Bloggers and Podcasters need to be controlled

[LittleBrownJug]

I am "one of those bloggers". I am a local who writes for a lifestyle blog. It isn't all about Disney by a long shot. There are few of us who cover all sorts of things in Orlando and Tampa. While we enjoy going to Disney (some of us more then others) we have lots going on that has nothing to do with Theme Parks. We (as a blog) are on the Disney media list and get invited to things. We are also on Universal and Sea World and Legoland among other places in Orlando that have nothing to do with theme parks.

We were there for Fantasyland/Test Track/ Splitsville opening. We didn't get a hotel room and we never have. We didn't get the same swag bag as the higher up media outlets got (with a New Fantasyland logo covered ipod touch for the QR Codes at every part of the media events). We got a set of pins you can buy at WOD, a pad, a pen, a pair of Splitsville socks (wont lie, they are pretty comfortable) and a bunch of papers with opening day info on them. Sure we got food and beverages at each part of the event we went to but even the smallest companies have treats laid out for events.

I (as well as the other bloggers on the site) pay for my annual pass monthly. Like I do to all the theme parks. We don't get a leg up unless invited to an event. I am in the parks less the some of my co bloggers because I just think the outlet is over saturated. I prefer to do other pieces on other Orlando things. Could I go every day? Sure. I have a pass that says I can. I MAYBE go once every two weeks. I have gone 3 months without stepping foot into the parks. I ( nor have my co bloggers) been put up at a hotel for an event put on by Disney. If I have stayed on property then the cost has come out of my pocket. I went on my first Disney Cruise in 2013 and I paid for that out of my own pocket. None of us ( my blogging partners) were invited to the Media Cruise. I have never been to Hawaii. Would love to go, not because of Disney, but, lord... who WOULDN'T want to sit on a beach and drink festive drinks out of fruit cups? Maybe some day but I have no problem paying my way.

The blog I write for was approached by Disney to be on their media lists because they liked our site and liked our style. We don't write " Pixie dust and sparkles and everything is happily ever after" because A. That is crap and B. We are all far too honest to do that. We just write our opinions and obviously they don't have an issue that we aren't all sunshine all the time because they haven't taken us off the media list. Personally I have HUGE issues with a lot that Disney does. The Yeti is horrid, The Tree of life is a joke, I think NFL is while pretty to look at, so far kinda boring (Grey stuff is not delicious, its glorified frosting) and Don't get me started on Wonders of Life and the Millennium Village. Disney quick service is TERRIBLE and I think the fact that they are shafting Annual Pass Holders more and more each year is a joke and a half. The insist they make more money on first timers then repeat visitors (weekly or monthly). Disney is FAR from perfect and they tend to glory over issues and paint pretty pictures over holes then to fill them in the way they should.

I don't get why everyone is assuming that every single Blogger/ Pod Caster/ whatever is just like "he who shall not be named". We all do NOT get treated the same. We all have different opinions on how to cover things and perhaps that is why there are so many bloggers/pod casters?

Do I think that the whole Social Media Media thing has gotten out of hand? Yes I do. I would never argue that it hasn't. But I think it is unfair to lump everyone together in one category of takers. To say that everyone is working the system to get things for free is unfair. Are people doing so? YES! TOTALLY!! But, not everyone.
What we do on the blog is nothing that anyone else can not do. We write about things we like, we do things that are fun, we have disappointments and sometimes things that we are excited for are HUGE let downs but, we aren't doing anything that someone with fingers and a computer could not do themselves.
Not everyone is a "shill". Not everyone is out for golden status. We have fun. That is all we are going for.

 

[hrcollectibles]

it's just the name.. it's not like they said "Ricky Brigante is the best WDW podcaster in the tri-state area!!"..

I guess they couldn't get the rights to his likeness... I mean its not like he would take up a lot of space in the panel..lol I used to listen to his podcast on a regular basis, not any more,its just way to sugar coated for me.

 

[luv]

I listen to the WDW Today podcast...sometimes.

I don't read blogs. I know as much (and often more) about visiting the parks as any of the bloggers, so I don't see the point, really. I get my WDW news from WDW employees and here. That is all I need.

I assume anyone that has a Disney site is either a seriously devoted fan, trying to make a buck or both. And there isn't anything wrong with any of that. If they get some free stuff from Disney, big whup.

