AVATAR land - the specifics

[GoofGoof]

Nobody seems to have any idea what's happening with the boat ride. Leaked plans suspiciously called it a C ticket. Then concept art came out that looked pretty promising. Then a rumor broke that it was cancelled. Then the rumor changed from cancelled to just postponed to a later phase. Cameron mentioned multiple rides on several occasions and the boat ride was referenced pretty recently. It's almost definitely still part of the project but we still have next to no details outside of the single piece of concept art and the foundation for a pretty large looking show building. I'm excited to see what they do with it.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

But DAK really doesn't have much in the way of screens (just ITTBAB really). I tend to dislike an overuse of screens in attractions, but any particular theme park should have a variety of experiences and I think this Soarin' type ride will compliment existing attractions in the park.

DAK doesn't have much in the way of rides in the first place. Decent rides that is. There's the Safari and Dinosaur for the actually good ones, arguably Everest in spite of serious flaws with even the original design (though its current state is simply shameful). Kali is a soaking mess and nothing more than a short but prettied up off the shelf raft ride (particularly disappointing compared to its Tiger River concept). Only the Safari IMHO lives up fairly well to its true potential and feels like a complete and quality experience, Dinosaur will always be negatively compared to both Indy and its original concept (though I do enjoy it, it feels unfinished and underbuilt). The Dinorama carnival is disgusting and pathetic for a Disney made product, I have nothing nice whatsoever to say about that garbage. It bothers me to have to go near it whenever I want to ride Dinosaur...

As both WDW1974 and whylightbulb have stated in recent years, the theme park industry is becoming overly reliant on video screen for the rides, and many creatives in the industry aren't happy with this reality. I don't mind a couple of simulators here and there, but the video screen craze is becoming far too dominant in newer rides from both Universal and Disney and i'm afraid we may lose more tangible experiences (Shanghai's POTC is rumored to have this concern). Star Tours and Body Wars I think are fair to say NOT considered the main draw of their respective parks when created. They were secondary attractions behind the real guns, such as the "big four" at EPCOT (as I call them- Spaceship Earth, Imagination, Horizons and World of Motion) or Great Movie Ride. And that's the way I wish they had stayed. I value in a theme park ride the ability to visit tangible environment set pieces and witness physical plants, animals, people etc. I believe video elements should remain in a subdued supporting role (as in for certain minor background elements and whatnot). Video elements in extreme moderation are ok at best, but the scale has tipped far out of balance and it's time for a counterbalance.

I'd also say of all the Disney parks out there, Animal Kingdom is one that should MOST rely on physical elements predominantly and keep the video at an absolute minimum. Based on the park's theme and purpose, nature and animals, I personally feel the presence of video screens interferes with this (with only exceptions perhaps being the night show). While I still don't want video to dominate any of the parks, at least it makes more sense at EPCOT and DHS (being technology and movie making based parks respectively).

 

[doctornick]

No doubt. But it's not the ride system, but the overall execution of the ride that makes them great. I'd like to see a clone of any of those rides in WDW.

Yeah, I've never ridden on any of them, so I can't really comment on the experience. But I've see videos of the ride through for (say) Mystic Manor and it seems amazing -- but from the ride through you can't really tell it's a trackless ride. Now, I'm not saying that the use of LPS doesn't enhance the experience, but to me, it looks like it would be pretty amazing even as a "regular" tracked ride. The execution of the ride just looks amazing in terms of sights/sounds/story/etc and that's what's really important.

 

[doctornick]

So... a question/thought about other Disney parks and Avatar. If the expansion is well regarded and especially if the rides are very popular, we could easily see them cloned in some capacity to other parks worldwide. I'm skeptical that we would see an entire land anywhere else due to the space limitations at other locations and also because it becomes a more problematic theming in other parks.

It's long been rumored that Paris will get something Avatar in the Studios park in the future. Seems quite possible that the Soarin'-ish ride would end up there especially since Soarin' itself is not in the resort. Although we have seen rumors of an expanded Star Wars for their castle park, I haven't seen any plans for any additions for the Studios there except for Avatar.

Now, I wonder about DLR.... One of the strong things we have heard is that Toontown will be replaced with a Star Wars themed area. If that happens, would Star Tours move from its present location in TL to the new area? Seems likely rather than have SW attractions in completely separate areas of the park. But if that happens, what would become of the Star Tours plot? Could it become a copy of the Iron Man Experience going into Hong Kong? Maybe, but it also could potentially house a Avatar attraction -- Disney has in recent years used TL as a sort of "sci fi fantasyland" and Pandora fits into that motif (arguably better than Iron Man or any other Marvel stuff), plus they might be using Marvel in DCA in the near future.

My point being that is probably makes sense to not think of Avatar as just an investment in DAK since we might be seeing some aspects copied worldwide, spreading around those development costs.

 

[GoofGoof]

So... a question/thought about other Disney parks and Avatar. If the expansion is well regarded and especially if the rides are very popular, we could easily see them cloned in some capacity to other parks worldwide. I'm skeptical that we would see an entire land anywhere else due to the space limitations at other locations and also because it becomes a more problematic theming in other parks.

It's long been rumored that Paris will get something Avatar in the Studios park in the future. Seems quite possible that the Soarin'-ish ride would end up there especially since Soarin' itself is not in the resort. Although we have seen rumors of an expanded Star Wars for their castle park, I haven't seen any plans for any additions for the Studios there except for Avatar.

Now, I wonder about DLR.... One of the strong things we have heard is that Toontown will be replaced with a Star Wars themed area. If that happens, would Star Tours move from its present location in TL to the new area? Seems likely rather than have SW attractions in completely separate areas of the park. But if that happens, what would become of the Star Tours plot? Could it become a copy of the Iron Man Experience going into Hong Kong? Maybe, but it also could potentially house a Avatar attraction -- Disney has in recent years used TL as a sort of "sci fi fantasyland" and Pandora fits into that motif (arguably better than Iron Man or any other Marvel stuff), plus they might be using Marvel in DCA in the near future.

