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News 'Beyond Big Thunder Mountain' Blue Sky concept revealed for Magic Kingdom

Magicart87

No Refunds!
Premium Member
I enter the inn and make a charisma roll to determine if there's anyone who seems like they're looking for an adventure, too.

I also ask the barkeep what's up with the three creepy and malformed druids outside taking a public bath in their robes.
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SpectreJordan

Well-Known Member
We’ve got concrete confirmation they’re building billion+ projects. We just know earlier than normal, and don’t know the plans. Normally plans just get designed all the time to see what sticks, but here there’s an expansion mandate and design is coming second. This is exciting, even if we don’t have details.

They could’ve said, “here’s blue sky in Hollywood Studios” or something else that’s crazy this year. But they didn’t. They doubled down on their large expansion plans. This is a win. South American continent plans look gorgeous
Yeah, I think the Beyond Big Thunder & especially the South America expansions are happening. I just wish they'd confirm they 100% are & get started ASAP.
That runs into the constant issue of how to actually put Coco there without having to do significant construction and overhauling part of the pavilion (to build the necessary queue space etc.). I believe Martin mentioned before that was part of the reason they backed off changing the Mexico ride to Coco.
How much room is there in the backstage between Mexico & Norway? Maybe they can build out into that & give Mexico 2 rides?
Adding Disney Villians to any park would be a terrible decision.
Disney Villains should have their own park entirely.
They have enough characters & IP to do it correctly & compete with Universal's Epic Universe.
I don't really think there's enough variety in Disney villains alone to support an entire park, no IP has that variety. Maaaybe if they included other IPs like Star Wars, Pixar, Marvel, Alien, etc... & had some original rides as well. But I think a sizeable land would be good enough for the core Disney villains.
 

aladdin2007

Well-Known Member
Yeah, I think the Beyond Big Thunder & especially the South America expansions are happening. I just wish they'd confirm they 100% are & get started ASAP.

How much room is there in the backstage between Mexico & Norway? Maybe they can build out into that & give Mexico 2 rides?

I don't really think there's enough variety in Disney villains alone to support an entire park, no IP has that variety. Maaaybe if they included other IPs like Star Wars, Pixar, Marvel, Alien, etc... & had some original rides as well. But I think a sizeable land would be good enough for the core Disney villains.
They cant go back further really and they cant expand the Mexico building to the right (a, its san angels kitchen etc on the that side) (b, yes the Norway addition can go away) but required access roads between the pavilion pads.
 

Rosso11

Well-Known Member
How much room is there in the backstage between Mexico & Norway? Maybe they can build out into that & give Mexico 2 rides?
Yes there is plenty of room behind the Norway bathrooms and meet and greets for a Coco attraction. However, the Mexico pavilion itself could not handle another ride. It’s already very common to have lines to just enter the pavilion. The entrance would need to be outside to the right. It would require some adjustments but it can be done. I’m sure Disney is looking at this option. To me it makes the most sense.
 

James Alucobond

Well-Known Member
I don't really think there's enough variety in Disney villains alone to support an entire park, no IP has that variety. Maaaybe if they included other IPs like Star Wars, Pixar, Marvel, Alien, etc... & had some original rides as well. But I think a sizeable land would be good enough for the core Disney villains.
There’s enough there, even with just their core villains. They could do it, even if I don’t think they should, by essentially dividing them by “habitat” and theming areas accordingly. So something along the lines of ...
  • Usurper's Court | Evil Queen, Queen of Hearts, Maleficent, Jafar
  • Shadow Alley | Cruella, Gaston, Gothel, Dr. Facilier
  • Blackwood Forest | Scar, the crocodile, Kaa, the Sheriff of Nottingham
  • Mythcleft Mountain | Chernabog, Hades, Madam Mim, the Horned King
  • The Depths | Ursula, Hook, Monstro, the giant squid
  • Mad Circus | Honest John, Ringmaster
Again, I don't think they should do this as I feel it would be pretty oppressive if extended out into an entire park, but it's possible. I just think it's probably more novel if contained to a single land.
 