If someone else wants the Disney freebies, they could start a blog, too.

 

[Lee]

I am "one of those bloggers"...

Thank you for your candor.
I hope it's been made clear, in this thread and others, that not every blogger or podcaster is part of the problem.

 

[WDW1974]

Thank you for your candor.
I hope it's been made clear, in this thread and others, that not every blogger or podcaster is part of the problem.

Seconded. ... In no way would I group all bloggers together. Just like I wouldn't group all ... I dunno ... Imagineers or NFL quarterbacks together. Our new member, who I hope sticks around, is probably more of the rule than the exception.

It's simply the exceptions, the huge self-promoters who are in this for a lot more than fun and writing about things that interest them that are the problem. Some of them have large financial interests that are now at stake because being de facto BRAND ADVOCATES for Disney has become their vocation. They are the ones getting free Dream cruises and being flown out to Hawaii (you should go, but there are better areas to stay than where Aulani is located on Oahu!) and even getting the better swag bags.

LittleBrownJug's contribution here is greatly appreciated and a well articulated view that I believe represents a significant portion of the blogosphere (that would be the good part!) Thanks again and welcome to MAGIC!

 

[Goofyernmost]

Not true-Ive seen DOL folks talk it up with employees leading to rulings unfavorable to the employer even though no complaint was filed. And if one were filed, well it's not like any of these guys are lawyers or anything

You are correct, they investigate and present a ruling of favorable or unfavorable, but that's where it ends for DOL. If the people affected by the ruling don't pursue legal action, nothing happens.

 

[asianway]

You are correct, they investigate and present a ruling of favorable or unfavorable, but that's where it ends for DOL. If the people affected by the ruling don't pursue legal action, nothing happens.

Yes...but in the year 2013, unless youre working at Scrooge & Marley, it is in your best interest to cure the wrong proactively once presented with an unfavorable ruling...

 

[PhotoDave219]

Well at least we know where this all came from......

Most likely, thats just a throw-a-way gag. Notice that JJJ is saying how annoying the media is. Juxtapose that against the guy naming himself and his outlet and maybe its the complete opposite if what everyone is thinking?

Anyways, found this today over on gawker. Journalism is not about YOU.

 

[Bolna]

Anyways, found this today over on gawker. Journalism is not about YOU.

Interesting link, thanks for posting it. Kind of reminds me of my dislike of the introduction of interactivity and audience participation (from the HM queue to Streetmosphere at DHS).

 

[Malin]

OK, I watched the video and didn't get a clear indication of the concerns about Disney's control of fan sites. Or are you guys expecting that someone that makes his living promoting "the magic" is going to swing the camera around and say, "well, it would be a nice place but look at that paint chip" or maybe "It's OK but not like it used to be". How long do you think they would keep their fan base if they went all microscopic on our butts.

You didn't get any clear indication, seriously. The fact he was at the Cars Land event which is something I doubt he paid flights or accomendation for and was given free access to talk to both Meg Crofton and Bob Iger. The organised events like the Cruises which he profits from and the free reign of the parks he's given are all things Disney do for him. Simply because he promotes the product in such a favourable light to Disney. In the interest of fairness how many other Disney blogs and sites are given this kind of access to Disney. Why is Lou being given special treatment to sell Magazines, Tours, books because he plays nice with Disney. If he was to use his network to point out the errors in recent years how quickly do you think he'd lose his benefits. If that's not Disney controlling Bloggers and Podcasters then I seriously don't know what else anyone else could say that will change your view. Your freebies all depend on how large your fan base is and how nice your willing to speak of the Mouse. It is very much a controlled environment and one that Disney is in charge off.

 

[Goofyernmost]

You didn't get any clear indication, seriously. The fact he was at the Cars Land event which is something I doubt he paid flights or accomendation for and was given free access to talk to both Meg Crofton and Bob Iger. The organised events like the Cruises which he profits from and the free reign of the parks he's given are all things Disney do for him. Simply because he promotes the product in such a favourable light to Disney. In the interest of fairness how many other Disney blogs and sites are given this kind of access to Disney. Why is Lou being given special treatment to sell Magazines, Tours, books because he plays nice with Disney. If he was to use his network to point out the errors in recent years how quickly do you think he'd lose his benefits. If that's not Disney controlling Bloggers and Podcasters then I seriously don't know what else anyone else could say that will change your view. Your freebies all depend on how large your fan base is and how nice your willing to speak of the Mouse. It is very much a controlled environment and one that Disney is in charge off.