My point being that is probably makes sense to not think of Avatar as just an investment in DAK since we might be seeing some aspects copied worldwide, spreading around those development costs.

The floating mountains take up a lot of space and at 150ft would be visually intrusive in another park. For those reasons I don't see an exact clone of Avatarland. But, assuming Cameron would be OK with it, there is no reason they couldn't build some version of the simulator itself utilizing the film and other elements in another park.

 

[marni1971]

I haven't seen any plans for any additions for the (Paris) Studios there except for Avatar.

The Marvel IP. Which would come before Cameron.

 

[doctornick]

Someone posted on the main Rumors board that there is now Pandora stuff in One Man's Dream.

 

[twebber55]

hey @danlb_2000 looks like there are new permits for project morpho

 

[danlb_2000]

hey @danlb_2000 looks like there are new permits for project morpho

Thanks for the heads up. One is for DAK Expansion - Morpho 803 Completion Package expiring October 31, 2016 and the other is for DAK Expansion - Morpho Canopy Mockups.

 

[danlb_2000]

Thanks for the heads up. One is for DAK Expansion - Morpho 803 Completion Package expiring October 31, 2016 and the other is for DAK Expansion - Morpho Canopy Mockups.

I assume the "canopy" referred to in that permit is for the tree canopy.

 

[twebber55]

I assume the "canopy" referred to in that permit is for the tree canopy.

well i was thinking that as well as in rain forest canopy

 

[danlb_2000]

Here are the links to the permits. The address of the Morpho Canopy one puts it way in the back of the park, back by Rafiki's. Hopefully we can get some aerials of that area in a few months. The other one is a new address, here is what I have so far for project Morpho.

467 W Savannah Circle Morpho 800AD Central Energy Plant
471 W Savannah Circle Morpho 804 Pkg 2
501 W Savannah Circle Morpho 800W
509 W Savannah Circle Morpho 800 M
517 W Savannah Circle Morpho 830 <--- Today's permit.



517 W Savannah Cir - DAK Expansion - Morpho 830 Completion Package
1461 E Savannah Cir - DAK Expansion - Morpho Canopy Mockups

 

[RSoxNo1]

The 10/31/2016 date is interesting. I wouldn't expect the project be completed by then at all. I would think at least 6 months after that.

 

[rioriz]

So are they building parts of the expansion inside the park? Why would the address be by rafikis

 

[twebber55]

Here are the links to the permits. The address of the Morpho Canopy one puts it way in the back of the park, back by Rafiki's. Hopefully we can get some aerials of that area in a few months. The other one is a new address, here is what I have so far for project Morpho.

467 W Savannah Circle Morpho 800AD Central Energy Plant
471 W Savannah Circle Morpho 804 Pkg 2
501 W Savannah Circle Morpho 800W
509 W Savannah Circle Morpho 800 M
517 W Savannah Circle Morpho 830 <--- Today's permit.



517 W Savannah Cir - DAK Expansion - Morpho 830 Completion Package
1461 E Savannah Cir - DAK Expansion - Morpho Canopy Mockups

so is morpho just the name of the entire park expansion?

 

[danlb_2000]

The 10/31/2016 date is interesting. I wouldn't expect the project be completed by then at all. I would think at least 6 months after that.

This is when the permit for the main contractor expires. Additional permits for could be filed to complete the work, especially by Disney internal construction company BVCC.

So are they building parts of the expansion inside the park? Why would the address be by rafikis

The permit is for canopy mockups, so they are using some of the empty area out in the back of the park to build some samples of what is going to eventually be constructed as part of the expansion. We saw something like this for the Fantasyland expansion where test pieced of rock work were built at the STOL port.

so is morpho just the name of the entire park expansion?

I believe it is being used to refer to just the Avatar part of the park expansion.

 

[twebber55]

This is when the permit for the main contractor expires. Additional permits for could be filed to complete the work, especially by Disney internal construction company BVCC.



The permit is for canopy mockups, so they are using some of the empty area out in the back of the park to build some samples of what is going to eventually be constructed as part of the expansion. We saw something like this for the Fantasyland expansion where test pieced of rock work were built at the STOL port.



I believe it is being used to refer to just the Avatar part of the park expansion.

ooohhhh that makes since now...yeah a mock canopy would be great for viewing... so more aerials latter would be cool

 

[Master Yoda]

The permit is for canopy mockups, so they are using some of the empty area out in the back of the park to build some samples of what is going to eventually be constructed as part of the expansion. We saw something like this for the Fantasyland expansion where test pieced of rock work were built at the STOL port.

It is a somewhat common practice for very large construction projects. I have seen everything from scaled down wall sections showing how ornamental stone work was to be applied all the way to full room mock ups for hotels and apartments.

 

[RSoxNo1]

For what it's worth, here's a photo of the Mine train that @Scuttle took on February 9th, 2012, roughly 2 years and 4 months before Mine Train opened. This looks to be on par with where Avatar is. In theory that build could be quicker considering it's easier to access.

 

[Scuttle]

For what it's worth, here's a photo of the Mine train that @Scuttle took on February 9th, 2012, roughly 2 years and 4 months before Mine Train opened. This looks to be on par with where Avatar is. In theory that build could be quicker considering it's easier to access.

It should be interesting to see what happens now that the movies are backed up. I agree they have total access to the construction site, so you'd think this could be done by the end of next year.... But this is Disney. Hopefully I'll get some updates soon. It's been too long for me!