News 'Beyond Big Thunder Mountain' Blue Sky concept revealed for Magic Kingdom

[BrianLo]

I don't think any theme park needs a simulator; they're generally weaker attractions.

Flight of Passage is easily the best simulator ever built and it's still not one of the very best rides just at WDW.

As for Coco -- I think it lends itself to a flying simulator better than many other IPs, but definitely not as well as Avatar. More importantly, Coco also fits other attraction types. A Coco flying sim could be solid, but they could definitely build something better.

I think every park needs variety and that’s what Universal has learned the hard way. They are seen as weaker attractions because Universal was horribly inconsistent at executing good attractions for a while there, not because the ride concept itself was inherently bad.

Soaring over California has long punched above its ‘ticketing’ weight in guests eyes. Star Tours has lived a long life. Flight of Passage was likely many guests favourite attraction for several years there. I’m sure it still is. Like it or not it’s still an ILL attraction, which speaks volumes. I think claiming FOP is not a top tier attraction is a forum snob opinion and doesn’t match the broader public.

3/4 for Disney is batting fairly strongly with that ride type, is it not?

A practical tour of the land of the dead could be good, but flying on an Alebrieje seems more what one would dream of. I’m all for an updated ride platform too.

 

[Andrew25]

I'm not opposed to attractions with screens... but MK has proven that you don't need them to be popular. A park (and just about every single theme park) should prioritize immersive environments.

I don't think MK should get a simulator attraction, just wouldn't feel right in the park.

 

[UNCgolf]

I think every park needs variety and that’s what Universal has learned the hard way. They are seen as weaker attractions because Universal was horribly inconsistent at executing good attractions for a while there, not because the ride concept itself was inherently bad.

Soaring over California has long punched above its ‘ticketing’ weight in guests eyes. Star Tours has lived a long life. Flight of Passage was likely many guests favourite attraction for several years there. I’m sure it still is. Like it or not it’s still an ILL attraction, which speaks volumes. I think claiming FOP is not a top tier attraction is a forum snob opinion and doesn’t match the broader public.

3/4 for Disney is batting fairly strongly with that ride type, is it not?

A practical tour of the land of the dead could be good, but flying on an Alebrieje seems more what one would dream of. I’m all for an updated ride platform too.

Obviously FoP is considered a top tier attraction by the general public, but I don't see how that matters -- I didn't think we needed to specify that it's just our personal opinion when we're talking about rides. There's nothing objective about ride quality.

Simulators are inherently weaker attractions (for me) because they struggle to ever go beyond the feeling that I'm just watching a movie. I can get almost the same experience watching the ride video at home as I can actually being on the simulator, so a Coco simulator merits a shrug from me compared to numerous other possibilities for an attraction.

I'm not suggesting a simulator would be a failure, just that I think they can do better. I also don't think anyone out there thinks the Magic Kingdom would be better if it had a simulator, as though it's something specifically missing from the park lineup.

 

[Delta-7]

I'm becoming uncertain over what manufacturer is doing the BTM retrack. I wouldn't be surprised if it's Dynamic Attractions since they did the retrack at Disneyland, or even Vekoma. But I'm hearing some people say, of all firms, it's going to be Intamin. I learned of this rumor coming from other sites that Disney and Vekoma had a falling out due to the parks running more trains than the manufacturer intended on GOTG and TRON, which might explain why Tokyo's new Space Mountain will be from Intamin (other than the fact that Tokyo Disney is owned and operated by OLC and that this new SM could have a drop track element).

This Intamin rumor has me concerned. The only "mine trains" they've ever made have downscaled trains with the wheel bogeys bracing the outside of the track, instead of inside like on classic Arrow and Vekoma coasters. Is this retrack more than what it seems, making BTM into an entirely new coaster credit? Or would Intamin just fabricate the track, trains and all to look identical to how it looks and operates right now? I hope it's the latter. I mean, it's probably gonna be the latter.

I know this sounds really crazy right now and might just be an outlandish rumor. It's just causing me some unwanted excitement. Regardless, I feel it's more likely to be Dynamic or Vekoma as the manufacturer for this project.

 

[castlecake2.0]

No

Good they need it even it’s for nothing more than easing demand on transportation after the fireworks

 

[Starship824]

I'm becoming uncertain over what manufacturer is doing the BTM retrack. I wouldn't be surprised if it's Dynamic Attractions since they did the retrack at Disneyland, or even Vekoma. But I'm hearing some people say, of all firms, it's going to be Intamin. I learned of this rumor coming from other sites that Disney and Vekoma had a falling out due to the parks running more trains than the manufacturer intended on GOTG and TRON, which might explain why Tokyo's new Space Mountain will be from Intamin (other than the fact that Tokyo Disney is owned and operated by OLC and that this new SM could have a drop track element).

This Intamin rumor has me concerned. The only "mine trains" they've ever made have downscaled trains with the wheel bogeys bracing the outside of the track, instead of inside like on classic Arrow and Vekoma coasters. Is this retrack more than what it seems, making BTM into an entirely new coaster credit? Or would Intamin just fabricate the track, trains and all to look identical to how it looks and operates right now? I hope it's the latter. I mean, it's probably gonna be the latter.

I know this sounds really crazy right now and might just be an outlandish rumor. It's just causing me some unwanted excitement. Regardless, I feel it's more likely to be Dynamic or Vekoma as the manufacturer for this project.

When did this rumour of vekoma not wanting to work with Disney come from?

 

[Delta-7]

When did this rumour of vekoma not wanting to work with Disney come from?

Can't be sure, but there's been talk about it on ParkFans.net. I'm not sure if I can believe it either.

 

[headintheclouds]

Does anyone know an estimate or guess of when they plan on closing BTMR.

