As of February, guests will no longer be able to see a trained Disney Artist who is d

ClemsonTigger

ClemsonTigger

Naturally Grumpy
You're never alone,
You're never disconnected
When you're with Mick
The toons are always in session

When you're with Grizz and the s*** hits the fan,
You've got brothers around, you're a Disney man!

Scooter Quote:
Originally Posted by barnum42
Sounds like a cue for one of my songs from "West Side Story" - I'm in. Who wants to be a Jet
No offense Grizz...But you REALLY need to get a life.
Click to expand...
Scooter, you may have used a laughing face, but the comment was uncalled for...especially after Hennie's personal attack.

HennieBogan1966

Barnum

People such as yourself like to take others' comments out of context whenever it suits them, as you have NOTHING to contribute, other than to fan the flames. If that's your hobby, so be it. I, on the other hand, DO have something to contribute, which is why I comment. If you don't like the comments, feel free to refute them. Otherwise, just watch the water for us, waterboy.
Click to expand...

Hennie, this is the third thread tonight where you had to resort to personal attacks in an effort to make your point. I would suggest if comments are bothering you that you just bow out or take it outside the thread. I find it very difficult to understand when people like Barnum (or Grizz) with long track records of quality contributions...or anyone else on this board for that matter are treated with that level of disrespect.

Kind of like the way the artists we are supposed to be talking about here have been treated... :(
 
barnum42

barnum42

New Member
ClemsonTigger said:
Hennie, this is the third thread tonight where you had to resort to personal attacks in an effort to make your point. I would suggest if comments are bothering you that you just bow out or take it outside the thread. I find it very difficult to understand when people like Barnum (or Grizz) with long track records of quality contributions...or anyone else on this board for that matter are treated with that level of disrespect.

Kind of like the way the artists we are supposed to be talking about here have been treated... :(
Click to expand...
Touche!

Here come the Jets Yeah
And were gonna' beat every last buggin' Eisner
From the whole buggin' Board
From the whole ever lovin - Disney Boaaaaarrrrrrd.

:lol:
 
promod1955

promod1955

Active Member
oops

I didn't mean to start anything :lookaroun . I'm planning on asking that griz. Still havent called yet, im mouse ears deep in work and school.
 
9

9oldmen

New Member
I guess my comments or statements don't hold any sort of truth to them!

I guess I'm someone who doesn't present the facts because I want only my point of view to be heard....HHMMM. NOT TRUE!

I take your word as the truth when you tell me that you were once a retail manager for Disney and your experiences on the business side of the company gives you the right to understand where the company is coming from.

Well, I was there when a lot of stuff happened that wasn't right.

I would drop down to you level Mr. Bogan and tell you what I know.....but I expect you to trust me at what I say--just like I trust you when you make your comments or statements. If you want the the company's side of the story call the people who made these decisions and you'll get an answer you might like.

For the Cast that still works with the comapny, www.wdwmagic.com is the only way for our say, our words, our truths to be heard. I know what the company is going to say but they've never told me nor our guest the truth.

That's why I say that the company at Walt Disney World sometimes insults the intelligence of the guests, but I know that most of us aren't fooled. That's why we all are here writing each other because we don't live in the MATRIX!

Someone was saying that DTA in California is great. That's my point! Why can't ours be great? Compared to California our attraction along the corridor is pitifull!!! It's embarrassing! This is some, not so good proof of money not being spent right MR. Bogan. I've done shows where my microphone is broken so maintenance can't fix it and my managers are pushing me out on stage to perform for guests.
It's emabarrassing for me because my face is the one that the guests can identify with that bad performance. There are times when the projectors break and they want us to continue shows!
My guests, my audience paid a lot of money to see a whole attraction not a 1/3 or a 1/2 of an attraction. that makes me mad!!! The guests, my fellow friends deserve more than that. You see Mr. Bogan that's why I've lasted at my position for a long time, because I care about not only myself but my audience, my friends, my guests. This isn't only about my job it's about selling s*** on a stick and putting Walt's name on it thinking it's going to sell!!!
Well, Somebody's going to buy it and fall for it....I hope it's not my family or friends.
I know what I'm talking about because I'm there most of the time.
Like today, I was the only artists that showed up to work untill another artists showed up at 11am. the other artists are looking for new jobs, but how can the artists do that when the company who says they're helping them by giving a deadline of Feb.1st to find new jobs is working them 10-14hr/6 to 7 days. Somethings not right here and it's the management that represents the company that's not looking good.