Of course it is Disney controlling him. Who's arguing with you on that and why does it matter? If you're going to point out flaws in Disney you are not going to get those "perks". Why is that so difficult to understand? He is no more a SN then anyone else that takes money from Disney to promote or generally be loyal to the Disney brand.

No one is arguing that there are problems, but he doesn't feel that it is his job to point that out. This guy isn't Walter Cronkite, he's a Disney fan promoting Disney. On top of that your second sentence, that I partially bolded and completely underlined is why I am so "defensive". You guy have doubts, but you don't have proof. He may very well receive comps. for his social media support, but I fail to see why that is of anyone's concern. Come clean everyone what is the real gripe here. I'd like to understand!

You already answered the question of why he is allowed to do this and other bloggers are not. If he is getting all this stuff, and he could be, it's because he does support Disney and doesn't point out it's flaws. It pretty elementary really. He isn't pretending to be an investigative reporter, he provides a service that Disney might have to pay the long buck to duplicate. All he has to do is, one time, say something "spirited" about the place and see how quickly that dissolves into the mud. What he does is different then what the rest of the bloggers do, that's why it happens. Plus I truly doubt he is the only one that gets that backhanded reward.

 

[Bolna]

Plus I truly doubt he is the only one that gets that backhanded reward.

No, of course not. Others get comped trips as well. However, they are open about it. Just look at the blog posts by the Allears.net team. If it is a post from an event they were invited to they disclose it very openly. See for example these posts from the Aulani Grand Opening where it says at the end of every post:

Disclosure:​

As an invited media guest, AllEars' travel expenses to the Aulani Grand Opening event were paid by the Disney company.​

 

[asianway]

Some light reading from the FTC:

http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2009/10/endortest.shtm

http://ftc.gov/os/2009/10/091005revisedendorsementguides.pdf

I believe at the height of the lp thread someone added some language hastily to their site that wasnt there before...

 

[PhotoDave219]

No, of course not. Others get comped trips as well. However, they are open about it. Just look at the blog posts by the Allears.net team. If it is a post from an event they were invited to they disclose it very openly. See for example these posts from the Aulani Grand Opening where it says at the end of every post:

Then my Hats off to Deb, her crew and their professionalism.

 

[Captain Chaos]

Of course it is Disney controlling him. Who's arguing with you on that and why does it matter? If you're going to point out flaws in Disney you are not going to get those "perks". Why is that so difficult to understand? He is no more a SN then anyone else that takes money from Disney to promote or generally be loyal to the Disney brand.

No one is arguing that there are problems, but he doesn't feel that it is his job to point that out. This guy isn't Walter Cronkite, he's a Disney fan promoting Disney. On top of that your second sentence, that I partially bolded and completely underlined is why I am so "defensive". You guy have doubts, but you don't have proof. He may very well receive comps. for his social media support, but I fail to see why that is of anyone's concern. Come clean everyone what is the real gripe here. I'd like to understand!

You already answered the question of why he is allowed to do this and other bloggers are not. If he is getting all this stuff, and he could be, it's because he does support Disney and doesn't point out it's flaws. It pretty elementary really. He isn't pretending to be an investigative reporter, he provides a service that Disney might have to pay the long buck to duplicate. All he has to do is, one time, say something "spirited" about the place and see how quickly that dissolves into the mud. What he does is different then what the rest of the bloggers do, that's why it happens. Plus I truly doubt he is the only one that gets that backhanded reward.

Then he needs to stop saying he isn't affiliated with the WDC when he clearly is...

But, the thing you are missing is he is allowed to make a living off their IP when others aren't even allowed to paint Disney's characters on the walls of their child care center... It isn't rocket science trying to figure out why people are annoyed over this... Disney has, many times, stopped people from trying to profit off their IP meanwhile they turn a blind eye towards others... What's good for the goose is good for the gander... If you allow one, you allow ALL... Try doing what Lou does.. See how fast you are escorted off property...

 

[Goofyernmost]

Then he needs to stop saying he isn't affiliated with the WDC when he clearly is...

