuff to try that with.
 

MerlinTheGoat

Well-Known Member
All three of the sequel movies are really bad IMO (and no that's not intended as an insult to people who did like them, you're entitled to your opinion). At the time it released, I considered 7 to be just "mediocre", it opened up a lot of questions that were very contingent on the sequels following through in a satisfying way. But 8 and 9 actually managed to retroactively make it worse. It's not often I see a case where my opinion on a movie can be altered based on the quality of the sequels. But so much of 7 was dependent on the sequels that, when they failed so spectacularly, 7 was also dragged down even lower in my view.

Original trilogy is never going to be topped, I watched the new 4K Disney+ transfers with my mom earlier this year (via a projector and a large wall, so it was a semi theatrical experience). She's only ever seen A New Hope all the way through of the OT. She's also not a big fan of the franchise as a whole, but she found the entire OT fantastic.

The prequel trilogy is often very stupid due to the childish comedy, ugly overused CGI characters, stupid dialog and bad acting. And yet they are still very entertaining movies and there's a good plot buried below the surface. The action is also generally great too, especially the lightsaber sequences. I also think it has the most interesting and exotic environment design in the franchise and wish the theme park land had borrowed more from those environments. I'm not bored while watching these movies, even if I wish Lucas had someone to reign him in. A "competent" yet boring movie is a worse thing for me than a stupid yet entertaining one.

The sequel trilogy is an example of the "boring" complaint. They're not as "stupid" as the prequels (at least not in the same way) and are more competently acted. But they don't have an interesting plot hidden below the surface to help carry them, nor is the action very good. They aren't fun or entertaining movies. Hell, even Ian McDiarmid isn't given anything fun to really work with.
 

Br0ckford

Well-Known Member
All three of the sequel movies are really bad IMO (and no that's not intended as an insult to people who did like them, you're entitled to your opinion). At the time it released, I considered 7 to be just "mediocre", it opened up a lot of questions that were very contingent on the sequels following through in a satisfying way. But 8 and 9 actually managed to retroactively make it worse. It's not often I see a case where my opinion on a movie can be altered based on the quality of the sequels. But so much of 7 was dependent on the sequels that, when they failed so spectacularly, 7 was also dragged down even lower in my view.

Original trilogy is never going to be topped, I watched the new 4K Disney+ transfers with my mom earlier this year (via a projector and a large wall, so it was a semi theatrical experience). She's only ever seen A New Hope all the way through of the OT. She's also not a big fan of the franchise as a whole, but she found the entire OT fantastic.

The prequel trilogy is often very stupid due to the childish comedy, ugly overused CGI characters, stupid dialog and bad acting. And yet they are still very entertaining movies and there's a good plot buried below the surface. The action is also generally great too, especially the lightsaber sequences. I also think it has the most interesting and exotic environment design in the franchise and wish the theme park land had borrowed more from those environments. I'm not bored while watching these movies, even if I wish Lucas had someone to reign him in. A "competent" yet boring movie is a worse thing for me than a stupid yet entertaining one.

The sequel trilogy is an example of the "boring" complaint. They're not as "stupid" as the prequels (at least not in the same way) and are more competently acted. But they don't have an interesting plot hidden below the surface to help carry them, nor is the action very good. They aren't fun or entertaining movies. Hell, even Ian McDiarmid isn't given anything fun to really work with.
Spot on. This is what is in my head. You explained it better.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Reading along here and I have a legitimate question. How on earth do folks have time to watch so much TV and movies? I don't even have enough time to get within 45 pages of being caught up on this thread!