SpectreJordan

Well-Known Member
The Gran Fiesta Tour is perfect the way it is, nuff said.
I wish it was more educational. The movie was educational... atleast for its time.
If I was in charge this is what I'd do, assuming that IPs must be used, opening in three phases. Everything is to scale.

This is purely spitballing and to get an idea of how much room there is back there!

View attachment 742140

Firstly, I'd have the Haunted Mansion Restaurant, pictured below as Pinocchio Village Haus open alongside a nicer queue re-oriented on the side of the Mansion, shown below as Disneyland Paris' line for Phantom Manor. The queue being re-oriented allows for a much better managed queue space along with its beautification and of course, freeing up space for a walkway to a Villain's Land. This of course would also create a brilliant transition.
View attachment 742141

While this is being built, the infrastructure work for Beyond Big Thunder would commence.

I opted for two lands: Cars Land, serving as a flawless transition from Big Thunder Mountain and a happier counter to the darkness of a Villains Land, and because it is already one of the best lands ever made. While I'd love California Adventure to keep it as an exclusive, I'd much rather take a surefire hit than something mediocre. Going through rockwork/a tunnel leads to outside the Villains Land from there, providing a decent transition. Perhaps this could be phase 3.

Now, it's possible Disney is going full-blown Galaxy's Edge in scale for the Villains Land, but I honestly feel it could be effectively handled perhaps only being 10 or 15% larger than Diagon Alley at Universal Studios Florida so you could cram in more detail. I feel it should definitely open before whatever other land they put in the park if they decide to do multiple.

I figure, with an expansion of this size, realistically two headlining E-tickets are all we are going to get, but where the King's Cross Station is at Diagon Alley on the northside of the land, there's an easy expansion plot for a major ride or an opening day C-ticket.

Further, if Cars Land is used, the right side of it already has a walkway which leads to Pacific Wharf, now San Fransokyo Square. You'd only have to minorly shrink RoA and have this be the main walking path to the Villains Land and then Liberty Square beyond that. The train would have to be re-routed, however, likely cutting between the lands with Cars Land being outside of its perimeter and Villains being within it.

The only thing is the walkway leading to Cars Land from Tiana's Bayou Adventure might be difficult to pull off. Putting it to the right of Big Thunder Mountain Railroad is an option too.
View attachment 742142

The Villains Land intrigues me the most. Now, Diagon Alley isn't as massive as Galaxy's Edge, but it's arguably the best-themed land in Orlando (I don't even think it's close). I felt it is a perfect land in tone for how Disney's land should be, and with Monsters Universe on the way at Epic Universe doubling down on this and is likely to be the park's best, they really do need to have a similar offering as a darker land like this is sorely lacking from Disney parks.

Diagon Alley is already largely covered and has Knockturn Alley. Its more reasonable footprint lends itself to that design. I say, why stop there? Just make the entire Villain's Land indoors. And rather than a Londonesque exterior that you stumble through to Diagon Alley, you could make it mischievous, perhaps to look like the side of a mountain.

The new Haunted Mansion queue and restaurant would be a perfect transition to the land as well!

And now, I'm not advocating for just copying and pasting Diagon obviously, but it could serve as a really good blueprint for how to go about this land.

In place of Escape From Gringotts I imagine should be a similarly thrilling dark ride, and a large-scale experience featuring either Maleficent or Chernabog. If it is Chernabog/Fantasia-themed, then I'd at least hope for a dragon walkthrough like DLP has for Maleficent.

And here's a list of Diagon Alley's shops! Everything from an ice cream parlor to a candy store is featured. Importantly, the kinetics in each window and the whimsicalness of the land's design are very effective.
View attachment 742143

Here are some things Diagon Alley has equivalents of and imagine it would be fantastic at MK too. Just letting you know, that I'm not selecting names, just ideas for what they could be. There's quite a lot to work with under the overarching theme of Disney Villains. Diagon Alley has even more individual places to explore than I am going to mention as well, so I think this is actually quite realistic.

