According to TMZ gator tried to board raft to tom sawyer island

BrerJon

Well-Known Member
Im 90% sure they are just pointing out the type of boat that the actual alligator pic was on. In the caption it says "log Raft" so in my mind that says the red arrow is pointing to the log raft..

There are pictures of the alligator climbing between the logs.

Yeah the video is of the alligator trying to get on a raft, then the picture below it is for context to give a bigger picture of what the rafts look like and where guests are, but they're not trying to say the picture shows a gator. The video clearly does though, don't know why that's a story though, there's always been gators there.
 

GhostHost1000

Premium Member
What happened is tragic, but what comes next. Are theme parks responsible if anyone gets stung by a bee or bit by a mosquito? You can only control so much.

I had a large snake run across the sidewalk right I front of me at Saratoga Springs last week and if I had got bitten I wouldn't say it was disneys fault
 

bhg469

Well-Known Member
What happened is tragic, but what comes next. Are theme parks responsible if anyone gets stung by a bee or bit by a mosquito? You can only control so much.

I had a large snake run across the sidewalk right I front of me at Saratoga Springs last week and if I had got bitten I wouldn't say it was disneys fault
I would kindly ask for them to buy me new shorts though
 

ABQ

Well-Known Member
What happened is tragic, but what comes next. Are theme parks responsible if anyone gets stung by a bee or bit by a mosquito? You can only control so much.

I had a large snake run across the sidewalk right I front of me at Saratoga Springs last week and if I had got bitten I wouldn't say it was disneys fault
Wondered something similar myself, if I'm driving along towards FT Wilderness and a deer jumps out into the road and I crash, do I blame WDW as there wasn't a deer crossing sign?
 

Daniel Johnson

Well-Known Member
I think we as Disney fanatics have the where with all to know that Disney is a patch of land, in florida...wild animals abound. Everywhere. You can't keep them all out. But the casual Disney goer isn't going to see the logic, and the media is going to sensualize anything they can about the issue at Disney. Sad. But it's true.
 

lostpro9het

Well-Known Member
I'm tired of all this media biased. Crocodiles have been trying to board boats at Disney for years yet authorities do nothing about it!
florida-magic-kingdom-peter-pan-ride-images-hook.jpg


Why is TMZ afraid to cover this hard hitting news!!!
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure what the policy is for linking to TMZ on this site, but they have photos of a gator trying to board a raft. Not sure if this has been mentioned before, sorry if it has or if this isn't the right board to post this on. Please delete if that's the case.

I know Florida is Alligator country, always has been, and I know I've seen them around the waters myself, but is the problem getting worse? I will admit those photos worried me a little.

What, do you expect alligators to swim over?!?

Seriously tho, this one is a baby one, maybe 18-24 inches. Totally harmless except for the fact that he's likely been fed a boatload of turkey legs and isn't afraid of people.

It will eventually need to be trapped and destroyed.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
I want to throw this one out there to @WDW1974: Budget cuts? We've known for years that the property was methodical in removing gators that were generally 4' and longer. In the news stories that have been circulating over the past day, there's a general theme of cast members noticing the gator problem and clear disregard from management. Your own witnessed incident is yet another glimpse.

Are we potentially seeing a greater number oflarger gators because Disney simply isn't relocating them as they once were? Of course none of us have internal documentation and direct eyes on the budget, but with the track record of stripping costs everywhere over the years, you do wonder if they simply don't do the relocations as they once did.

I have been asked this question a few times privately by other posters and the answer is that I don't know, but I wouldn't doubt it. I know in years past they have cut the budget for pest control. I will never forget it because it coincided with me getting eaten alive by mosquitoes for the first time ever at the MK (after decades of visits without a single bite).

I keep repeating it, but it bears repeating because it is accurate:
1.) Too much loss of habitat;
2.) A rise in gator population (yes, there actually were fewer around in the 70s/80s because they had been hunted to near extinction, but have made a huge comeback);
3.) WDW overbuilding;
4.) ***And this IS the key issue/problem that the media is finally realizing*** Bumpkin Guests feeding gators for fun having no idea how dangerous and illegal the behavior is or not caring;
5.) Disney CMs and management not wanting to offend human dollar signs mixed with the same ignorance as above.