You wanted to know facts about how I know the that money is rolling into the attraction. Well, let me once again repeat the fact that I guess you did'nt read...because you just jumped into the middle of a thread or someones comments, but I'm friends with a lot of the higher management in the company. The VP over operations came to my office and wanted to talk to me and tell me how sorry he was about what's going on (I thank the fans of this website and animation for this really). I believe the guy was there because of the heat he's taking about the letters and the phone calls flooding offices throughout the comapany. I also am friends witrh the President of the park and he has talked to me about what's going on.
You see I just don't show up to work and leave--I know people in the highest of places and the lowest of places in my company. The past President of the park was walking around The Disney-MGM Studios one day and I walked up to him and had a conversation about the new attraction and he told me that the merchandise in the Animation Gallery was selling at 100% and he was happy that I was one of the people that was making it happen. Managers are always coming up to us asking us to pitch some kind of product on the tour so that it will sell in the Gallery and it works. I don't care about who gets the credit for that but don't tell me that we're not putting people in seats and that we're not making money because it's not true. The company is donig well, ask Ovizts and Eisner about that one!
I agree wth one person, the managers are still selling this as a place where animators work. The company's not telling the guests that studio is closed because they know people will stop coming through the building.

I want to end this because I have to, I can go on and on and tell you tragic stories but I have to keep remembering I'm a mature guest on this site.

I'm going to paste a reply that was posted a while back so that Mr. Bogan can read it. The cast talked about this thread response and was upset by the posting last week:

"IF THESE GUYS WERE ALLOWED TO STAY AND DRAW MICKEY MOUSE OVER AND OVER FOR TOURISTS IN THIS DEGRADING SENERIO, HOW LONG DO YOU THINK IT WOULD BE BEFORE THEY THEMSELVES WOULD GET BORED?
I know if I wouldn't stick around long if it were the case for me.
Do these guys touch peoples lives? Of course they do;
but for me personally, I find that seeing a great Disney artist reduced to drawing Mickey and friends over and over, day after day for tourists...well frankly I find the thought kind of sad." -Scooter

Does that answer your question Mr. Bogan. I'm not perfect but I try to read every comment before I write a comment or statement. Some of us need to learn manners.
The Brady family who has a son named Matthew, who's a TV actor took me out to dinner last night at 50's PrimeTime Caf'e. They did'nt see my role as being degrading. Matt wants to be an animator someday.
Faith and her mom Sharon, who visited me 4 weeks ago and will be back again from North carolina will be here in a few days. Faith wants me to spend time with her and go over some of her drawings before I leave the company.
Faith doesn't think my work is degrading, drawing Mickey over and over again.

What do you think of that Mr.Bogan? Write a thread for Scooter about his comments.

I want to thank Barnum42, Waltdisny, Woody13, Clemsontigger, Promod1955 and my MORPHEUS, Gen. Griz for keeping this thread running strong. I also want to thank Mr.Bogan interesting eve though I don't agree with him and others that fall into his catagory.
 
Woody13

Woody13

New Member
Alice fell through the looking glass. Dorothy got swept up by a tornado. Strange journeys always seem to happen in different ways. Just remember to always keep your sketchpad with you 9oldmen!
 
ClemsonTigger

ClemsonTigger

Naturally Grumpy
I'ts so frustrating when you have so much support from many layers of management and the juggernaut of the beancounter still wins out. I know you take pride in your work, and your experiences (some of which you shared here) will help carry you through.

I wholeheartedly second the thoughts expressed by Woody that something good will come out of this trial.

Two thoughts/questions...with the people you know, couldn't there be help in finding a good (even if temporary, and not necessarily in animation) position where your good interpersonal skills and Disney knowledge can be put to good use? Second, with your talents, are there any opportunities on the Disney Cruise Line...I believe they use animators on board (that aren't tracing yet :lookaroun )

We hope you stick around here and keep us posted on the positive out of this...I am confident that it will happen before long! :eek:
 
9

9oldmen

New Member
Thanks Guys and Gals

I'm working on revising my portfolio and resum'e every day. I don't get much time since I'm working 6-7days but I still get time to add something at different times of the day.
I called some of my friends and there's possibly www.projectfirefly.com, LEGACY Animation and Creoplia Video Game Animation (spelling). Disney Design Group (DDG) is another opportunity. I haven't thought of the Disney Cruise Line at all.

