Accused of Pizza Flyer Scam at Dolphin.

[twinnstar]

Im only 16 (turn 17 in November), so im still learning the real world, If you were my age in that predictament, and didnt wanna go to jail for something you didnt do, you probably would of done the same thing.

I'm just gunna act like this never happened, but if it ever happens again (i vist Contemporary more than anyother resort), Im going to demand them show me "evidence" of it happening. (which i feel i should of done this time)

I'm sorry you had to go through that, that must have sucked, but at least you learned a good lesson about your Drivers License! That goes for your social security number, and any other personal information, too. Guard it! There's no reason for a lay person to need to randomly see your ID, especially when you know you didn't do anything wrong. And actually - if you are ever in a situation like that again, you should ask to see that proof they said they had, and otherwise, you should just leave. they aren't cops, they cannot detain you legally, you weren't under arrest or anything. And, if they really wont stop bothering you - call the cops yourself and say they are detaining/threatening you.

 

[xdan0920]

Common sense. I've stayed at many Disney Resorts and rooms are clearly separate from public areas.

You have never had to walk through guest areas to arrive at public areas?

 

[The Mom]

Perhaps the answer is to limit access to guest rooms. I've stayed in hotels where you have to use your room key to take an elevator anywhere other than a public area. And even then you can only access your own floor, not another. The stairway doors only opened one way - as a fire exit where you would have to continue to the nearest "public" floor.

And they could go even further and set up each floor similar to the Concierge lounge, where you would have to use your room key to enter.

Of course, this would add to the price of a room, but would eliminate a lot of difficulties, and make guests feel more secure. Many of us are more than happy to pay more for for a hotel that has interior corridors, rather than direct access to the outside. I suspect that if people knew about people thinking it's OK to wander anywhere in a hotel even if they are not staying there, some might be willing to pay more for better security, too.

 

[The Mom]

You have never had to walk through guest areas to arrive at public areas?

Not if I wasn't already a guest and passed through them to/from my room. I've never had to walk through guest areas as a visitor to get to restaurants, shops, etc. Mostly lobbies, and in some instances, an elevator that went directly to a public area. Or directly from the outside.

But I haven't stayed in every hotel at WDW; perhaps your experience has been different, and you'll let us know which one has a visitor who is not staying in the hotel walking through/by guest rooms to get to a public area?

 

[Rob562]

No. He lives in a country where if you are on private property uninvited you are trespassing. :wave:

I'm not a lawyer, but I believe that most of WDW falls under the "public use" parts of the law. Meaning that Disney gives free access to everyone (i.e. they openly invite anyone and everyone) until such time that they do not want a particular person on their property. At that point, when they "trespass" someone, they file paperwork that formally tells the person that they are no longer welcome on their property, they must leave and never return (or OK to return after xx number of years, in some cases).

That is why, on the side roads onto property that don't have the big "Walt Disney World" signs marking the entrance onto property, there are signs declaring "Private Property. Walt Disney World Resort guests, cast, and business invitees only. And at least in the parks, any entrance to areas that Disney does *not* allow everyone, there are "Cast Members Only" signs.

If it were the case that someone is trespassing on Disney property unless they were invited, how exactly does Disney individually invite the 10's of thousands of people each day and grant them the permission to enter their property in the first place?

-Rob

 

[Rob562]

Not if I wasn't already a guest and passed through them to/from my room. I've never had to walk through guest areas as a visitor to get to restaurants, shops, etc. Mostly lobbies, and in some instances, an elevator that went directly to a public area. Or directly from the outside.

But I haven't stayed in every hotel at WDW; perhaps your experience has been different, and you'll let us know which one has a visitor who is not staying in the hotel walking through/by guest rooms to get to a public area?

One example that springs to mind is the lobby of the Wilderness Lodge. There are rooms facing drectly out to the lobby. Anyone who wanders up the stairs to get an elevated view of the lobby or out to the balconies at the back is walking past those rooms. (Though I do admit they're pretty well-exposed and safe)

-Rob

 

[Todd L]

I'm not a lawyer, but I believe that most of WDW falls under the "public use" parts of the law. Meaning that Disney gives free access to everyone (i.e. they openly invite anyone and everyone) until such time that they do not want a particular person on their property. At that point, when they "trespass" someone, they file paperwork that formally tells the person that they are no longer welcome on their property, they must leave and never return (or OK to return after xx number of years, in some cases).

That is why, on the side roads onto property that don't have the big "Walt Disney World" signs marking the entrance onto property, there are signs declaring "Private Property. Walt Disney World Resort guests, cast, and business invitees only. And at least in the parks, any entrance to areas that Disney does *not* allow everyone, there are "Cast Members Only" signs.

If it were the case that someone is trespassing on Disney property unless they were invited, how exactly does Disney individually invite the 10's of thousands of people each day and grant them the permission to enter their property in the first place?

-Rob

Is that Right?? Wow..I can understand them allowing people to use the Resturants, Bars, Nightclubs, giftshops, even the pool But , A Hallway with nothing but guest rooms seems a bit much to me.

I go to visit family in hotels when they come to Nyc and always stop at the front desk to avoid any question of tresspassing..then again, Nyc and Wdw are two different universes!!

 

[devoy1701]

One example that springs to mind is the lobby of the Wilderness Lodge. There are rooms facing drectly out to the lobby. Anyone who wanders up the stairs to get an elevated view of the lobby is walking past those rooms. (Though I do admit they're pretty well-exposed and safe)

-Rob

In addition, if you choose to head out to Docks or Beach at the WL via interior corridors instead of the courtyard you will be walking by guest rooms.

 

[captainkidd]

One example that springs to mind is the lobby of the Wilderness Lodge. There are rooms facing drectly out to the lobby. Anyone who wanders up the stairs to get an elevated view of the lobby or out to the balconies at the back is walking past those rooms. (Though I do admit they're pretty well-exposed and safe)

-Rob

That's just another example of wandering through guest areas of the hotel. The lobby, shop, bathrooms, and restaurants are all that need to be available to non-guests of the resort. All of those can accessed at the WL without venturing up to any of the floors where rooms overlook the lobby.

 

[captainkidd]

In addition, if you choose to head out to Docks or Beach at the WL via interior corridors instead of the courtyard you will be walking by guest rooms.

But why would anyone do that? There are signs clearly pointing which way to go. I've stayed there 5 times and I don't think I could even find my way out to those areas through the guest hallways.

 

[Pioneer Hall]

In addition, if you choose to head out to Docks or Beach at the WL via interior corridors instead of the courtyard you will be walking by guest rooms.

To which Disney would likely say "There are signs directing you out to the dock this way. There is no reason that you have to go near guest rooms to get there."

Of course this would only happen if you gave Disney a reason to believe that you were doing something wrong.

 

[Todd L]

um....:lookaroun lol

I think it would also be a matter of how you handle the situation yourself on whether they attempt to challenge your refusal to hand over your ID. I'm not sure what cussing them out and laughing at them in their face would accomplish besides making them want to make the rest of your afternoon a living hell. Calmly explaining why you were there and apologizing followed by a sincere but stern "but I am not going to surrender my License to you" would have been perfectly acceptable.

Yeah man..Thats exactly right...You can get so much more out of most situations by keeping your tone and posture non-threatening and non-defensive.

Of course there are exceptions but most people are sensable enough to read a situation and avoid making it worse.

Walking away from security is probably not the best idea and would rouse suspicion..fairly or Not!!

 

[devoy1701]

But why would anyone do that? There are signs clearly pointing which way to go. I've stayed there 5 times and I don't think I could even find my way out to those areas through the guest hallways.

If it was cold or raining perhaps? or deathly hot and you wanted to enjoy the A/C as long as possible?

I'm just providing an example of traveling through resort guest areas to get to a public area! :animwink:

 

[Pioneer Hall]

If it was cold or raining perhaps? or deathly hot and you wanted to enjoy the A/C as long as possible?

I'm just providing an example of traveling through resort guest areas to get to a public area! :animwink:

But the thing is, that you really don't have to do that. Disney is providing you with a simple way to get there without you going near a guest room. You are choosing to go near those rooms because you want to stay inside. If Disney had suspicion to stop you going near those rooms, they could question why you were there when the sign says to exit to go to the dock. Saying you didn't want to go out in the heat doesn't have to fly with them. There is a reason that you don't need to go through room areas to do anything in a resort...they don't want you to. If you aren't staying there, they don't want you near the rooms. I

 

[captainkidd]

But the thing is, that you really don't have to do that. Disney is providing you with a simple way to get there without you going near a guest room. You are choosing to go near those rooms because you want to stay inside. If Disney had suspicion to stop you going near those rooms, they could question why you were there when the sign says to exit to go to the dock. Saying you didn't want to go out in the heat doesn't have to fly with them. There is a reason that you don't need to go through room areas to do anything in a resort...they don't want you to. If you aren't staying there, they don't want you near the rooms. I

Exactly.

Disney maneuvers non-guests through public areas away from guest rooms the same way Vegas hotels maneuver guests through the casino to get to their rooms.

 

[CaptainShortty]

I was one of those kids who hated the bad rap that teenagers got and really hated the profiling that was done on young kids. I wouldn't have given up my ID even at that age. But then again by parents wouldn't have let me wonder to Disney by myself at 16 either. lol

"That being said, the 16 year old me (heck, the 21 year old me) would have given it to them too in sheer fear of what would have happened if I didn't."

Hell no!!!! I would barely hand it over to the cops...lol... But no seriously I would have laughed in their face and probably cused them out and just left.... you just don't freely show some "security guards" ur I'd/license!!!

Just my opinions of course on these. I'm saying that me at 16 would have probably given up my ID in fear. Of course everyone reacts differently. I was just giving some sympathy to the OP in saying that I understand where he came from in giving it up.

 

[xdan0920]

Not if I wasn't already a guest and passed through them to/from my room. I've never had to walk through guest areas as a visitor to get to restaurants, shops, etc. Mostly lobbies, and in some instances, an elevator that went directly to a public area. Or directly from the outside.

But I haven't stayed in every hotel at WDW; perhaps your experience has been different, and you'll let us know which one has a visitor who is not staying in the hotel walking through/by guest rooms to get to a public area?

Had is not the right word. There is almost always another way. However, in some cases the most convenient way is past guest rooms.

I just don't think this is a black and white issue. If someone like yourself was walking to the Dolphin from Epcot, and ducked into the inside corridor because it was 99 degrees outside, the security should not be rushing to detain you. Especially if the outside door to the hallway does not say, Guests Only.

Thousands of people walk past guest rooms daily at Disney Resorts, and there is no way to tell who is a guest, who is a guest of a guest, who is using the hallway as a shortcut to a resturant. All of these type of people have essentially the same demeanor. It is up to security to weed out those people who seem up to no good. My only point was, a kid with a camera and and AP, taking pictures is not up to no good.

 

[xdan0920]

Also, you are right. The best way to curtail this would be to make access to guest floors only by Key Card. Short of this, it is up to security personal to use their best judgement. And in this case, they goofed.

 

[DisneySaint]

They are not legitimate pizza shops, all they want to do is steal credit card numbers.

Who is giving their credit card number over the phone to a pizza shop out of town?! :shrug:

 

[DisneySaint]

Good point, however they are affiliated with Disney and share the same accomadations such as bus service and EMH. I would say it does have something to do with Disney and if the OP wanted to discuss this with Disney (not saying you do OP) then it would be valid.

False. The S&D basically "rent" those services from Disney; and pay a hearty price to do so. Don't be fooled by the proximity of the resort or the fact Disney buses are pulling through there - their management has zero affiliation with Disney. Sending a letter to WDW Guest Comm will just get a "we're sorry that it happened to you, please contact..."