And now, I don't think they should only be selling merch/food from these specific properties, but that the shops themselves are just themed to said IP.

Candy Store = The Poison Apple from Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, themed to the Evil Queen.
View attachment 742149

Toy Store = A Toy Story Shop, perhaps with many of Sid's horrifying creations (but without featuring Sid). You could also have a second store themed to Making Christmas from the Nightmare Before Christmas.
View attachment 742145

Butterbeer Cart = Some unique beverage stand from Dr. Facilier from The Princess and the Frog.

Quick-Service Restaurant = Queen of Hearts Banquet Hall or perhaps a Headless Horseman Tavern (I'd put Gaston but he already has representation in New Fantasyland).

Ice Cream = Heffalumps and Woozles from Winnie the Pooh.

General Merch = Big Bad Wolf Shop, perhaps outside the land on the pathway around RoA appearing as his house, maybe with a back entrance into the land, serving as an alternative to the main entrance.

Very Unique Clothing Store = Cruella de Vil's, perhaps it could also sell Halloween costumes.
View attachment 742158

Jafar, Ursula, Captain Hook, Judge Frollo, Scar, Mother Gothel, and even Gaston also definitely need representation.

Some other additions I think would be great.

Diagon Alley has an indoor Butterbeer shop, but I say for a Villains Land go even further and make it like an Oogie Boogie Gamblin' Bar. I'm thinking more like Trader Sam's than Oga's Cantina, but obviously much larger, with an Oogie Boogie Animatronic in the center and a fair share of blacklight and chaos throughout.
View attachment 742144

And finally, if this land only opens with one land, I feel a small-scaled show (but infinitely better themed and executed) like an American Idol Experience or Stitch's Great Escape could be a good idea. Honestly, why not theme it to a Hades, Pain, and Panic Comedy Show, the levity provided with some dark humor sprinkled throughout could be very fun!
View attachment 742152

If it opens with two rides, I'd kill for a Nightmare Before Christmas Trackless Ride or even an Arabian Nights Coaster with Jafar.

There are very few things I feel an overabundance of IPs would be amazing for, but THIS is one of them.

There's so much lore to explore. Halloween has one of the coolest aesthetics there is, and man would I kill for a land like this. Even if it takes 6-7 years for it to open, the fact that a massive land themed to Villains is really in the pipeline just has me so excited. It's an infinitely better concept than just throwing Encanto and Coco there and calling it a day, and I'm glad it has seemingly taken priority despite the
Villains Land being inspired by Diagon is a fantastic idea. I just hope they'd have more than one ride in it.
^ Please no on Carsland. I wouldn’t mind seeing it show up at Hollywood Studios, but I really like that Magic Kingdom is still free of IP-locked lands.
I'm mixed on that idea tbh. On one hand, I do like how MK doesn't have any lands based on a single IP. But Radiator Springs would fit really well with the Americana theme of Magic Kingdom.
Yes there is plenty of room behind the Norway bathrooms and meet and greets for a Coco attraction. However, the Mexico pavilion itself could not handle another ride. It’s already very common to have lines to just enter the pavilion. The entrance would need to be outside to the right. It would require some adjustments but it can be done. I’m sure Disney is looking at this option. To me it makes the most sense.
Yeah, I'd want it to be in that open space between Mexico & Norway. The main pavillion should be untouched.
 

SpectreJordan

Well-Known Member
I wish they would put an amphitheater in the back that they could move Fantasmic to for this, allowing DHS to have a new show. I love Fantasmic and don't want to lose it (literally my favorite show), but it would fit much better in Magic Kingdom.
I'd be down for that but I say put a ride or two in Fantasmic's spot at DHS. They can do a more traditional fireworks show at the theater for DHS's nightime show.
 

MagicHappens1971

Well-Known Member
I'd be down for that but I say put a ride or two in Fantasmic's spot at DHS. They can do a more traditional fireworks show at the theater for DHS's nightime show.
I think this would be a colossal mistake. Fantasmic is a FANTASTIC Show that has great GSAT scores.