8 hours sleep, 8 hours work, 8 hours for watching. Even more on weekends. 😉
I sleep maybe 3-5 hours…

But I don’t watch much tv because THATS When I fall asleep 🤪
 

Tonto

Well-Known Member
Oh good grief. This forum is amazing sometimes. A person cannot dislike a movie without having an agenda now? Or is it possible that I might just have different tastes than you? I think Titanic and Avatar are both horrible, horrible films. And I have not the slightest desire to see any of Cameron's 27 planned Avatar sequels. Please tell me what agenda is driving that.
You lost me at "Oh Good Grief".
Be well
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
All three of the sequel movies are really bad IMO (and no that's not intended as an insult to people who did like them, you're entitled to your opinion). At the time it released, I considered 7 to be just "mediocre", it opened up a lot of questions that were very contingent on the sequels following through in a satisfying way. But 8 and 9 actually managed to retroactively make it worse. It's not often I see a case where my opinion on a movie can be altered based on the quality of the sequels. But so much of 7 was dependent on the sequels that, when they failed so spectacularly, 7 was also dragged down even lower in my view.

Original trilogy is never going to be topped, I watched the new 4K Disney+ transfers with my mom earlier this year (via a projector and a large wall, so it was a semi theatrical experience). She's only ever seen A New Hope all the way through of the OT. She's also not a big fan of the franchise as a whole, but she found the entire OT fantastic.

The prequel trilogy is often very stupid due to the childish comedy, ugly overused CGI characters, stupid dialog and bad acting. And yet they are still very entertaining movies and there's a good plot buried below the surface. The action is also generally great too, especially the lightsaber sequences. I also think it has the most interesting and exotic environment design in the franchise and wish the theme park land had borrowed more from those environments. I'm not bored while watching these movies, even if I wish Lucas had someone to reign him in. A "competent" yet boring movie is a worse thing for me than a stupid yet entertaining one.

The sequel trilogy is an example of the "boring" complaint. They're not as "stupid" as the prequels (at least not in the same way) and are more competently acted. But they don't have an interesting plot hidden below the surface to help carry them, nor is the action very good. They aren't fun or entertaining movies. Hell, even Ian McDiarmid isn't given anything fun to really work with.
…I love you…in a “Cyrano” kinda way…

Will you marry me?
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Is he in federal custody? That’s a serious crime

If a company or a CEO creates content meant for outlet "A", but then decides to put it out through outlet "B" first, then "A" -- well, that's not a crime. (It could get you in trouble if you promised a big name star it would be theatrical first and then put it on a streamer and then gave her a lot less money than she expected, but, that's a different controversy.)

Doing it to "hide" the cost of Disney+ isn't such a bad idea if you can get advertiser dollars for it on a linear channel and then put it on the streamer to keep the churn rate down. Plenty of shows made for the linear channels show up on the streamer the next day (and many companies do exactly that).

In some ways, it's an artificial distinction that some B-list series is "streamer material" rather than "linear channel material." Disney could have decided that almost all D+ content would have to go through theatrical or a linear channel first in order to get a second pay window out of it. If you're making content exclusively for your streamer to keep people subscribed to your streamer... it better be top notch A-list stuff that keeps people subscribed.

It's a way to share the cost of a project between two outlets, like Disney makes two parks share the cost of a cloned ride.

To call it "cooking the books" and implying criminality, or at least, deception, seems to be born of thinking the worst of a person (which is understandable in this case). But business-wise, it could be considered crafty. If it were up to some Wall Street types who panicked over Disney losing out licensing content in the Pay2 and Pay3 windows to other companies, there wouldn't be any new and exclusive D+ content. It would all go through the Pay Window grinder first.
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
This is why I would have liked to have seen Disney Parks and Resorts revive Walt's old idea of a ski resort somewhere. Or at least I would have, before the Imagineering dept. was gutted. Something like Mont Tremblant resort, which looks exactly like something Joe Rohde would have designed.

Disney seems unable to think outside a warm weather box, however.
Right outside Denver. Put a castle park with all the best indoor rides nearby, and create a second park at a ski resort (DisneySlope).

It's next to a major airport, West of the Mississippi, and in a state whose politics wouldn't get too rattled by Disney.
 

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