But, the thing you are missing is he is allowed to make a living off their IP when others aren't even allowed to paint Disney's characters on the walls of their child care center... It isn't rocket science trying to figure out why people are annoyed over this... Disney has, many times, stopped people from trying to profit off their IP meanwhile they turn a blind eye towards others... What's good for the goose is good for the gander... If you allow one, you allow ALL... Try doing what Lou does.. See how fast you are escorted off property...

I see your point and understand that more clearly then the random "unfairs" that have been thrown about. It kind of makes me think that perhaps he is contracted to do what he does by Disney as an independent contractor. As such, he doesn't have a direct connection with Disney other than via contract and since the contract would spell out what type of behavior they are contracting him to do, doesn't warrant anything other than acknowledging that he is there. The terms of the agreement do not legally have to be discussed and he "technically" is not personally within Disney's control. He would have to follow the terms of his contract, but wouldn't necessarily support it from the heart. I could see that happening. Based on that I could see Disney having the power to tell him where his services are needed and what event they needed to be covered.

I'm still not sure why it is essential that there be a full disclosure when the vast majority that come in contact with him, Guest-wise, more than likely assume he's paid to be there anyway. A grown man cannot spend his time in the parks, playing radio and TV DJ with no visible means of income. WDW Radio cannot be perceived as anything but a owned WDW connection, can it?

I'm just thinking that there is a great deal more to this story then just some blogger/podcaster identification. There has to be otherwise all would qualify. If this is true, then Lou has sold his soul to Disney and the others have refused to do so. Free Country isn't it?

 

[Captain Chaos]

I see your point and understand that more clearly then the random "unfairs" that have been thrown about. It kind of makes me think that perhaps he is contracted to do what he does by Disney as an independent contractor. As such, he doesn't have a direct connection with Disney other than via contract and since the contract would spell out what type of behavior they are contracting him to do, doesn't warrant anything other than acknowledging that he is there. The terms of the agreement do not legally have to be discussed and he "technically" is not personally within Disney's control. He would have to follow the terms of his contract, but wouldn't necessarily support it from the heart. I could see that happening. Based on that I could see Disney having the power to tell him where his services are needed and what event they needed to be covered.

Perhaps he is contracted, who knows? I don't... And like you, I personally don't care.. He built a niche for himself, more power to him... I can't or won't bash the guy for doing something he obviously loves... I mean, it is evident the man has an (probably unhealthy) passion for Disney... I just can't stand his podcast because it causes a pixie dust induced coma... But, I won't take away from him the fact that he knows his stuff about Disney..

I'm still not sure why it is essential that there be a full disclosure when the vast majority that come in contact with him, Guest-wise, more than likely assume he's paid to be there anyway. A grown man cannot spend his time in the parks, playing radio and TV DJ with no visible means of income. WDW Radio cannot be perceived as anything but a owned WDW connection, can it?

I believe in full disclosure because I want to know if the review being given is an honest one or a bought and paid for one... If he is being bought and paid for by Disney then his reviews of anything is bogus and therefore cannot be trusted... Now, I would say majority of his audience already knows about Disney so anything he reviews is probably nothing new to them... however, it is the regular guest who doesn't truly know anything that will be fooled by a bogus review... If they are being led to believe the parks are in great shape, all the food is the best food ever, and everything is perfect, they are being misled... Do I blame Lou like most here want to do? No... I blame Disney... Because Disney is creating a facade, falsely advertising their product by allowing a fan with no job to come and go as he pleases and to earn a living off of THEIR legally protected IP as long as he is a part of this facade... Maybe it is unethical of him, maybe not... That isn't for me to decide... But, it is highly unethical of Disney...

I'm just thinking that there is a great deal more to this story then just some blogger/podcaster identification. There has to be otherwise all would qualify. If this is true, then Lou has sold his soul to Disney and the others have refused to do so. Free Country isn't it?

Free but with restrictions... We have the freedom of speech right? But can you walk into a crowded movie theater and yell FIRE? No.. Well, I guess technically you can but you'll be answering to the police why you shouldn't be arrested...

And again, I'm don't blame Lou completely, and actually, blame him very little... If any one here could get away with what him and Jeff Lange get away with, I'm sure any one here would do the same... But chances are you cannot and will not get away with it... And that should be the questions being raised... I mean look at the new member we have here who has down right told us she and her partners do not get anything free from Disney.. Well why not? Why does Lou, Ricky, and god knows who else get the freebies and others don't? Cause they kiss the mouse's ? Well, then I guess the whole notion of FREE COUNTRY goes out the window... Cause then Disney is controlling the media and press (remember we have freedom of the press too)... So, in order to get freebies (and geez, are people that pathetic and desperate for a Disney freebie, is the addiction THAT bad?????) you have to lose your freedom of speech and press and let the dictatorship (TWDC) control you...

Again, personally, I don't care... What Lou does has absolutely no affect on my life.. Things will either go my way and be good for me or they won't based on my actions, not whether Lou gets a free trip to Disneyland... So, I'm with ya Goof, believe me... And personally, this thread is just down right silly.. I mean, it was started by a guy who has, let's see, a Disney fan site, Disney fan blog, and a Disney fan podcast yet he bashes bloggers and podcasters and the treatment they get from Disney because Lou's name was in a Spider-Man comic... Sour grapes?? Yes...

With that said, who is better for blogging: Word Press or Blogger or is there an even better one out there? I think I need to get in on the action..

 

[flynnibus]

Agreed.

But with this 'new media' there are no rules and it's like the Wild West when it comes to how WDW Co is dealing with bloggers/podcaster/lifestyle whores. ... People aren't being given the whole story by any stretch.

But why is that Tom or Lou's responsibility? They are free to cover whatever they chose. They can live and die by those choices. Having a fair, unbiased, view of Disney being available isn't their responsibility.

The problem is you can't dictate that the market demand one either. These guys have success because there is an audience that wants what they offer. Is that audience being deceived into thinking they are getting a fair and objective view? I don't think so - I don't even think they even advertise themselves as one to start with.

I can't fault them for not being something they themselves don't even consider themselves to be - nor can I will them into being something i think they should be. So no skin off my back.

I think there should be fair and balanced eyes on parks&resorts, and that's why I come to places like this. But I don't think there is any sense in the comment of the op about 'stopping' sites that don't meet my personal criteria.

Other companies have similar efforts - some succeed others do not. It's the audience that defines that.

To me the only thing that of debate is a group's independence or not. That is worthy of discussion and worthy of pursing any outing. IMHO

As far as the truth as you said - it's clear to me that isn't what these guys want their 'product' to be. So it needs to come from elsewhere

 

[flynnibus]

I don't know, but I find the whole concept to be largely useless (yes, like Twitter).

Imagine if there was someone you respected, but you don't have anytime, on demand access to. And the kind of conversation you would have if you we're together,they recorded such a conversation and allowed you to listen to it when you wanted. Those kinds of podcasts are good because they know how to represent your part of the conversation without your actual participation- or at least know how to initiate a discussion you'd like to listen to. There is such good content out there so don't lose all hope

.. Someone remarked to me earlier today that one of the Lifestylers was recording their 2012 Year in Review Podcast and it was five or six hours long. All I could think is 'what type of person thinks that much happened that's worthy of that amount of time -- I could do a 30 minute wrap up of WDW and all the O-Town parks quite easily and not miss anything?' and 'who will actually listen to that?' ... Do they truly think they'll get the time back when they get to the Pearly Gates (assuming of course you believe it that)?

I learned to stop worrying about other people's failures. It wasn't worth getting worked up over people who refused to be helped. I've been much more content and relaxed since

The only passion they have is for their own bottom lines. Do they like Disney? Sure. But if another company offered them the chance to be a paid online BRAND ADVOCATE, they'd drop the Mouse tomorrow

I dunno. I haven't seen anything to make me see them as so money driven. I think it's more about idolization. They idolize the ideals the company projects about itself and by coddling the bloggers the company plays to their fantasies... Letting them get close to the things they ,etc. then, the fear of losing that is enough in itself to control them.

I haven't seen anything to lead me to believe there is greed enticing numbers in this space. I mean flights to Hawaii are great - but it's not gonna pay your mortgage or pay to put your kids through college you know? It can only fund your hobby interest.

 

[flynnibus]

I'm still not sure why it is essential that there be a full disclosure when the vast majority that come in contact with him, Guest-wise, more than likely assume he's paid to be there anyway.

Well for one thing because it is required by law because the FTC has recognized the lack of transparency hurts consumers when a reviewer's position as a customer is distorted or misrepresented.