I do have a meeting with a partner of mine who's trying to get me to go fulltime with our website based on art and great american athletes, www.artletics.com,
check it out some time.

Remember to write:
Jim MacPhee:fork:
DISNEY-MGM STUDIOS ADMINISTRATION
407-560-6688 OFFICE PHONE
407-560-1150 FAX
 
Z

Zurg

New Member
Scooter said:
...Disney no longer makes full length animated features...
Click to expand...

Insert the word good in that between makes and full forget everything else.

It sums up everything wrong with the short term greed is good managament of the Disney company.
 
H

HennieBogan1966

Account Suspended
Well 9

Allow me to respond sir.

First, I don't believe that I EVER said that YOUR job was degrading. But you somehow try and construe my comments to mean such. They did not!!!! Please don't make gross assumptions about me, as you don't know me. As for the business aspect of this issue, the point that I have tried on several occasions to make regarding this issue is this:

(1) Your art (or whatever) product may be selling at 100%, doesn't mean that the attraction itself is showing a profit. There's much more cost to operating any given facility than merely the product that is sold thru it. To think that you can make the argument that because the product was moving well meant that you're making profits, isn't telling the WHOLE story. I work in the retail industry of golf and I can most assuredly tell you that just because we have product with high margins DOESN'T guarantee us a profit on a daily basis. Aside from the overhead and operational costs, you have to address margins that are made on that product. Now, you might say that if YOU personally are producing the product and then placing it in a guests hands for a given price, that's 100% profit. IT IS NOT!!! You have to be paid, the power for the building is paid, the maintenance for the building, on, and on, and on. So, it's NEVER going to be 100% profit. That's the cost of doing business.

Now, on to another issue regarding this matter. If Disney is able to reproduce this product, to the satisfaction of the guests, then why not do it? Yes, it displaces people like yourself, but from a BUSINESS perspective, it makes sense. Having worked for the TDS, I can tell you that one of the stores here in Austin, which has since been closed, sold art from Disney. But they had to stop, as the cost outweighed the profit. Why? Because in the end, it was a very small market that wanted that product. Hence, it didn't make sense to offer something in the store that took up space that could be utilized for higher profit margin product, and that they could offer thru a catalog or web site.

I'm not disagreeing that there are guests out there that love being able to see the work being done. My Wife loved going to the animation tour at MGM, and loved watching the work being done. (since that was her major in college, I can understand her connection to a place like that). But let's face it. That's not going to be the case for the majority. If it were, you would see an uphevel that would cause Disney to rethink their decision.

While I understand your frustration with the fact that your life has been adversely affected by this, it doesn't make the company the bad guy. It makes it a business. Which is something I have always stressed on this site. IT'S FIRST AND FOREMOST A BUSINESS!!!

I can't imagine the costs to the guests if EVERY ride and attraction were kept in the fear that the public might not like it. You think 47 sq. miles is a lot of land? Geez, you need a 3rd of the state by the time you were done.

Things change. Business especially. Events every day shape business. And it shapes the decisions that are made in all types of businesses. Again, I feel for the loss of your job. But as I stated in an earlier post on this thread, I also understand that you were offered another position within the comany. Now, it obviously won't be what you want, as you were DOING what you wanted to be doing. However, the company could have offered nothing. Give them SOME credit. There are businesses every day that just shut the doors, and wham, you're out of work. Happens every day in Nascar. Had it happen to me once in North Carolina, working for a printer. Know what? I went out and found something else to do for a living. That's life my friend. If this causes you such pain, that you feel it necessary to leave the company forever, so be it. That's YOUR choice. I'm sure they don't want you to do so, but it isn't up to them now is it?
 
G

General Grizz

New Member
This week may be the last for the artists. For those of you who wish otherwise, contact Disney ASAP!

Jim MacPhee
The Disney-MGM Studios Administration
Phone: 407-560-6688 (Ask for Disney-MGM Studios Management)
Fax: 407-560-1150

Walt Disney World Guest Communications
PO Box 10000
Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830-1000
EMAIL: wdw.guest.communications@disneyworld.com - (it only takes five minutes!)