If I were Georgie K (and I know he's a loyal reader/lurker), then I'd print this out and meet with my team and talk about everything that needs to be done to make sure this tragedy is never repeated. And it has got to start with a 100% no tolerance policy for feeding gators. You do it and you just ended your MAGICal WDW vacation. That means new signage, Guests signing mandatory letters at check in to the resorts AND the policy written and placed in park guide maps and resort welcome packages.

Now ... where's my consulting check?
 

DisneyGigi

Well-Known Member
I don't think I have ever been to WDW, that I didn't see at least one alligator. They are in the water near Dawa Bar frequently and there has been one hanging out near El Centro at CS every time we have stayed there. It is water, in Florida, there are Alligators.
 

The Mom

Moderator
Premium Member
I have been asked this question a few times privately by other posters and the answer is that I don't know, but I wouldn't doubt it. I know in years past they have cut the budget for pest control. I will never forget it because it coincided with me getting eaten alive by mosquitoes for the first time ever at the MK (after decades of visits without a single bite).

I keep repeating it, but it bears repeating because it is accurate:
1.) Too much loss of habitat;
2.) A rise in gator population (yes, there actually were fewer around in the 70s/80s because they had been hunted to near extinction, but have made a huge comeback);
3.) WDW overbuilding;
4.) ***And this IS the key issue/problem that the media is finally realizing*** Bumpkin Guests feeding gators for fun having no idea how dangerous and illegal the behavior is or not caring;
5.) Disney CMs and management not wanting to offend human dollar signs mixed with the same ignorance as above.

If I were Georgie K (and I know he's a loyal reader/lurker), then I'd print this out and meet with my team and talk about everything that needs to be done to make sure this tragedy is never repeated. And it has got to start with a 100% no tolerance policy for feeding gators. You do it and you just ended your MAGICal WDW vacation. That means new signage, Guests signing mandatory letters at check in to the resorts AND the policy written and placed in park guide maps and resort welcome packages.

Now ... where's my consulting check?

I would only add that it's not just WDW overbuilding - it's the whole state. We are seeing bears in our area, in older, 60 + year established communities. They may have been there 100 years ago, but left when people moved in. Now they are running out of places to live, so are going back to old neighborhoods - especially since people aren't used to dealing with them, and are not as careful about garbage, bird feeders, etc.
 
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rael ramone

Well-Known Member
I want to throw this one out there to @WDW1974: Budget cuts? We've known for years that the property was methodical in removing gators that were generally 4' and longer. In the news stories that have been circulating over the past day, there's a general theme of cast members noticing the gator problem and clear disregard from management. Your own witnessed incident is yet another glimpse.

Are we potentially seeing a greater number oflarger gators because Disney simply isn't relocating them as they once were? Of course none of us have internal documentation and direct eyes on the budget, but with the track record of stripping costs everywhere over the years, you do wonder if they simply don't do the relocations as they once did.

I've theorized this as well.

Since a death is involved, everything about this process needs a through review:

1. Who has the ultimate oversight over this? Florida Fish & Wildlife? Reedy Creek? Any Federal agency?

2. Who does Animal Control report to. TDO, or Reedy Creek?

3. What role does their Animal Control have? Do they move ANY animals? If they move any, WHY are they doing it (and not an outside professional or wildlife official)? Is TDO and/or Reedy Creek legally required to fulfill this function? Or do they do so to minimize outside government/regulatory interactions/interference? And if someone outside the bubble has ultimate authority, are they improperly ceding too much control over to TDO/Reedy Creek?

4. How proactive is the Animal Control department? Do they regularly scout out waterways looking for potential problems? Or do they wait for issues to be reported?

5. When if there's one that they need to call, who do they call in? FF&W? A private trapper? (I remember a line in Unofficial Guide saying Gatorland comes in). Is there a cost to this? Is there a 'service contract' arrangement with a simple annual fee? Or is each call 'time and materials'? If it has to be called in, who approves the work order, and does the person ever deny the work order due to budget reasons?

6. What are the statistics on gators moved this year? Last year at this time? Year before? And is this department allotted a set budget? If so, how rigid is such budget? And has the budget decreased? How would a chart of 'gators moved' look overlapping with 'Animal Control Budget'?

These questions need answers. If the family chooses to reject a settlement and pursue this in court (it's conceivable that a family would reject even a gargantuan sum for a settlement if it comes with the stipulation that TWDC 'does not admit fault'), I'm sure every place where they could be at fault will be explored. Since Sen. Markey has shown to have an interest in themed enterprises beyond Mouse Arrest Bands on preteens, he could start sniffing around.

If it turns out that one of the 'faults' that $DIS has here is a 'budget cut' to guest safety and it get's out, I don't think it's just 'managers' that will be brushing off their resumes...
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
Not exactly news that there are gators in the Rivers of America, i've seen multiple videos of one just feet away from the Splash Mountain flume after the drop.



There's another video of an alligator trying to climb over the barrier to get inside the flume, with an employee trying to stop it. Video complete with horror movie music added (i won't post it, seems somewhat alarmist and disrespectful in light of the tragedy, you can find it easily enough by searching "alligator splash mountain" in youtube)...

Are there actually openings in the TSI rafts that a gator could get inside?


Disney finally puts some realism into their rides and people get all upset!! ;)
 

ChrisFL

Premium Member
did it have fastpass or is it a Q jumper? Tour gators.

Gate-r crashers

BTW, I was close friends with a CM who worked in ODF (Outdoor Foods) at MK and they had a name for a certain gator that would hang out near one of the food carts...in 2008.

So yes, like others have said it's nothing new or special, it's Florida, but since we're in the instant news gratification society, everything is magnified 1000%
 

alphac2005

Well-Known Member
I've theorized this as well.

Since a death is involved, everything about this process needs a through review:

1. Who has the ultimate oversight over this? Florida Fish & Wildlife? Reedy Creek? Any Federal agency?

2. Who does Animal Control report to. TDO, or Reedy Creek?

3. What role does their Animal Control have? Do they move ANY animals? If they move any, WHY are they doing it (and not an outside professional or wildlife official)? Is TDO and/or Reedy Creek legally required to fulfill this function? Or do they do so to minimize outside government/regulatory interactions/interference? And if someone outside the bubble has ultimate authority, are they improperly ceding too much control over to TDO/Reedy Creek?

4. How proactive is the Animal Control department? Do they regularly scout out waterways looking for potential problems? Or do they wait for issues to be reported?

5. When if there's one that they need to call, who do they call in? FF&W? A private trapper? (I remember a line in Unofficial Guide saying Gatorland comes in). Is there a cost to this? Is there a 'service contract' arrangement with a simple annual fee? Or is each call 'time and materials'? If it has to be called in, who approves the work order, and does the person ever deny the work order due to budget reasons?

6. What are the statistics on gators moved this year? Last year at this time? Year before? And is this department allotted a set budget? If so, how rigid is such budget? And has the budget decreased? How would a chart of 'gators moved' look overlapping with 'Animal Control Budget'?

These questions need answers. If the family chooses to reject a settlement and pursue this in court (it's conceivable that a family would reject even a gargantuan sum for a settlement if it comes with the stipulation that TWDC 'does not admit fault'), I'm sure every place where they could be at fault will be explored. Since Sen. Markey has shown to have an interest in themed enterprises beyond Mouse Arrest Bands on preteens, he could start sniffing around.

If it turns out that one of the 'faults' that $DIS has here is a 'budget cut' to guest safety and it get's out, I don't think it's just 'managers' that will be brushing off their resumes...

I know that these issues with gators are typically dealt with by Florida Fish and Wildlife (and then can be delegated out if need be), but Disney has always had an agreement where they take care of the matter instead of the state agency. Whether that is agreed to with the company or Reedy Creek, I'm not sure.
 

Missymoe4

Well-Known Member
I do not think there is a problem with it so I will link the article.

http://www.tmz.com/2016/06/17/disney-world-alligator-in-park-weeks-before-attack/

As to the article...gators have always been in WDW. A little more so now thanks to their population rebounding, but it seems since the tragedy, every news organization is running with any video of a gator in WDW or a picture of a kid ankle deep in the & Seas Lagoon.

The style/vo the was written makes me question the writer and his/her aim. I guess that pop magazines and sites style their writing toward the general audience and don't sound all too educated. I don't care for how they phrased the little boy's death, but that's just me.
I'm tired of all this media biased. Crocodiles have been trying to board boats at Disney for years yet authorities do nothing about it!
View attachment 146510

Why is TMZ afraid to cover this hard hitting news!!!

This is GREAT!
 

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