 

[PREMiERdrum]

Unless something has changed very, very recently, it's not Intamin.

PREMiERdrum, a Cedar Point local.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I learned of this rumor coming from other sites that Disney and Vekoma had a falling out due to the parks running more trains than the manufacturer intended on GOTG and TRON

That doesn’t really make sense. Disney using their own ride controls is not new but there are only so many blocks on the circuit. Running too many trains would mean putting more than one train in a block at a time.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Vekoma is still happy to take Disney’s money. They are well aware of how Disney operates its coasters.

A company we will never see in the parks is Bolliger & Mabillard.

 

[Andrew25]

I learned of this rumor coming from other sites that Disney and Vekoma had a falling out due to the parks running more trains than the manufacturer intended on GOTG and TRON, which might explain why Tokyo's new Space Mountain will be from Intamin (other than the fact that Tokyo Disney is owned and operated by OLC and that this new SM could have a drop track element).

I sincerely doubt Vekoma will do anything to harm their relationship with the mouse, especially over how many trains they run. GOTG and Tron are already designed with more than enough sufficient block zones to operate at Disney's desired efficiency.

A company we will never see in the parks is Bolliger & Mabillard.

B&M has two newer family models that could lend themselves well to Disney projects actually... Penguin Trek at SWO is something I can see taking over Space Mountain with its ability to fit into compact spaces.

5 years ago I would have laughed at a B&M inside a Disney park, but they've been offering newer products now that can fit Disney's goals.

 

[ToTBellHop]

I sincerely doubt Vekoma will do anything to harm their relationship with the mouse, especially over how many trains they run. GOTG and Tron are already designed with more than enough sufficient block zones to operate at Disney's desired efficiency.


B&M has two newer family models that could lend themselves well to Disney projects actually... Penguin Trek at SWO is something I can see taking over Space Mountain with its ability to fit into compact spaces.

5 years ago I would have laughed at a B&M inside a Disney park, but they've been offering newer products now that can fit Disney's goals.

I’ve never known them to be flexible enough to work with Disney’s theming demands. Even Universal has soured on B&M come over to Vekoma. (Intamin and Mack at UEU, right?).

 

[tanc]

Villains land is all I could ask for, but it needs to be Fantasy Springs level of detail. Every possible ounce of imagination they can put in without cutting budget. I just don't know how feasible that is though. We know they can do it, it's just if they're willing to invest into it. Fantasy Springs I think practically costs as much as DisneySea in its entirety to build so it's going to be incredibly expensive.

But BBTM has so much potential, MK could be the definitive castle park if they bring enough to the table I think. The walk ways at MK are getting so crowded that at this point, I think Tom Sawyer has to go. It could really alleviate crowding issues. It practically almost feels like a hazard with how many people crowd the streets sometimes.

 

[DisDude33]

I think Tom Sawyer has to go. It could really alleviate crowding issues. It practically almost feels like a hazard with how many people crowd the streets sometimes.

I absolutely agree. FL is my least favorite park of the park for a few reasons but one of them is how crowded the area always feels. Feeling up ROA and freeing up all that space could open a lot of doors for whatever development they decide to do in the future and give that side of the park some much needed breathing room.

 

[Delta-7]

Villains land is all I could ask for, but it needs to be Fantasy Springs level of detail. Every possible ounce of imagination they can put in without cutting budget. I just don't know how feasible that is though. We know they can do it, it's just if they're willing to invest into it. Fantasy Springs I think practically costs as much as DisneySea in its entirety to build so it's going to be incredibly expensive.

But BBTM has so much potential, MK could be the definitive castle park if they bring enough to the table I think. The walk ways at MK are getting so crowded that at this point, I think Tom Sawyer has to go. It could really alleviate crowding issues. It practically almost feels like a hazard with how many people crowd the streets sometimes.

Don’t touch ROA and Tom Sawyer’s!!! That island’s one of the few places in the park where you can just relax and get away from the stress.

They should at least cut down on the river a little bit to make way for expansion like DL did. Besides, with new areas going in behind Big Thunder and potentially looping around to the Haunted Mansion, that’ll certainly alleviate congestion in a corner of the park, right??

 

[Patcheslee]

I’ve never known them to be flexible enough to work with Disney’s theming demands. Even Universal has soured on B&M come over to Vekoma. (Intamin and Mack at UEU, right?).

Wonder what RMC could do with it.

 

[DisneyDean97]

I’ve never known them to be flexible enough to work with Disney’s theming demands. Even Universal has soured on B&M come over to Vekoma. (Intamin and Mack at UEU, right?).

Agreed, the only time B&M was slightly flexible when it came to theming was Efteling's Baron 1898, and their custom supports for the lift hill.

 

[PREMiERdrum]

I’ve never known them to be flexible enough to work with Disney’s theming demands. Even Universal has soured on B&M come over to Vekoma. (Intamin and Mack at UEU, right?).

It's not as much themeing as it is operations.

WDI typically does just enough of the engineering and installation load so that they can legally be listed as the manufacturer of record. This gets them around regulations requiring parks to operate the machinery "as directed by the manufacturer."

Vekoma and others are happy to sign away much of their liability, but this is an area where B&M reportedly won't budge.

 

[TheDisneyParksfanC8]

No major changes to what I've shared earlier, though things do appear to be morphing a bit as they come into focus.

I still expect Moana (AL) and Coco (BBTM) to be the first shovels moving at MK. Still not optimistic on a Phase II. Less convinced of major expansion at DHS.

After a few months feeling like Scrooge McDuck jumping into a vault of coins, reality appears to be setting in.

DHS will probably get some sort of expansion, but It might not be until after BBTM and the AK expansions are wrapped up if what you are saying is true.