Mr. Al Weiss
President of Walt Disney World Resort
PO Box 10040
Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830
Phone: (407) 828-3464

Mr. Lee Cockerell
Executive VP of WDW Operations
1375 Buena Vista Drive
Lake Buena Vista, FL 32830-1000
Phone: (407) 934-7287

Mr. James A. (Jay) Rasulo
President of Walt Disney Attractions
500 South Buena Vista Street
Burbank, CA 91521

Mr. Michael Eisner
Chief Executive Officer
Walt Disney Company
500 South Buena Vista Street
Burbank, CA 91521

Thank you! It means a lot to these artists, Disney animation/art fans, and even the ex-animators.
 
H

HennieBogan1966

Account Suspended
Sorry for the delay barnum, but had been taking some time away. Forgive me for the slowness of my response. But when I saw 9's comments, I had to respond.
 
PurpleDragon

PurpleDragon

Well-Known Member
Sorry but I would like to throw in my 2 cents here. I think the whole arguement is not weather WDC is a business or not, its the fact that they are turning their back on the very thing that got them where they are in the first place. The very people who were/are the foundation of this company. Disney started out as a feature animation company, it prided itself on the talent and creativity of its artists, it nurtured creative talent and helped it grow so that the next great animated feature would be that much better than the last. The whole thing is Disney has forgotten its roots and is looking for the quick buck rather than taking pride in the quality of its attractions and animated features.

Since they have cut costs on feature animated movies, the return on them has dwnidled to almost nothing. In response to this WDC decides that animation is not the way to go and begins cutting back on all things related to animation claiming that it is does not generate enough profit. So they close up shop and sell off the furniture, that is just rediculous.

If they were truely concerned about Walt's legacy then they would be supporting all their talented animators, hanging on to each one of them as if they were family, making sure they were all keeping busy so they can deliver the best product possible. But alas the greed and deceit in Disney upper management has torn apart one of the greatest animation powerhouses in the industry, this is truely a sad sad time.

Thank you, that is all I have to say.
 
ClemsonTigger

ClemsonTigger

Naturally Grumpy
From the Disney 2004 Annual Report:

Since its founding in 1923, The Walt Disney Company has remained faithful in its commitment to producing unparalleled entertainment experiences based on its rich legacy of quality creative content and exceptional storytelling. Today, Disney is divided into four major business segments: Studio Entertainment, Parks and Resorts, Consumer Products, and Media Networks. Each segment consists of integrated, well-connected businesses that operate in concert to maximize exposure and growth worldwide.
Disney Studio Entertainment
The Studio Entertainment unit is the foundation on which The Walt Disney Company was built, and at its heart are world-renowned animated features and live-action motion pictures. With the creation of Mickey Mouse and Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, the world's first full-length animated feature, the Disney name quickly became synonymous with quality entertainment for the whole family.
Click to expand...

It was shaping up to be a very good year, and, as you can see, one of the primary drivers, as always, was fantastic creative product – in our films and in our parks. -ME
Click to expand...

Over at Walt Disney Feature Animation, where so much of the entertainment magic is first conjured up, they have completed the transition to digital production. More than 20 remarkable projects are in various phases of development, including a second sequel to Toy Story. The next production will be Chicken Little. As you’ll see, we are bringing our own original Disney look and feel to the very exciting 3D animation medium. -ME
Click to expand...

I don't need to add anything more :(
 
H

HennieBogan1966

Account Suspended
Clemson

Let me first state that I am NO fan of Michael Eisner. And I can't disagree with the fact that he refers to the importance of feature animation within the context of the history of the company.

However, let's be honest. With all the advancements in technology, there is really no LARGE market for hand-drawn feature animation anymore. The competition has moved beyond that, and so too must Disney. I don't deny its importance to the legacy and foundation of the company. I also don't deny that maybe they should maintain a presence with animators at each of the parks throughout the world. But again, I can understand why the company has decided to move the direction they have.

Change is never easy to accomplish, or accept sometimes. Especially within a large company like Disney. I choose to be optimistic that this too will work out for the best.

In the end, it's about business, profits and losses. The bottom line is the bottom line.
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom