News Bob Iger is back! Chapek is out!!

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Compared to Universal it's it bigger but not sure if it would be as difficult as imagined. Just for conversation.....

Deluxe at Universal is 2400 rooms for two parks that's 1200 per park.

Disney Deluxe and DVC combine for 10380 room. Divided by four parks 2595 per park.

Universals is unlimited. If Disney put a limit I think it would be doable and a great incentive for deluxe and DVC stay.

What you’re glossing over is Disney has zero reason to give it.

Why? What benefit to them?

 

[Disone]

What you’re glossing over is Disney has zero reason to give it.

Why? What benefit to them?

I did say "for conversation" .

And it can't be both "Disney is struggling to sell deluxe inventory" but also "Disney has zero reason to give incentives".

 

[UNCgolf]

You also aren't limited to one ride. I can go on the same rides multiple times with my band.

Only with the unlimited version at Universal (which is the one that comes with a deluxe hotel room, making the value so good). They also sell another version that only gives you one ride per attraction.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I did say "for conversation" .

And it can't be both "Disney is struggling to sell deluxe inventory" but also "Disney has zero reason to give incentives".

Actually…I think both can and maybe are true? In a bizarro “only in wdw” sorta way…

 

[pdude81]

Compared to Universal it's it bigger but not sure if it would be as difficult as imagined. Just for conversation.....

Deluxe at Universal is 2400 rooms for two parks that's 1200 per park.

Disney Deluxe and DVC combine for 10380 room. Divided by four parks 2595 per park.

Universals is unlimited. If Disney put a limit I think it would be doable and a great incentive for deluxe and DVC stay.

There are a lot of things about the two places that are very different, including potential wait times and merge ratios. And for UO, most of the people with EP are on site guests, as the cost for anybody else to buy it is gross. If we were trying to use Universal as a barometer, you might have to cap the number of guests who could use it or raise the price on the few who were paying to a reputation damaging amount.

Now I could see them giving a discount on G+ to on site or deluxe guests. Say they average $20 per day now, then give a $5 discount for deluxe guests and they pocket similar money regardless. Or say one free G+ per stay as an incentive. Now that we're all clearly willing to pay for it the cat is out of the bag.

The "struggle" to sell deluxe rooms would only be due to the overcharging of those rooms, and they've been very willing to hold the top line on pricing. Discounts sure, but this is the price and too bad if you're not rich enough to pay. It's ironic how they play that game the other way with cast member salaries.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The "struggle" to sell deluxe rooms would only be due to the overcharging of those rooms, and they've been very willing to hold the top line on pricing.

 

[Basil of Baker Street]

How can that be? They took something that people loved and Updated It For Modern Audiences. That never fails.

Could you imagine if Disney hadn't acquired Marvel and Star Wars..

 

[OrlandoRising]

I don’t know what use there would be in describing specific institutional rot when it permeates every facet of the company. Do you think WDI is as strong of an institution as it was 5, 10, 20 years ago? Do you think consumer products have gotten better? Do you think Disney branded live action is in a better place now than it was 10 years ago? Do you think domestic theme park oppression operations have improved over the last decade? Do you think there are more original ideas coming out of the company in 2022 than in 2002? Do I have to ask more rhetorical questions?

The rhetorical questions suffice as specific examples. I'm not questioning the premise, but I think a term as serious as "institutional rot" requires some evidence, which you provided. I'm also wary of the Disney faithful exaggerating such a serious term to describe something much more trivial, like the presence of Disney IP inside Epcot.

You also aren't limited to one ride. I can go on the same rides multiple times with my band.

Cedar Point you can also get by without. We went maybe 5 times this summer, and bought it one day. In all honesty, we didn't even need it that day, but we had an early morning competition the next day, so that let us be done by 4. The other days? Throughout the day, just by watching wait times, we were able to hit almost everything, with most being around 30 minute waits or less. Now, we were strategic in picking our days. No holidays, not during the peak of summer, not on weekends, etc. But still. Beyond them setting up better with them, Cedar Point has 22 rides with it (and another dozen or more that aren't a part of it). DHS, there are 12. And that doesn't include like 2 more rides. DAK it's like 11, and then like 2 more without it. Which goes back to the point that they are just horribly underbuilt.

Not to make this thread about Cedar Point, but I also got Fast Lane Plus there on a mid-May Sunday when it wasn't entirely necessary but I just wanted to get on everything with ease. Mission accomplished there, though the merge points with the regular queue can be too early on some coasters, in my opinion.

I was wary of relying on their reported wait times because when I've visited other Cedar Fair parks, the wait times were rarely accurate and not frequently updated. Cedar Point is better, but if you stay in the Disney and Universal bubble, you take for granted that parks care about telling guests anything remotely accurate about wait times. That's a low priority (at most) for most regional parks.

Only with the unlimited version at Universal (which is the one that comes with a deluxe hotel room, making the value so good). They also sell another version that only gives you one ride per attraction.

I actually calculated this once years ago for a blog post, but back in 2017, the only situation where a cheaper hotel + buying a separate Express pass cost less than just upgrading to a Universal deluxe hotel with Express included was if you were a solo traveler staying at Cabana Bay. It really is a tremendous value.

 

[michmousefan]

These aren't exactly comparable systems when Express Pass doesn't require any reservation like FastPass or Genie+. Express and similar systems at regional parks -- Cedar Fair's Fast Lane, SeaWorld's Quick Queue -- eliminate almost any need for planning, you can ride everything you want as you come to it and you're virtually guaranteed a15-minute wait at most, more often a walk-on. A significant benefit for a significant upcharge.

It does seem like only a matter of time before they modify the system to include a "Lightning Lane Max" offering that *does* include Express-like access to the front of the lines/LL entrance. I only shudder at what the cost will be. Bet they test it out with Deluxe Resort guests first.

I would also imagine that they will still keep the Genie+ and individual LL options available so they can say they are "offering choices and flexibility" to their guests. Like the choice of... do you want to go into debt for six months, or six years?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It does seem like only a matter of time before they modify the system to include a "Lightning Lane Max" offering that *does* include Express-like access to the front of the lines/LL entrance. I only shudder at what the cost will be. Bet they test it out with Deluxe Resort guests first.

I would also imagine that they will still keep the Genie+ and individual LL options available so they can say they are "offering choices and flexibility" to their guests. Like the choice of... do you want to go into debt for six months, or six years?

I don’t think there is a scenario where a “all you can use” line skip can go into effect…no matter the cost.

It’s simply not enough seats to fit people efficiently. That would make it much worse.

 

[Jrb1979]

I don’t think there is a scenario where a “all you can use” line skip can go into effect…no matter the cost.

It’s simply not enough seats to fit people efficiently. That would make it much worse.

I could see a one use only pass that could work but they would have to charge a lot more then $30 that Genie+ is topping out at right now.

I would start at $150 a person for MK and hoppers and $100 a person for DHS, Epcot and AK. I understand it goes against everything that FP and Genie+ is used for and the type of clientele that goes to Disney.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

…yeah…the numbers just don’t work for an amusement park rollercoaster line skip upsell…
They’d almost have to price it to the point No one would buy it…which means it also does nothing

 

[dreday3]

Could you imagine if Disney hadn't acquired Marvel and Star Wars..

I would love it.

 

[Basil of Baker Street]

I would love it.

Me too. Star Wars anyway. Don't really care about Marvel.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Numbers coming out showing Willow is a huge flop on D+.

Disney is really hitting it out of the park lately.

I could see a one use only pass that could work but they would have to charge a lot more then $30 that Genie+ is topping out at right now.

I would start at $150 a person for MK and hoppers and $100 a person for DHS, Epcot and AK. I understand it goes against everything that FP and Genie+ is used for and the type of clientele that goes to Disney.

Willow was never gonna be that popular anyway

 

[MrPromey]

I actually calculated this once years ago for a blog post, but back in 2017, the only situation where a cheaper hotel + buying a separate Express pass cost less than just upgrading to a Universal deluxe hotel with Express included was if you were a solo traveler staying at Cabana Bay. It really is a tremendous value.

A tremendous value, entirely of their design since they literally set the value by determining the high retail price of that perk.

This has proven to be an incredibly smart move for a company that does not have the luxury of land to distance themselves from competing hotels.

It's such a huge perk to onsite guests and effectively, costs UNI almost nothing - really feels win-win.

Looking at that you have to ask yourself at what point Disney management decided that for them to win, the guests had to lose?

 

[MrPromey]

I don’t think there is a scenario where a “all you can use” line skip can go into effect…no matter the cost.

It’s simply not enough seats to fit people efficiently. That would make it much worse.

Isn't that the VIP tours?

They definitely found a price point that limits that one!

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Isn't that the VIP tours?

They definitely found a price point that limits that one!

I think they’re up to $2300 (not including admission) minimum?

Not exactly the six flags q-bot

 

[MrPromey]

I think their up to $2300 (not including admission) minimum?

Not exactly the six flats q-bot

Oh gosh, they start at way more than that - $450-$900 per hour, 7 hour minimum.*

So minimum of $3,150-$6300 per day (more if you want to go over the 7 continuous hours - yeah, you'll still be paying VIP pricing when you stop for lunch and/or dinner in the middle) for those who don't want to do the math.

I've never called to get full details but with that range in hourly pricing, I'm guessing that $450 price is available about as often as the bottom ticket price for date based admission to the MK is.

Anyway, that's why I have to laugh when people are like "They'd have to charge a crazy amount for an unlimited option - something like... $300 a day!" - they already have it and the fact that so few people seem to realize it even exists shows how out of reach it is for the vast majority.


*to be as fair as can be with this sort of thing, that includes up to 10 people so if you can actually talk 9 other people into going in on this with you all on the same date, it might be sort of doable that one day of the year they have the $450 per hour pricing.

 

[JoeCamel]

Oh gosh, they start at way more than that - $450-$900 per hour, 7 hour minimum.*

So minimum of $3,150-$6300 per day (more if you want to go over the 7 continuous hours - yeah, you'll still be paying VIP pricing when you stop for lunch and/or dinner in the middle) for those who don't want to do the math.

I've never called to get full details but with that range in hourly pricing, I'm guessing that $450 price is available about as often as the bottom ticket price for date based admission to the MK is.

Anyway, that's why I have to laugh when people are like "They'd have to charge a crazy amount for an unlimited option - something like... $300 a day!" - they already have it and the fact that so few people seem to realize it even exists shows how out of reach it is for the vast majority.


*to be as fair as can be with this sort of thing, that includes up to 10 people so if you can actually talk 9 other people into going in on this with you all on the same date, it might be sort of doable that one day of the year they have the $450 per hour pricing.

Plus gratuity....