They can expand backstage behind RnRC/Sunset Blvd, Animation Courtyard and into the parking lot on the Muppets side. Leave the Hollywood Hills Ampitheatre alone
 

maleficentfan

Active Member
Cinderella already has a whole castle. The manor seems unnecessary when all it would really accomplish is giving Lady Tremaine, Anastasia, and Drizella a slightly more suitable home, but the proposed villain land could end up resolving that anyway.

Seven Dwarves Mine Train also doesn’t in and of itself prevent Snow White from having a nearby M&G. Having those two complementary offerings seems to work well enough with Under the Sea and Ariel’s Grotto. If anything, I think they should push farther in the direction of having attractions and restaurants for the characters so that they’re gaining both capacity and sensible attached locations for M&Gs rather than shoving them all into wastes of space like Fairytale Hall. If they’d converted Scary Adventure into a Sleeping Beauty attraction instead, Rapunzel would really be the only “homeless” official princess who makes regular appearances in the wild at MK once Bayou Adventure is complete. And I guess Merida now that she’s been evicted.
It kills me that Sleeping Beauty has almost zero representation in any of the parks beyond either a meet-and-greet or appearances in parades or nighttime spectaculars. Magic Kingdom at Disneyland has a walkthrough attraction in Sleeping Beauty castle. Other than that, that's it. And Maleficent's appearances have been dwindling for years, now basically just relegated to FOF and Fantasmic. That could all be easily fixed with a huge Villain's expansion.
There’s enough there, even with just their core villains. They could do it, even if I don’t think they should, by essentially dividing them by “habitat” and theming areas accordingly. So something along the lines of ...
  • Usurper's Court | Evil Queen, Queen of Hearts, Maleficent, Jafar
  • Shadow Alley | Cruella, Gaston, Gothel, Dr. Facilier
  • Blackwood Forest | Scar, the crocodile, Kaa, the Sheriff of Nottingham
  • Mythcleft Mountain | Chernabog, Hades, Madam Mim, the Horned King
  • The Depths | Ursula, Hook, Monstro, the giant squid
  • Mad Circus | Honest John, Ringmaster
Again, I don't think they should do this as I feel it would be pretty oppressive if extended out into an entire park, but it's possible. I just think it's probably more novel if contained to a single land.
That's pretty much the shortlist. I think, if I had to downsize, I'd go with the following as must haves:
1. Maleficent
2. Evil Queen
3. Chernabog
4. Scar
5. Hades
6. Ursula
7. Jafar
8. Dr. Facilier
9. Cruella

Also, the way I'd love to see this land designed is like the way the Evil Queen's land is in the PC game Villains' Revenge
1695065274345.png

There's lots of potential here for a much needed expansion AND much needed representation of the Villains back into MK besides at Halloween during the parties.
 

SpectreJordan

Well-Known Member
It kills me that Sleeping Beauty has almost zero representation in any of the parks beyond either a meet-and-greet or appearances in parades or nighttime spectaculars. Magic Kingdom at Disneyland has a walkthrough attraction in Sleeping Beauty castle. Other than that, that's it. And Maleficent's appearances have been dwindling for years, now basically just relegated to FOF and Fantasmic. That could all be easily fixed with a huge Villain's expansion.

That's pretty much the shortlist. I think, if I had to downsize, I'd go with the following as must haves:
1. Maleficent
2. Evil Queen
3. Chernabog
4. Scar
5. Hades
6. Ursula
7. Jafar
8. Dr. Facilier
9. Cruella

Also, the way I'd love to see this land designed is like the way the Evil Queen's land is in the PC game Villains' RevengeView attachment 743671
There's lots of potential here for a much needed expansion AND much needed representation of the Villains back into MK besides at Halloween during the parties.
I imagine Maleficent would be the "star" of a villains land since she's always front & center in their merch/promos.
 

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